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GE Exit Poll 10 pm

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Comments

  • #6212
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,305 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    LuasSimon wrote: »
    Should Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael not merge at this stage and form a Tory Conservative party , don’t think there’s much of a difference between them anymore ??
    Both want the status quo to remain , look after the rich or their buddies etc etc ...The Irish Conservative party ??
    Dev must be turning in his grave

    A better question is why don't all the left leaning parties merge? It would make much more sense so they had a solid block to form a government. Vote left transfer left is pointless when they can't come to a deal afterwards.

    I know it will never happen, because each have their own purity tests and attention seeking leaders, but given the circumstances it needs to be asked.


  • #6213
    Brendan Bendar
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,469 ✭✭✭✭Brendan Bendar


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    A better question is why don't all the left leaning parties merge? It would make much more sense so they had a solid block to form a government. Vote left transfer left is pointless when they can't come to a deal afterwards.

    I know it will never happen, because each have their own purity tests and attention seeking leaders, but given the circumstances it needs to be asked.

    Who would want a Govt. with Gino Kenny, Mick Barry, Paul Murphy, et al in it.

    C’mon


  • #6214
    salmocab
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,757 ✭✭✭✭salmocab


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    A better question is why don't all the left leaning parties merge? It would make much more sense so they had a solid block to form a government. Vote left transfer left is pointless when they can't come to a deal afterwards.

    I know it will never happen, because each have their own purity tests and attention seeking leaders, but given the circumstances it needs to be asked.

    Different parties have different ethos, it’s different shades of left. What your proposing is effectively the American system of two parties albeit they don’t have any left. Right and left are just broad terms but it’s probably not a good way to just lump people in and expect them to agree. FG would be Center right and I doubt they have much in common with hard right people.


  • #6215
    Billcarson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭Billcarson


    brendanwalsh wrote: »
    The country is in a good state.
    We have one of the highest standards of living in the world.




    Sure that's why fg did so well in the election. Lol


  • #6216
    Billcarson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,723 ✭✭✭Billcarson


    Mantis Toboggan wrote: »
    FF & FG are going save the country :pac::pac::pac:

    Lol indeed.

    The only ones they are saving or trying to save is themselves. A real circle the wagons job.. They need each other now.


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  • #6217
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,305 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    salmocab wrote: »
    Different parties have different ethos, it’s different shades of left. What your proposing is effectively the American system of two parties albeit they don’t have any left. Right and left are just broad terms but it’s probably not a good way to just lump people in and expect them to agree. FG would be Center right and I doubt they have much in common with hard right people.

    I'm not proposing a two party system, I'm calling out how hypocritical it is to demand that FG and FF merge but not taking that mindset to all parties.

    Parties of the centre/centre right have more in common than differentiates them, likewise those on the left. It doesn't mean they should all merge.


  • #6218
    Tony EH
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,093 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    I'm not proposing a two party system, I'm calling out how hypocritical it is to demand that FG and FF merge but not taking that mindset to all parties.

    That's not people are saying though. Some folk are suggesting (facetiously in most cases) that FF and FG merge because there is little genuine difference between them nowadays.

    That doesn't apply to the parties on the left, because it's a broader church of political opinion.


  • #6219
    Mad_maxx
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,496 ✭✭✭✭Mad_maxx


    salmocab wrote: »
    Different parties have different ethos, it’s different shades of left. What your proposing is effectively the American system of two parties albeit they don’t have any left. Right and left are just broad terms but it’s probably not a good way to just lump people in and expect them to agree. FG would be Center right and I doubt they have much in common with hard right people.

    how are FG centre right ( in 2020 ) ?


  • #6220
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 45,738 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    FF/FG/Greens the big favourite now for government. The bookies don't think SF will be in now. Big blow after last week.


  • #6221
    devnull
    Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators Posts: 11,893 Mod ✭✭✭✭devnull


    Instead of reading the lines, I've spent the last hour analysing statements in between the lines from politicians.

    Fianna Fail have refused to rule out propping up a Sinn Fein led government in a confidence and supply motion but have in a coalition.

    Fianna Fail and Sinn Fein are still talking despite this which suggests something is still at work.

    Fianna Fail say they are talking to other parties but not Fine Gael yet, whilst Sinn Fein says similar.

    Suggests that Fianna Fail may be willing to prop up a Sinn Fein / Left wing led minority government with confidence and supply?

    Other than that FF/FG/Green looks likely, however FF and FG seem to be avoiding any contact at the moment.


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  • #6222
    McMurphy
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,365 ✭✭✭✭McMurphy


    6 wrote: »
    FF/FG/Greens the big favourite now for government. The bookies don't think SF will be in now. Big blow after last week.

    Big blow?

    I wouldn't think so, they... do.... not....have...the... numbers, once again.....
    they do not have the numbers to form a coalition of the left, and with FF FG locking them out by circling the wagons, I reckon MLMD, Doherty, Carthy and O'Reilly etc will be happy enough being handed the main opposition party role.

    McDonald certainly don't hold back and say nowt if Tweedle Dum and Dee are presiding over some dodgy deal or a bit of the auld cronyism.

    Apart from that, with/if SF are the main opposition party, and dum/dee are forced to coalesce together, they might actually work together to benefit the state and not each other or their developer buddies or their redacted mates with a 37 seat strong shinners breathing down their necks.

    SF will also be building up serious momentum and when FF FG make their inevitable funk up, one will inevitably shaft the other in a blame game, in comes the election, one or the two of FFG will be obliterated, and the shinners will return more seats.

    It's a win win for everyone all round, and an end to two party politics. Sure you couldn't beat it with a big thorny one


  • #6223
    Calhoun
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    Looks like ML still has some cleaning to do, possibly posted already.

    https://www.thesun.ie/news/5096652/sinn-fein-violet-anne-wynne-charity-rent-arrears/amp/


  • #6224
    listermint
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 34,141 ✭✭✭✭listermint


    Brendan Bendar wrote: »
    Didn’t see too many others putting their shoulders to the wheel.

    I'm sick of this shoulder to the wheel stuff. It's nothing more than soundbytes like tighten your belt.

    Let me let you in on a secret. TDs and ministers aren't shoulders to the wheel. It's he ordinary worker, the person Manning the desk in and A and E . The individuals pouring Foundations on a pissing wet morning, the postman delivering post up a boreen or on house number one thousand in a Dublin suburb.


    This guff about TDs putting their shoulder to a wheel it's a figment of your imagination. There is no shoulder and there is no wheel.

    It's crap like this stemming from subservient attitudes where the person on the street is a thick and the folks in the offices of power are their betters.


    Could you have been any more FG with your wording. I don't think so. Are you the FG press officer because you've had a sterling week with it.


  • #6225
    is_that_so
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 32,132 ✭✭✭✭is_that_so


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Looks like ML still has some cleaning to do, possibly posted already.

    https://www.thesun.ie/news/5096652/sinn-fein-violet-anne-wynne-charity-rent-arrears/amp/
    Yeah, she has her own thread!


  • #6226
    Calhoun
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,447 ✭✭✭Calhoun


    is_that_so wrote: »
    Yeah, she has her own thread!

    Lol really, will have to check it out. The Reddit thread is great, anti vaxx ect.


  • #6227
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    brendanwalsh wrote: »
    The country is in a good state.
    We have one of the highest standards of living in the world.




    Sure that's why fg did so well in the election. Lol

    Exactly. Its extraordinary that people who have it so good, do not appreciate those delivering them such high standards of living. The Irish really behaving like spoiled brats in this latest election. Both FG and FF did superbly well during the last government - there is simply no disputing this fact. But there are people who unthinkingly just put the boot in anyway and bitch as if they have the living standard of Bangladesh. Its brainless behavious and most unseemly and unbecoming.


  • #6228
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    listermint wrote: »
    This guff about TDs putting their shoulder to a wheel it's a figment of your imagination. There is no shoulder and there is no wheel.

    It's crap like this stemming from subservient attitudes where the person on the street is a thick and the folks in the offices of power are their betters.

    TDs work extremely hard. That doesnt fit the narrative of lazy gits on a gravy train though. But then, why let reality influence a good bitching. How many people know that a TDs salary is only €96k ? Yes. Think about that and the work they do, and its clear they arent taking the job for the money, but for public service, and to make a difference for the good of the people of the country.


  • #6229
    Idbatterim
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,449 ✭✭✭✭Idbatterim


    6 wrote: »
    FF/FG/Greens the big favourite now for government. The bookies don't think SF will be in now. Big blow after last week.

    This can potentially explode in FFG face. If thats the case this election, it will likel be the case next election, i.e. not wanting to go in with SF. If they dont make serious progress, which given they have done nothing, will be some turn about. They will be hammered even more, the next election...


  • #6230
    elperello
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 17,408 ✭✭✭✭elperello


    Calhoun wrote: »
    Lol really, will have to check it out. The Reddit thread is great, anti vaxx ect.

    Violet Anne Wynne SF TD for Clare is certainly making the news.

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2058054143


  • #6231
    Hercule Poirot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,231 ✭✭✭Hercule Poirot


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Exactly. Its extraordinary that people who have it so good, do not appreciate those delivering them such high standards of living. The Irish really behaving like spoiled brats in this latest election. Both FG and FF did superbly well during the last government - there is simply no disputing this fact. But there are people who unthinkingly just put the boot in anyway and bitch as if they have the living standard of Bangladesh. Its brainless behavious and most unseemly and unbecoming.

    I don't live in Bangladesh, I live in Ireland

    And if I want to hold the previous government ministers to account for their failings then I'm entitled to do so - this utter bullsh1t of "well at least we're not in Bangladesh" is plain nonsense

    For a developed country to have people sleeping on trolleys in hospitals, to have budgets for government projects spiraling out of control, to have career criminals repeatedly let loose on the streets, the total lack of support for children with special needs? Yes I will blame the incumbent government and yes I will vote for an alternative


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  • #6232
    The Rape of Lucretia
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,440 ✭✭✭The Rape of Lucretia


    Hercule Poirot wrote: »
    to have career criminals repeatedly let loose on the streets

    Thats a problem, yes. But not as big a problem as people electing career criminals as their representatives in the Dail.


  • #6233
    Damien360
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,280 ✭✭✭Damien360


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Thats a problem, yes. But not as big a problem as people electing career criminals as their representatives in the Dail.

    Or terrorists :)


  • #6234
    Hercule Poirot
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,231 ✭✭✭Hercule Poirot


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Thats a problem, yes. But not as big a problem as people electing career criminals as their representatives in the Dail.

    Electing career criminals ahead of FFG candidates says more about the FFG candidates and the lack of faith those areas had in them if you ask me


  • #6235
    efanton
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,164 ✭✭✭efanton


    The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »
    Thats a problem, yes. But not as big a problem as people electing career criminals as their representatives in the Dail.

    I'd be curious as to whom you are referring too?
    THats a genuine question, I cant think of any TD with multiple criminal offences.

    Does fiddling Dail expenses count as a criminal offence?
    If that's the case I could see what you are saying


  • #6236
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,305 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    Tony EH wrote: »
    That's not people are saying though. Some folk are suggesting (facetiously in most cases) that FF and FG merge because there is little genuine difference between them nowadays.

    That doesn't apply to the parties on the left, because it's a broader church of political opinion.

    The difference with FF/FG is that their members can generally act like grown ups and compromise within their parties, despite having quite varied views. With the plethora of parties on the left they instead throw their toys out of the pram and start their own party on nearly every difference of opinion or failed purity test.

    I agree there is little genuine difference between FF/FG at this point but the same could be said between the 'champagne socialist' grouping of Labour & SD or the 'want everything & pay nothing' grouping of Solidarity & PBP & I4C & Workers. That would be 6 left parties down to 2. SF is a complete wildcard, as outside of unification their position swings between those two groups whatever way the popularity wind is blowing.


  • #6237
    Boggles
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 42,572 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    The difference with FF/FG is that their members can generally act like grown ups and compromise within their parties, despite having quite varied views. With the plethora of parties on the left they instead throw their toys out of the pram and start their own party on nearly every difference of opinion or failed purity test.

    I have Renua on the phone for you.


  • #6238
    Tony EH
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,093 ✭✭✭✭Tony EH


    Foxtrol wrote: »
    The difference with FF/FG is that their members can generally act like grown ups and compromise within their parties, despite having quite varied views. With the plethora of parties on the left they instead throw their toys out of the pram and start their own party on nearly every difference of opinion or failed purity test.

    I agree there is little genuine difference between FF/FG at this point but the same could be said between the 'champagne socialist' grouping of Labour & SD or the 'want everything & pay nothing' grouping of Solidarity & PBP & I4C & Workers. That would be 6 left parties down to 2. SF is a complete wildcard, as outside of unification their position swings between those two groups whatever way the popularity wind is blowing.

    Irrespective of how you want to childish frame people who political opinions are different to yours, the point remains.


  • #6239
    Jinglejangle69
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,190 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    McMurphy wrote: »
    Big blow?

    I wouldn't think so, they... do.... not....have...the... numbers, once again.....
    they do not have the numbers to form a coalition of the left, and with FF FG locking them out by circling the wagons, I reckon MLMD, Doherty, Carthy and O'Reilly etc will be happy enough being handed the main opposition party role.

    McDonald certainly don't hold back and say nowt if Tweedle Dum and Dee are presiding over some dodgy deal or a bit of the auld cronyism.

    Apart from that, with/if SF are the main opposition party, and dum/dee are forced to coalesce together, they might actually work together to benefit the state and not each other or their developer buddies or their redacted mates with a 37 seat strong shinners breathing down their necks.

    SF will also be building up serious momentum and when FF FG make their inevitable funk up, one will inevitably shaft the other in a blame game, in comes the election, one or the two of FFG will be obliterated, and the shinners will return more seats.

    It's a win win for everyone all round, and an end to two party politics. Sure you couldn't beat it with a big thorny one

    Why did Mary Lou say she's going to talk to the left parties and FF or FG would be a disaster if they got back into government.

    Are you telling me she can't do simple maths or she was lying?


  • #6240
    Suckit
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 11,211 ✭✭✭✭Suckit


    The same people shouting IRA and Terrorism fail to realise that everyone that voted SF already knew all of those connections before they voted, repeating it over and over isn't likely to make much difference. However, they also know the stories of all the dodgy deals, the corruption allegations, the expensive tribunals, the quangos, the cronyism, the nepotism, the wage hikes, the ridiculous overspending, the hospital queues, the homelessness numbers and the hundreds of other things that can be associated with FFFG.
    The reason that most people that voted for SF this time, is because they are sick to death of FF, FF, FF, FG, FG, FF, FF, FF, FG etc. and those stories.
    If FFFG continue with their refusal to entertain anyone but each other, it will very likely serve to remind people exactly of which stories they may have forgotten too. But that hasn't been so much the case yet.
    In any case, mud slinging seems a bit impotent when used after the horse has bolted.

    FG would definitely seem to be the ones with the most to lose if SF became a regular feature with the majority of voters. After this election, I would be willing to bet that their recruitment has been in overdrive. Expect a lot of changes when they come to fruition.
    FF are undoubtedly the biggest party in the country in terms of elections, FG generally get in when their regular voters are joined by protest votes. This time the protest votes went to SF for obvious reasons, and could easily again, as more and more people see FF and FG as the same party.
    So the more sh*t acting by them, the better it is for SF.
    FG may be in a position now to sit on the sidelines shouting instructions about who the onus is on, but as mentioned, I think it will only serve to drop their figures even more in a party that is already losing popularity, that seems like a pretty dodgy game to be playing.
    Leo has delivered the 2nd worst election campaign the party has ever seen in it's entire history, yet they still seem reluctant to blame him, Harris and Murphy. But insist on blaming the C&S, and well, anything else that they can point at.
    I wonder who they will blame when this all goes tits up for them too..


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  • #6241
    Jinglejangle69
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,190 ✭✭✭Jinglejangle69


    Suckit wrote: »
    The same people shouting IRA and Terrorism fail to realise that everyone that voted SF already knew all of those connections before they voted, repeating it over and over isn't likely to make much difference. However, they also know the stories of all the dodgy deals, the corruption allegations, the expensive tribunals, the quangos, the cronyism, the nepotism, the wage hikes, the ridiculous overspending, the hospital queues, the homelessness numbers and the hundreds of other things that can be associated with FFFG.
    The reason that most people voted SF this time, is because they are sick to death of FF, FF, FF, FG, FG, FF, FF, FF, FG etc.
    If FFFG continue with their refusal to entertain anyone but each other, it will very likely serve to remind people exactly of which stories they may have forgotten too. But that hasn't been so much the case yet.
    In any case, mud slinging seems a bit impotent when used after the horse has bolted.

    FG would definitely seem to be the ones with the most to lose if SF became a regular feature with the majority of voters. After this election, I would be willing to bet that their recruitment has been in overdrive. Expect a lot of changes when they come to fruition.
    FF are undoubtedly the biggest party in the country in terms of elections, FG generally get in when their regular voters are joined by protest votes. This time the protest votes went to SF for obvious reasons, and could easily again, as more and more people see FF and FG as the same party.
    So the more sh*t acting by them, the better it is for SF.
    FG may be in a position now to sit on the sidelines shouting instructions about who the onus is on, but as mentiones, I think it will only serve to drop their figures even more in a party that is already losing popularity, that seems like a pretty dodgy game to be playing.
    Leo has delivered the 2nd worst election campaign the party has ever seen in it's entire history, yet they still seem reluctant to blame him, Harris and Murphy. But insist on blaming the C&S, and well, anything else that they can point at.
    I wonder who they will blame when this all goes tits up for them too..

    Most people voted SF???????????


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