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Caroline Flack found dead

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Comments

  • #452
    sashafierce
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,599 ✭✭✭sashafierce


    Millicently wrote: »
    So you are saying that if he cheated on her it's fine for her to assault him while he slept? If someone cheats then you leave them, you don't pick up a lamp and smash it on their head while they sleep. There is no justifying what she did. Of course he didn't want to press charges, most victims don't which is why there have been changes to the law over the years because of pressure put on victims not to press charges. This isn't an isolated incident for her, she's got form for it.

    Christ no what I'm saying is we don't know. We know nothing about the situation at all. We have absolutely no inside information about it therefore why do we judge


  • #453
    Tork
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 3,769 ✭✭✭Tork


    This isn't just about her bashing him over the head with a lamp though. She had form when it came to being abusive. And Lewis Burton was as much a victim as she was.


  • #454
    Hammer89
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,004 ✭✭✭Hammer89


    Deleted User wrote: »
    That is very harmless in fairness.

    Ah yeah it's only a bit of public humiliation in front of millions of people during a personal and professional crisis. Water off a duck's back.


  • #455
    AMKC
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 19,268 ✭✭✭✭AMKC
    Ms


    She done something stupid but we do not know the full facts only what we hear in the media. It is not up to us to judge her. The courts would have done that.

    Unfortunatly for her it became to much and she commited suicide which is very sad.

    She could have admitted what she done was wrong, stupid and dangerous if she did do it and just serve the sentance she was giving but I guess with social media and the comments against her it was all just to much for her.

    I did not know her and did not follow any of the shows she presented or was on but I still think it is terrible to see such a beautiful young women take her own life.

    RIP Caroline.

    Live long and Prosper

    Peace and long life.



  • #456
    Blanco100
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,933 ✭✭✭Blanco100


    People want to use social media to peddle their wares and extract as much positive spin/attention from it as they possibly can.

    The problem is, their reliance on it doesnt enable them a thick enough skin to deal with any type of negativity whatsoever, whether innocent or self induced.

    Living your life in the tabloid magazines/twitter/instagram and actively courting attention/press is a very dangerous game and its a buzz im sure when its all positive, but you better be sure you are squeaky clean or at least mentally capable of dealing with the inevitable mud that gets slung your way.

    Who knows what the thought process was, shame, embarrassment, realisation she may have to join the mere mortals and work outside of the entertainment industry?

    People blaming the justice system who wanted a show trial, thats a joke, they saw first hand what happened not the dressed up version/PR exercise that was presented afterwards to save face for all the "celebs" involved.


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  • #457
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 3,773 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Hammer89 wrote: »
    Ah yeah it's only a bit of public humiliation in front of millions of people during a personal and professional crisis. Water off a duck's back.

    A joke in other words. Yes. The more concerning thing surely is that the joke wasn't even that funny.


  • #458
    Itssoeasy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 41,941 ✭✭✭✭Itssoeasy


    Just another point with regards to the term "blood on their hands" being used. I saw one tweet that said the media had committed "manslaughter" towards Caroline flack which okay the media aren't angels but a certain section of social media throw words and phrases around far too easily IMO. I think does of us who can remember a time before technology and social media when words mattered and there were weight to certain words or phrases that if said made you listen. I mean I understand people are upset but claiming manslaughter is ridiculous.


  • #459
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,795 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Hammer89 wrote: »
    Ah yeah it's only a bit of public humiliation in front of millions of people during a personal and professional crisis. Water off a duck's back.

    Where do you draw the line then . All comedians would be out of work over night


  • #460
    anewme
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 12,202 ✭✭✭✭anewme


    [Deleted User] wrote: »
    A joke in other words. Yes. The more concerning thing surely is that the joke wasn't even that funny.

    I didn't actually get the joke to be honest.

    It cant be that she had to come back in a mask? That's just stupid.

    But Walliams must know how a smart ass comment like that can already kick someone when they are down..

    Watched the Whitney documentary the other night and there were similar comments passed about Whitney (on the Simpsons) when she was clearly in a bad way with drugs.


  • #461
    Millicently
    Closed Accounts Posts: 478 ✭✭Millicently


    sashafierce wrote: »
    Christ no what I'm saying is we don't know. We know nothing about the situation at all. We have absolutely no inside information about it therefore why do we judge
    We know what the Police saw and said.


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  • #462
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    She may have attacked her BF in a mentally ill state

    Mental illness can sometimes result in violent outbursts, that she took her own life lends further evidence?

    She's dead now, sounds like her life was nothing to envy


  • #463
    Hammer89
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,004 ✭✭✭Hammer89


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    Where do you draw the line then . All comedians would be out of work over night

    It isn't the same. You're talking about comedians making insensitive jokes after the tragedy. This was before the tragedy, so already there's a question of liability. I don't think David Walliams is liable in the least. Does that mean his comment was harmless? No. We don't know if it was harmless. We don't know if she laughed or cried when discovering that she was the butt of another joke. What we do know is that jokes in general aren't harmless if the root goal is to get laughs at somebody's expense.


  • #464
    Fr_Dougal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,166 ✭✭✭Fr_Dougal


    Millicently wrote: »
    We know what the Police saw and said.

    This.

    And even her ex came out and said this:
    Brady first spoke out on Flack's case in December, uploading pictures of a confidentiality agreement, thought to be from when he was engaged to her, on social media with the caption: 'Abuse has no gender.'


    'It appears there's yet another victim of domestic abuse being silenced by a gagging order.'

    He added: 'You may be able to silence victims but a leopard never changes her spots. The truth will come out eventually.'

    Looks like she had form, it wasn’t a once off.


  • #465
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,205 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Tork wrote: »
    Unless you subscribe to the theory that he's a psychopath who was abusing her and made it all up.

    who subscribes to this crazy theory exactly?

    his head was cracked with a lamp and there was so much blood that the police attending described it as like a horror movie.

    this is a picture of the bed

    NINTCHDBPICT000550809843-e1577826089602.jpg?w=960


  • #466
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,795 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Hammer89 wrote: »
    It isn't the same. You're talking about comedians making insensitive jokes after the tragedy. This was before the tragedy, so already there's a question of liability. I don't think David Walliams is liable in the least. Does that mean his comment was harmless? No. We don't know if it was harmless. We don't know if she laughed or cried when discovering that she was the butt of another joke. What we do know is that jokes in general aren't harmless if the root goal is to get laughs at somebody's expense.

    I never said anything about it being after the event. Every day comedians make jokes about people and situations they find them selfs in. You seem to think that they shouldn't be allowed to say a joke incase it hurts the person feelings


  • #467
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,696 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Deleted User wrote: »
    Ah here it was only a joke. I am sure he wouldn't have done it if he thought it would contribute to death.

    I am sure of that too. It didnt come across well, got lots of boos in fact. It came from nowhere and was unnecessary


  • #468
    Hammer89
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,004 ✭✭✭Hammer89


    the_pen_turner wrote: »
    I never said anything about it being after the event. Every day comedians make jokes about people and situations they find them selfs in. You seem to think that they shouldn't be allowed to say a joke incase it hurts the person feelings

    Comedians can say whatever they like but they do so in the knowledge that it might very well offend or hurt somebody's feelings. If it didn't do either of those things then it wouldn't have the shock factor and therefore they wouldn't bother saying it. If it was completely harmless there'd be no joke.


  • #469
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,696 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    retro:electro wrote: »
    I didn’t even hear the joke but cheap shot or not, he had no part at all in what happened to her. He had the misfortune of being the barer of an unfunny joke that wouldn’t age well. It’s not fair that he’s now receiving abuse and vilification from the very mob who are criticising Caroline’s vilification.

    Never suggested otherwise. I actually said in my post that I wasnt suggesting for a second that he has blood on his hands. Bet he feels a bit bad about it though.

    Never suggested any abuse he was getting was fair game.


  • #470
    jackboy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,289 ✭✭✭jackboy


    Shelga wrote: »
    I presume it was the torrents of abuse she surely received on social media, fuelled by the cruel British media.

    I’d say getting fired from her job and the end of her relationship had a far bigger impact than the social media stuff.


  • #471
    the_pen_turner
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,795 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Hammer89 wrote: »
    Comedians can say whatever they like but they do so in the knowledge that it might very well offend or hurt somebody's feelings. If it didn't do either of those things then it wouldn't have the shock factor and therefore they wouldn't bother saying it. If it was completely harmless there'd be no joke.

    Offence is taken not given . People choose to be offwnded


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  • #472
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,696 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Deleted User wrote: »
    A joke in other words. Yes. The more concerning thing surely is that the joke wasn't even that funny.

    Out of context it sounds like nothing. But I was watching the show at the time and it came out of nowhere.

    If she hadn't killed herself no more would probably have been said about it. For me it was more, kicking a person while they're down and a cheap shot.

    We now know the depths she was at and it makes the joke even more sh*t.


  • #473
    Ironicname
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,177 ✭✭✭Ironicname


    coinop wrote:
    They only print those stories because people buy the papers. Did you hold the same views during the Paddy Jackson "trial by media"?

    I know I did.


  • #474
    strandroad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,676 ✭✭✭strandroad


    jackboy wrote: »
    I’d say getting fired from her job and the end of her relationship had a far bigger impact than the social media stuff.

    Agree, not sure why the focus on social media at all? Just to have a go at Love Island?
    If someone faces a trial with a fair chance of conviction and their career is down the drain, with a history of depression the impact must be huge as is, with tabloid coverage perhaps an extra kick but still a symptom not the root cause.


  • #475
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,205 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    jackboy wrote: »
    I’d say getting fired from her job and the end of her relationship had a far bigger impact than the social media stuff.

    and the fear of maybe going to jail.

    having a very public job with a nice salary is a double-edged sword and that's just the way it is and even more so these days. any mis-step will be broadcast because some people are interested in reading all about this type of stuff.

    so the falls are greater than they are for a person not so-much in the public eye.


  • #476
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    razorblunt wrote: »
    Fück Piers Morgan. His behaviour towards Megan Markle is equally as disgraceful.
    He’s also doing all those things to Jameela Jamil now too.

    I know, that’s why I said I’m loathe to agree with him.
    He’s a total hypocrite. But in this instance, he’s correct.
    Caroline had lost everything privately, publicly, personally and professionally.
    Her career was over and her reputation was in tatters, no one was publicly supporting her or defending her actions. She was completely isolated in every sense of the word.
    So there was absolutely no need for the press to twist the knife by repeatedly targeting her over and over with the same stories about the allegations when the trial hadn’t even taken place yet.


  • #477
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    lawrencesummers wrote: »
    Out of interest (and not having a go) if the gender roles were reversed would you still hold the same opinion? Had she been allegedly battered on the head with a lamp by the BF and he was vilified by the media to the point of suicide would you think the same?


    I don’t seem to recall anyone having that point of view about the bladerunner fella pistorious before his conviction.

    If the genders were reversed there would have been a significant portion of the public and media that would have considered him innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
    The coverage and treatment he got wouldn’t have been so one sided and relentless, and it might not have been so hard for a person to deal with.

    Even here on Boards there was a thread a week or two ago about a man who confessed to raping his unconscious partner.
    He confessed, admitted it, pled guilty and was convicted.
    And guess what?
    There was still a lot of people here saying that maybe the woman made him do it and found roundabout ways to lay all the blame on her shoulders for the fact that she had been raped.

    So I actually think it would have been better for Caroline if she had been a man and the genders were reversed, because at least then she would have had some of the people like the above defending her until she had her day in court, and she might not have felt so lost and alone that the only way out she saw was taking her own life.


  • #478
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    Calculon6000 wrote: »
    Well in fairness you can use that excuse for anything, does a mentally healthy person rape or murder people.

    Not defending her but that she took her own life relatively soon after suggests mental illness may have been a factor for quite some time


  • #479
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 19,205 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    If the genders were reversed there would have been a significant portion of the public and media that would have considered him innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
    The coverage and treatment he got wouldn’t have been so one sided and relentless, and it might not have been so hard for a person to deal with.

    Even here on Boards there was a thread a week or two ago about a man who confessed to raping his unconscious partner.
    He confessed, admitted it, pled guilty and was convicted.
    And guess what?
    There was still a lot of people here saying that maybe the woman made him do it and found roundabout ways to lay all the blame on her shoulders for the fact that she had been raped.

    So I actually think it would have been better for Caroline if she had been a man and the genders were reversed, because at least then she would have had some of the people like the above defending her until she had her day in court, and she might not have felt so lost and alone that the only way out she saw was taking her own life.

    Rubbish.

    If it was the boyfriend who smashed her head with a lamp and that photo with blood all over the shop was out there he would have been thrown under a bus. even more so. And unfortunately some people I would wager would probably say good enough for him if he had subsequently taken his life.

    don't see how a couple of posts from loonies on some other boards thread has any relevance to this.


  • #480
    Fr_Dougal
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,166 ✭✭✭Fr_Dougal


    SusieBlue wrote: »
    If the genders were reversed there would have been a significant portion of the public and media that would have considered him innocent until proven guilty in a court of law.
    The coverage and treatment he got wouldn’t have been so one sided and relentless, and it might not have been so hard for a person to deal with.

    Even here on Boards there was a thread a week or two ago about a man who confessed to raping his unconscious partner.
    He confessed, admitted it, pled guilty and was convicted.
    And guess what?
    There was still a lot of people here saying that maybe the woman made him do it and found roundabout ways to lay all the blame on her shoulders for the fact that she had been raped.

    So I actually think it would have been better for Caroline if she had been a man and the genders were reversed, because at least then she would have had some of the people like the above defending her until she had her day in court, and she might not have felt so lost and alone that the only way out she saw was taking her own life.

    Maybe you should have a look at the Belfast Trial thread.

    Bear in mind this is after they were found not guilty. https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057856515

    They were still treated as guilty by the majority of people.


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  • #481
    SusieBlue
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,029 ✭✭✭SusieBlue


    glasso wrote: »
    Rubbish.

    If it was the boyfriend who smashed her head with a lamp and that photo with blood all over the shop was out there he would have been thrown under a bus. even more so. And unfortunately some people I would wager would probably say good enough for him if he had subsequently taken his life.

    don't see how a couple of posts from loonies on some other boards thread has any relevance to this.

    Actually it’s been reported that the blood on the bed is her own from self harming, it wasn’t from a wound inflicted on him.

    I completely disagree, regardless. It wasn’t a few, it was a lot. Enough of them to get the thread locked pretty sharpish.
    And it happens all the time here, in any thread where a woman is a victim there will be a significant amount of posters who will defend the man at all costs.
    There is a big enough cohort here, and there are people like that in the real world too.

    I stand by my claim that if it was the other way around the coverage wouldn’t have been so one sided. Innocent until proven guilty and all that.


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