Caroline Flack found dead

partyguinness · 17-02-2020 04:05PM

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

The blonde irish one that took her job really takes the biscuit for me. Her name escapes me at present, but basically this long tearful spiel about her 'vivacious' friend. Your friend whose job you had whipped away from her in about 15 minutes you mean? Some neck.

Laura Whitmore?

She has a programme on BBC Radio 5 Live every Sunday morning at 10am and yesterday I had to turn off the radio before I vomited just as she started gushing about Flack through her tears.

The media love nothing more than banging on about themselves.

One eyed Jack · 17-02-2020 04:05PM

Millicently wrote: »

The vile nasty abusive stuff on Social Media has to stop, people should have to provide their real names to open an account and not be able to hide behind aliases.

Boards offers posters relative anonymity* on here and people are for the most part capable of remaining civil to each other in spite of the fact that they may vehemently disagree with each other. Twitter, Facebook and other social media offer people less anonymity, but people feel no apparent compulsion to be civil to each other. Often it appears to be the complete opposite - people are proud to stand behind their ability to humiliate other people.

*First rule of the Internet: No such thing as anonymity.

Hammer89 · 17-02-2020 04:06PM

retro:electro wrote: »

The point I’m making and the one you continually seem to be missing is that it does not matter what he decides to say the next day if the footage shows the immediate aftermath of an obvious attack, and apparently she admitted on the footage that she “whacked him over the head”. The reason police wear this body cam footage when called to domestic incidents is for these very reasons, where the next day the victim will play down what happened and say it was all a bit of nothing and just an exaggeration. In these types of situations people need to be protected from themselves.

If there was clear evidence that an attack took place then they are duty bound to press charges, what don’t you understand about that? And now the CPS are being attacked and blamed by people who don’t seem to understand that this is the process of the law. I’m getting tired of making the same point over and over to you so I’m just not going to reply to you anymore.

It's beyond question that there was an attack. That isn't the issue, and if you think I've been arguing that she didn't assault him well that's false. The issue is whether the version of events correlate to exactly what's being reported because the public's perception of her is directly linked to what's being reported, and if there's fundamental flaws in the coverage, which there undeniably is, then there has to be flaws with the subsequent perception.

That's my issue. There's new revelations coming out every day and people aren't adjusting accordingly. I guarantee most people still think it was his blood all over the bedroom. It massively changes the complexion, and there'll be other huge and yet subtle inconsistencies to come. I know what you're saying. You're saying domestic violence is domestic violence irrespective of the details but it's not. You can't form an iron-clad opinion about something - anything - without knowing the context and the finer details.

borderlinemeath · 17-02-2020 04:09PM

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

Is that truely the case though? Id say it is a bit naive to think that every single thing that has taken place in her life, or even this relationship was played out in that one incident as reported by media.
Its probably more likely that there were other incidents and the guy followed through on threats to call police on this occasion.

Personally I feel she was someone who just wasnt equipped for fame, rather than getting any particularly harsh treatment that was worse than treatment other celebrities received.
It also should be pointed out that while facing the gaze of the ireland and GB public for a while must be a rough experience, there are much harsher hardships out there that people live with. I dont believe she was driven to take her own life. I think it was the actions of someone who needed professional help.
That is why these celeb friends of hers who are now posting constant tearful odes to her are something I find quite hard to swallow. If they were actually her friends they would have been spending enough time with her to see that she needed help and would have helped her get it.
The blonde irish one that took her job really takes the biscuit for me. Her name escapes me at present, but basically this long tearful spiel about her 'vivacious' friend. Your friend whose job you had whipped away from her in about 15 minutes you mean? Ffs like.
To my mind all she is thinking throughout that spiel is 'my career my career my career'

Caroline Flack has publicly stated that she wanted Laura Whitmore to fill in. She was expected to return for the summer series.

Do you have an issue with Holly Willoughby filling in for Ant Mc Partlin on Celeb Jungle when he went in to dry out? Is she just as false??

partyguinness · 17-02-2020 04:09PM

Apparently suicide takes more lives than car crashes and cancer in the under 35s (Ok I know she was 40)

I had a quick think about that and yes I know more people my own age that have committed suicide than have died from car crashes or cancer.

Laura99 · 17-02-2020 04:10PM

MayoAreMagic wrote: »

The blonde irish one that took her job really takes the biscuit for me. Her name escapes me at present, but basically this long tearful spiel about her 'vivacious' friend. Your friend whose job you had whipped away from her in about 15 minutes you mean? Ffs like.
To my mind all she is thinking throughout that spiel is 'my career my career my career'

Harsh. They were friends, it made sense for Laura to step into the role, she didn't outshine Caroline so much so that people wanted her to take over completely. And she was also already part of the ITV team, she probably would have been to Cape town the odd time anyways as she's seeing Ian Sterling, and would have visited the set on previous seasons. I don't think this will negatively affect her career at all.

mloc123 · 17-02-2020 04:14PM

The outpouring of celebrities, who have all at some stage in their career had some link to the media, solely blaming social media (which they all choose to use in order to further their career) for her death is laughable.

Crazy idea... if social media is such an ugly place for all these celebs, why don't they delete their accounts and get on with life?

borderlinemeath · 17-02-2020 04:27PM

mloc123 wrote: »

The outpouring of celebrities, who have all at some stage in their career had some link to the media, solely blaming social media (which they all choose to use in order to further their career) for her death is laughable.

Crazy idea... if social media is such an ugly place for all these celebs, why don't they delete their accounts and get on with life?

If you actually read their statements you would see that it's not just social media trolls getting outed, but the tabloid press and their despicable treatment of whoever is the best fodder for them at any particular time.

I'm sure any of her celeb friends who have chosen to speak out were subjected to tabloid gossip/innuendo/lies at some point and know exactly how the media spin things. Look at the phone hacking scandal by Murdochs rags, that wasn't just celebs/royal family. Normal private people and their families were hugely affected by it.

Media can be worthwhile, there are good investigative journalists and then there are the gutter press that twist and manipulate facts to create the most sensational narrative to sell print. Then you have crossover trolls like Katie Hopkins and Piers Morgan stirring things up. Imagine being that hateful every day to get validation? It's baffling to most sane people.

17-02-2020 04:27PM

partyguinness wrote: »

Laura Whitmore?

She has a programme on BBC Radio 5 Live every Sunday morning at 10am and yesterday I had to turn off the radio before I vomited just as she started gushing about Flack through her tears.

The media love nothing more than banging on about themselves.

the bit from her that they played on the tv repeatedly yesterday (same piece at you are referring to I'm sure) I did find more nauseating than anything else tbh

video on this link

https://www.standard.co.uk/showbiz/celebrity-news/caroline-flack-death-laura-whitmore-tribute-a4363226.html

magic_murph · 17-02-2020 04:28PM

Its amazing how celebrities are so distraught after the passing of somebody they know they just have to reach for twitter.
Same when the news of Kobe broke - ex players that you know were good friends with Kobe were posting messages an hour or so after the news.
Hard to find any sincerity in actions like that

AryaStark · 17-02-2020 04:28PM

Dots1982 wrote: »

I’m not the one arguing that they can’t understand it

I made a statement that I cannot understand it... you can fancy who ever you want.
I personally dont understand how an adult (30 year old) can find a baby faced boy sexually attractive and follow through and actually have sex with said boy. Harry was no man he was a boy... and he didnt look older or seem mature... he was very much a young looking boy in a boy band.

Now I can understand thinking he is very attractive and will turn heads when he is older... but I will never understand having her having sex with him.

Hannibal_Smith · 17-02-2020 04:28PM

retro:electro wrote: »

Her team released a statement slamming the CPS for pursuing a “show trial” and heavily implied that she couldn’t cope with the pressure of an the impending case. Have you even read their statement? Nowhere does it mention online trolls or mean comments, yet that hasn’t stopped hundreds of thousands stating a campaign of kindness across social media, as if people being mean to her is what caused her to kill herself. Where are people getting this from? Now I’m sure if she was getting abuse it certainly didn’t help, but I haven’t seen any evidence of this trolling. I’ve seen comments criticising her for apparently doing something awful, that’s not the same as trolling.

It is they who you should be targeting with your passive aggressive know it all comment, not me, as they seem to know exactly why she did what she did.

Her team have said she couldn’t cope with the pressure, they slammed the CPS and she tragically took her own life hours after being made aware that body cam footage would be used against her. So yes, it’s more reasonable to deduce that it was the pressure of the trial and the anxieties around that which was a major factor. Again, pure speculation on my part and none of us will know for sure until there is an inquest.

I realise now my original comment you quoted doesn’t read well so I will edit now accordingly.

You said 'despite the fact that her family and team' -family and team.

The nerve of people starting a campaign of kindness :pac:

Where are people saying it was online trolling and tabloid from is because they have been hounding her since it happened. That surely is no news to you?

They said she was vulnerable. Do you think an online and tabloid campaign could possibly have made it worse?

Passive aggressive know it all comment - the absolute irony.

retro:electro · 17-02-2020 04:29PM

Hammer89 wrote: »

It's beyond question that there was an attack. That isn't the issue, and if you think I've been arguing that she didn't assault him well that's false. The issue is whether the version of events correlate to exactly what's being reported because the public's perception of her is directly linked to what's being reported, and if there's fundamental flaws in the coverage, which there undeniably is, then there has to be flaws with the subsequent perception.

That's my issue. There's new revelations coming out every day and people aren't adjusting accordingly. I guarantee most people still think it was his blood all over the bedroom. It massively changes the complexion, and there'll be other huge and yet subtle inconsistencies to come. I know what you're saying. You're saying domestic violence is domestic violence irrespective of the details but it's not. You can't form an iron-clad opinion about something - anything - without knowing the context and the finer details.

Well if it’s “beyond question” that there was an attack and you’re not arguing against her having assaulted him, I’m at a loss as to what you’re issue is. If there was sufficient evidence at all that an assault took place and footage of a volatile aftermath then the CPS would have been absolutely reckless and irresponsible not to pursue that, and that would have been a decision that goes against everything people who care about domestic violence have been campaigning for for years.

Whether she would have been convicted is anyone’s guess. But the more I’m reading about cases like this and non-compliant witnesses, it’s likely she would have been acquitted or received a suspended sentence. Who knows. But the CPS did their job in initially bringing about a charge, it’s anyone’s guess what the outcome of a trial would have been. It’s just a pity she didn’t see it through.

Keano · 17-02-2020 04:29PM

mloc123 wrote: »

The outpouring of celebrities, who have all at some stage in their career had some link to the media, solely blaming social media (which they all choose to use in order to further their career) for her death is laughable.

Crazy idea... if social media is such an ugly place for all these celebs, why don't they delete their accounts and get on with life?

So what your are saying is that being on social media gives everyone a right to have a pop at you and you just have to suck it up?

Muahahaha · 17-02-2020 04:30PM

Hammer89 wrote: »

Well that's no less of an assumption than me assuming she would've been found innocent. Her friends say, unquoted, that it was the idea of going to court itself - not the potential verdict - which had her distressed, the idea that a courtroom would have to watch bodycam footage of her half-naked, bleeding, drunk and shouting, the idea of those details coming to light. Even if she was innocent, I imagine there's still profound shame and public humiliation to live with, not to mention the strong possibility that she thought her career was over either way.

Yeah it seems that it was likely the thought of the body cam footage getting leaked was what drove her over the edge. Without it maybe, just maybe her career could have been rehabilitated in a year or 18 months. But the footage of her covered in blood and being restrained by police was the ultimate death knell on her career. The tabloids would have published it across their sites and then taken still pictures from the video with her face in a rage and body covered in blood, 'Caroline Flack as never seen before', etc.

You've also got to think that the photo of the blood stained bedroom was already leaked by someone in the police so she would have known it was inevitable that the video was going to get leaked too. That in itself would have put huge pressure on her, it wasnt just her career crumbling, it was her whole life forever living in the UK. She would have been a an absolute pariah once that footage got widely seen and shared. Knowing that was going to happen very soon likely tipped her over the edge.

retro:electro · 17-02-2020 04:38PM

Hannibal_Smith wrote: »

You said 'despite the fact that her family and team' -family and team.

The nerve of people starting a campaign of kindness :pac:

Where are people saying it was online trolling and tabloid from is because they have been hounding her since it happened. That surely is no news to you?

They said she was vulnerable. Do you think an online and tabloid campaign could possibly have made it worse?

Passive aggressive know it all comment - the absolute irony.

If you’re going to deliberately misconstrue every comment I make then I have no desire to continue this conversation with you. My point is that people are using this death for their own self serving reasons. People on social media are stating with absolute certainty that it was social media manslaughter and that nobody should hold a critical opinion of anyone anymore should it lead to them taking their life.

In reality it’s likely to be a situation that was a lot more complex than that. What we do know is she was struggling under the pressure of the impending trial and had anxieties about the footage being used against her. We know that she attempted suicide not only that night, but in a previous volatile relationship with Andrew Brady where an ambulance had to be called with concern to her safety. We know she was in an incredibly vulnerable position and struggling immensely and seemingly had been for years. We know that authorities were called to her home on Friday with concerns to her mental state. So to deduce her death to “trolls” seems completely reductive given the complex situation at hand.

And yes your comment was passive aggressive. If you have something to say then say it outright instead of taking a swipe at me.

partyguinness · 17-02-2020 04:39PM

Keano wrote: »

So what your are saying is that being on social media gives everyone a right to have a pop at you and you just have to suck it up?

I am not saying it is right or wrong but in all reality that's what it comes down to.

It is a symbiotic relationship. 'Celebrities' use social media for exposure to make themselves money and the media get to fill their columns with gossip and the like which they sell. Helluva lot easier than real journalism such as reporting on famines and war.

I suppose you could tell a 'celebrity' just delete your accounts. Simple. But I guess that is like telling an alcoholic "Just stop drinking". Social media is their lifeline and they get all consumed by it.

mloc123 · 17-02-2020 04:44PM

Keano wrote: »

So what your are saying is that being on social media gives everyone a right to have a pop at you and you just have to suck it up?

No.. I am saying, if it is such an ugly place for them... why use it?

Would you sit in a room of people that dislike you and have a pop at you? No... you would get up and leave.

Most of what I saw are celebs blaming only social media, nothing to do with the fact that at one point they have been on the payroll of the various tabloids that fanned the flames.

Galwayguy35 · 17-02-2020 04:44PM

Jurgen Klopp refused to take a question from a Sun reporter because of what happened to Caroline Flack, seems a bit silly to take it out on a sports rpporter who is just doing his job.

optogirl · 17-02-2020 04:46PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Jurgen Klopp refused to take a question from a Sun reporter because of what happened to Caroline Flack, seems a bit silly to take it out on a sports rpporter who is just doing his job.

The manager of Liverpool would have more than one reason not to answer questions asked by that absolute rag of a paper

py2006 · 17-02-2020 04:47PM

mloc123 wrote: »

No.. I am saying, if it is such an ugly place for them... why use it?

Its an important tool these days for celebs and for promoting.

17-02-2020 04:47PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Jurgen Klopp refused to take a question from a Sun reporter because of what happened to Caroline Flack, seems a bit silly to take it out on a sports rpporter who is just doing his job.

he was dead right. why does he have to comment on it?

what has love island got to do with the premiership?

edit. he wasn't asked about it but rather from the sun so he wouldn't answer the question.

any excuse to ignore the sun due to Hillsborough for Liverpool really.

although were the sun any worse than the daily mail, the mirror etc. - probably not.

PaulieC · 17-02-2020 04:47PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Jurgen Klopp refused to take a question from a Sun reporter because of what happened to Caroline Flack, seems a bit silly to take it out on a sports rpporter who is just doing his job.

Lols. Yeah, that's the exact reason a Liverpool manager didn't take a question from The Sun.

mloc123 · 17-02-2020 04:49PM

py2006 wrote: »

Its an important tool these days for celebs and for promoting.

Ah, so they are okay to whore themselves on it... once all the response is positive?

Itssoeasy · 17-02-2020 04:50PM

PaulieC wrote: »

Lols. Yeah, that's the exact reason a Liverpool manager didn't take a question from The Sun.

Might be a terrible event over thirty years ago.

optogirl · 17-02-2020 04:51PM

mloc123 wrote: »

Ah, so they are okay to whore themselves on it... once all the response is positive?

it would be pretty much expected that you promote the show/film/book/album you are part of by using social media - could often be written into contracts. Maybe that needs to be looked at and agents/producers etc have to ease off on what they expect from their talent.

py2006 · 17-02-2020 04:51PM

mloc123 wrote: »

Ah, so they are okay to whore themselves on it... once all the response is positive?

Didn't say that, I was responding to you question of why they use it.

banie01 · 17-02-2020 04:56PM

Galwayguy35 wrote: »

Jurgen Klopp refused to take a question from a Sun reporter because of what happened to Caroline Flack, seems a bit silly to take it out on a sports rpporter who is just doing his job.

I honestly cannot believe that you would think Caroline Flack has anything to do with any LFC employee or supporter not engaging with the Sc*m?

I mean really? Do you also think that's why Anfield was refused hosting an England game?

Galwayguy35 · 17-02-2020 04:57PM

PaulieC wrote: »

Lols. Yeah, that's the exact reason a Liverpool manager didn't take a question from The Sun.

Well he had no problem answering them up to this and said the reason he wasn't answering wasn't because he was Liverpool manager.

mloc123 · 17-02-2020 04:57PM

py2006 wrote: »

Didn't say that, I was responding to you question of why they use it.

I know, tbh it was a leading question.

It just seems they are happy to accept all the benefit from social media... but laws should be brought in to prevent any negative feedback. God forbid there are people out there that do not love them as much as they love themselves.

Caroline Flack found dead

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