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The UK response to Covid-19 [MOD WARNING 1ST POST]

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Comments

  • #3302
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    meeeeh wrote: »
    They didn't ask for charity, he wanted to do it.

    NHS a monstrosity of an organization and there were warnings before that it is very hard to run such a huge system efficiently. Cuts are nowhere near the only reason there are issues with NHS. Part of the problem is that NHS is such a national treasure beyond reproach. Nobody managed to look across borders and see better health systems in Europe ran with less money. This crisis just exposed the deficiencies more.
    All valid points. I just don't think you got why I'm saying what I'm saying.

    It's not like it's a philanthropic endeavour from a wealthy individual for a research centre or some such. It's an old man raising money for the health service because it needs it. It's disgusting that it needs it.


  • #3303
    Kermit.de.frog
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,466 ✭✭✭✭Kermit.de.frog


    https://twitter.com/jamesdoleman/status/1250354747271512064


  • #3304
    A Dub in Glasgo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,448 ✭✭✭✭A Dub in Glasgo


    Scotland:
    In hospital: 1,799 (+51)
    In ICU: 196 (+1)
    Total confirmed cases: 7,102 (+354)
    Total deaths with confirmed COVID-19: 779 (+80)

    Therefore as it stands, there are a minimum of 1,173 (779+394) deaths in scotland (confirmed and suspected)


  • #3305
    RobMc59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,831 ✭✭✭RobMc59


    robinph wrote: »
    It's not going to the NHS, it's charities that support the NHS.

    Fantastic,selfless achievement by the old warrior.A true hero and getting lots of attention around the world .
    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/15/coronavirus-99-year-old-army-vet-raises-8-million-britain-nhs/5136182002/


  • #3306
    Seth Brundle
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 43,907 Mod ✭✭✭✭Seth Brundle


    RobMc59 wrote: »
    Fantastic,selfless achievement by the old warrior.A true hero and getting lots of attention around the world .
    https://www.usatoday.com/story/news/world/2020/04/15/coronavirus-99-year-old-army-vet-raises-8-million-britain-nhs/5136182002/
    Why is he having to raise money?


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  • #3307
    nacho libre
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,894 ✭✭✭✭nacho libre


    Joe_ Public wrote: »
    Captain Tom Moore, 99, set out to raise £1,000 for the NHS by walking 100 laps of his garden. Yesterday the total stood at £3m. Todays it's shot up to £12m. Incredible story really, most heartening.

    Imagine the lift it will give to very tired frontline workers seeing this man's wonderful efforts.


  • #3308
    RobMc59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,831 ✭✭✭RobMc59


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Why is he having to raise money?

    He doesn't have to,he wants to do it.


  • #3309
    1641
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭1641


    The Office for National Statistics indictes that 3,912 people died with Coronavirus in England and Wales up until 31st March. The DOH figures had indicated there were 2,226 deaths up until the same date (deaths only included for hospital settings). So the real figure for England and Wales was about 75% higher than the official daily figures.
    There is no reason to doubt that this is any different today. Applying that to the 12,868 figure for today on Worldometer would suggest the real number of deaths in the UK is closer to 22,600.

    https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-more-than-1-600-covid-19-linked-deaths-outside-of-hospitals-in-england-and-wales-in-march-11974052


  • #3310
    VinLieger
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,182 ✭✭✭✭VinLieger


    Seth Brundle wrote: »
    Why is he having to raise money?


    Because the people his kids voted for decided the NHS shouldn't have any money


  • #3311
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    RobMc59 wrote: »
    He doesn't have to,he wants to do it.

    Can the UK Gov not find 3m down the back of the couch instead?


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  • #3312
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    1641 wrote: »
    The Office for National Statistics indictes that 3,912 people died with Coronavirus in England and Wales up until 31st March. The DOH figures had indicated there were 2,226 deaths up until the same date (deaths only included for hospital settings). So the real figure for England and Wales was about 75% higher than the official daily figures.
    There is no reason to doubt that this is any different today. Applying that to the 12,868 figure for today on Worldometer would suggest the real number of deaths in the UK is closer to 22,600.

    https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-more-than-1-600-covid-19-linked-deaths-outside-of-hospitals-in-england-and-wales-in-march-11974052

    Could even be higher if you were to calculate the exponential growth rate!


  • #3313
    RobMc59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,831 ✭✭✭RobMc59


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Can the UK Gov not find 3m down the back of the couch instead?

    If you read the articles he wanted to do it to help charities-does'nt that happen everywhere?


  • #3314
    BonnieSituation
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,088 ✭✭✭✭BonnieSituation


    RobMc59 wrote: »
    If you read the articles he wanted to do it to help charities-does'nt that happen everywhere?

    Tom is a fúcking hero.

    Unsurprisingly you're missing the point.


  • #3315
    Joe_ Public
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,023 ✭✭✭✭Joe_ Public


    To me it really shows how powerful a brand the NHS remains. If he was collecting on behalf of any other institution, he might have got a couple of hundred grand maybe. But the combination of war veteran and nhs captured the imagination in an unprecedented way. But people have to think about what that really means. Its a great story but needs to have some consequence to be truly meaningful.


  • #3316
    Harry Palmr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 40,059 ✭✭✭✭Harry Palmr


    Kermit.de.frog wrote: »
    https://twitter.com/jamesdoleman/status/1250354747271512064

    The longer Bojo and the Coronavirus Kid are out of the equation the better the UKs' chances!


  • #3317
    McGiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,995 ✭✭✭McGiver


    1641 wrote: »
    The Office for National Statistics indictes that 3,912 people died with Coronavirus in England and Wales up until 31st March. The DOH figures had indicated there were 2,226 deaths up until the same date (deaths only included for hospital settings). So the real figure for England and Wales was about 75% higher than the official daily figures.
    There is no reason to doubt that this is any different today. Applying that to the 12,868 figure for today on Worldometer would suggest the real number of deaths in the UK is closer to 22,600.

    https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-more-than-1-600-covid-19-linked-deaths-outside-of-hospitals-in-england-and-wales-in-march-11974052

    That brings the mortality rate to 0.34 per 1000. That is 8.5 times worse than Germany.


  • #3318
    RobMc59
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,831 ✭✭✭RobMc59


    BonnieSituation wrote: »
    Tom is a fúcking hero.

    Unsurprisingly you're missing the point.

    Don't you understand the concept of an old soldier wanting to do his bit to help charities-nothing to do with the UK not stumping up money for the NHS.I can't understand why you are struggling to comprehend he wants to help his country in this time of danger-its called 'all pulling together ' .


  • #3319
    McGiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,995 ✭✭✭McGiver


    theological wrote: »
    My position is that the UK hasn't done significantly worse than other European countries on this and that many of the remarks on this thread are unsubstantiated. There is probably a lot to learn from Germany on how to handle both this going forward and on how to handle other pandemics for sure.

    Your "position" is incorrect then.

    "UK hasn't done significantly worse" is in my terminology a BS.

    UK is the 3rd-4th worst at the moment (if we use the fiddled numbers), in line with Italy, and only Spain, Belgium and marginally France are worse than the UK. All remaining 25 odd countries in Europe managed it better, many of them much better.


  • #3320
    1641
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭1641


    McGiver wrote: »
    That brings the mortality rate to 0.34 per 1000. That is 8.5 times worse than Germany.


    What is the German reporting like? Are they including care homes, etc in their daily figures?


  • #3321
    McGiver
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,995 ✭✭✭McGiver


    1641 wrote: »
    What is the German reporting like? Are they including care homes, etc in their daily figures?

    UK doesn't, so it's a rhetorical question and quite irrelevant.
    If Germany is then this makes the UK numbers even worse...


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  • #3322
    1641
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭1641


    McGiver wrote: »
    UK doesn't, so it's a rhetorical question and quite irrelevant.
    If Germany is then this makes the UK numbers even worse...


    Well it is relevant to me as I would like to know.


    And unless we do know it does make comparisons to Germany, as in above, more difficult (for better or worse).


  • #3323
    Donald Trump
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,337 ✭✭✭✭Donald Trump


    RobMc59 wrote: »
    Don't you understand the concept of an old soldier wanting to do his bit to help charities-nothing to do with the UK not stumping up money for the NHS.I can't understand why you are struggling to comprehend he wants to help his country in this time of danger-its called 'all pulling together ' .




    Not at all. I'd say that the crafty fecker is only doing it for his instagram likes!
















    That is a joke for anyone who gets offended. Fair play to the oul divil


  • #3324
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    England deaths up by 740, details here:
    https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2020/04/COVID-19-total-announced-deaths-16-April-2020.xlsx

    Of these deaths:
    10 were from March
    143 were between 1st and 12th April
    122 were on 13th April
    314 were on 14th April
    151 up to 5pm on 15th April.

    Caveats as below
    Confirmation of COVID-19 diagnosis, death notification and reporting in central figures can take up to several days and the hospitals providing the data are under significant operational pressure. This means that the totals reported at 5pm on each day may not include all deaths that occurred on that day or on recent prior days.

    These figures do not include deaths outside hospital, such as those in care homes.


  • #3325
    robinph
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,146 Mod ✭✭✭✭robinph


    McGiver wrote: »
    Your "position" is incorrect then.

    "UK hasn't done significantly worse" is in my terminology a BS.

    UK is the 3rd-4th worst at the moment (if we use the fiddled numbers), in line with Italy, and only Spain, Belgium and marginally France are worse than the UK. All remaining 25 odd countries in Europe managed it better, many of them much better.

    Remember back just two or three weeks ago when Belgium were included in the memes about how it should be done by locking down on day 1 and how having a female PM was the path to success?


  • #3326
    FVP3
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,187 ✭✭✭FVP3


    Its extraordinary that the deaths in care homes are not included, in Ireland thats about half the total IIRC correctly. It probably wouldn't be proportionately as much in the UK, but high enough.

    The one thing that Ireland did badly, as well as delay the whole process by a week, was lack of control in the nursing homes.


  • #3327
    Leroy42
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,138 ✭✭✭✭Leroy42


    devnull wrote: »
    England deaths up by 740, details here:
    https://www.england.nhs.uk/statistics/wp-content/uploads/sites/2/2020/04/COVID-19-total-announced-deaths-16-April-2020.xlsx

    Of these deaths:
    10 were from March
    143 were between 1st and 12th April
    122 were on 13th April
    314 were on 14th April
    151 up to 5pm on 15th April.

    Caveats as below

    Thats in the 700's for the last few days, substantially down form the 900+ last week. Have they hit the peak and are now in a plateau?

    Surely they can't still be underreporting due to the holiday weekend?

    Maybe the warmer weather is having an effect?


  • #3328
    1641
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,298 ✭✭✭1641


    FVP3 wrote: »
    Its extraordinary that the deaths in care homes are not included, in Ireland thats about half the total IIRC correctly. It probably wouldn't be proportionately as much in the UK, but high enough.

    The one thing that Ireland did badly, as well as delay the whole process by a week, was lack of control in the nursing homes.




    I don't know about that. If deaths in care homes and other locations outside of hospitals was 75% higher than reported hospital deaths in March, then I would expect it to be even more now, if anything. The "lockdown" should be reducing community transmissions (and subesequent deaths) but if the virus is established with residential settings it will continue to rip through.


  • #3329
    Charles Babbage
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,711 ✭✭✭Charles Babbage


    FVP3 wrote: »
    Its extraordinary that the deaths in care homes are not included, in Ireland thats about half the total IIRC correctly. It probably wouldn't be proportionately as much in the UK, but high enough.

    The one thing that Ireland did badly, as well as delay the whole process by a week, was lack of control in the nursing homes.


    In other European countries the proportion in nursing homes is about the same as in Ireland. Of course a country could have prepared for this, for instance Taiwan, but there is no reason to suppose that the UK prepared much differently than France (say).


  • #3330
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Leroy42 wrote: »
    Thats in the 700's for the last few days, substantially down form the 900+ last week. Have they hit the peak and are now in a plateau?

    Those figures I posted are for Hospital Deaths in ENGLAND ONLY, not the UK as a whole - they do not include Wales, Northern Ireland or Scotland Deaths.

    The 900+figures you were talking of were for the whole of the UK and it's likely that the figures for the UK today will not be far of 900 by the time they are in and added up.

    Scotland has reported 80 today and Wales 32 so we're currently at 852 for England, Wales and Scotland with Northern Ireland still to be added, I would imagine that it'll be somewhere around 860 for the day.


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  • #3331
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 11,912 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    NI Deaths just been confirmed at 18.

    Therefore 870 hospital deaths reported for last 24 hours

    England 740
    Scotland 80
    Wales 32
    Northern Ireland 18


This discussion has been closed.
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