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I'm 18, just got my A2 license, turns out I can't insure any of the bikes I wanted to

  • 20-07-2020 12:20PM
    #1
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭


    Hey guys, turns out I can't insure any of the bikes I was interested in buying even though they met the 35kW and 0.2kW/kg limits. Liberty basically said to get a 125cc bike, what a joke. If you're interested, I wanted to buy either a Yamaha virago 535, Yamaha V-star 650, or a Kawasaki Ninja 250r. Any advice before I give up?

    Edit: sorry the title cuts out, *I wanted to ride*

    Edit: got a quote from Carole Nash for a Yamaha Drag Star 250 cruiser, €3500 per year, nice.


«13

Comments

  • #2
    IrishGrimReaper
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 897 ✭✭✭IrishGrimReaper


    What did Principle Insurance and Carole Nash say?


  • #3
    Pawwed Rig
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,452 ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    I am 44 and it looks like nothing has changed since I was 18 getting my first bike. Insurance in this country is a disgrace given that we are very safe drivers by international standards. Sorry OP. All you can do is call all of the companies that will cover bikes and ask.


  • #4
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    IrishGrimReaper wrote: »
    What did Principle Insurance and Carole Nash say?

    Principle said they and Carole Nash don't insure under 20yos.


  • #5
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,920 ✭✭✭zubair


    Talk to liberty about any courses they recognise that will qualify you for a quote on one of these bikes. Otherwise you might have to serve your time on an A1.


  • #6
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    Pawwed Rig wrote: »
    I am 44 and it looks like nothing has changed since I was 18 getting my first bike. Insurance in this country is a disgrace given that we are very safe drivers by international standards. Sorry OP. All you can do is call all of the companies that will cover bikes and ask.

    I called principle and liberty, principle said Carole Nash doesn't do under 20year olds either, the only company left I know of is Axa, but from my dads experience they're horrible. Looks like a dead end.


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  • #7
    punisher5112
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,519 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    I called principle and liberty, principle said Carole Nash doesn't do under 20year olds either, the only company left I know of is Axa, but from my dads experience they're horrible. Looks like a dead end.

    Horrible or not if you get it at a price you can afford or they are the only ones id use them for minimum third party.


  • #8
    galwaytt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,712 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    I called principle and liberty, principle said Carole Nash doesn't do under 20year olds either, the only company left I know of is Axa, but from my dads experience they're horrible. Looks like a dead end.

    My son has been insured with Liberty since he was 16 (2019), so can't see why you have an issue.

    Btw, you can forget anything with the letter 'R' in it: CBR, GSX-R, Z..R etc.

    Buy a 250-400cc bike.

    No reflection on your skills etc, but for those of us riding bikes since the 80's, the notion of anyone starting off on anything other than a 125 is fanciful, and as for riding 650's at 18............lolz. I was well into my 20's before I got to do that.

    Back then we didn't need A1, A2, A or IBT to 'graduate' through from small to bigger bikes: it was just sheer economics: wages were low, bikes were dear, insurance bananas.

    Same as it always was then.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



  • #9
    Jimmy Bottlehead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,931 ✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    Hey guys, turns out I can't insure any of the bikes I was interested in buying even though they met the 35kW and 0.2kW/kg limits. Liberty basically said to get a 125cc bike, what a joke. If you're interested, I wanted to buy either a Yamaha virago 535, Yamaha V-star 650, or a Kawasaki Ninja 250r. Any advice before I give up?

    1) Try all insurance companies. Liberty, Carole Nash, Principle, brokers... try them all. You might be lucky.

    2) Get a 125cc, insure it and put in the time. You'll be up a year's NCB and age, and likely able to insure something bigger next year.

    3) Buy my CB400SF :D I got insured on it after my IBT, though I was a bit older by then.

    If you're ready to give up because you can only have a 125, then it's probably for the best as impatience on a bike can be fatal with no second chances.


  • #10
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    Jimmy Bottlehead wrote: »
    1) Try all insurance companies. Liberty, Carole Nash, Principle, brokers... try them all. You might be lucky.

    2) Get a 125cc, insure it and put in the time. You'll be up a year's NCB and age, and likely able to insure something bigger next year.

    3) Buy my CB400SF :D I got insured on it after my IBT, though I was a bit older by then.

    If you're ready to give up because you can only have a 125, then it's probably for the best as impatience on a bike can be fatal with no second chances.

    I'm considering putting in the time, it's just I waited 2 years doing summer jobs to save up for a bike, it'd be quite disappointing being told that you've wasted two years. But as you've said, I might do a year on a 125, it's not that it's bad, it's just more about the disappointment.


  • #11
    Padre_Pio
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,618 ✭✭✭Padre_Pio


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    I'm considering putting in the time, it's just I waited 2 years doing summer jobs to save up for a bike, it'd be quite disappointing being told that you've wasted two years. But as you've said, I might do a year on a 125, it's not that it's bad, it's just more about the disappointment.
    You haven't wasted any time, and you're the same as anyone starting out:)
    Even in a car the insurance would crucify you if you dare to buy larger than a 1.4.


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  • #12
    TheUnderfaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 275 ✭✭TheUnderfaker


    The chicks won't know the difference whether it's a 125 or 250


  • #13
    goblin59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭goblin59


    try AXA, some of these places will insure you if you do a Motorbike skills assessment programme.

    The other option is buy the bike you want, and have it restricted to a 125cc, after a year you can probably remove the restriction.


    Another option is, if your dad can ride a bike, get the bike under his name for now, and then have yourself as a named driver under his insurance policy.

    (I was always told to **** off when i mentioned this to my Dad though, he didn't want me ****ing up 40+ years of no claims)


  • #14
    goblin59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭goblin59


    thing i learn't today is boards *** swearing now.


  • #15
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,920 ✭✭✭zubair


    goblin59 wrote: »
    thing i learn't today is boards *** swearing now.

    They've always ****ing did that.


  • #16
    endacl
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 22,434 ✭✭✭✭endacl


    ******* *****. *** * **** ** ** ******!


  • #17
    Jimmy Bottlehead
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,931 ✭✭✭Jimmy Bottlehead


    endacl wrote: »
    ******* *****. *** * **** ** ** ******!

    Jesus Enda, the poor lad just wants insurance. :D


  • #18
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    goblin59 wrote: »
    try AXA, some of these places will insure you if you do a Motorbike skills assessment programme.

    The other option is buy the bike you want, and have it restricted to a 125cc, after a year you can probably remove the restriction.


    Another option is, if your dad can ride a bike, get the bike under his name for now, and then have yourself as a named driver under his insurance policy.

    (I was always told to **** off when i mentioned this to my Dad though, he didn't want me ****ing up 40+ years of no claims)

    I'll try AXA, lol my dad wouldn't agree to that either. Also imagine restricting an already slow 650cc bike to 125cc, I'd have to roll it down a hill every time to start it XD.


  • #19
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    TheUnderfaker wrote: »
    The chicks won't know the difference whether it's a 125 or 250

    Hahahahahahahahaha, true.


  • #20
    ratracer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,476 ✭✭✭ratracer


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    I'll try AXA, lol my dad wouldn't agree to that either. Also imagine restricting an already slow 650cc bike to 125cc, I'd have to roll it down a hill every time to start it XD.

    I can’t imagine that there are many 125cc bikes that won’t do 100km/h. It might not be as cool as you think, but it’ll be quick enough. As said already, if you want to be a biker just get whatever you can insure and get a year or two no claims under your belt while trying to stay alive!

    We’ve all been there, back in the day I wanted and RG250...... I ended up with an Kawasaki AR-80, but it got me anywhere I wanted to go in the country!!


  • #21
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    ratracer wrote: »
    I can’t imagine that there are many 125cc bikes that won’t do 100km/h. It might not be as cool as you think, but it’ll be quick enough. As said already, if you want to be a biker just get whatever you can insure and get a year or two no claims under your belt while trying to stay alive!

    We’ve all been there, back in the day I wanted and RG250...... I ended up with an Kawasaki AR-80, but it got me anywhere I wanted to go in the country!!

    I meant that it would be almost impossible for a 125cc engine to move a 240kg bike, by default, its max speed with a 650cc engine at full throttle is 140kmph, so it's already pretty slow. Also you're probably right, life is a series of compromises after all.


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  • #22
    rock22
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,804 ✭✭✭rock22


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    ......its max speed with a 650cc engine at full throttle is 140kmph, so it's already pretty slow. ........

    To be honest, you really don't sound mature enough to be riding a motorcycle on the public road


  • #23
    zubair
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,920 ✭✭✭zubair


    rock22 wrote: »
    To be honest, you really don't sound mature enough to be riding a motorcycle on the public road

    I don't know, anything that can't do a ton seems pretty slow to me too.


  • #24
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    rock22 wrote: »
    To be honest, you really don't sound mature enough to be riding a motorcycle on the public road

    I was just stating that going at full throttle in 5th gear, it can barely achieve that speed. A smaller engine Kawasaki Ninja 250r can achieve 175ish kmph, and from the very little experience that I have I can tell you sports bikes have a much more responsive throttle than cruisers. This is the exact reason why I was considering to get a larger but slower cruiser. Funny enough the smaller engine cruiser, the Yamaha can achieve 160kmph.


  • #25
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    rock22 wrote: »
    To be honest, you really don't sound mature enough to be riding a motorcycle on the public road

    I was just stating that going at full throttle in 5th gear, it can barely achieve that speed. A smaller engine Kawasaki Ninja 250r can achieve 175ish kmph, and from the very little experience that I have I can tell you sports bikes have a much more responsive throttle than cruisers. This is the exact reason I was considering to get a larger but slower cruiser. Funny enough the smaller engine cruiser, the Yamaha virago 535 can achieve 160kmph.


  • #26
    MojoMaker
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,638 ✭✭✭MojoMaker


    You'll never see those speeds in Ireland though Damo, so you won't be missing anything.

    Most of us here started on 50s, 80s, 100s, 125s, and 250s over time. There's no shame in getting going on a 125 for your first year - something low cost that won't break your wallet if you drop or prang it. You're going to make a sh1tload of mistakes in your first year anyway (even if you don't believe it) and you're FAR better off on something modest at 18. This is the reason you're hitting the wall with these companies - they already know this from experience and data.


  • #27
    Rafal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 84 ✭✭Rafal


    Damo_108 wrote: »
    Hey guys, turns out I can't insure any of the bikes I was interested in buying even though they met the 35kW and 0.2kW/kg limits.

    As long as there is a company that insures your age group, you definitely can get insurance in Ireland even if refused. Read up about the DCA (Declined Cases Agreement) procedure in this post I shared on another thread: https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110413700&postcount=5

    Bottom line: you need to get three refusal letters from three different Irish insurers. Then follow the procedure and as long as it is not against the public interest to insure you Insurance Ireland will instruct the first company that refused you to offer you a quote. It may—in your case it will—be expensive, but it cannot be unreasonably high for your age and risk group, ie. it will be as expensive as others in your risk group would have to pay.

    As others said, many of us had to pay a lot for our first insurances. Mine cost more than my first bike, and it was only a baby Ninja 125 (before they were called Ninja) back in 1995. Give it a year or two and the premium will come down. Pass a RoSPA exam and it *will* come down a lot for you.

    If you really want to try something more powerful without having to insure it, consider a trackday at Mondello. Above all, practice and learn plenty, which is much easier when you are younger, and totally worth the extra insurance cost. :)


  • #28
    CJhaughey
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 14,669 ✭✭✭✭CJhaughey


    Twins handle restriction better than I4 engines, something like a XL125V would be good for you if you can find a good one.
    They are a decent size for a 125.
    I started on a MT5 years back, then an RD50 so I know a thing or two about small bikes.
    Its not about speed when you start out, think about using your time on a learner bike to further your mechanical skills and road craft.
    Its all about being a safe and competent rider, you want to be in this for the long haul not just a quick blast and a trip to the ER.


  • #29
    Vikings
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,783 ✭✭✭Vikings


    Try something like a Varadero 125 see what quotes insurance give you on that. Will be a tall comfy bike that you can increase your skills on and become a better rider. Riding is about observation skills as much as handling skills.

    Speed should be your last criteria on your first bike.


  • #30
    Damo_108
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23 ✭Damo_108


    MojoMaker wrote: »
    You'll never see those speeds in Ireland though Damo, so you won't be missing anything.

    Most of us here started on 50s, 80s, 100s, 125s, and 250s over time. There's no shame in getting going on a 125 for your first year - something low cost that won't break your wallet if you drop or prang it. You're going to make a sh1tload of mistakes in your first year anyway (even if you don't believe it) and you're FAR better off on something modest at 18. This is the reason you're hitting the wall with these companies - they already know this from experience and data.

    Sorry I probably should've phrased it better, I'm just comparing the maximum speed these bikes are capable of, I'm taking account of different factors that will determine how the bike drives. For example, I know for a fact you can achieve 60-70kmph on the first gear on a CBR 600rr before you have to switch to second gear to go any faster. On a cruiser, I can make a guess that you can't go any faster than 40kmph on first gear and it would take much longer to reach that speed, which is obviously better for a new biker, going slower making me less of a hazard for myself and other people, and giving me more reaction time. To clarify, I'm looking for a bike I can both enjoy and learn on, not looking to go fast.


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  • #31
    goblin59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,954 ✭✭✭goblin59


    Vikings wrote: »
    Try something like a Varadero 125 see what quotes insurance give you on that. Will be a tall comfy bike that you can increase your skills on and become a better rider. Riding is about observation skills as much as handling skills.

    Speed should be your last criteria on your first bike.


    I was just about to recommend a Vandero 125.
    A friend of mine had one for his first bike and loves it
    Great bike overall, and for the engine size he was saying he had no issues on the motorways with it.

    He wants to do it up for going on off road trips as its lighter than his CB500X


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