Is it just me or have SF vanished?

aido79 · 08-04-2020 08:21PM

smurgen wrote: »

"The report also noted that Ireland is the fourth largest exporter of medical devices that can be used to treat Covid-19. These include ventilators"

Are you willing to bet that in 17bn worth of sales and with Ireland at the cutting edge of this type of manufacturing that it's not being made here?

There has never been such a demand for ventilators before so being the 4th largest exporter of medical devices that can be used to treat covid19 means nothing. For all we know this could mean Ireland exports 50 ventilators a year.

The reagent for covid19 was only developed this year and there is a worldwide shortage so I wouldn't bet that it's being made in Ireland currently. The 17bn worth of sales were for last year so no real relevance.

smurgen · 08-04-2020 08:25PM

aido79 wrote: »

There has never been such a demand for ventilators before so being the 4th largest exporter of medical devices that can be used to treat covid19 means nothing. For all we know this could mean Ireland exports 50 ventilators a year.

The reagent for covid19 was only developed this year and there is a worldwide shortage so I wouldn't bet that it's being made in Ireland currently. The 17bn worth of sales were for last year so no real relevance.

So you're saying with 17 billion in various reagents you'd wager they're probably not manufacturing the reagent for Covid 19 here now?is this what you're saying?

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 08:26PM

aido79 wrote: »

There has never been such a demand for ventilators before so being the 4th largest exporter of medical devices that can be used to treat covid19 means nothing. For all we know this could mean Ireland exports 50 ventilators a year.

The reagent for covid19 was only developed this year and there is a worldwide shortage so I wouldn't bet that it's being made in Ireland currently. The 17bn worth of sales were for last year so no real relevance.

Should we not know this, in a crisis situation? Why is it being left to journalists to find out?

smurgen · 08-04-2020 08:28PM

Phoebas wrote: »

So what is it you want - the government to appropriate private property or the government to negotiate a deal? It can't be both.

It sounds to me that the course you want the government to take is any course that they are not now taking.
A classic Sinn Fein stance.

did you read your sentence before your wrong? The course they're taking is to close down testing centers for extended periods of time because of a lack of reagents. They should have been trying to get those by any means possible.it was barely excusable when we thought there was a global shortage now if we know it's actually being manufactured here it's criminal we don't have enough.

aido79 · 08-04-2020 08:33PM

smurgen wrote: »

So you're saying with 17 billion in various reagents you'd wager they're probably not manufacturing the reagent for Covid 19 here now?is this what you're saying?

I would definitely say that in the 17bn in various reagents produced in 2019 not a drop was produced for covid19 testing.

I don't know if they are making the reagent for covid19 testing that was only developed this year. If you know please let us know how you know.

aido79 · 08-04-2020 08:34PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Should we not know this, in a crisis situation? Why is it being left to journalists to find out?

Should we not know what?

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 08:38PM

aido79 wrote: »

Should we not know what?

For starters, the answer to your own doubts.

The reagent for covid19 was only developed this year and there is a worldwide shortage so I wouldn't bet that it's being made in Ireland currently.

And exactly what is capable of being done and what isn't.

aido79 · 08-04-2020 08:40PM

Anyone got any lysis buffer lying around in their shed that they would be willing to donate to the cause? That's not far from the vibe I get from people thinking the reagent can be just mixed up in any old chemical plant that makes reagents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/science/irish-scientists-develop-reagent-in-effort-to-ease-covid-19-testing-delays-1.4223897%3fmode=amp

08-04-2020 09:06PM

aido79 wrote: »

Anyone got any lysis buffer lying around in their shed that they would be willing to donate to the cause? That's not far from the vibe I get from people thinking the reagent can be just mixed up in any old chemical plant that makes reagents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/science/irish-scientists-develop-reagent-in-effort-to-ease-covid-19-testing-delays-1.4223897%3fmode=amp

Genuinely bizarre how far from science some people are. Like depressingly so.

all about the mane · 08-04-2020 09:11PM

aido79 wrote: »

Anyone got any lysis buffer lying around in their shed that they would be willing to donate to the cause? That's not far from the vibe I get from people thinking the reagent can be just mixed up in any old chemical plant that makes reagents.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.irishtimes.com/news/science/irish-scientists-develop-reagent-in-effort-to-ease-covid-19-testing-delays-1.4223897%3fmode=amp

A company in Ireland in conjunction with one of the universities has just produced a large amount of the reagent. Brilliant from them

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 09:13PM

So to be clear, SF think that we can magic up mega-litres of effective testing reagent for an a virus only mapped less than 3 months ago (the SARS-CoV-2 genome was only published on the 12 Jan).

They seem to think pharmaceutical science is like laundering diesel

My only real surprise is that some loon in their party isn't suggesting homeopathic "treatments"!!

blanch152 · 08-04-2020 09:17PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

For starters, the answer to your own doubts.

And exactly what is capable of being done and what isn't.

How and why should we know?

Suckit · 08-04-2020 09:18PM

Mortelaro wrote: »

L0l

Btw to answer your question earlier, we're 5th on a list of 15 European countries that report testing numbers according to today's dept of health news conference

We entered the top ten of coronavirus cases per million last night, way ahead of the UK in terms of cases per capita. After today we are looking at maybe 8th. Rapidly climbing and still weeks away from reaching the target figures for testing of 15,000 per day. Two weeks ago after the DOH changed the testing criteria the figures jumped from 6% to 15%, so undoubtedly those figures will jump again.

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 09:18PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

So to be clear, SF think that we can magic up mega-litres of effective testing reagent for an a virus only mapped less than 3 months ago (the SARS-CoV-2 genome was only published on the 12 Jan).

They seem to think pharmaceutical science is like laundering diesel

My only real surprise is that some loon in their party isn't suggesting homeopathic "treatments"!!

Where has anybody said anything about 'magic-ing up mega litres'?

blanch152 · 08-04-2020 09:19PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

So to be clear, SF think that we can magic up mega-litres of effective testing reagent for an a virus only mapped less than 3 months ago (the SARS-CoV-2 genome was only published on the 12 Jan).

They seem to think pharmaceutical science is like laundering diesel

My only real surprise is that some loon in their party isn't suggesting homeopathic "treatments"!!

Your wan in Clare is probably suggesting homeopathic treatments.

However, your other point is correct, their only experience of chemical treatments is which colour dye.

blanch152 · 08-04-2020 09:23PM

Suckit wrote: »

We entered the top ten of coronavirus cases per million last night, way ahead of the UK in terms of cases per capita. After today we are looking at maybe 8th. Rapidly climbing and still weeks away from reaching the target figures for testing of 15,000 per day. Two weeks ago after the DOH changed the testing criteria the figures jumped from 6% to 15%, so undoubtedly those figures will jump again.

How many tests should we be doing?

The UK are doing around 10,000 tests per day, should we be doing 900, because that is the proportional number?

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-52149832

Cases per capita reflect testing per capita, up to a certain point. Testing needs to be at a level that catches 98% of cases in order to completely eliminate the virus. We are not there, but we are a long way ahead of others, so that means we have a higher case number per capita.

all about the mane · 08-04-2020 09:40PM

Suckit wrote: »

We entered the top ten of coronavirus cases per million last night, way ahead of the UK in terms of cases per capita. .

Why do you think that is?

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 09:43PM

blanch152 wrote: »

How many tests should we be doing?

Are we counting 'idiots' and people who 'don't exist'?

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 09:43PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Where has anybody said anything about 'magic-ing up mega litres'?

Yeah, look SF seemed to think any old reagent would do - they failed to grasp (and still do) what's involved in developing a diagnostic test for a novel infectious agent.

As Tully confirmed with her statement released yesterday (and linked above) SF still have no idea what's involved. She is "urging the government to liaise with the many medical device companies with facilities here in Ireland to produce domestic kits to increase testing capacity here."

She can urge all she wants, the government can liaise all it wants, but can SF not understand? - medical device companies cannot produce test kits.

Abbott Nutrition and Abbott Diagnostics are separate business lines - just because one makes test kits or the elements of test kits, it doesn't mean all of Abbott can make test kits.

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 09:47PM

Suckit wrote: »

We entered the top ten of coronavirus cases per million last night, way ahead of the UK in terms of cases per capita. After today we are looking at maybe 8th. Rapidly climbing and still weeks away from reaching the target figures for testing of 15,000 per day. Two weeks ago after the DOH changed the testing criteria the figures jumped from 6% to 15%, so undoubtedly those figures will jump again.

just to be clear......you do understand there's a significant difference between

Cases per million.......

.....and.....

Cases per capita?

all about the mane · 08-04-2020 09:47PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Yeah, look SF seemed to think any old reagent would do - they failed to grasp (and still do) what's involved in developing a diagnostic test for a novel infectious agent.

As Tully confirmed with her statement released yesterday (and linked above) SF still have no idea what's involved. She is "urging the government to liaise with the many medical device companies with facilities here in Ireland to produce domestic kits to increase testing capacity here."

She can urge all she wants, the government can liaise all it wants, but can SF not understand? - medical device companies cannot produce test kits.

Abbott Nutrition and Abbott Diagnostics are separate business lines - just because one makes test kits or the elements of test kits, it doesn't mean all of Abbott can make test kits.

There has been a major breakthrough in reagent production though in Cork. Will help address worldwide shortages. Brilliant result.

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 09:48PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

Yeah, look SF seemed to think any old reagent would do - they failed to grasp (and still do) what's involved in developing a diagnostic test for a novel infectious agent.

As Tully confirmed with her statement released yesterday (and linked above) SF still have no idea what's involved. She is "urging the government to liaise with the many medical device companies with facilities here in Ireland to produce domestic kits to increase testing capacity here."

She can urge all she wants, the government can liaise all it wants, but can SF not understand? - medical device companies cannot produce test kits.

Abbott Nutrition and Abbott Diagnostics are separate business lines - just because one makes test kits or the elements of test kits, it doesn't mean all of Abbott can make test kits.

So nobody talked about 'magicing up mega litres' of reagent.
Do stop exaggerating.

08-04-2020 09:50PM

blanch152 wrote: »

Your wan in Clare is probably suggesting homeopathic treatments.

However, your other point is correct, their only experience of chemical treatments is which colour dye.

I had assumed she was some weirdo anti-science outlier in the party, seemingly not.

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 09:52PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

So nobody talked about 'magicing up mega litres' of reagent.
Do stop exaggerating.

I think we can see from SF's "step up" call and Tully's statement yesterday just how much SF don't know about the pharmaceutical industry.

Doubtless they'd have accepted any colouredy water waved in front of them

smurgen · 08-04-2020 09:55PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

I think we can see from SF's "step up" call and Tully's statement yesterday just how much SF don't know about the pharmaceutical industry.

Doubtless they'd have accepted any colouredy water waved in front of them

Like Harris and co buying ppe off Alibaba?

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 09:57PM

all about the mane wrote: »

There has been a major breakthrough in reagent production though in Cork. Will help address worldwide shortages. Brilliant result.

Yes, only 4 iterations to get to the good stuff is, to my mind, really super going and excellent work.

And they went with Lilly, not any old medical device manufacturer.

Suckit · 08-04-2020 09:57PM

blanch152 wrote: »

How many tests should we be doing?

The UK are doing around 10,000 tests per day, should we be doing 900, because that is the proportional number?

https://www.bbc.com/news/health-52149832

Cases per capita reflect testing per capita, up to a certain point. Testing needs to be at a level that catches 98% of cases in order to completely eliminate the virus. We are not there, but we are a long way ahead of others, so that means we have a higher case number per capita.

Did you just randomly quote me and then start blurting stuff out on the keyboard?
It says how many tests are our target in the post you quoted.

Who would have honestly thought that the cases per capita are reflected by the amount of people tested? :eek: That is some fine detective work right there.
We won't catch 98% of cases while we are still thousands per day under our daily target, which is why I said we are weeks away from reaching said target.

Now that we have confirmed that tested cases will let us estimate the amount of cases per capita, do you think that figure is goin to drop or grow?

I know 12-15 people now that have had COVID-19, 5 have taken the test almost 3 weeks ago and still not got their results, one has been in ICU and is on the far side of it now hopefully.

That is 7-10 people untested, all but confirmed via tests that they have had it in a small area.

FrancieBrady · 08-04-2020 09:59PM

Sultan_of_Ping wrote: »

I think we can see from SF's "step up" call and Tully's statement yesterday just how much SF don't know about the pharmaceutical industry.

Doubtless they'd have accepted any colouredy water waved in front of them

All about the Mane has news you might be interested in. I remember earlier people were claiming that all our pharma companies were at capacity etc etc.

Seems one has found the time. Mad what can happen in a crisis.

Sultan_of_Ping · 08-04-2020 10:00PM

smurgen wrote: »

Like Harris and co buying ppe off Alibaba?

Where would you have bought PPE during a global pandemic when demand overwhelmingly exceeds supply?

I'm sure you can name an alternative that would've supplied first rate kit?

Or is this just more hurling from the ditch?

smurgen · 08-04-2020 10:06PM

aido79 wrote: »

There has never been such a demand for ventilators before so being the 4th largest exporter of medical devices that can be used to treat covid19 means nothing. For all we know this could mean Ireland exports 50 ventilators a year.

The reagent for covid19 was only developed this year and there is a worldwide shortage so I wouldn't bet that it's being made in Ireland currently. The 17bn worth of sales were for last year so no real relevance.

Ireland is one of the biggest manufacturers or ventilators internationally. Metronic has it's global headquarters here and the plant in Galway manufacturers them.

Is it just me or have SF vanished?

Comments