CoVid19 Part XII - 4,604 in ROI (137 deaths) 998 in NI (56 deaths)(04/04) Read OP

easypazz · 31-03-2020 11:22AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

The fear mongering is completely out of order! For example the way that poor woman who was clearly dying was exploited on Claire Byrne last night.
I don't care if her family gave permission and if she was in hospital and I'm certain she was why did doctors allow this? I always thought there was something called etiquette. I watched it for about 20 seconds and decided I didn't want to be part of this exploitation.

Was that the woman in the mask who didn't need a ventilator or ICU?

I don't think she was dying, or anywhere near it?

kilkenny31 · 31-03-2020 11:22AM

Wibbs wrote: »

Oh I'm not Brit bashing K and they're certainly far less heavy handed than police in places like Spain and Italy where their forces are more "militaristic" for the want of a better word.

Again I'd say it's down to very high density dwellings. A city like Madrid is chock full of high rise apartments. Like I was saying earlier the average Irish road of houses is significantly less risky for community spread than the same number of people in a high rise apartment building. If your neighbour here has the virus you can avoid contact with him and the surfaces they touch without even really trying. If they were living in an apartment on your floor you couldn't. You would have to be far more proactive in protecting yourself. That was seen in the 1918 pandemic. People who lived in suburban and extraurban houses were far less affected than those living in shared city housing.

I've always been stressing that point. Even without the measures that are in place we would likely have seen a slowing in spread compared to Italy and Spain. We live differently to them. Perhaps we should continue with our urban sprawl.

BanditLuke · 31-03-2020 11:23AM

irishlad. wrote: »

Numbers in ICU up to 103 here

That is depressing.

quokula · 31-03-2020 11:24AM

kilkenny31 wrote: »

Our government made one decision better then theirs. They also acted quicker when it came to the "lockdown", their financial supports were announced sooner and cover 80% of pay rather then 70. They have a better healthcare system than ours and have been looking after their citizens with free healthcare since the 1940's. Our government done a good job late in the outbreak. Neither Britain or Ireland acted soon enough to control the infected people coming into out country. We need to be analytical when we look at the approach of our government. There has been a lot of good done but a lot that could have been done sooner and a lot more that needs to be done.

I lived over there until recently and had family members working in the NHS. The statement that their healthcare system is better than ours may have been true in the past but is on shaky ground these days. Ireland spends more per capita on healthcare while the NHS has been in freefall for a decade - The Lancet ranks Ireland's healthcare more highly than the UKs.

BanditLuke · 31-03-2020 11:26AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

The fear mongering is completely out of order! For example the way that poor woman who was clearly dying was exploited on Claire Byrne last night.
I don't care if her family gave permission and if she was in hospital and I'm certain she was why did doctors allow this? I always thought there was something called etiquette. I watched it for about 20 seconds and decided I didn't want to be part of this exploitation.

I'm sorry but iv'e no problem with the fear mongering. Tbh if it makes people pause for thought about how serious this is then so be it.

weldoninhio · 31-03-2020 11:27AM

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

They threatened a shopkeeper with a charge of criminal damage because he painted (in chalk) distancing marks on the pavement outside his shop.

There are other instances of ridiculous policing in the UK to be found online.

Added an important part of the story.

caveat emptor · 31-03-2020 11:27AM

Don't shoot the messenger.
#notpaddy
#notdoingitforthelikes

https://twitter.com/paddycosgrave/status/1244932180553449476?s=20

tobefrank321 · 31-03-2020 11:30AM

beolight wrote: »

Sorry have to correct that....We are only hearing about the Nursing Home clusters in the last few days. The important word here is hearing (unofficially)..:.prior to this we were only being told of cases in East West North South information. Independent broke the 14 infected case in a Nursing Homes in East on 22 March these cases tested positive well before that and symptoms would have surfaced even earlier .... so the 3 week window from March 6 is convenient camouflaging and the 3 week window does not apply to HSE run Nursing Homes and also not forgetting residential units

Who knows how the staff or nursing home residents picked up the virus but closing the homes to visitors was the right call by the nursing homes and ignoring the CMO response was correct but,unfortunately HSE run nursing homes couldn’t ignore it and had to allow visitors back in . It was only after this that HSE Paul Reid appeared on the airwaves and returned individual autonomy of hospitals to their their individual CEO

So of the 22 nursing home clusters how many are HSE run?

Instead of admonishing the Nursing Homes for acting unilaterally why didn’t the CMO/ dept of health /Government use the opportunity to go further and cocoon them? Or had Leo’s spin Doctor not coined that phrase yet?

Unfortunately for cocooning to work in Nursing Homes/ residential settings the staff also need to be cocooned so vigilance in infection control and proper PPE need to be in place in all these settings. Is this the case?

Good post.

I did not know that about visitors being allowed back in. This is worrying if true. It was asking for trouble. If that was the cause of the nursing home clusters, its scandalous. I hope its not true though. The chances of a public report on it are slim.

The handling of nursing homes was just one of a catalog of errors made by the government and HSE, whose incompetence help spread this far and wide here. Remember the advice that you didn't need to isolate after returning from Italy unless you displayed symptoms? That caused a doctor returned from Italy to do a hospital shift and other work. Complete incompetence.

Rob A. Bank · 31-03-2020 11:31AM

INMO Trolley Watch figures for March 31st 2020

Only 9 people waiting for beds in Irish Hospitals today.

https://www.inmo.ie/Trolley_Ward_Watch

Elmer Blooker · 31-03-2020 11:32AM

easypazz wrote: »

Was that the woman in the mask who didn't need a ventilator or ICU?

I don't think she was dying, or anywhere near it?

I'll withdraw the 'clearly dying' comment and I sincerely hope she makes a recovery. My problem is with RTE and the way they are clearly trying to shock, 99.9% of people are behaving responsibly in my opinion during this crisis so what is the point of RTE creating a climate of fear?

MadYaker · 31-03-2020 11:33AM

Nonoperational wrote: »

To be fair the fact that we generally do what we are told probably relates to the fact that overall most of us are fairly decent people who want to just get on with their business. It's not necessarily a bad thing. I see there are mutterings of our civil liberties etc being taken from us but its for good reason. We can still be sensible and pop out for a walk. At the end of the day we are being asked to try and kill the resevior of virus for 2 weeks, not pick cotton in our bare feet either.

It’s important to remember also that this isn’t going to last forever. It’s likely we’ll be able to begin to resume some sort of normalcy in 2 months. Even under current conditions were much better off than the Italians or Spanish. The lockdowns there are far more draconian. I’m even sneaking out for a circular run everyday without being much more than 2k from my home.

TheAsYLuMkeY · 31-03-2020 11:34AM

DOCARCH wrote: »

International Women's Day!

When Spain looks back, the decision, a couple of weeks ago, to let gatherings and marches go ahead for International Women's Day may be one of their big downfalls!

On earlier versions of this thread, most on here were saying...WTF!

I agree totally, and we can look back at ourselves and say to close all the pubs day before patricks day was one of the most decisive moves to prevent it having been out of control here.

easypazz · 31-03-2020 11:37AM

MadYaker wrote: »

I’m even sneaking out for a circular run everyday without being much more than 2k from my home.

post reported;)

Roger_007 · 31-03-2020 11:37AM

Deleted User wrote: »

Awful numbers from Spain. What the hell is going on there?

The problem is that nobody knows enough about this virus to be able to predict how it’s spreading in the community. The remarkably different scenarios in different countries doesn’t fit neatly into any ‘model’ so far.
Nobody seems to be able to explain why it’s so much worse in some countries like Italy and Spain. There are so many theories about different countries counting things in different ways that it’s really impossible to compare one country with another.
But there is no doubting the body count and Spain is certainly in a bad place on that statistic.

BrianD3 · 31-03-2020 11:38AM

Tanner Cold Needlepoint wrote: »

The media has been incorrectly reporting the cumulative ICU numbers as current since the beginning so I see no reason to take them figures as fact. Also they say 88 on Saturday while the official figures are 84 on Saturday. The only numbers that can be believed is those published on gov.ie and these are cumulative numbers with our most up to date figure being 84 people in total have needed ICU since the start of the outbreak up to Saturday evening.

Yes, the wording on gov.ie is clear. If what they *actually* meant was, number of patients currently in ICU, it is very sloppy use of language. This is highly unlikely - the wording will have been carefully chosen and there will be reasoning behind it.

It is very likely that there is some sort of game being played here - possibly to inflate the numbers in ICU to avoid complacency among the public, knowing full well that stupid journalists would misinterpret plain English and "do their dirty work for them".

It's also possible that there will be a subtle change in the wording on gov.ie depending on what message they want to put out and on how things are going.

This is all par for the course for the likes of the HSE.

Rob A. Bank · 31-03-2020 11:38AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I'll withdraw the 'clearly dying' comment and I sincerely hope she makes a recovery. My problem is with RTE and the way they are clearly trying to shock, 99.9% of people are behaving responsibly in my opinion during this crisis so what is the point of RTE creating a climate of fear?

Maybe shock tactics are needed to reach those who are not behaving responsibly.

It put a human face on the damage Covid-19 is doing here. There is no point in trying to varnish the truth in a dangerous pandemic

easypazz · 31-03-2020 11:39AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I'll withdraw the 'clearly dying' comment and I sincerely hope she makes a recovery. My problem is with RTE and the way they are clearly trying to shock, 99.9% of people are behaving responsibly in my opinion during this crisis so what is the point of RTE creating a climate of fear?

I don't know about shock, I have seen far worse images from hospitals around the world, rows of people lying on the floor, ICU's in chaos, coffins in refrigerated containers out the back of the hospital etc.

In any case we get bombarded with so much information these days most of it just flies in and out.

31-03-2020 11:40AM

I recall a number of posters referring to trials of the BCG vaccine for Covid. I wasn't aware of the apparent correlation between reported national death rates and historic BCG vaccine policy. It seems Italy and Spain (and the US) do not have a comprehensive BCG vaccine programmes, whereas Japan and China do. On the other hand, I think France and the UK had comprehensive programmes also and their death rates seem fairly high.

Anyway The BCG is being trialled in Australia for health workers: https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-30/century-old-vaccine-investigated-as-a-weapon-against-coronavirus

Also, there is a related drug to the BCG, but which was originally developed as a treatment for some cancers, that is also being given consideration. Apparently, it emerged that a side effect of the treatment seemed to at least some protection against colds and seasonal flu. It seems to work as as an immune booster.

"As a cancer immunologist, I have been involved with a number of clinical trials involving vaccines and other immune therapies. One of these is a mycobacterial product known as IMM-101, which has proved an effective treatment in melanoma and pancreatic cancer studies.

Intriguingly, a number of participants in trials have remarked that, since having this "vaccine", they have not suffered any flu or cold symptoms, often having succumbed every winter previously. Many were elderly, with more than one serious illness.

More recently, I was asked by colleagues in Norway, with whom I have collaborated on a therapeutic HIV vaccine programme, to help with a Covid-19 inoculation they have manufactured, and which is being produced for trials. I suggested swapping the vaccine's current adjuvant - an ingredient added to boost the immune response - with IMM-101. The result has now been supplied for pre-clinical studies." Prof Angus Dalgleish.
https://www.independent.ie/world-news/europe/britain/this-cancer-treatment-seems-to-stop-flu-and-colds-why-not-give-it-a-try-to-help-protect-health-workers-too-39090060.html

billybonkers · 31-03-2020 11:41AM

Update on healthcare workers

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1244931974365618176

SleetAndSnow · 31-03-2020 11:41AM

https://twitter.com/FergalBowers/status/1244929975142227975?s=20

elperello · 31-03-2020 11:41AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

I'll withdraw the 'clearly dying' comment and I sincerely hope she makes a recovery. My problem is with RTE and the way they are clearly trying to shock, 99.9% of people are behaving responsibly in my opinion during this crisis so what is the point of RTE creating a climate of fear?

It wasn't shock journalism.

It was a hard watch not intended to create fear but to let people know how bad this virus is.

BanditLuke · 31-03-2020 11:42AM

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-girl-12-becomes-youngest-known-person-to-die-in-europe-11966171

Absolute tragedy. May she rest in peace.

31-03-2020 11:43AM

wakka12 wrote: »

Yes I read about that, bizarre that it was labelled as a Covid death. But having said that, I don't think it necessarily the newspapers fault, her own family claimed she had died of covid 19

If her family are doctors then ok, but they're not and so it's not for them to claim her cause of death, and the newspapers know that well, but never let the truth get in the way of a good story.... you're right though bizarre. it seems there's only one story in town and they aim to milk it.

jay0109 · 31-03-2020 11:44AM

caveat emptor wrote: »

Don't shoot the messenger.
#notpaddy
#notdoingitforthelikes

https://twitter.com/paddycosgrave/status/1244932180553449476?s=20

What's he ringing the Chinese for!!!
1. This *hitstorm started in their country and they have not been very transparent on it
2. We're paying for the supplies. It's not as though they're free

billybonkers · 31-03-2020 11:45AM

Gardaì in the south came across a COVID-19 positive person who was travelling to post a letter.

:(

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1244930925080842241

bilston · 31-03-2020 11:46AM

BanditLuke wrote: »

https://news.sky.com/story/coronavirus-girl-12-becomes-youngest-known-person-to-die-in-europe-11966171

Absolute tragedy. May she rest in peace.

Horrendous

Stheno · 31-03-2020 11:47AM

Bob24 wrote: »

It is a good thing for sure, but in a way a bit scary. You can already imagine rules whereby people with a "certificate of immunity" are handed bracelet or a digital certificate on their phone confirming they are allowed in the real world, while others are told to stay at home until the health system is up to speed.

statto25 wrote: »

There is but there was a quote from the HSE on Matt Cooper last week saying that its too early for Ireland to be running this test and its something for further down the road. Personally, I think they are 1000s of folks who have had the virus but have been mild affected or not at all and just isolated. Finding these people would be more beneficial in letting the public get back on track. Its also a blood test I believe so not as specific in terms of kit for testing

I think once we managed to get the numbers down (if we do) that then would be the time to consider rolling out the antibody test if we can get enough kits.

For now the focus is on the dangerously ill, and with todays rise in ICU from 84 to 103 that's the correct approach imo? Keep everyone else including the asymptomatics in as much as possible

Rob A. Bank wrote: »

Checking temperature would detect the 'open' cases, those who are already shedding virus all over the place. Stopping them at the airport would have saved a lot of heartache and clusters here later.

If you looked closer at Nextstrain you would find that the Netherlands strain of virus infected Northern Italy, and from there back to Ireland.

Asymptomatic people don't have temperatures

Even Claire Byrne did not have a temperature

caveat emptor · 31-03-2020 11:48AM

Nice video from Piacenza. Worth noting the level of PPE worn. Really hope our men and women fighting this are given the same standard.
The vast majority of HCW infected did not travel which means either community or more likely in work.

https://twitter.com/tancredipalmeri/status/1244936784871555073?s=20

Akabusi · 31-03-2020 11:50AM

billybonkers wrote: »

Gardaì in the south came across a COVID-19 positive person who was travelling to post a letter. :(

https://twitter.com/GardaTraffic/status/1244930925080842241

That is one stupid person.

31-03-2020 11:50AM

Elmer Blooker wrote: »

The fear mongering is completely out of order! For example the way that poor woman who was clearly dying was exploited on Claire Byrne last night.
I don't care if her family gave permission and if she was in hospital and I'm certain she was why did doctors allow this? I always thought there was something called etiquette. I watched it for about 20 seconds and decided I didn't want to be part of this exploitation.

100% and one poster here yesterday "member of the media" said I was full of shyte for pointing this type of thing out, from sections of the media trying to out ghoul each other.. they've no shame..

CoVid19 Part XII - 4,604 in ROI (137 deaths) 998 in NI (56 deaths)(04/04) **Read OP**

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CoVid19 Part XII - 4,604 in ROI (137 deaths) 998 in NI (56 deaths)(04/04) Read OP