Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie

Madeleine McCann

1…111112114116117…165

Comments

  • #3392
    owlbethere
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,329 ✭✭✭owlbethere


    Banana Republic. wrote: »
    It was a few nights in a row that the kids were left alone in the apartment so if anyone was watching them they would of seen their habits and there is talk of staff from the Tapas bar being involved in some way. That woman Nicole seemed to be involved with CB robbing houses so she could well have been watching The Mc Canns. Yes The Mc Canns are guilty of neglect and if it was anyone lower ranked in society we’d be talking a very different case and anyone denying that is denying themselves the truth.

    Thanks for clearing some aspects up. It happened so long ago and I wasn't paying attention over the past few years, I forgot what happened. It changes things for sure. They had child free dinner nights a few nights in a row. There were a few people calculating their movements for sure.


  • #3393
    nc6000
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,429 ✭✭✭nc6000


    sxt wrote: »
    The McCanns have spent millions of pounds trying to ban goncal amarals book on at least three different occasions

    Really? How many millions have they spent?


  • #3394
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    nc6000 wrote: »
    Really? How many millions have they spent?

    Not millions, billions....or even a trillion.


  • #3395
    dark crystal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,962 ✭✭✭✭dark crystal


    yourdeadwright wrote: »
    But there is no evidence she was kidnapped and there is no evidence anyone else ever entered the apartment,

    Genuine question, but what evidence are you looking for for a kidnapping? Besides the child being disappeared, of course.

    No CCTV in the resort, experienced intruder wears gloves, door was unlocked. Crime scene was trampled and not preserved.
    So that leaves the parents

    We're back to how, when , where and why did they commit the crime of manslaughter and concealment of their child's body within the timeline then. Remember they had no transport and no witnesses saw either of them carrying their deceased daughter anywhere between 6pm and 10pm that night.

    If you say there is no evidence of a kidnap, then you can apply the same logic to say there is no evidence of a crime by the parents also.


  • #3396
    Day Lewin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,873 ✭✭✭Day Lewin


    dark crystal wrote: »
    Genuine question, but what evidence are you looking for for a kidnapping? Besides the child being disappeared, of course.

    No CCTV in the resort, experienced intruder wears gloves, door was unlocked. Crime scene was trampled and not preserved.



    We're back to how, when , where and why did they commit the crime of manslaughter and concealment of their child's body within the timeline then. Remember they had no transport and no witnesses saw either of them carrying their deceased daughter anywhere between 6pm and 10pm that night.

    If you say there is no evidence of a kidnap, then you can apply the same logic to say there is no evidence of a crime by the parents also.

    Sad to say, there's no evidence of a nothing, - apart from the child being not there.
    These situations are a criminology conundrum:
    The evidence is flimsy to say the least - vague eyewitnesses of not much, dubious dogs in a rented apartment

    They sort of have to go by statistics - so what is the most likely?
    Sad to say that is often the parents.

    Look up the Azariah Chamberlain case - mother claimed a dingo took the baby. There was no evidence, no witnesses, and the statistics would be against her.
    This mother was actually imprisoned!! Many MANY years later the baby's chewed cardigan was found at a dingo den. A tragic miscarriage of justice. But the police really didn't have much to go on.

    So it goes.


  • Advertisement
  • #3397
    Rock77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Rock77


    Day Lewin wrote: »
    Sad to say, there's no evidence of a nothing, - apart from the child being not there.
    These situations are a criminology conundrum:
    The evidence is flimsy to say the least - vague eyewitnesses of not much, dubious dogs in a rented apartment

    They sort of have to go by statistics - so what is the most likely?
    Sad to say that is often the parents.

    Look up the Azariah Chamberlain case - mother claimed a dingo took the baby. There was no evidence, no witnesses, and the statistics would be against her.
    This mother was actually imprisoned!! Many MANY years later the baby's chewed cardigan was found at a dingo den. A tragic miscarriage of justice. But the police really didn't have much to go on.

    So it goes.

    Sort of going by statistics is crazy though.. one particular case is nothing to do with another..

    Just because the Chamberlain woman was innocent doesn’t mean the McCanns are..

    Likewise just because statistically it’s often the parents doesn’t mean the McCanns are guilty


  • #3398
    kanadams123
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 403 ✭✭kanadams123


    Rock77 wrote: »
    Sort of going by statistics is crazy though.. one particular case is nothing to do with another..

    Just because the Chamberlain woman was innocent doesn’t mean the McCanns are..

    Likewise just because statistically it’s often the parents doesn’t mean the McCanns are guilty

    I agree with this. Although I understand and get the posters point, that's not really how statistics work.

    For example if you flip a coin 10 times and it lands on heads 10 times out of 10, and then you flip a coin an 11th time, the odds of getting a heads on the next flip is still 50:50.


  • #3399
    joeguevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,255 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    kanadams123 wrote: »
    I agree with this. Although I understand and get the posters point, that's not really how statistics work.

    For example if you flip a coin 10 times and it lands on heads 10 times out of 10, and then you flip a coin an 11th time, the odds of getting a heads on the next flip is still 50:50.

    It is how law enforcement works though. Based on similar crimes they will always start with the family or partner in any kidnapping and/or murder case unless there is a monetary motivation and ransom. Even with the ransom cases more often than not it is a family member.

    Not saying that its that in this case but if you ask any law enforcement, every investigation starts at that. To say that its similar to calling out a random person who has no connection with a crime is not the same thing.


  • #3400
    yourdeadwright
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,953 ✭✭✭✭yourdeadwright


    dark crystal wrote: »
    Genuine question, but what evidence are you looking for for a kidnapping? Besides the child being disappeared, of course.

    No CCTV in the resort, experienced intruder wears gloves, door was unlocked. Crime scene was trampled and not preserved.



    We're back to how, when , where and why did they commit the crime of manslaughter and concealment of their child's body within the timeline then. Remember they had no transport and no witnesses saw either of them carrying their deceased daughter anywhere between 6pm and 10pm that night.

    If you say there is no evidence of a kidnap, then you can apply the same logic to say there is no evidence of a crime by the parents also.

    I'm not saying it WAS the parents ,

    I was replying to someone who said blaming the parents was the same as them blaming the poster for the disappearance of Trevor as there was no evidence for both ,

    I'm saying the parent must be suspects and have to be until there is actual evidence of a Kidnapp or someone else being in the room ,
    They where the last people to see her and there was evidence of only them in the apartment so they have to be suspects until its proven otherwise ,Again that is not me saying it was them or even thinking it was them its just how it works

    Blaming a random person for someone else disappearance is not the same ,

    Ps . a child disappearance is not evidence of a kidnapp)


  • #3401
    Rock77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Rock77


    joeguevara wrote: »
    It is how law enforcement works though. Based on similar crimes they will always start with the family or partner in any kidnapping and/or murder case unless there is a monetary motivation and ransom. Even with the ransom cases more often than not it is a family member.

    Not saying that its that in this case but if you ask any law enforcement, every investigation starts at that. To say that its similar to calling out a random person who has no connection with a crime is not the same thing.

    Agreed, the point I was making however is that you can’t just decide someone is guilty because of the statistics.. in this case nobody has ever been charged.

    The parents were official suspects but no evidence could be found, if there is no evidence to prove the parents are guilty then you can’t just go with the statistics! (I could be wrong but is that what happened in the Chamberlain case?)

    Now this is where me and another poster had a difference of opinion, I believe that if a new investigation is starting than all suspects have to be considered, every avenue investigated again, from the very start. Parents included.


  • Advertisement
  • #3402
    Day Lewin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,873 ✭✭✭Day Lewin


    Oh, I agree: statistics alone do not make a case!

    Nevertheless, (in the absence of forensic) detectives tend to start from a simple question like - "Who's the likeliest person to have done this?"
    - and then see what they can find to shore this up.
    Which is far from a cool, objective inquiry.

    I may sound a little cynical. But this does happen. Sometimes it's the only thing that can happen.

    In the Chamberlain case, it was the parent's unsupported word; and the police chose to believe that dingoes were not active in the area and/or never take human babies.
    (true, it is rare)
    - and the rest is history. It was probability, rather than proof, that put Lindy Chamberlain in jail. The baby's body was never found.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Azaria_Chamberlain

    I am NOT alleging that this is the same as the McCann case. No, it is not. But you can see a few similarities!


  • #3403
    Banana Republic.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,587 ✭✭✭Banana Republic.


    Day Lewin wrote: »
    Oh, I agree: statistics alone do not make a case!

    Nevertheless, (in the absence of forensic) detectives tend to start from a simple question like - "Who's the likeliest person to have done this?"
    - and then see what they can find to shore this up.
    Which is far from a cool, objective inquiry.

    I may sound a little cynical. But this does happen. Sometimes it's the only thing that can happen.

    In the Chamberlain case, it was the parent's unsupported word; and the police chose to believe that dingoes were not active in the area and/or never take human babies.
    (true, it is rare)
    - and the rest is history. It was probability, rather than proof, that put Lindy Chamberlain in jail. The baby's body was never found.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Azaria_Chamberlain

    I am NOT alleging that this is the same as the McCann case. No, it is not. But you can see a few similarities!

    The parents were the last ppl known to have seen Madeline so you start from them it’s only natural and go from there. If there’s no evidence then you have to quiz the parents as they are the only viable option that you are 100% sure seen her last. You then work through their stories with ask the other ppl in their company that night who can say they were with them including the guy Gerry spoke to. It proceeds from there and if they can find evidence that someone else is involved then they move on from the parents but never totally exclude them until they have hard evidence of another suspect.


  • #3404
    Rock77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Rock77


    Day Lewin wrote: »
    Oh, I agree: statistics alone do not make a case!

    Nevertheless, (in the absence of forensic) detectives tend to start from a simple question like - "Who's the likeliest person to have done this?"
    - and then see what they can find to shore this up.
    Which is far from a cool, objective inquiry.

    I may sound a little cynical. But this does happen. Sometimes it's the only thing that can happen.

    In the Chamberlain case, it was the parent's unsupported word; and the police chose to believe that dingoes were not active in the area and/or never take human babies.
    (true, it is rare)
    - and the rest is history. It was probability, rather than proof, that put Lindy Chamberlain in jail. The baby's body was never found.

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Death_of_Azaria_Chamberlain

    I am NOT alleging that this is the same as the McCann case. No, it is not. But you can see a few similarities!

    Poor Lindy and Michael Chamberlain that’s all I can say... they lost their baby girl and were blamed for her murder.. there’s no evidence so the parents must have done it... crazy, crazy stuff.. if there’s no evidence then there’s nothing that can be done!!


  • #3405
    Rock77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Rock77


    Banana Republic. wrote: »
    The parents were the last ppl known to have seen Madeline so you start from them it’s only natural and go from there. If there’s no evidence then you have to quiz the parents as they are the only viable option that you are 100% sure seen her last. You then work through their stories with ask the other ppl in their company that night who can say they were with them including the guy Gerry spoke to. It proceeds from there and if they can find evidence that someone else is involved then they move on from the parents but never totally exclude them until they have hard evidence of another suspect.

    Agreed, unfortunately after 13 years there’s still no evidence...

    Thank god they didn’t just decide the parents did it like in the Chamberlain case.


  • #3406
    buttercups88
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 764 ✭✭✭buttercups88


    Portuguese police have reopened Hazel Behans rape case in light of evidence linking C.B


  • #3407
    MonsterCookie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 959 ✭✭✭MonsterCookie


    buttercups88 wrote: »
    Portuguese police have reopened Hazel Behans rape case in light of evidence linking C.B

    she has been tremendously brave going forward like she did. i really hope gets justice. CB or whoever, should be made to pay for what he did.

    i wonder what evidence they have or can get...would she be on any of the images or videos they found...


  • #3408
    buttercups88
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 764 ✭✭✭buttercups88


    MonsterCookie wrote: »
    she has been tremendously brave going forward like she did. i really hope gets justice. CB or whoever, should be made to pay for what he did.

    Unfortunately as her rape happened in 2004 and Portugal having a 15year statute of limitations its unlikely she will get justice.

    Her attack is eerily similar to the one he committed on the American lady and the description she gave them. I cannot understand why the Portuguese destroyed the DNA evidence collected though it makes no sense at all.


  • #3409
    MonsterCookie
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 959 ✭✭✭MonsterCookie


    buttercups88 wrote: »
    Unfortunately as her rape happened in 2004 and Portugal having a 15year statute of limitations its unlikely she will get justice.

    Her attack is eerily similar to the one he committed on the American lady and the description she gave them. I cannot understand why the Portuguese destroyed the DNA evidence collected though it makes no sense at all.

    good point re the 15 year limit - but does that apply to all crimes? I had read about it in the context of murder.

    i wonder why are they reopening the case then?


  • #3410
    buttercups88
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 764 ✭✭✭buttercups88


    MonsterCookie wrote: »
    good point re the 15 year limit - but does that apply to all crimes? I had read about it in the context of murder.

    i wonder why are they reopening the case then?

    According to sky its for rape as well. Maybe if they were able to prove it was him they could use it in his appeal against conviction for the other rape. Im not sure though.

    Also it might help join dots in the Madeleine investigation


  • #3411
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,130 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Will never be solved.

    Too many irons in the fire from UK. No wonder Amaral won his case against the McCanns. Anyone who opened their mouths were sued, why I wonder.

    5, 4, 3,2 1

    Hi Dark Crystal, nice to see you again.


  • Advertisement
  • #3412
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    Spanish Eyes wrote: »
    Will never be solved.

    Too many irons in the fire from UK. No wonder Amaral won his case against the McCanns. Anyone who opened their mouths were sued, why I wonder.

    5, 4, 3,2 1

    Hi Dark Crystal, nice to see you again.

    The blatant sh*t stirring is just getting boring now, you’d want to grow up a bit and stop trying to purposely derail the thread. It’s actually pathetic.


  • #3413
    Spanish Eyes
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,130 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    The blatant sh*t stirring is just getting boring now, you’d want to grow up a bit and stop trying to purposely derail the thread. It’s actually pathetic.

    I happen to think it is fine. And I am not for a moment stirring anything.

    But the truth might hurt now and then of course.

    You have the option of putting me on ignore and I suggest you might think about that. But to be honest you come across as a decent poster even if I don't agree with you sometimes.


  • #3414
    dark crystal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,962 ✭✭✭✭dark crystal


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    The blatant sh*t stirring is just getting boring now, you’d want to grow up a bit and stop trying to purposely derail the thread. It’s actually pathetic.

    It was all going so peacefully as well...shame.


  • #3415
    dark crystal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,962 ✭✭✭✭dark crystal


    MonsterCookie wrote: »
    she has been tremendously brave going forward like she did. i really hope gets justice. CB or whoever, should be made to pay for what he did.

    i wonder what evidence they have or can get...would she be on any of the images or videos they found...

    She mentioned that her attacker had a distinctive birthmark on his thigh. Pretty easily identified I'd think.


  • #3416
    Day Lewin
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,873 ✭✭✭Day Lewin


    dark crystal wrote: »
    She mentioned that her attacker had a distinctive birthmark on his thigh. Pretty easily identified I'd think.

    Now, who's first up, to inspect the thigh of Christian B?

    Yergh, shudders at the very thought!!


  • #3417
    buttercups88
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 764 ✭✭✭buttercups88


    Day Lewin wrote: »
    Now, who's first up, to inspect the thigh of Christian B?

    Yergh, shudders at the very thought!!

    Would rather that job that look through his home video collection


  • #3418
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    The blatant sh*t stirring is just getting boring now, you’d want to grow up a bit and stop trying to purposely derail the thread. It’s actually pathetic.

    It’s the “Goncarlo ....SORRY! DR Amaral Fan Club” Believe it or not he was very quickly a sex symbol (shudders) for a certain type of woman of a certain age.
    If overweight, chain smoking, scowling, hirsute, lying ,lazy assed Latin types are your thing then you’d take serious offence at any critiscm of your idol, perceived or otherwise.


  • #3419
    joeguevara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,255 ✭✭✭joeguevara


    MonsterCookie wrote: »
    good point re the 15 year limit - but does that apply to all crimes? I had read about it in the context of murder.

    i wonder why are they reopening the case then?

    Behind the scenes when I used to practice criminal law (now specifically specialising in aml and counter terrorist financing) there was always a reason for opening a seemingly closed case. Now I never came across statute of limitations as in the case mentioned but it was usually used as a tool to interview or bring evidence for further examination, even if used in a different case. Also, clocks can be stopped, making statute of limitations longer if certain things are shown e.g. impossible to interview if incarcerated for a different crime.

    Isn’t it great that it looks like steam is building up. I’m not going to say anything about people being imprisoned across the water but I hope that every child, woman and indeed men who were hurt, get justice.

    One other thing is that I would like to apologise if I offended any poster in this thread. Definitely was not my intention. It took poster rock to call me out that.


  • #3420
    Rock77
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,123 ✭✭✭Rock77


    joeguevara wrote: »
    Behind the scenes when I used to practice criminal law (now specifically specialising in aml and counter terrorist financing) there was always a reason for opening a seemingly closed case. Now I never came across statute of limitations as in the case mentioned but it was usually used as a tool to interview or bring evidence for further examination, even if used in a different case. Also, clocks can be stopped, making statute of limitations longer if certain things are shown e.g. impossible to interview if incarcerated for a different crime.

    Isn’t it great that it looks like steam is building up. I’m not going to say anything about people being imprisoned across the water but I hope that every child, woman and indeed men who were hurt, get justice.

    One other thing is that I would like to apologise if I offended any poster in this thread. Definitely was not my intention. It took poster rock to call me out that.

    No apology necessary Joe!

    Yeah it does give you hope that thinks look like they are progressing...


  • Advertisement
  • #3421
    Baggly
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,024 ✭✭✭✭Baggly


    Mod

    Cards have been handed out for attacking a poster and backseat modding. Stop doing that, please.


Advertisement