Places commutable to Dublin where one off houses still get planning

Eric Cartman · 23-03-2020 8:32pm #1

does anyone know of any areas near Dublin where putting a 2 storey house on an acre is still in general accepted by the planning board ?

Just need something near a motorway really, preferably not through a toll to the M50 .

and before anyone starts, I'm not expecting a bus service and this isn't a thread to discuss whether one off housing is you're thing or not... protip, if you're going to use the words 'eyesore' or 'mcmansion' in your post, it doesn't belong here.

zerosugarbuzz · 23-03-2020 8:41pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

does anyone know of any areas near Dublin where putting a 2 storey house on an acre is still in general accepted by the planning board ?

Just need something near a motorway really, preferably not through a toll to the M50 .

and before anyone starts, I'm not expecting a bus service and this isn't a thread to discuss whether one off housing is you're thing or not... protip, if you're going to use the words 'eyesore' or 'mcmansion' in your post, it doesn't belong here.

I’d love that too.

beauf · 23-03-2020 8:56pm

World you know from looking at sites with planning permission?

listermint · 23-03-2020 8:58pm

Mad idea .

I know...

But bear with me...

Buy something that's built......

Eric Cartman · 23-03-2020 9:24pm

listermint wrote: »

Mad idea .

I know...

But bear with me...

Buy something that's built......

too much money, buying a site and building what I need now ( a 4 bay garage with an office and 1 bed apartment over it ) and adding a large house beside it as time goes on is much more affordable and practical.

Gumbo · 24-03-2020 1:10am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

too much money, buying a site and building what I need now ( a 4 bay garage with an office and 1 bed apartment over it ) and adding a large house beside it as time goes on is much more affordable and practical.

The problem, is you won’t get planning to build the garage now and a house later.
Any ‘apartment’ that’s over a garage, will be ancillary to the main dwelling, but if the main dwelling is not built then it’s not ancillary.
Another issue may be the mortgage, the garage is not habitable so no funds released.

You won’t get building regulation or planning compliance in my opinion.

Baybay · 24-03-2020 8:30am

Perhaps an option might be to try to find somewhere derelict & apply for planning permission to renovate & extend into something that suits you.

mariaalice · 24-03-2020 10:56am

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/27-merrymeeting-rathnew-wicklow/4384283

Its basically a site

Bit of a pipe dream op, but with a lot of compromises something like this might work, Rathnew is very commutable to Dublin.

mariaalice · 24-03-2020 11:09am

https://www.daft.ie/meath/bungalows-for-sale/stamullen/balloy-stamullen-meath-2259215/#img=1

Again not exactly what you want but lots of outbuilding and separate residents being developed on it, Stamullen very commutable to Dublin.

mariaalice · 24-03-2020 11:21am

https://www.myhome.ie/residential/brochure/donacarney-great-co-meath-a92-aw29/4273560

They are all basically sites.

No local athourity is going to let you build a garage with an apartment over it and then build a house beside it in time.

listermint · 24-03-2020 11:23am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

too much money, buying a site and building what I need now ( a 4 bay garage with an office and 1 bed apartment over it ) and adding a large house beside it as time goes on is much more affordable and practical.

Sorry but now i know your pulling everyone's leg.

:rolleyes:

ELM327 · 24-03-2020 11:27am

I'd suggest Meath but thanks to our ridiculous one off planning laws (you cant get planning without being "local needs") you won't get it

Cuddlesworth · 24-03-2020 11:31am

Eric Cartman wrote: »

too much money, buying a site and building what I need now ( a 4 bay garage with an office and 1 bed apartment over it ) and adding a large house beside it as time goes on is much more affordable and practical.

Not sure viable sites are much cheaper then just purchasing a finished house. In a lot of cases, it seems the other way around.

Planning wise, you would need to apply for a house with 4 bed garage + apartment, build that and then keep renewing the planning for the rest.

Not sure where you would get planning for a 4 bay garage with a apartment coupled with what would be a fairly large site with a expected 2 two story buildings.

Yellow_Fern · 24-03-2020 11:50am

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Not sure viable sites are much cheaper then just purchasing a finished house. In a lot of cases, it seems the other way around.

Planning wise, you would need to apply for a house with 4 bed garage + apartment, build that and then keep renewing the planning for the rest.

Not sure where you would get planning for a 4 bay garage with a apartment coupled with what would be a fairly large site with a expected 2 two story buildings.

I guess that is true partly because the scale of building estates and also the fact that one off tend to be much better built and designed.

awec · 24-03-2020 12:24pm

Yellow_Fern wrote: »

I guess that is true partly because the scale of building estates and also the fact that one off tend to be much better built and designed.

Wouldn't be so sure about that.

mariaalice · 24-03-2020 12:31pm

Places like Tipparey still have one-off housing, you could look somewhere within strikeing distance of the M7

Hoboo · 24-03-2020 12:38pm

ELM327 wrote: »

I'd suggest Meath but thanks to our ridiculous one off planning laws (you cant get planning without being "local needs") you won't get it

Thank God for that law. I know I won't have some scumbag landing a few fields up.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 24-03-2020 12:54pm

Hoboo wrote: »

Thank God for that law. I know I won't have some scumbag landing a few fields up.

Mind elaborating on that? No scumbags in Meath? :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:

Gumbo · 24-03-2020 1:48pm

Hoboo wrote: »

Thank God for that law. I know I won't have some scumbag landing a few fields up.

Mod Note

We have standards in this forum.
Please read the forum charter before posting again in this or any other thread in A&P.

24-03-2020 2:46pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

too much money, buying a site and building what I need now ( a 4 bay garage with an office and 1 bed apartment over it ) and adding a large house beside it as time goes on is much more affordable and practical.

I think if you were serious about this you'd already have found out it's a non runner.

Idbatterim · 24-03-2020 3:59pm

cartman I can definetly see why you would want somewhere private and secure to lock up the S class you intend on buying... He isnt trolling, he is into his motors... and imagine landing out hundreds of thousands and having an entire social housing block a stones throw, like in dundrum!

24-03-2020 4:41pm

Idbatterim wrote: »

......... He isnt trolling, he is into his motors...........

Ah yeah, no doubt but he's not actually serious about this. He's in the early stages of thinking out loud and came to boards to help pick a location instead of researching/realising that you can't build the garage before building the house.

Also, in times of recession (and we're in one now) it's always cheaper to buy rather than to build. Especially when you are on about building two x 2 storey structures.

Eric Cartman · 24-03-2020 5:18pm

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Not sure viable sites are much cheaper then just purchasing a finished house. In a lot of cases, it seems the other way around.

Planning wise, you would need to apply for a house with 4 bed garage + apartment, build that and then keep renewing the planning for the rest.

Not sure where you would get planning for a 4 bay garage with a apartment coupled with what would be a fairly large site with a expected 2 two story buildings.

that would be the idea, I can mortgage a site and afford to build a 2 storey apartment over garage now , and in 10 years Time be in a position to be a decent way towards the main house. I don't need a 4 bedroom house right now, I do need a multi bay garage and workshop.

Gumbo · 24-03-2020 7:15pm

Eric Cartman wrote: »

that would be the idea, I can mortgage a site and afford to build a 2 storey apartment over garage now , and in 10 years Time be in a position to be a decent way towards the main house. I don't need a 4 bedroom house right now, I do need a multi bay garage and workshop.

You won’t get planning and sign off to do this.

Gumbo · 24-03-2020 7:15pm

Cuddlesworth wrote: »

Not sure viable sites are much cheaper then just purchasing a finished house. In a lot of cases, it seems the other way around.

Planning wise, you would need to apply for a house with 4 bed garage + apartment, build that and then keep renewing the planning for the rest.

Not sure where you would get planning for a 4 bay garage with a apartment coupled with what would be a fairly large site with a expected 2 two story buildings.

You cannot renew the planning for the house of the garage has been commenced.
It has to be substantially completed or the planning expires and you need a new planning.

CalRobert · 25-03-2020 11:13am

Can't imagine this working but you could keep an eye out for derelict buildings. I just tried to get permission for a modern house with the existing structure (old cottage) as an accessory dwelling and was immediately shot down.

Also, local needs has been ruled illegal and the councils are dragging their feet on updating it. You could apply, get denied for local needs, and then sue, if you're the fighting sort.

Gumbo · 25-03-2020 2:51pm

CalRobert wrote: »

Can't imagine this working but you could keep an eye out for derelict buildings. I just tried to get permission for a modern house with the existing structure (old cottage) as an accessory dwelling and was immediately shot down.

Also, local needs has been ruled illegal and the councils are dragging their feet on updating it. You could apply, get denied for local needs, and then sue, if you're the fighting sort.

Your understanding of local needs is incorrect.

Local needs only applies in an area where planning is strictly forbidden in the first place. They make an exception for local needs.

If you cancel local needs, it means nobody gets planning on that location.

CalRobert · 25-03-2020 3:03pm

Gumbo wrote: »

Your understanding of local needs is incorrect.

Local needs only applies in an area where planning is strictly forbidden in the first place. They make an exception for local needs.

If you cancel local needs, it means nobody gets planning on that location.

My understanding is based on
https://selfbuild.ie/news/revision-to-locals-only-rule-a-priority-minister/

I believe what you describe is what is happening. See Meath, for instance:

https://consult.meath.ie/en/consultation/meath-draft-county-development-plan/chapter/09-rural-development-strategy

Looks like you need 25 acres and a family history, which is a bit inconsiderate towards people who might like to become farmers and don't need 25 acres, tbh.

Some folks concerned about the above at https://www.change.org/p/meath-county-council-save-rural-housing?recruiter=333547639&utm (this is not an endorsement)

25-03-2020 3:03pm

What's your budget OP?
I imagine buying an existing farmhouse and yard would be the most likely.
https://touch.daft.ie/commercial-property-for-sale/rogerstown-edenderry-co-offaly/1475483
That's what happens around me - farm sheds are repurposed into workshops.

Donald Trump · 25-03-2020 3:48pm

CalRobert wrote: »

Looks like you need 25 acres and a family history, which is a bit inconsiderate towards people who might like to become farmers and don't need 25 acres, tbh.

That is an oxymoron and a half

(Unless you are going building glasshouses.......and that ain't cheap)

CalRobert · 25-03-2020 3:49pm

Donald Trump wrote: »

That is an oxymoron and a half

(Unless you are going building glasshouses.......and that ain't cheap)

I was specifically thinking of high end niche growers, in the model of Richard Perkins, Jean-Martin Fortier, etc.

Places commutable to Dublin where one off houses still get planning

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