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New Dail / New Taoiseach

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Comments

  • #632
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 17,847 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Oh, Dear. Mammy won’t be best pleased. SF TDs not paying into the party coffers. How very dare they! https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-gets-less-from-tds-wages-than-required-982340.html


  • #633
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    zimmermania wrote: »
    Getting back on track,can anyone tell me why Lady Lou would want to go into government with FF or FG when SF say they have little in common with both parties?,is she just playing a game,hoping they would talk to her? and when the talks would break down Lady Lou would come out and say she could not betray her supporters by entering into a arrangement with the right wing parties who were not prepared to accede to her demands.

    It will take a while to sort out a government and the saying "it aint over until the fat lady sings" was never more true.
    It is about giving the right impression. The options are very limited and diminishing in likelihood - a cobbled left thing propped up by FF, a straight coalition between FF and SF and that grand coalition/alliance FF might beg FG for. The more likely option as we stand is Round 2 and MLM being all stateswomanlike in the face of the "undemocratic" FF & FG will be a core feature of their next campaign.


  • #634
    Stewball
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 813 ✭✭✭Stewball


    Ged Nash ruling himself out of the leadership race this morning.


  • #635
    PatrickSmithUS
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 263 ✭✭PatrickSmithUS


    Howlin not running for Ceann Comhairle is costing them an easy additional seat in the next election.

    George Lawlor would romp home in Wexford without Howling in the race.


  • #636
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,012 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    They would be nuts to have Kelly as the new leader. He's mouthy and immature.


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  • #637
    sdanseo
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 9,276 ✭✭✭sdanseo


    Sleeper12 wrote: »
    He can refuse to dissolve the Dail. Brian Lenihan senior famously called the president to ask him not to dissolve the Dail. If he feels there is a better option he could refuse. I think if Leo went to the president in the next few weeks the president can refuse & suggest that they try harder. Obviously eventually if no government is formed the president would agree to an election.
    I think I'm correct in the above. Happy to be corrected

    Spot on.


  • #638
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,609 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Oh, Dear. Mammy won’t be best pleased. SF TDs not paying into the party coffers. How very dare they! https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-gets-less-from-tds-wages-than-required-982340.html


    Interesting name on the list of those not paying is John Brady.

    As I understand it he lives in a council house despite raking in over 100k in salary and expenses. This was defended at the tie. By the usual group of supporters on the basis that he was on a lot less because he was contributing to the party.

    Seems that wa a white lie.


  • #639
    Dyr
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,246 ✭✭✭✭Dyr


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Oh, Dear. Mammy won’t be best pleased. SF TDs not paying into the party coffers. How very dare they! https://www.irishexaminer.com/breakingnews/ireland/sinn-fein-gets-less-from-tds-wages-than-required-982340.html

    It's a stupid policy, nothing more than a PR stunt that keeps biting them on the arse, as stupid as the stunt where they claimed that they were on the AIW and then got caught (oops Dessie) taking their full wage.

    A few years back one of their party staff actually called in his union because he rightfully claimed that his employer was trying to strong arm a portion of his wages back off him.


  • #640
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,384 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Seems 42% want MLMD as Taoiseach.
    1

    https://twitter.com/caulmick/status/1230016828967092231?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1230016828967092231&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boards.ie%2Fvbulletin%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D2058045382%26page%3D90


  • #641
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Seems 42% want MLMD as Taoiseach.
    1

    https://twitter.com/caulmick/status/1230016828967092231?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1230016828967092231&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boards.ie%2Fvbulletin%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D2058045382%26page%3D90
    Nearly 50% of the Dail do not!


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  • #642
    Salary Negotiator
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,138 ✭✭✭Salary Negotiator


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Seems 42% want MLMD as Taoiseach.
    1

    https://twitter.com/caulmick/status/1230016828967092231?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1230016828967092231&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boards.ie%2Fvbulletin%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D2058045382%26page%3D90

    Shows that Varadkar is doing the right thing by aiming to go into opposition.


  • #643
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,609 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    FrancieBrady wrote: »
    Seems 42% want MLMD as Taoiseach.
    1

    https://twitter.com/caulmick/status/1230016828967092231?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1230016828967092231&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.boards.ie%2Fvbulletin%2Fshowthread.php%3Ft%3D2058045382%26page%3D90


    Let them have her.

    She has the numbers, there are 86 non-FF, non-FG TDs in the Dail. Her negotiating skills should be able to pull a government together.


  • #644
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,384 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    Salary Negotiator wrote: »
    Shows that Varadkar is doing the right thing by aiming to go into opposition.

    Based on that poll is Varadkar (not to mention Martin) doing anything 'right'?


  • #645
    ednwireland
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,795 ✭✭✭✭ednwireland


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Let them have her.

    She has the numbers, there are 86 non-FF, non-FG TDs in the Dail. Her negotiating skills should be able to pull a government together.

    this, get on with it

    My weather

    https://www.ecowitt.net/home/share?authorize=96CT1F



  • #646
    celt262
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,800 ✭✭✭celt262


    ednwireland wrote: »
    this, get on with it

    Yes I voted for change.


  • #647
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,700 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Let them have her.

    She has the numbers, there are 86 non-FF, non-FG TDs in the Dail. Her negotiating skills should be able to pull a government together.

    FG and FF can continue being salty and refusing to negotiate an equal partnership and we’ll go back to the electorate to sort it out. SF don’t appear to have much to fear there.


  • #648
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,609 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    FG and FF can continue being salty and refusing to negotiate an equal partnership and we’ll go back to the electorate to sort it out. SF don’t appear to have much to fear there.

    Why would we vote again? Mary-Lou has the numbers, do it. The people voted for change, and if Mary-Lou isn't up to delivering it, let them vote for someone else to do it.


  • #649
    FrancieBrady
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 75,384 ✭✭✭✭FrancieBrady


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Why would we vote again? Mary-Lou has the numbers, do it. The people voted for change, and if Mary-Lou isn't up to delivering it, let them vote for someone else to do it.

    That's the same thing as saying 'vote again'. :)


  • #650
    LuckyLloyd
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 36,700 ✭✭✭✭LuckyLloyd


    blanch152 wrote: »
    Why would we vote again? Mary-Lou has the numbers, do it. The people voted for change, and if Mary-Lou isn't up to delivering it, let them vote for someone else to do it.

    Yeah yeah, you know that isn’t true but whatever.

    Two of FFG and SF need to do a deal, with help from at least one smaller party. Otherwise we’re back at the polls.

    That’s the reality and you know it, as much as I enjoy your displeasure at the situation.


  • #651
    Chips Lovell
    Moderators, Politics Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 24,277 Mod ✭✭✭✭Chips Lovell


    There's a lot of haggling left to be done but I suspect we're heading towards a minority government and the route to that may lie in at least one of the big three parties abstaining on a vote for Taoiseach.


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  • #652
    Mearings
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 558 ✭✭✭Mearings


    If SF assume power who will play the part of Dominic Cummings?


  • #653
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,609 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    LuckyLloyd wrote: »
    Yeah yeah, you know that isn’t true but whatever.

    Two of FFG and SF need to do a deal, with help from at least one smaller party. Otherwise we’re back at the polls.

    That’s the reality and you know it, as much as I enjoy your displeasure at the situation.


    We don't need another election, Mary-Lou just needs to get on with delivering the change she promised.

    The numbers are there for her, we have been through this already. Now that the rural independents want to do a deal, there is no issue.


  • #654
    ddarcy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 553 ✭✭✭ddarcy


    blanch152 wrote: »
    We don't need another election, Mary-Lou just needs to get on with delivering the change she promised.

    The numbers are there for her, we have been through this already. Now that the rural independents want to do a deal, there is no issue.

    Except the numbers aren’t there and you well know it. A stable government needs to be formed and inherently that is not possible with loads of independents (a lot of whom are former FF and FG TDs). So it’s either FF-SF, FF-FG or SF-FG plus another smaller party (really has to be the greens). Or another election and FF and FG crying about the electorate being wrong won’t help them.

    MLM has nothing to lose by trying to form a government. It makes FF and FG look even worse. And quite frankly SF policies are a bit nuts, so the former two big parties hold their nose and go into coalition or risk losing more seats and being given the same option again of them going into coalition.


  • #655
    road_high
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,911 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    ddarcy wrote: »
    Except the numbers aren’t there and you well know it. A stable government needs to be formed and inherently that is not possible with loads of independents (a lot of whom are former FF and FG TDs). So it’s either FF-SF, FF-FG or SF-FG plus another smaller party (really has to be the greens). Or another election and FF and FG crying about the electorate being wrong won’t help them.

    MLM has nothing to lose by trying to form a government. It makes FF and FG look even worse    . And quite frankly SF policies are a bit nuts, so the former two big parties hold their nose and go into coalition or risk losing more seats and being given the same option again of them going into coalition.

    I think in all this SF reticence and game playing some are losing sight of what an election's aim actually is- electing a government to govern. The easy part is actually the governemnt formation- it's the getting in there and delivering on impossible promises that will be the real test. From a SF/others frontbench of extremely limted abilities and experience.
    MLM has everything lo lose in forming a governemnt as there's no where to hide anymore. No blaming "the men" as she does daily and gets away with. No blaming FF or FG. It'll all be on her and co from here on in.


  • #656
    PatrickSmithUS
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 263 ✭✭PatrickSmithUS


    Bowie wrote: »
    They would be nuts to have Kelly as the new leader. He's mouthy and immature.


    That looks like how they're going though.



    O'Riordain, though he loves himself, always come across as extremely ethical in most things he does (Paddy Jackson tweeting aside). If Labour have any hope of appealing to young voters and the vital Dublin based electorate then they have no option but to pick him.


  • #657
    subpar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 509 ✭✭✭subpar


    If you had a problem , who who you rather see come into the room to help . Whilst O'Riordan would talk and listen nicely . Kelly would fix it . Thats the essential difference and thats what Labour needs .


  • #658
    blanch152
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31,609 ✭✭✭✭blanch152


    ddarcy wrote: »
    Except the numbers aren’t there and you well know it. A stable government needs to be formed and inherently that is not possible with loads of independents (a lot of whom are former FF and FG TDs). So it’s either FF-SF, FF-FG or SF-FG plus another smaller party (really has to be the greens). Or another election and FF and FG crying about the electorate being wrong won’t help them.

    MLM has nothing to lose by trying to form a government. It makes FF and FG look even worse. And quite frankly SF policies are a bit nuts, so the former two big parties hold their nose and go into coalition or risk losing more seats and being given the same option again of them going into coalition.


    The numbers are there, up to 86 non-FF, non-FG votes available to Sinn Fein.

    Fine Gael managed to pull a government together in 2016 from a similar position, others did it in the 1980s with more precarious numbers, are you suggesting that Mary-Lou is less of a politician than Enda Kenny, CJH or Garrett?


  • #659
    topmanamillion
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,521 ✭✭✭topmanamillion


    The Tetrarch wrote: »
    Perhaps Sinn Fein might recognise reality.
    They do not recognise Northern Ireland or Ireland.

    From the Sinn Fein mainfesto

    Political unionism has lost its electoral majority in four consecutive elections and the exit poll conducted across the 26 counties in the wake of the Local Government and European elections in 2019 showed a huge majority in support of Irish Unity.

    Demographic trends suggest a nationalist voting majority in the north is close.
    shifts in population and identity demographics in the North in recent decades.
    in the event of Unity, the North would automatically
    In the North, Tory-imposed austerity has placed
    Continued access to citizens in North to the
    currently carried out by the HSE in the South and the NHS in the North
    based on the model in the North of Ireland
    supporting the LGBTQI community North and South
    In the North, we have
    linking larger cities North and South
    authorities in the North
    coastal counties in the North of Ireland
    people living in the North

    Not a fan of SF but this is surely consistent with a party whose primary goal is reunification.
    Essentially the nation they represent doesn't exist yet. Not in a political sense anyway.
    If you're a hard line republican from the anti treaty side then both the North and Republic are imposters and merely stop gap solutions.


  • #660
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    Mearings wrote: »
    If SF assume power who will play the part of Dominic Cummings?

    That is what is worrying. Who will be these nameless backroom group who will decide the direction of the SF led gov? They have not gone away, you know.


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  • #661
    Sam Russell
    Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators Posts: 20,475 Mod ✭✭✭✭Sam Russell


    topmanamillion wrote: »
    Not a fan of SF but this is surely consistent with a party whose primary goal is reunification.
    Essentially the nation they represent doesn't exist yet. Not in a political sense anyway.
    If you're a hard line republican from the anti treaty side then both the North and Republic are imposters and merely stop gap solutions.

    After nearly a century?

    It was a shame that those that drafted the agreement did not agree a single name for it. 'The Good Friday Agreement' or 'The Belfast Agreement'

    They should also have got all sides to agree names for the various entities. Ireland, Northern Ireland, Great Britain - meaning the island of GB including small islands, but not including NI, The UK - meaning NI plus GB, etc. etc. All media should be required to use these terms exclusively.

    A missed opportunity.


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