New Dail / New Taoiseach

Wtf ? · 13-02-2020 04:30PM

The thought of SF getting ''inner access'' to our state sends shivers down my spine. Too many shadowy figures still in the backround pulling the strings.
Give me a FF/FG plus whoever anytime.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 04:42PM

mayoman1973 wrote: »

Dont get me wrong. I love the idea of a 32 county sovereign state. Us all waving shamrocks and gaith duine ag caint as gailge. Sinn Fein have done their homework and honed in on the voters who also like this idea but these are not the people who will end up paying for it. This Irish language Act nonsense also gets on my goat. Being force fed Irish from age 4 to 18 has not helped my gra for the language ( Or most people I know down south ) and I cant imagine that being any different up here if Irish were made compulsory. Nurses, teachers etc being underpaid here so that I can have road signs As gailge telling me it's 40 miles to Beal Feirsde is what Sinn Fein are pedalling. Like the Brexit vote, the people who will feel the real pinch when the Sinn Fein honeymoon period is over should they ever actually decide to take on the mantle of power and make some real decisions are the people who voted them in. I'm speaking as one of a limited number of people who can and does vote in both jurisdictions. Even Mary Lou cant do that. My bad. I probably shouldnt though

Making Irish compulsory and teaching it against the will of a student for over a decade is not what an Irish language is about. Irish is taught in a very different way in the north. It actually flourishes.

You think road sign costing is equivalent to the salaries of our nurses and doctors?

The Irish language is about giving right to those who want to use the language as much as possible. Nobody is going to say it's for everything. Why shouldn't we offer that to people, and to protect that language?

You are totally within your right to be against the preservation of my language but give me some facts as to why.

Dyr · 13-02-2020 04:43PM

Wtf ? wrote: »

The thought of SF getting ''inner access'' to our state sends shivers down my spine. Too many shadowy figures still in the backround pulling the strings.
Give me a FF/FG plus whoever anytime.

Indeed, the idea that they'll release the files on the Dublin - Monaghan Bombings must be terrifying.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 04:46PM

tayto lover wrote: »

RTÉ reporting that FF have agreed NOT to go into Government with SF.

Win win for Sinn Fein.

FF and FG in a coalition. SF the opposition. There'll be another GE this year and SF will get a few more seats.

Wtf ? · 13-02-2020 04:48PM

Bambi wrote: »

Indeed, the idea that they'll release the files on the Dublin - Monaghan Bombings must be terrifying.

I don't care about that I live in the now. ''Up the Ra'' cemented my thinking.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 04:53PM

Wtf ? wrote: »

I don't care about that I live in the now. ''Up the Ra'' cemented my thinking.

That's what gets you angry?

Not crooks and banks etc?

At least the shinners only got £26m

Sam Russell · 13-02-2020 04:53PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

Win win for Sinn Fein.

FF and FG in a coalition. SF the opposition. There'll be another GE this year and SF will get a few more seats.

If there is a Gov formed between FF and FG (with support from a mudguard party or two) then it could be quite stable and last 4 or 5 years. They agree on most policies - only differ as to who gets the nice lucrative jobs. After all, FF supported FG for the last 4 years, and now with their trotters in the trough, they should just get along fine, as long as the mudguard party traps all the nasty stuff.

Wtf ? · 13-02-2020 04:58PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

That's what gets you angry?

Not crooks and banks etc?

At least the shinners only got £26m

So you admit SF are crooks ?

charlie14 · 13-02-2020 05:01PM

Deleted User wrote: »

And it only took one left party (Labour) to say they were going to go into opposition to bring about a hung Dail, and new GE.

FF or FG certainly wont offer a C&S support to SF.

And I don't see FF, FG and the greens forming a coalition. Have they taken down the posters yet?!?

I would not totally rule out the offer of a C&S from either.

One or the other,( most likely FF imo), could offer it where this time around the numbers would be much tighter on money bill and confidence votes whereby abstaining would, unlike last time still not guarantee government survival, by SF still needing the support of 24 other TD`s

13-02-2020 05:03PM

charlie14 wrote: »

I would not totally rule out the offer of a C&S from either.

One or the other,( most likely FF imo), could offer it where this time around the numbers would be much tighter on money bill and confidence votes whereby abstaining would, unlike last time still not guarantee government survival, by SF still needing the support of 24 other TD`s

No way. Look what supporting a fairly normal party like FG did for FF. Being seen to support SF and their less than economically sound policies would be ludicrous. And if the leader of FF said he has moral issues with SF how can he prop them up?!?

easypazz · 13-02-2020 05:06PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

Win win for Sinn Fein.

FF and FG in a coalition. SF the opposition. There'll be another GE this year and SF will get a few more seats.

FG are meeting Monday. They will possibly say "we lost the election, we are happy to take our beating, and will go into opposition"

They did say before the election they would only support FF as a last resort on a short term basis.

DrumSteve · 13-02-2020 05:06PM

All well and good for FF to do this, but they've screwed themselves with regards to the North now and power sharing.

Why should the DUP ever listen to them about going into government with SF, if FF won't do it themselves?

13-02-2020 05:08PM

DrumSteve wrote: »

All well and good for FF to do this, but they've screwed themselves with regards to the North now and power sharing.

They haven't - Northern Ireland is effectively a Super Council set up. It's not a government of a fully fledged country. It's Granny Smiths and Oranges (:pac:)

Kermit.de.frog · 13-02-2020 05:09PM

DrumSteve wrote: »

All well and good for FF to do this, but they've screwed themselves with regards to the North now and power sharing.

Why should the DUP ever listen to them about going into government with SF, if FF won't do it themselves?

Not the same. There is a forced marriage in the north.

This is a republic and it's for the parties to decide who goes in to government with who. The north is an irrelevance in terms of our government here.

olestoepoke · 13-02-2020 05:10PM

Wtf ? wrote: »

I don't care about that I live in the now. ''Up the Ra'' cemented my thinking.

This post is a contradiction of itself

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 05:11PM

Sam Russell wrote: »

If there is a Gov formed between FF and FG (with support from a mudguard party or two) then it could be quite stable and last 4 or 5 years. They agree on most policies - only differ as to who gets the nice lucrative jobs. After all, FF supported FG for the last 4 years, and now with their trotters in the trough, they should just get along fine, as long as the mudguard party traps all the nasty stuff.

The government will get on fine together for the main (except a lot of FF backbenchers who detest the idea of getting into bed with FG again). But there’ll be absolutely no change to what is happening in society that has made people turn to SF. That is the main point. People voted in larger numbers than ever before for change (obviously change doesn’t have a majority in the country but it’s looking like going that way).

SF will be laughing at this. Their manifesto was written for opposition.

FF should have got SF in then shafted them by taking credit for their policies if they worked.

Scoondal · 13-02-2020 05:11PM

FF have rejected coalition with SF.
FG should now step up with phrases like " national Interest", " protecting the economy" and "with a heavy heart" and offer themselves as a coalition partner to SF.
See SF run a mile.
FG look good. SF look bad. FF looks bad.
FG now have a huge tactical advantage here.
The electorate did not vote for a SF government. 75% voted against SF.

The Tetrarch · 13-02-2020 05:11PM

easypazz wrote: »

FG are meeting Monday. They will possibly say "we lost the election, we are happy to take our beating, and will go into opposition"
They did say before the election they would only support FF as a last resort on a short term basis.

I think FG will let FF takes the main role with Michael Martin as Taoiseach.
We are in a boom. FF will get the blame for the next recession. FG then take over again.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 05:12PM

Wtf ? wrote: »

So you admit SF are crooks ?

I think all politicians are crooks

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 05:15PM

Scoondal wrote: »

FF have rejected coalition with SF.
FG should now step up with phrases like " national Interest", " protecting the economy" and "with a heavy heart" and offer themselves as a coalition partner to SF.
See SF run a mile.
FG look good. SF look bad. FF looks bad.
FG now have a huge tactical advantage here.
The electorate did not vote for a SF government. 75% voted against SF.

The electorate did not vote for a FF government. 75% voted against FF.

Yet we might end up with FF.

Scoondal · 13-02-2020 05:17PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

I think all politicians are crooks

That is incorrect andit is a typical politically populist comment that offers nothing to the electorate.
Irish people are more intelligent than you might think. Most of us can see populist rubbish a mile away.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 05:18PM

Scoondal wrote: »

That is incorrect andit is a typical politically populist comment that offers nothing to the electorate.
Irish people are more intelligent than you might think. Most of us can see populist rubbish a mile away.

It was a sweeping statement with absolutely zero analysis and conviction.

Hence the smiley.

charlie14 · 13-02-2020 05:21PM

Deleted User wrote: »

No way. Look what supporting a fairly normal party like FG did for FF. Being seen to support SF and their less than economically sound policies would be ludicrous. And if the leader of FF said he has moral issues with SF how can he prop them up?!?

My point was that unlike the C&S with FG, FF would not be solely in the position of keeping SF in government in that to do so on money bill and confidence votes would still require a further 24 TD`s support other than SF TD`s to do so.

13-02-2020 05:24PM

charlie14 wrote: »

My point was that unlike the C&S with FG, FF would not be solely in the position of keeping SF in government in that to do so on money bill and confidence votes would still require a further 24 TD`s support other than SF TD`s to do so.

I think practically everyone would see them as propping up SF regardless... I would anyway.

Castlekeeper · 13-02-2020 05:24PM

Green&Red wrote: »

This is very accurate. If we take it that we want a peaceful unified Ireland, then you have to make them an offer they can't refuse. Much like the IRA haven't gone away neither have the UVF etc. So even if we ignore the massive financial cost, what does that offer look like?

Realistically a government split between Kildare St and Stormont, no more Irish language on the state bodies, police instead of gardai, Amhrain na bhfiann no longer the national anthem. That list goes on.

Then you have the massive financial cost, theres no way we could afford to take on the public sector in NI.

They seem to successfully manage similar issuesin Belgium and Switzerland.

UDAWINNER · 13-02-2020 05:24PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

The electorate did not vote for a FF government. 75% voted against FF.

Yet we might end up with FF.

actually 78%:)

olestoepoke · 13-02-2020 05:25PM

Scoondal wrote: »

FF have rejected coalition with SF.
FG should now step up with phrases like " national Interest", " protecting the economy" and "with a heavy heart" and offer themselves as a coalition partner to SF.
See SF run a mile.
FG look good. SF look bad. FF looks bad.
FG now have a huge tactical advantage here.
The electorate did not vote for a SF government. 75% voted against SF.

Forgive my ignorance but if I voted for lets say a Lab candidate number 1 and put SF as my 2nd or 3rd choice and that SF candidate acquired the quota and much more on the 1st count (as was the case in almost all the 39 constituencies) What happens to that 2nd 3rd or 4th vote? My point is that to say because 25% of the electorate voted SF as their first choice does not automatically mean that "75% voted against SF" but then that wouldn't suit your narrative right?

charlie14 · 13-02-2020 05:27PM

Scoondal wrote: »

FF have rejected coalition with SF.
FG should now step up with phrases like " national Interest", " protecting the economy" and "with a heavy heart" and offer themselves as a coalition partner to SF.
See SF run a mile.
FG look good. SF look bad. FF looks bad.
FG now have a huge tactical advantage here.
The electorate did not vote for a SF government. 75% voted against SF.

FG would not even need to go into coalition. They could offer a C&S that would have the same possible outcome, plus keep their supporters who appear resigned on going into opposition, happier than a coalition with FF.

The_Fitz · 13-02-2020 05:28PM

olestoepoke wrote: »

Forgive my ignorance but if I voted for lets say a Lab candidate number 1 and put SF as my 2nd or 3rd choice and that SF candidate acquired the quota and much more(as was the case in almost all the 39 constituencies) What happens to that 2nd 3rd or 4th vote? My point is that to say because 25% of the electorate voted SF as their first choice does not automatically mean that "75% voted against SF" but then that wouldn't suit your narrative right?

It was a ridiculous analysis.

Obviously 75% of people didn't vote against Sf just as 78% (thanks to the guy above) didn't vote against FF. It simply does not work like that.

olestoepoke · 13-02-2020 05:30PM

The_Fitz wrote: »

It was a ridiculous analysis.

Obviously 75% of people didn't vote against Sf just as 78% (thanks to the guy above) didn't vote against FF. It simply does not work like that.

You are absolutely right it does not work like that but there seems to be a lot of posters using it as a snowball to throw at other.

New Dail / New Taoiseach

Comments