Whacking Phoenix

chrissb8 wrote: »

Have you ever been around some absolute gowl starts going off pontificating virutous this that and the other? (insert veganism, sustainability, socialism etc.)

Yeah, it's the same thing. No one likes to be talked down to. We are all aware of what's going on in the world. I don't need to hear it from some actor, just so his ego can feel stroked and his vanity can be placated.

I could take it from Leo Di Caprio who seems to be very invested in environmental causes and has been at it for a long time but F U Jacoo coo Phenis and any other imbecile out there who thinks they're striking some chord with the masses.

You can choose to see it as a positive message in which it was intended, or you can choose to feel like you're being talked down to. He's not talking down to anyone, he's speaking from his heart, from a place of good intentions not vanity- and you're choosing to be offended. Not everyone is aware, and most of us are in a state of complacency.

The overwhelming positive response on social media indicates he did strike a chord with the masses, actually.

1800_Ladladlad wrote: »

Nobody likes being preached too. It's as simple as that. Especially when it's coming from actors/musicians who live a totally different lifestyle than the general public. His speech, and many like it, are the equivalent of "spitting down". An actor/musician/celeb incorporating their political beliefs/views into the likes of the mainstream media via their interviews/speeches/media is not on for me.

What the speeches/statements say to me is that the audience and the public is wrong, you should be guilty and do more. I don't see them "speaking out" as using their position to spread awareness but as an abuse of their platform which serves to benefit them and even cause resentment amongst their fans.

Iv always been a massive fan of Phoenix, but I won't be looking at his behind the scenes, interviews or speeches, etc in the future as he's a great actor and I just don't want his sh*te getting in the way of me being a fan of his. IMO if you're a musician/actor/celeb your political opinions should be kept separate.

Not everyone feels the way you do about statements and POV's as being "preached at." The high level of positive response he's received goes to show that a great many people remain open-minded and open-hearted and are glad of the positive messaging urging awareness and change.

Fact is we are not blameless and should do more. I think where it rubs the nerve is that some people don't like being reminded of the harm we're doing to others and the natural world and don't want to change. An actor/musician/celeb are as varied as any of us in their personal lives, pay their taxes, and are entitled to a voice like anyone else. What benefit does Joaquim get for speaking his mind and heart? So it's abuse and preaching when someone highly visible speaks out, but it's acceptable if an average Joe does it, and what does it matter if the message was the same. If it's right. He's not wrong.

Celebs/musicians have been speaking out and doing good things for years. U2? Live Aid? If I dug deep or googled I'm sure an absolute massive list could be generated of the celebrities/actors/musicians & bands who have used their "star power" to do a **** ton more good than any average person or small not for profit org.

chrissb8 wrote: »

They're singers, actors and other established famous people. The average person does not have time in their lives for such causes. What are you getting at here.

Their opinion is valid, to a degree. The average person will dig their heels in because they do not like being told from someone so far removed from everyday life they have to be better.

It's the self awareness to not realise this from celebrities who "feel" they have to use their platform. They are famous because they are good actors or singers. This does not make them opinion leaders and more often than not get shown up for their hypocrisy.

Take U2 as your example you used, U2, who teamed up with Apple for the Ipods, terrible stuff going on the production lines of Apple.

It's the entitlement that these people feel they can preach, and it is preaching, to everyday hardworking people as Ricky Gervais said. Most people are thinking and who are you? To tell me to change my life?

That's how people's minds work. You have to earn the right to say that kinda stuff. Just like I've seen in real life vegans saying to other people the farming industry isn't sustainable and cruel.

People just shut down. Most people think, good for you but don't start commenting on my lifestyle. We only need to look closer at each other and the warts become visible. This is how people think, they don't want to be talked down to, you have to convince them.

Taking Phoenix again as another example of hypocrisy. He goes on about how the meat industty is cruel yet, in the same speech talks about discrimination in an industry he has been years in, and has just accepted an award off? "I feel conflicted" Here's an idea. Don't accept the award.


Preaching is preaching. Making people understand through education, reason and incentives is how you convince people. Not hijacking an award speech taking it out of context and because it's a good cause doesn't make it preaching and frankly is just f*****g rude. It's about how you deliver it, like any conversation.

What I'm getting at is that they don't lose their right to speak up on whatever they want just because they're famous. And if the average person doesn't have time (which just isn't true) then all the better to let anyone who does have the time and desire to speak out and up.

Some people don't mind "being told," aka taking a fair point and perspective from someone speaking on something valid. It's a cop out is what that is. I would say people far less like being ordered to do something, being left with no choice to make. If we leave things as they are the choice to listen or not will eventually be taken from us all. If you agree that fair points have been made it shouldn't matter who said it. Right is right. If people shut down out of stubbornness then that's their moral failing. The fault doesn't lie with the person who chose to speak up and do something about it. It's not just Joaquim that has an entitlement to speak up, if that's the way you want to put it. We're all entitled to should we choose. He didn't display a lack of self awareness, quite the opposite actually. He called himself out in his own speech. I'm sure he's well aware (and he sounded quite nervous) that not everyone was going to accept what he's saying, but he chose to do so anyway according to his own standards and morals which he lives up to by all accounts. That's not hypocrisy.
Who is he to tell anyone anything? Same as the rest of us. On a bigger platform, so maybe those who have a bigger voice have an even bigger responsibility to speak out because it makes a bigger impact and difference. On my social media feed alone, there are quite a few conversations about it including one old work mate who didn't really know how cows produced milk- he didn't really think about it and had assumed some cows are just "milk cows." There ya go.

If people shut down rather than keeping open minded and considering the message on it's merit and working on positive change where they can, well what can I say other than it's contributing to the sh*t show the world is in. I don't respect people who just stubbornly dig their heels in and say, nope, I don't like being told what to do. Some people need to remove their heads from their own arses. "You have to earn the right to say that kind of stuff..."Horrible attitude to have about the plight of others and this world we all share. Again, for one to even have that ability to check out is to be in a place of privilege.

Where would you suggest he deliver that speech? And the others he also made? For one there wouldn't be the same global reach, which is the POINT. Secondly, part of it was to do with the actual acceptance of the award(s) and pointing out a lack of diversity and the message that sends to people of colour as he put it. If he feels called to speak out against that, he's every right to do it and it was the absolute appropriate venue to do so.

At my company holiday party last year, leadership talked about what we've achieved internally and in the community and how we could do more. In fact that's happened at almost every company party, and award event I've been to. A lot of people take that opportunity to talk about where they'd like us to go further and do more. It's actually quite a normal thing to do, Oscars/famous or not.