Domestic Solar PV Quotes 2020

11-05-2020 08:36AM

championc wrote: »

Midsummer.ie or solartricity.ie are good starting points

Tiles may need some grinding off the underside, depending on the brackets bought. Obviously slates need cutting and so are a totally different ballgame.

Thanks,
I'll take a look.
I spent the summer after my leaving cert as a roof tiler,but that is starting to feel like a loooongg time ago

ActingDanClark · 11-05-2020 07:01PM

BrownFinger wrote: »

Thanks,
I'll take a look.
I spent the summer after my leaving cert as a roof tiler,but that is starting to feel like a loooongg time ago

Leaving cert? What that then?

cameramonkey · 11-05-2020 07:05PM

bilbot79 wrote: »

Surely the greens will get grants upped etc?

Grants up, prices up. They should revisit schemes to make them more competitive for consumers.

gomamochi1 · 14-05-2020 12:28AM

cameramonkey wrote: »

Grants up, prices up. They should revisit schemes to make them more competitive for consumers.

Best quote I got yet--see price as follows . Jsa Solar panel mono crystalline 305kw 14 number.4.8kw battery.5kw solis invertor.i boast water heater.zappy car charger.fitted and commissions total price €11100 .your grant will be €3600 paid to you by seai making total price €7500 depending on site survey.
_______________
I Had a quick look around. That UC2000 battery is 700 pounds for 1.

https://www.itstechnologies.shop/products/pylontech-us2000-2-4kwh-solar-battery-storage

You can get 2 of them and an inverter for 2700stg on ebay.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Pylontech-US2000-4-8kWh-Lithium-with-5kW-Off-Grid-Conversol-V5-Charger-MPPT-48V/223425948090?hash=item34053969ba:g:xHUAAOSwdUxdf6J0

The JA Solar monocrystaline panels are €150
https://mpe-online.ie/shop/pv-solar/pv-solar-panels/q-cell-monocrystalline-pv-solar-panel-305w/
Solis iboost 300e

So, ignoring the grant, total materials is around 6k, give or take. He's charging 5k for the install - that's €312/hour for his work, if it takes 2 days.

This is the painful truth that any grant scheme in Ireland goes straight in installers pockets not the consumer.

Pushing me more towards DIY with sparks bro in law... is it worth it from the DIY'rs on here and can you still claim the grant or is it gone for a DIY?

unkel · 14-05-2020 01:05AM

That might not be a bad quote, a Zappi is not cheap for starters and he quoted for twice the size of the smallest batteries some people get. Does he include the €600 subsidy for the EV charge point install? You only get that if you just bought an EV. Did you? Did you get a quote for the same size 4.3kwp system without booster, Zappi or batteries? Or with one battery?

You can only claim the grant if the install is done by an SEAI approved installer

If you are going DIY, do not include new lithium batteries as they will never pay for themselves

gomamochi1 · 14-05-2020 01:17AM

unkel wrote: »

That might not be a bad quote, a Zappi is not cheap for starters and he quoted for twice the size of the smallest batteries some people get. Does he include the €600 subsidy for the EV charge point install? You only get that if you just bought an EV. Did you? Did you get a quote for the same size 4.3kwp system without booster, Zappi or batteries? Or with one battery?

You can only claim the grant if the install is done by an SEAI approved installer

If you are going DIY, do not include new lithium batteries as they will never pay for themselves

Thought it was a good quote too until I looked up everything....
He included the 600 ev charger grant as it's only new ev to our house.
Also have solar thermal 5 years so maybe no need for iboost.

Didn't get the separate quote minus the booster, zappi or batteries though guessing it would be in the range of:
- 1000e zappi 2
-300e ibooster for immersion
-2000e 2x 2.4kw batteries

garo · 14-05-2020 01:33PM

I think it includes the 600 grant for the Zappi. You can see the grant is 3600. I would ask for a quote without Zappi, iBoost and just a single 2.4kW battery. You should get that down to 5500-6000 ex grant. Also as I mentioned in PM, when costing a self-install take VAT and shipping into account. You'll be paying 23% VAT.

gomamochi1 · 14-05-2020 01:43PM

garo wrote: »

I think it includes the 600 grant for the Zappi. You can see the grant is 3600. I would ask for a quote without Zappi, iBoost and just a single 2.4kW battery. You should get that down to 5500-6000 ex grant. Also as I mentioned in PM, when costing a self-install take VAT and shipping into account. You'll be paying 23% VAT.

Best quote so far-
7 panels on east facing roof and associated Solis 6KW Hybrid inverter, 14 panels on west facing Garage roof, 4.8 KWH Battery, I boost Water heater, Zappi 2 Untethered Car Charger, 8500e Net cost to me after grant which they apply for.

Or Alternatively 7000e- Original setup - 14 panels on West facing roof, Solis 6KW Hybrid Inverter (future proofing to get more panels and batteries at later date), 4.8KW Battery, I boost Water heater, Zappi 2 Untethered Car Charger.
What do ye think folks? looking more likely get them than self install? Thanks

unkel · 14-05-2020 04:37PM

garo wrote: »

I would ask for a quote without Zappi, iBoost and just a single 2.4kW battery. You should get that down to 5500-6000 ex grant. Also as I mentioned in PM

Mentioned exact same thing in PM

gomamochi1 · 14-05-2020 06:56PM

unkel wrote: »

Mentioned exact same thing in PM

Thanks to you both and everyone on this forum. Going for scaled down model with a view to adding more pv and batteries at a later date with a larger 6kw solis inverter.

unkel · 14-05-2020 07:59PM

I'd stick in as much PV as you can, right from the start. Once they're up, they're up. They will last forever. And they are dirt cheap (compared to install costs, inverters, batteries, etc.)

Geeyfds53573 · 14-05-2020 09:03PM

Thanks guys for all the knowledge and support it has been really helpful. Apologise if I get some terminologies incorrect on a few questions I have please. Going for SE NW install (no choice) with limited space due to velux windows. I reckon 5 panels NW and 7 SE so prob need 400 and 300 panels so 4 kw in total. Does this make sense? Any advice? Also do I need a second inverter i.e. not all on the one string or will one inverter do once it is over the total of 4 kw? Does anything extra need to get done now to take advance of the FIT when it come available? Also I have looked at Eddie and Zappi but will park for now but I do understand that you can prioritise one over the other but if I got a small battery will i be able to change the priority on it’s charging? Also would the battery take from both strings? Any other advice?

reklamos · 15-05-2020 06:55AM

Geeyfds53573 wrote: »

Thanks guys for all the knowledge and support it has been really helpful. Apologise if I get some terminologies incorrect on a few questions I have please. Going for SE NW install (no choice) with limited space due to velux windows. I reckon 5 panels NW and 7 SE so prob need 400 and 300 panels so 4 kw in total. Does this make sense? Any advice? Also do I need a second inverter i.e. not all on the one string or will one inverter do once it is over the total of 4 kw? Does anything extra need to get done now to take advance of the FIT when it come available? Also I have looked at Eddie and Zappi but will park for now but I do understand that you can prioritise one over the other but if I got a small battery will i be able to change the priority on it’s charging? Also would the battery take from both strings? Any other advice?

There are plenty dual MPPT inverters on the market so you can split your strings. The other option is optimizers but then the price does go up. Check if you have enough space for 400W panels as they are bigger in size compared to 300 ones.

Geeyfds53573 · 15-05-2020 07:24AM

reklamos wrote: »

There are plenty dual MPPT inverters on the market so you can split your strings. The other option is optimizers but then the price does go up. Check if you have enough space for 400W panels as they are bigger in size compared to 300 ones.

Thank you, any brand that’s good but not too expensive and any installer that you know does 400w or higher and still offers a fair price for install.

championc · 15-05-2020 08:28AM

Geeyfds53573 wrote: »

Going for SE NW install (no choice) with limited space due to velux windows. I reckon 5 panels NW and 7 SE so prob need 400 and 300 panels so 4 kw in total. Does this make sense?

You need to look at the NW carefully. It may be pointless. Carefully look at how much sun ACTUALLY shines on that surface currently, and at what angle the sun hits it. If it only got sun for the last few hours of the day, at this time of year, you may well have almost zero for the 6 months from Oct to Mar

Geeyfds53573 wrote: »

Also do I need a second inverter i.e. not all on the one string or will one inverter do once it is over the total of 4 kw?

See my post #177 - NEVER combine panels on different roofs on the same string. If one lot is in sunshine, the others could be in shade, and will kill the output of the sunny panels. You would need a Dual String inverter, or two serparate units

Geeyfds53573 wrote: »

Does anything extra need to get done now to take advance of the FIT when it come available?

Don't hold your breath for FIT coming any time soon

Geeyfds53573 wrote: »

Also I have looked at Eddie and Zappi but will park for now but I do understand that you can prioritise one over the other but if I got a small battery will i be able to change the priority on it’s charging? Also would the battery take from both strings?

You can prioritize Zappi over Eddi and vise versa. But there are two things with charging a battery.
1. With a Hybrid Inverter, the Battery charging is inbuilt into the Inverter so the Inverter will always (I believe) charge it's (on-board) battery first
2. Given that a Hybrid Inverter has the battery as part of the unit, the Zappi or Eddi cannot see the battery element and so cannot affect charging of the battery. This can only be done (in a limited way) with a separate Storage Inverter (like a Sofar ME3000SP / Tesla Powerwall)

unkel · 15-05-2020 08:40AM

championc wrote: »

You need to look at the NW carefully. It may be pointless. Carefully look at how much sun ACTUALLY shines on that surface currently, and at what angle the sun hits it. If it only got sun for the last few hours of the day, at this time of year, you may well have almost zero for the 6 months from Oct to Mar

Quentin Gargan demonstrated on this forum before that even a pure north facing panel produces about 50% of what a south facing panel produces in Ireland if I remember right. So it's not so bad at all. Not sure, but NW might be worse than north, we would need to use a calculator to be sure

championc · 15-05-2020 09:46AM

unkel wrote: »

Quentin Gargan demonstrated on this forum before that even a pure north facing panel produces about 50% of what a south facing panel produces in Ireland if I remember right. So it's not so bad at all. Not sure, but NW might be worse than north, we would need to use a calculator to be sure

The roof slope will be a big factor, since the apex of the roof will block the sun from coming over the top. 50% seems very high. Obviously on a cloudy day, output would be more or less equal,

gomamochi1 · 15-05-2020 10:45AM

https://zerohomebills.com/product/solis-1p6k-4g-single-phase-dual-mppt-6kw-solar-inverter-w-dc-isolator/

Does this solis hybrid inverter take two strings ie easy facing roof on house and west facing roof on garage? Thanks

reklamos · 15-05-2020 02:03PM

gomamochi1 wrote: »

https://zerohomebills.com/product/solis-1p6k-4g-single-phase-dual-mppt-6kw-solar-inverter-w-dc-isolator/

Does this solis hybrid inverter take two strings ie easy facing roof on house and west facing roof on garage? Thanks

It does 'Dual MPPT design'

garo · 15-05-2020 10:46PM

championc wrote: »

The roof slope will be a big factor, since the apex of the roof will block the sun from coming over the top. 50% seems very high. Obviously on a cloudy day, output would be more or less equal,

True roof slope will be a factor and you may get very little output Nov-Feb compared to a S facing panel. But I just looked up a panel at 30 degree tilt facing NW and it produces 55% of a S facing panel and 70% of a panel facing due E or due W.

@Geefy: I wouldn't really bother with a 400W panel. Look at the cost per W in making your decision. The higher output panels are generally larger and not much more efficient per sq. m. 12x335W panels would get you over 4kW. Most inverters including the Solis are dual MPPT so should be fine for your setup. Don't bother with the Zappi or Eddi. Go for a small battery to maximize the grant.

unkel · 16-05-2020 05:03PM

garo wrote: »

True roof slope will be a factor and you may get very little output Nov-Feb compared to a S facing panel. But I just looked up a panel at 30 degree tilt facing NW and it produces 55% of a S facing panel and 70% of a panel facing due E or due W.

If panels would get a good bit cheaper (and we got a FIT), I'd be tempted to plaster my north facing roof with PV as well.

gomamochi1 · 18-05-2020 02:44AM

unkel wrote: »

If panels would get a good bit cheaper (and we got a FIT), I'd be tempted to plaster my north facing roof with PV as well.

Is there a website or app that can gauge the best pitch and aspect for northern hemisphere countries like ireland . Also heard on here about vertical mounting panels for eg gable end of garage is south facing would it be worth it along with west garage roof? Thanks

championc · 18-05-2020 08:24AM

gomamochi1 wrote: »

Is there a website or app that can gauge the best pitch and aspect for northern hemisphere countries like ireland . Also heard on here about vertical mounting panels for eg gable end of garage is south facing would it be worth it along with west garage roof? Thanks

First of all, to see the sun angle at any time of the day, on any day of the year, use https://www.timeanddate.com/sun/ireland/dublin

So the optimum is to have the sun directly overhead and therefore perfectly perpendicular to your panels. Therefore, vertical panels on a gable end wall facing west will be increasing in output as a setting sun gets lower in the sky, with the angles becoming more and more favourable by the minute

garo · 18-05-2020 09:46AM

gomamochi1 wrote: »

Is there a website or app that can gauge the best pitch and aspect for northern hemisphere countries like ireland . Also heard on here about vertical mounting panels for eg gable end of garage is south facing would it be worth it along with west garage roof? Thanks

Google PV-GIS. Ah here: https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/en/pvgis

But remember you are not just trying to maximize total output but output at the times you need electricity. No point having loads of output at noon when no one is in the house and then nothing at 6pm.

gomamochi1 · 18-05-2020 10:26AM

garo wrote: »

Google PV-GIS. Ah here: https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/en/pvgis

But remember you are not just trying to maximize total output but output at the times you need electricity. No point having loads of output at noon when no one is in the house and then nothing at 6pm.

Thanks was on that website already though could not make sense of it. I am trying to maximise the solar gain as the system we are getting has 4.8kw pv panels with 4.8kw battery's and hope to charge EV at home some days and run the gaff off the batteries at night and remainder to go into the car at night when things get back to normal we will be doing more miles than we are presently just in out of town twice a day at present.
My query is there some benefit in northern hemisphere countries to place panels on the same string west facing roof and some on vertical south facing gable end of garage that may take more gains in winter that i will loose on the E/W facing roof from Nov to Mar? thanks for all the useful info direction and recommendations folks.

phester28 · 18-05-2020 11:47AM

You cant (shouldn't) combine panels on different directions as the ones not producing would pull down the whole string to the lowest panel.

Now it is possible using optimiziers for each panel but that adds cost to your install. They would effectively disconnect or (more efficiently do a dc to dc conversion to match the normal production voltage but limit the current. Or some just put the lower producing into a high impedance (bypass mode)

Some brands optimiziers may do things differently and there may be a possibility of paralleling with bypass diodes the effective two strings (within one string). But I do not know enough about this to comment properly. Open to correction on any of these points

garo · 18-05-2020 12:42PM

gomamochi1 wrote: »

Thanks was on that website already though could not make sense of it. I am trying to maximise the solar gain as the system we are getting has 4.8kw pv panels with 4.8kw battery's and hope to charge EV at home some days and run the gaff off the batteries at night and remainder to go into the car at night when things get back to normal we will be doing more miles than we are presently just in out of town twice a day at present.
My query is there some benefit in northern hemisphere countries to place panels on the same string west facing roof and some on vertical south facing gable end of garage that may take more gains in winter that i will loose on the E/W facing roof from Nov to Mar? thanks for all the useful info direction and recommendations folks.

If you are asking whether you should put your two strings S, W instead of E, W the answer is we cannot tell unless you tell us your hourly usage pattern. Even an E/W system gives max output near solar noon. As mentioned by phester28, do not put different facing panels on the same string.

championc · 18-05-2020 06:20PM

gomamochi1 wrote: »

Thanks was on that website already though could not make sense of it. I am trying to maximise the solar gain as the system we are getting has 4.8kw pv panels with 4.8kw battery's and hope to charge EV at home some days and run the gaff off the batteries at night and remainder to go into the car at night when things get back to normal we will be doing more miles than we are presently just in out of town twice a day at present.
My query is there some benefit in northern hemisphere countries to place panels on the same string west facing roof and some on vertical south facing gable end of garage that may take more gains in winter that i will loose on the E/W facing roof from Nov to Mar? thanks for all the useful info direction and recommendations folks.

I think I know where you're coming from. In the northern hemisphere above about 45 deg lat, if you could rotate panels on one single axis to follow the sun, it makes more sense to rotate on the vertical rather than the horizontal. But South facing and vertical is indeed an option. If you could rig up something to tilt it slightly in steps every second month, that would be even better.

Remember though, output will be massively impacted until the point in the day when ALL panels can be hit by sunshine, so you'll get little or nothing until the last cell of the last panel on the West side is hit by sunshine, unless you fitted any shaded panel(s) with optimizer(s)

I think you also need to do your sums a bit more on the battery output. If the house consumes 500w per hour in the evening and 250w per hour after midnight, that's about 2kw possibly gone by midnight, and another 2kw by 8am. In addition, you'll get feck all for 4kw into an EV. For EV charging at night, forget about battery use an look at any power coming from night rate. Batteries are really only worthwhile to get you from dusk to nightrate start time. There's no point in batteries saving the payment of sub-10 cent kw units and as many will attest, even recouping the investment against full-price units is very doubtful.

Hope this helps

gomamochi1 · 18-05-2020 08:35PM

championc wrote: »

I think I know where you're coming from. In the northern hemisphere above about 45 deg lat, if you could rotate panels on one single axis to follow the sun, it makes more sense to rotate on the vertical rather than the horizontal. But South facing and vertical is indeed an option. If you could rig up something to tilt it slightly in steps every second month, that would be even better.

Remember though, output will be massively impacted until the point in the day when ALL panels can be hit by sunshine, so you'll get little or nothing until the last cell of the last panel on the West side is hit by sunshine, unless you fitted any shaded panel(s) with optimizer(s)

I think you also need to do your sums a bit more on the battery output. If the house consumes 500w per hour in the evening and 250w per hour after midnight, that's about 2kw possibly gone by midnight, and another 2kw by 8am. In addition, you'll get feck all for 4kw into an EV. For EV charging at night, forget about battery use an look at any power coming from night rate. Batteries are really only worthwhile to get you from dusk to nightrate start time. There's no point in batteries saving the payment of sub-10 cent kw units and as many will attest, even recouping the investment against full-price units is very doubtful.

Hope this helps

Thanks all very helpful. Agree that the night rate meter is most likely the only option at night for charging the EV. the thoughts of banging a couple of Kw's into her during the day purely from sun does excite me though if its at all feasible!! Maybe looking at increasing the amount of panels and batteries when china opens up again and can self install the rest. know of some Chinese producers with warehouses in Germany and a pallets 50e to Ireland so maybe an option later down the line also avoiding dreaded import duties!

Great info on the solar pv positioning and strings Thanks

n97 mini · 18-05-2020 09:09PM

garo wrote: »

Google PV-GIS. Ah here: https://ec.europa.eu/jrc/en/pvgis

But remember you are not just trying to maximize total output but output at the times you need electricity. No point having loads of output at noon when no one is in the house and then nothing at 6pm.

Yeah, no point in maximising output if you've no way to store it. E-W panels probably make more sense for most people than S. In Germany for example S facing panels are a thing of the past.

As mentioned above, the angle of the sun on the summer solstice is about 60 degrees, winter is 13 degrees (Dublin numbers), so ideally your panels should angled in between (36 degrees is half way).

Worth noting too that solar noon in Dublin isn't 12:00, but 13:22 in summer, 12:22 in winter.

Domestic Solar PV Quotes 2020

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