Why is Ireland lagging behind the world in cannabis legalisation / decriminalisation?

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 02:45PM #1

Recreational cannabis should be fully decriminalised and made available to any adult over 18 like the Netherlands and the vintners should have zero say in it.

Cannabis is no more a "gateway" drug than booze is. Besides, cannabis gives a different "high" than cocaine, benzos etc. So the "gateway" argument is bullshit.

The Netherlands is no more or less functional as a society than we are and regulating the source of it will remove the criminality.

A good chunk of the world and even certain US states have either opted for partial decriminalisation or full legalisation. The fact that a young lad or girl can end up with a lifelong conviction for smoking a joint is despicable.

Alcohol caused far more societal problems. People don't eject from coffeeshops beating each other up, vandalising property and assaulting their husbands and wives.

Cannabis legalisation would decimate alcohol industry.

is_that_so · 21-06-2020 02:47PM

Supposedly lagging behind The Netherlands is not lagging behind the world.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 02:50PM

Decriminalisation only

is_that_so wrote: »

Supposedly lagging behind The Netherlands is not lagging behind the world.

Read my post like a good kid.

I gave NL as one specific example. The US, Canada and Portugal and other jurisdictions also meet the description.

GarIT · 21-06-2020 02:52PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Read my post like a good kid.

I gave NL as one specific example. The US, Canada and Portugal also meet the description.

Behind 4 of 200+ is not lagging behind.

TuringBot47 · 21-06-2020 02:53PM

And how many doped out potheads are a positive influence on society?
Does it help them to work and contribute to society, or does it just mean they can be lazy nobodies drugged out on their sofa?

Of course it's a gateway drug.
They get their weed from drug dealers, you don't think they try upselling?

I'd a brother-in-law... never harmed a soul, but loved his weed.
Out of employment more than he was in it.

Got a call he was found dead on his sofa.
I still remember the roars of his mother as his body was brought into their sitting room before the funeral.

These days, alcohol would be considered a drug and banned. But too ingrained in society.

Decriminalising drugs only helps the useless losers that use them, certainly does absolutely no good for the decent people who contribute to society.

GarIT · 21-06-2020 02:54PM

TuringBot47 wrote: »

And how many doped out potheads are a positive influence on society?
Does it help them to work and contribute to society, or does it just mean they can be lazy nobodies drugged out on their sofa?

Of course it's a gateway drug.
They get their weed from drug dealers, you don't think they try upselling?

I'd a brother-in-law... never harmed a soul, but loved his weed.
Out of employment more than he was in it.

Got a call he was found dead on his sofa.
I still remember the roars of his mother as his body was brought into their sitting room before the funeral.

These days, alcohol would be considered a drug and banned. But too ingrained in society.

Decriminalising drugs only helps the useless losers that use them, certainly does absolutely no good for the decent people who contribute to society.

If they were getting their weed in Tesco they wouldn't need to go to drug dealers.

Portugal decriminalised and has some of the lowest usage and best attitude to drugs in the world. Treating drug use as a medical issue and not a criminal one has proven to be more effective in lowering drug use and improving public safety.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 02:55PM

Decriminalisation only

GarIT wrote: »

Behind 4 of 200+ is not lagging behind.

Countries in blue have opted for full legalisation.

Countries in orange have opted for decriminalisation (including NL).

There's a lot more than 4.

Stark · 21-06-2020 02:56PM

Decriminalisation only

No interest in it personally but it's been legalised/decriminalised in most places in the US and the sky hasn't fallen in there. (Well the sky has fallen for other reasons but not the cannabis).

Notmything · 21-06-2020 02:56PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Cannabis is no more a "gateway" drug than booze is. Besides, cannabis gives a different "high" than cocaine, benzos etc. So the "gateway" argument is bull

I've worked with far too many young people, and adults who started out on weed/cannabis and ended up going onto harder drugs to accept the above. Not everyone who uses cannabis will, that's true, but there is no way it is not a gateway drug for many.

But it's like alcohol, some people can regularly partake with no issues while others end up in a bad way because of their habit/addiction.

Decriminalise no, but maybe look at alternative ways of dealing with people caught with small amounts.

is_that_so · 21-06-2020 02:56PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Read my post like a good kid.

I gave NL as one specific example. The US, Canada and Portugal and other jurisdictions also meet the description.

So the world has now grown to 4 countries! You seem much given to hyperbole!

talla10 · 21-06-2020 02:57PM

GarIT wrote: »

If they were getting their weed in Tesco they wouldn't need to go to drug dealers.

.

Tesco sell cigerettes. How many are still imported illegally to avoid paying custom and tax charges?

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 02:58PM

Decriminalisation only

TuringBot47 wrote: »

And how many doped out potheads are a positive influence on society?
Does it help them to work and contribute to society, or does it just mean they can be lazy nobodies drugged out on their sofa?

Of course it's a gateway drug.
They get their weed from drug dealers, you don't think they try upselling?

I'd a brother-in-law... never harmed a soul, but loved his weed.
Out of employment more than he was in it.

Got a call he was found dead on his sofa.
I still remember the roars of his mother as his body was brought into their sitting room before the funeral.

These days, alcohol would be considered a drug and banned. But too ingrained in society.

Decriminalising drugs only helps the useless losers that use them, certainly does absolutely no good for the decent people who contribute to society.

If it was legal you wouldn't be "sourcing it from a drug dealer trying to upsell".

"Potheads" are no more a societal scourge than alcoholics, of which there are many here.

Stark · 21-06-2020 02:58PM

Decriminalisation only

Notmything wrote: »

I've worked with far too many young people, and adults who started out on weed/cannabis and ended up going onto harder drugs to accept the above. Not everyone who uses cannabis will, that's true, but there is no way it is not a gateway drug for many.

How much of this is due to having to make contacts with dodgy people who also happen to sell harder drugs in order to avail of it.

Alcohol and cigarettes would probably be "gateway drugs" also if you had to go to a dodgy dealer to buy some as opposed to buying from legitimate regulated premises.

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 03:00PM

Decriminalisation only

is_that_so wrote: »

So the world has now grown to 4 countries! You seem much given to hyperbole!

I said AND OTHER COUNTRIES TOO.

Read before posting.... Christ.

Dr Bob · 21-06-2020 03:02PM

Vintners association have a fair bit of pull politically , and anything that might negatively effect pubs tends to be pushed down.

Flickerfusion · 21-06-2020 03:02PM

Decriminalisation only

Is it not a gateway drug precisely *BECAUSE* it's criminalised and thus introduces people to dealers who may then introduce them to harder drugs?

I mean imagine if the only way you could get alcohol was to buy it from a drug dealer? Then alcohol would be a gateway to heroin too.

Badly Drunk Boy · 21-06-2020 03:02PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Read my post like a good kid.

I gave NL as one specific example. The US, Canada and Portugal and other jurisdictions also meet the description.

Look at you map you put up yourself. Most of the world is red, meaning it's illegal there. I'm not bothered either way, just wanted to point out that your post is flawed.

GarIT · 21-06-2020 03:03PM

talla10 wrote: »

Tesco sell cigerettes. How many are still imported illegally to avoid paying custom and tax charges?

What % is sold illegally, even if 10% were sold illegally its still brings 90% off the streets instead of 0%. And the reason I said that in the first place is that someone said interesting with dealers gets people onto harder drugs, if that's the case any reduction in interacting with dealers is positive.

GarIT · 21-06-2020 03:04PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

I said AND OTHER COUNTRIES TOO.

Read before posting.... Christ.

While I support legalising your arguments for it has been absolute ****e tbh

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! · 21-06-2020 03:09PM

Decriminalisation only

GarIT wrote: »

While I support legalising your arguments for it has been absolute ****e tbh

Which specific aspects of my argument, pray tell.

Church on Tuesday · 21-06-2020 03:13PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

Recreational cannabis should be fully decriminalised and made available to any adult over 18 like the Netherlands and the vintners should have zero say in it.

Cannabis is no more a "gateway" drug than booze is. Besides, cannabis gives a different "high" than cocaine, benzos etc. So the "gateway" argument is bullshit.

The Netherlands is no more or less functional as a society than we are and regulating the source of it will remove the criminality.

A good chunk of the world and even certain US states have either opted for partial decriminalisation or full legalisation. The fact that a young lad or girl can end up with a lifelong conviction for smoking a joint is despicable.

Alcohol caused far more societal problems. People don't eject from coffeeshops beating each other up, vandalising property and assaulting their husbands and wives.

Cannabis legalisation would decimate alcohol industry.

It absolutely is.

Smells like **** too.

TuringBot47 · 21-06-2020 03:13PM

Hairy Japanese BASTARDS! wrote: »

"Potheads" are no more a societal scourge than alcoholics, of which there are many here.

Trying to say "we're no worse than X" really isn't arguing your case.
What positive influence do they have?

In fact, your thinking must be so blurred, I'll actually argue on your side a little.
There appears to be a lot of positive medicinal benefits of cannabis derived drugs, to certainly open it up to limited specific medical applications.

But doesn't mean it should be sold uncontrolled like cigarettes.

Lyan · 21-06-2020 03:18PM

Decriminalisation only

I am for legalizing it, but can we just agree thgat those who use it are for the most part useless people who are often predisposed to using escapism and stimulant drugs in general (including alcohol)?

Your Face · 21-06-2020 03:20PM

Familiar posting style.

jaxxx · 21-06-2020 03:21PM

Let idiots be idiots, but don't waste resources trying to save said idiots from their own idiocy.

That make sense?

I think it makes sense.

Let good old fashioned Darwinism work its magic.

Notmything · 21-06-2020 03:23PM

Stark wrote: »

How much of this is due to having to make contacts with dodgy people who also happen to sell harder drugs in order to avail of it.

Alcohol and cigarettes would probably be "gateway drugs" also if you had to go to a dodgy dealer to buy some as opposed to buying from legitimate regulated premises.

It's often a multi factorial issue. Some go onto harder drugs because they are chasing a new or better high. Some are offered drugs by dealers. Some go on to harder drugs because it's what they see happen in their family.

You might be shocked at how many end up on drugs from peer pressure within their family.

But whether they buy it from a dealer, off their brother or from a legalised source it is still going to be a gateway drug for some to move onto harder stuff.

Alcohol is legal and regulated but that doesn't mean people are happy to drink lager or ale, how many move onto shots on a night out or drink a bottle of spirits so they can get the buzz quickly?

Notmything · 21-06-2020 03:25PM

Flickerfusion wrote: »

Is it not a gateway drug precisely *BECAUSE* it's criminalised and thus introduces people to dealers who may then introduce them to harder drugs?

I mean imagine if the only way you could get alcohol was to buy it from a drug dealer? Then alcohol would be a gateway to heroin too.

Is it not a "gateway" drug because often it leads to trying other, harder drugs. Even if it was decriminalised it would still result in people wanting to try other drugs.

Hoboo · 21-06-2020 03:26PM

TuringBot47 wrote: »

And how many doped out potheads are a positive influence on society?
Does it help them to work and contribute to society, or does it just mean they can be lazy nobodies drugged out on their sofa?

Of course it's a gateway drug.
They get their weed from drug dealers, you don't think they try upselling?

I'd a brother-in-law... never harmed a soul, but loved his weed.
Out of employment more than he was in it.

Got a call he was found dead on his sofa.
I still remember the roars of his mother as his body was brought into their sitting room before the funeral.

These days, alcohol would be considered a drug and banned. But too ingrained in society.

Decriminalising drugs only helps the useless losers that use them, certainly does absolutely no good for the decent people who contribute to society.

That's awful. What did he die of?

Hoboo · 21-06-2020 03:27PM

Notmything wrote: »

Is it not a "gateway" drug because often it leads to trying other, harder drugs. Even if it was decriminalised it would still result in people wanting to try other drugs.

So alcohol is therefore a gateway drug.

JohnnyFlash · 21-06-2020 03:30PM

It’s a dirty and dangerous drug that is causing a huge spike in young men presenting at psychiatric facilities with life-changing cases of psychosis.

Notmything · 21-06-2020 03:36PM

Hoboo wrote: »

So alcohol is therefore a gateway drug.

Yep, in my professional experience it is. Never argued it wasn't.

Why is Ireland lagging behind the world in cannabis legalisation / decriminalisation?

Legalise recreational cannabis? 153 votes

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