F1 season start - Austria

Charlie-Bravo · 05-07-2020 7:39pm

Any driver finishing 90% of the Laps will be classified. So if they get to lap 64 in Austria they're classified.

namloc1980 · 05-07-2020 8:30pm

Was every one of the 9 retirements today due to mechanical or electronic failure of same kind in the cars?

the_pen_turner · 05-07-2020 8:33pm

coulthard embarrasing himself on c4 backing up hamilton. its clear cut albon was ahead and hamilton didnt change his line so not to hit him. it should be a stop go in my opinion. dangerous driving

this is ruining races. max did it on charles last year too

05-07-2020 9:26pm

namloc1980 wrote: »

Was every one of the 9 retirements today due to mechanical or electronic failure of same kind in the cars?

Max Verstappen - electrical failure
Daniel Riccardo - cooling problem caused overheating
Lance Stroll - engine trouble
Kevin Magnussen - brake failure right front wheel
Romain Grosjean - brake issues
George Russel - car failure unknown
Kimi Raikkonen - front right wheel came off
Alex Albon - forced to retire after collision
Daniel Kvyat - puncture

jammiedodgers · 05-07-2020 9:31pm

^^^ I think Brundle mentioned the Williams had an issue with fuel pressure?

Inquitus · 05-07-2020 9:45pm

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Alex Albon - forced to retire after collision

The collision seemed to have little to do with his car failure?

Frank Bullitt · 05-07-2020 9:52pm

That was like an opening race from the 90's.

Loved it. I want a season like this in my life.

murphyebass · 05-07-2020 9:56pm

Gintonious wrote: »

That was like an opening race from the 90's.

Loved it. I want a season like this in my life.

Was it though only a small fraction of the race being exciting?

Don’t get me wrong I’ll take it over a full 70 lap borefest but it was badly gripping from the start.

SureYWouldntYa · 05-07-2020 10:01pm

murphyebass wrote: »

Was it though only a small fraction of the race being exciting?

Don’t get me wrong I’ll take it over a full 70 lap borefest but it was badly gripping from the start.

Hamilton didn't win, and it's not a Mercedes 1-2

That alone makes it exciting enough

dublinman1990 · 05-07-2020 10:01pm

Wow. That was some race result. Fair play to LeClerc & Norris on getting a podium today. Both of them deserve it for doing some great driving.

It was quite interesting to note that Mercedes, Ferrari & McLaren were the only cars on the podium today that did not have any retirements being given to their other drivers in the race as opposed to the other teams who had retirements left, right & centre. The final outcome was absolutely nuts. Hamilton, Sainz & Vettel had all finished with gaining points for these teams on the podium in which I thought was a great result under the circumstances. I don't know if that outcome has happened before on the 1st race of the season's calendar from past races?

The race today had absolutely everything that you had ever wanted in a season opener as a F1 fan. It was exciting, it was intense, it was all just absolutely brilliant.

And my god...the amount of retirements to see in it today was very large to observe overall.

You had tyres flying around the track (although not intentional obviously

), you had engines failures and lots of break failures due to the very warm weather taking place on the track today. The heat of the warm weather certainly could have a big factor in Red Bull being the biggest losers of today's race. If the warm weather was around again for next weekend's race; Could Red Bull's cars have a chance to fail under the heat at the track once more?

And nothing really has changed for Renault & Williams from today's race either sadly. They still have the same problems to encounter with their engines in their cars.

Cork Trucker · 05-07-2020 10:19pm

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Hamilton didn't win, and it's not a Mercedes 1-2

That alone makes it exciting enough

Hamilton is 100% at fault for Mercedes not getting a clean sweep throughout the weekend, not complaining though.

SureYWouldntYa · 05-07-2020 10:34pm

Cork Trucker wrote: »

Hamilton is 100% at fault for Mercedes not getting a clean sweep throughout the weekend, not complaining though.

If Albon got by him he could have really challenged Bottas, he was on softs albeit used ones

The race ended up being a lot more interesting that it looked after Max went out anyway

murphyebass · 05-07-2020 10:37pm

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Hamilton didn't win, and it's not a Mercedes 1-2

That alone makes it exciting enough

Sort of I suppose. Kind of. Is it?

quokula · 05-07-2020 10:49pm

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Hamilton didn't win, and it's not a Mercedes 1-2

That alone makes it exciting enough

This is how low standards have dropped in the hybrid era. No need for any actual quality racing, just a completely dominant procession for 90% of the race followed by a late safety car and then a bad move from Hamilton.

jammiedodgers · 05-07-2020 10:50pm

Would it not have made sense for Hamilton to take the lead from Bottas after the penalty to try and make up the 5 seconds? It seemed at one stage he was pushing for that but then bakced off? Were they too worried about the gearbox/sensor issues maybe?

Cork Trucker · 05-07-2020 10:51pm

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

If Albon got by him he could have really challenged Bottas, he was on softs albeit used ones

The race ended up being a lot more interesting that it looked after Max went out anyway

I agree, what we’ll never know though was Albon’s retirement connected to being spun by Hamilton. The boy could have won his first race in any event.

the_pen_turner · 05-07-2020 10:56pm

jammiedodgers wrote: »

Would it not have made sense for Hamilton to take the lead from Bottas after the penalty to try and make up the 5 seconds? It seemed at one stage he was pushing for that but then bakced off? Were they too worried about the gearbox/sensor issues maybe?

several facters at play

they want to keep bottas sweet. leaving him the win will be great for his confidence

merc know they have a dominant car so dont need those points for hamilton

they dont want to piss off anymore fans by doing crap like that in the first race

bad pr

it would look very bad to have hamilton still get second after ruining another drivers race

Charlie-Bravo · 05-07-2020 11:13pm

Let's just admire the top part of the table for at least this week...

Results
Pos|Driver|Pts
1|V. Bottas| 25
2|C. Leclerc|18
3|L. Norris|16
4|L. Hamilton|12
5|C. Sainz Jr. |10

AMKC · 05-07-2020 11:34pm

I think Austria should be the opening race of every season from now on. So much better than Melbourne even if the first part was a bit boring. The whole race in Australia would have been boring.

chicorytip · 05-07-2020 11:39pm

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought. It was a rash move by Albon. Horner's claim that he "had got the job done" when the collision occurred is ludicrous. The Red Bull was less than half a car length ahead at that point and Lewis did nothing more than defend his position. A more experienced driver than Albon would have bided his time and waited for a clearer opportunity to overtake particularly as it appeared the Red Bull was the faster car at that stage of the race.

the_pen_turner · 05-07-2020 11:41pm

chicorytip wrote: »

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought. It was a rash move by Albon. Horner's claim that he "had got the job done" when the collision occurred is ludicrous. The Red Bull was less than half a car length ahead at that point and Lewis did nothing more than defend his position. A more experienced driver than Albon would have bided his time and waited for a clearer opportunity to overtake particularly as it appeared the Red Bull was the faster car at that stage of the race.

it was front wheel to rear wheel contact so 75% ahead if not more.
either way he was along side or ahead and there should have been room left

d8491prj5boyvg · 05-07-2020 11:53pm

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Hamilton didn't win, and it's not a Mercedes 1-2

That alone makes it exciting enough

The opening was boring but the result was exciting. It is a little empty though. Most are happy because the favourite didn't win and therefore it was unpredictable. But Hamilton's penalties had a huge impact. Ok, they were most likely deserved but it's not the same as decided 100% on the track

cherryghost · 06-07-2020 12:02am

chicorytip wrote: »

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought. It was a rash move by Albon. Horner's claim that he "had got the job done" when the collision occurred is ludicrous. The Red Bull was less than half a car length ahead at that point and Lewis did nothing more than defend his position. A more experienced driver than Albon would have bided his time and waited for a clearer opportunity to overtake particularly as it appeared the Red Bull was the faster car at that stage of the race.

That job was done by Albon. Honestly Hamilton shows his rustiness of racecraft when he is not in front. A handful of times that he wasnt in front he's ended up doing similar crap (aside from Brazil). When you look back pre-hybrid he has a history of it. Boy he is fast, but nobody is perfect really (except Raik

)

mickdw · 06-07-2020 12:43am

chicorytip wrote: »

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought. It was a rash move by Albon. Horner's claim that he "had got the job done" when the collision occurred is ludicrous. The Red Bull was less than half a car length ahead at that point and Lewis did nothing more than defend his position. A more experienced driver than Albon would have bided his time and waited for a clearer opportunity to overtake particularly as it appeared the Red Bull was the faster car at that stage of the race.

Its alright to say albon should have bided his time but really adter a restart he had a lap or two to make hay as the others struggled to get their used hard tyres up to temp so while he wohld have been on the better tyres anyway, those initial laps were the ones to male his moves and win the race.
Id but the incident itself down to racing incident as hamilton could do little to tighten his line at that point id say.
Not impressed with Hamiltons comment after the race re taking the knee at the start claiming those drivers that didnt show a lack of understanding.

H3llR4iser · 06-07-2020 12:55am

AMKC wrote: »

I think Austria should be the opening race of every season from now on. So much better than Melbourne even if the first part was a bit boring. The whole race in Australia would have been boring.

That'd be lovely, although I have a strong suspicion March isn't exactly a scorcher of a month in Styria. But you know, if rain mixes races up, potential snow is gonna be a riot

ro_chez · 06-07-2020 1:18am

Larbre34 wrote: »

Hamilton did absolutely nothing there. And I've no love for him whatsoever.

Albon attempted a move that physics was never going to allow.

No, if a driver is going into a corner on a defensive line(like Hamilton was), they should at least keep that line through and out of the corner if they cant see the other car in their mirrors.

And Albon was in front of him by a wheel, so Ham obviously would not have seen him behind, and should therefore presumed he was alongside, and given more room on the exit of the corner.

Poor racecraft/situational awareness by Hamilton imo.

06-07-2020 8:04am

chicorytip wrote: »

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought.

I think you will find that the majority of F1 fans will disagree with you.

Harika · 06-07-2020 8:12am

https://mobile.twitter.com/TommyWTF1/status/1279851277258764295

Norris coached and pushed for the last lap.

Harika · 06-07-2020 8:16am

H3llR4iser wrote: »

That'd be lovely, although I have a strong suspicion March isn't exactly a scorcher of a month in Styria. But you know, if rain mixes races up, potential snow is gonna be a riot

March is still good for skiing and snowfall then is not unheard of.
Australia with low reliability gets also exciting, Austria with its high full throttle percentage and sausage kerbs shake all deficiency out of cars.

HighLine · 06-07-2020 9:22am

Harika wrote: »

https://mobile.twitter.com/TommyWTF1/status/1279851277258764295

Norris coached and pushed for the last lap.

It was a fantastic lap and was delighted to see him get on the podium but I don't like to hear a driver being coached around a lap.

Burkie1203 · 06-07-2020 9:30am

HighLine wrote: »

It was a fantastic lap and was delighted to see him get on the podium but I don't like to hear a driver being coached around a lap.

The two mercs were being coached for most of the race from pit wall.

quokula · 06-07-2020 9:31am

HighLine wrote: »

It was a fantastic lap and was delighted to see him get on the podium but I don't like to hear a driver being coached around a lap.

I wouldn’t call that coaching. He’s not being advised on racing lines or braking points or anything, just which straights to press the magic boost button on. Which will depend on the telemetry the team have on the state of the energy storage, temperatures etc. I’d prefer if all that stuff didn’t exist, but as long as it does the drivers always get told how much is available at different stages of the race.

BikeRacer · 06-07-2020 9:39am

2011 wrote: »

I think you will find that the majority of F1 fans will disagree with you.

Trying to have a civil discussion around anything Hamilton does has become increasing difficult. I'm sure there are plenty who thought it was a racing incident, but a lot of social media including here have turned into an anti-Hamilton echo chamber so people just won't bother.

Joeface · 06-07-2020 9:40am

it was a little bit too much coaching , dulls the Lando Podium a tiny bit . I get the driver has to choose the racing line , but been instructed to one push of the overtake out certain corners and then 5secs for the next that is a little bit far. I am sure its on the radio all the time for drives but dulls it bi t. Still agreat drive and Nice podium steal as I think Charles had just got the fastest lap right a head of Lando robbing it back .

ELM327 · 06-07-2020 9:51am

chicorytip wrote: »

The penalising of Hamilton was harsh, I thought. It was a rash move by Albon. Horner's claim that he "had got the job done" when the collision occurred is ludicrous. The Red Bull was less than half a car length ahead at that point and Lewis did nothing more than defend his position. A more experienced driver than Albon would have bided his time and waited for a clearer opportunity to overtake particularly as it appeared the Red Bull was the faster car at that stage of the race.

If your front tire hits the back tire of t he other car, it's usually your fault

06-07-2020 9:53am

I don’t like the coaching either. All teams do it though, right?

I get the radio chat if you’ve got an issue and they tell you to change some settings but all drivers should have to use their own intuition and ability for everything else.

quokula · 06-07-2020 9:57am

Joeface wrote: »

it was a little bit too much coaching , dulls the Lando Podium a tiny bit . I get the driver has to choose the racing line , but been instructed to one push of the overtake out certain corners and then 5secs for the next that is a little bit far. I am sure its on the radio all the time for drives but dulls it bi t. Still agreat drive and Nice podium steal as I think Charles had just got the fastest lap right a head of Lando robbing it back .

I don't really agree with that. Throttle, brake, steering, gears - these are the inputs a driver should be the master of. Pressing buttons on the steering wheel to define how long you spend in different engine modes, that depends entirely on the state of the engine and how much it needs to be preserved, which is driven by the team. Every driver on the grid is being told when, and how much energy they have available to use all the time.

Personally I'd rather ditch all that entirely and go back to proper racing engines, but too much money has been invested in these hybrids for them to ever countenance going back to something better suited to great racing.

Harika · 06-07-2020 12:08pm

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I don’t like the coaching either. All teams do it though, right?

I get the radio chat if you’ve got an issue and they tell you to change some settings but all drivers should have to use their own intuition and ability for everything else.

When it first was broadcast people didn't like it then it was banned what led to comical situations like Lewis in Baku, so gentlemen agreement was struck that FOM won't broadcast this messages anymore.

ELM327 · 06-07-2020 12:18pm

I'd say it happens a lot in qualifying too.

Mike3287 · 06-07-2020 3:28pm

quokula wrote: »

I don't really agree with that. Throttle, brake, steering, gears - these are the inputs a driver should be the master of. Pressing buttons on the steering wheel to define how long you spend in different engine modes, that depends entirely on the state of the engine and how much it needs to be preserved, which is driven by the team. Every driver on the grid is being told when, and how much energy they have available to use all the time.

Personally I'd rather ditch all that entirely and go back to proper racing engines, but too much money has been invested in these hybrids for them to ever countenance going back to something better suited to great racing.

It's no wonder they have advice when you read stuff like below

In all, Formula 1 considers there are six separate elements powering the cars racing during Grand Prix races: the engine, the turbocharger, the MGU-K, the MGU-H, the Energy Store and the control electronics.

Each of the drivers is entitled to using only four of each of these systems per season. Using more than four of any one component during a race will lead to the driver being penalized on the grid from five to ten places.
Drivers are capable of switching to different power unit settings or dictate how much energy ERS recovers through steering wheel controls.

Having ERS allows the driver to either go for a very fast lap time by going full power or saving energy to overtake at critical points while giving up on setting record lap times.

06-07-2020 6:11pm

Saw someone on Twitter mention it looked like he was lifting and coasting into corners on that lap , I thought I noticed it through the race with most on-boards. I assume it's for charging and make sure they have full power out of the corners. Along with the instructions I don't like it.

murphyebass · 06-07-2020 9:29pm

To be fair there’s just too much tech rubbish in F1 these days.

That and way too much disparity amongst teams due to money.

The new regs will help with the money but not enough unfortunately.

I’d love all the cars to be the same and the drivers making the difference. It’ll never happen due to money but a man can dream.

Rodney Bathgate · 06-07-2020 9:37pm

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

I don’t like the coaching either. All teams do it though, right?

I get the radio chat if you’ve got an issue and they tell you to change some settings but all drivers should have to use their own intuition and ability for everything else.

Early on Hamilton asked where he was losing time to Bottas, the engineer mentioned 2 corners, so Hamilton was also being coached, in this case Hamilton asking for the coaching.

Jordan 199 · 06-07-2020 10:03pm

afatbollix · 06-07-2020 10:19pm

A bit strange that people are complaining about engineers talking to the drivers.

The drivers now have beeps when to change gears, When to lift off to save fuel.

This happens in all sport, Football with the coach going mental on the sideline, Rugby with the water boys running on with headsets to pass on info from the coaches and spotters in the grandstands. Cycling with radios and team cars and make sure you dont watch the american motorsports they have to be told when to turn right...

Sport these days are all about the marginal gains and that is how you win or in this case, get onto the podium.

That brings me on to the next point about Hamilton and I feel like he has taken his eye off the ball by going down an activist route and not concentrating on his racecraft. Hamilton is renowned for being very anal about his racing with debriefs lasting hours and literly talking about each lap down to each gear change. I have a feeling he has spent time worrying and pushing his ideas around which is fine but I have a feeling it was that 5% thinking about it that landed him in 4th today and hopefully he will get it back.

BikeRacer · 06-07-2020 10:52pm

Rodney Bathgate wrote: »

Early on Hamilton asked where he was losing time to Bottas, the engineer mentioned 2 corners, so Hamilton was also being coached, in this case Hamilton asking for the coaching.

And to think if only Bottas thought to ask this to his race engineer every race about Hamilton, he might have 3 world championships by now.

pjohnson · 07-07-2020 9:27am

Those last two laps Lando put in.

Top Dog · 07-07-2020 9:52am

Saw somewhere last night that Landos fastest lap was identical to the fastest lap in 2019 done by Max - to the thousandth! :eek::cool:

naughto · 07-07-2020 10:08am

Low fuel loads would definitely help

Mike3287 · 07-07-2020 11:10am

naughto wrote: »

Low fuel loads would definitely help

A 2 second a lap difference between lap 66 and 71 suggests car was coasting along?

They are babying those cars so much?

F1 season start - Austria

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