What have we come to

gormdubhgorm · 10-02-2020 09:43PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Back to how important Brexit was even tho the electorate didnt give it a shíte.

Because they did not understand the issues nor the seriousness of the issues.
It is much easier to peddle a vague concept like 'change'.

blanch152 · 10-02-2020 09:43PM

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Of course it is relevant is The poster Matt Barrett is anti FG vehemently so and picked the name of Leo's partner as his user name.

When someone picks a username for a bit of crack that they know will annoy and upset other people, well we know what kind of a person they are.

Gynoid · 10-02-2020 09:44PM

KWAG2019 wrote: »

All sides do have issues. The savagery of that incident is very obvious; the hidden suicides of the crash less so, the mass emigration less so, the ill health that people worked themselves into to keep things functioning less so. There is no shortage of savagery from the loyalists, the Free State, the Anti Treaty side, the RUC, the British army and on and on. Those are facts.

You lads are telling stories ye think ye have just invented, we older people covered that type of ground long ago when ye were dribbling in yer bibs, you are not inventing the wheel or surprising anyone with yer supposedly blistering analysis. Everyone with 2 brain cells knows about wrong on either side of the troubles.
I was not saying comparable issues re SF and British Army or loyalists etc. We do not have the UVF having just won 20 whatever percent of the vote here because sjws think they are getting socialism and radical change. I am saying show me the comparable issues Matt claims exist with other political candidates here, comparable with what I described.
And by the way I have never voted FF or FG, so stop spouting the stuff about suicides. And I won't tell you there were 50000 casualties of the troubles, and how a lot of deaths were not caused just by a bullet or a bat with nails in it.

Iscreamkone · 10-02-2020 09:45PM

Do Maths say that the Greens are required to make a majority happen ??

blanch152 · 10-02-2020 09:45PM

bubblypop wrote: »

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dessie_Ellis

Probably the nastiest piece of work in the Dail.

gormdubhgorm · 10-02-2020 09:45PM

BanditLuke wrote: »

The establishment aren't taking this well are they. Has anyone checked in on Michael McDowell?

SF you mean they are establishment? Considering McDowell is not a sitting TD I doubt many are thinking of him. But I am sure he is touched.

pjohnson · 10-02-2020 09:46PM

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Because they did not understand the issues nor the seriousness of the issues.
It is much easier to peddle a vague concept like 'change'.

Only the FG Acolytes can truly understand.

The electorate are wrong not FG!

Odhinn · 10-02-2020 09:47PM

blanch152 wrote: »

Probably the nastiest piece of work in the Dail.

Hardly. Lowry surely has that title well under wraps.

Foxtrol · 10-02-2020 09:50PM

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

Glib comment deny and deflect. You mention something that happened decades ago when it suits in one post. Yet in all the others you say we should forget the past and move on.
Now you are trying to ignore the present comments of a sitting Sinn Fein TD who was referring to the past.

SF people must get fierce heartburn with all the deny, deflect, discredit tactics.

It will only get worse. Do you think half their new candidates have been fully vetted and trained properly to deal with the scrutiny that is coming?

A lot of skeletons to come out (or be highlighted to the wider public) and a lot of terrible soundbites to come. They'll blame the media for bias but all you have to do it point to is the hounding they gave Maria Bailey

This will probably be very high on the list of concerns for FF when thinking about going into government with SF.

10-02-2020 09:50PM

Odhinn wrote: »

Hardly. Lowry surely has that title well under wraps.

really?
no problem with people found with bombs & bomb making equipment is somehow worse than others??

FrancieBrady · 10-02-2020 09:51PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

I'm not sure what you're struggling with, your hypocrisy is pretty clear.

In one post you get outraged that I gave FG credit for their part in negotiating Brexit while a few posts earlier you wanted credit to be passed on to Mary Lou and her new band of misfits in the republic for historical negotiations in the north

And we need to negotiate with the 27 on large elements of the deal.

Even without direct negotiations, there will be meetings with Britain (like the ones between Leo and Boris/May) and also negotiations through media. I'm sure the likes of members of the government party shouting 'up the ra' will make things go much more smoothly.

You think SF have never had negotiations with the British before? Dear me.

I think the British are adult enough to know SF's past and accept it. Pity some here weren't as well.

RandomName2 · 10-02-2020 09:51PM

pjohnson wrote: »

Only the FG Acolytes can truly understand.

The electorate are wrong not FG!

Not everyone who votes for SF is a dole scrounger .
Not everyone who thinks SF are scum is a FG acolyte.

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think SF have never had negotiations with the British before? Dear me.

I think the British are adult enough to know SF's past and accept it. Pity some here weren't as well.

Yeah that Corbyn-Sinn Fein alliance worked out real well in Westminster.

pjohnson · 10-02-2020 09:52PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

It will only get worse. Do you think half their new candidates have been fully vetted and trained properly to deal with the scrutiny that is coming?

A lot of skeletons to come out (or be highlighted to the wider public) and a lot of terrible soundbites to come. They'll blame the media for bias but all you have to do it point to is the hounding they gave Maria Bailey

This will probably be very high on the list of concerns for FF when thinking about going into government with SF.

"Hounding they gave Maria Bailey" so shes a brave FG martyr now :pac:

Odhinn · 10-02-2020 09:53PM

bubblypop wrote: »

really?
no problem with people found with bombs & bomb making equipment is somehow worse than others??

Not if you view the armed struggle as valid.

tayto lover · 10-02-2020 09:54PM

hots wrote: »

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/sinn-f%C3%A9in-s-david-cullinane-defends-shouting-up-the-ra-after-election-1.4168791

Jesus christ he stands by it too. I hope this gets the coverage it deserves.

Who is he referring to as “they”?

10-02-2020 09:56PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

You think SF have never had negotiations with the British before? Dear me.

I think the British are adult enough to know SF's past and accept it. Pity some here weren't as well.

While I'm sure the British government were happy to negotiate, back in the day, with every party they could, in order to stop the violence, I'm pretty sure that an Irish government full of people that are saying 'Up the Ra' & signing rebel songs are not going to be the British Governments choice of people to deal with

We need to deal with the British Government, people in the Irish government siging 'oh ah up the ra' is getting us nowhere

pinkyeye · 10-02-2020 10:05PM

vriesmays wrote: »

Imagine if she forgets her makeup.

Talk about stupidity. This has to be the most stupid post I've seen so far on this thread and the bar is high. :rolleyes:

RandomName2 · 10-02-2020 10:06PM

Odhinn wrote: »

Not if you view the armed struggle as valid.

Well that's really the crux of the matter isn't it? Do you consider murder, torture, and bombing legitimate means to an end? I don't. Martin Luther King could have become a guerrilla and lynched white people to get some satisfaction. He didn't. Ghandi could have got his followers to plant bombs and terrorize large populations of people in sectarian attacks. He didn't. Seamus Mallen could have made himself feel like a big guy by putting on a balaclava and pulling the fingernails out of someone accused of being an informer in a dimly lit garage. He didn't.

Everyone has choices. People can justify anything. We have seen people justify anything.

A bit like how Sinn Fein justified its defense of the killing of garda if they got in the way of robberies designed to help fund the armed struggle.

James Brown · 10-02-2020 10:06PM

blanch152 wrote: »

If you are against violence, then you have to be against anyone celebrating violence. Whether it is SF thugs singing “up the ra” or British Army vets counting their kills, they should be condemned.

So unless you are a blatant hypocrite, I expect you to agree that Cullinane should apologise.

I couldn't care less about him shouting that and I couldn't care less about some English lad shouting 'up the Paras' either.

Keeping it like with like. Your post is funny.

anewme · 10-02-2020 10:07PM

Mark Ward, elected in Dublin mid west has signed off this Facebook updates with TAL and an Irish flag.

The Rape of Lucretia · 10-02-2020 10:08PM

pinkyeye wrote: »

Talk about stupidity. This has to be the most stupid post I've seen so far on this thread and the bar is high. :rolleyes:

The bar on stupidity in Ireland has been proven to be set very low. The population were set a very simple exam on Saturday, and 24% flunked it dramatically. What a nation of dunces.

Odhinn · 10-02-2020 10:10PM

RandomName2 wrote: »

Well that's really the crux of the matter isn't it? Do you consider murder, torture, and bombing legitimate means to an end?

Yes, in certain circumstances

RandomName2 wrote: »

I don't. Martin Luther King could have become a guerrilla and lynched white people to get some satisfaction. He didn't. Ghandi could have got his followers to plant bombs and terrorize large populations of people in sectarian attacks.

Gandhi benefited from the violent tactics of others, which over-streched the British regime.

RandomName2 wrote: »

He didn't. Seamus Mallen could have made himself feel like a big guy by putting on a balaclava and pulling the fingernails out of someone accused of being an informer. He didn't.

Instead he was a "useful idiot" of the British regime.

Pamela Landy · 10-02-2020 10:11PM

anewme wrote: »

Mark Ward, elected in Dublin mid west has signed off this Facebook updates with TAL and an Irish flag.

Quick... Ring the Guards.

gormdubhgorm · 10-02-2020 10:12PM

pjohnson wrote: »

"Hounding they gave Maria Bailey" so shes a brave FG martyr now :pac:

She would have to die be a martyr....

I am sure it is something at least a few SF voters could arrange?

James Brown · 10-02-2020 10:13PM

gormdubhgorm wrote: »

She would have to die be a martyr....

I am sure it is something at least a few SF voters could arrange?

Did she not claim she died on that swing, as part of the claim?

lawrencesummers · 10-02-2020 10:14PM

bubblypop wrote: »

ok, enlighten me?

That would take years.

10-02-2020 10:15PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

It's telling that you portray the British government as a neutral party in the conflict and seem to think we should be electing a government based on who the British will like more.

no its not
do you see the british government singing anti-irish songs when they are elected?

we need to work together now, do you not believe we do?

10-02-2020 10:16PM

TBH I find it amusing that the SF supporters are so aghast at the Maria Bailey affair..

FrancieBrady · 10-02-2020 10:17PM

bubblypop wrote: »

While I'm sure the British government were happy to negotiate, back in the day, with every party they could, in order to stop the violence, I'm pretty sure that an Irish government full of people that are saying 'Up the Ra' & signing rebel songs are not going to be the British Governments choice of people to deal with

We need to deal with the British Government, people in the Irish government siging 'oh ah up the ra' is getting us nowhere

Put on airs and graces you mean? Pretend to be something they are not?

I kinda accepted that we'd have to listen to this outrage everytime a Shinner sang a song or mentioned the RA when I voted for them and if they got into government.
I am gonna largely ignore the outrage tbh...but I will make you a promise, if I see the RA back on maneuvers up here on the border I'll give you a heads up.

RandomName2 · 10-02-2020 10:17PM

Doctor Jimbob wrote: »

seem to think we should be electing a government based on who the British will like more.

Not being smart but yes, you do tend to think about how your trade partners, allies, and neighbors think about the political parties in your country during elections. It should never be the most significant aspect in an election, but you'd have to be as thick as a brick for it not to factor into your calculation.

Boris Johnson's good relationship with Trump was seen as an asset in the general election there, while his poorer relations with Europe was a slight negative. However, he was seen as being a much stronger negotiator than Theresa May in relation to Europe.

The only leader I can remember Varadkar getting on with was Justin Trudeau, which is not a good mark for Varadkar. He did have allies in the EPP though. Sinn Fein has no connection with anybody I think. It's isolationist, and has ties to organisations our allies (such as France, Spain, the US) would find more than a little questionable. It's block in the EU (GUE/NGL) is one of the smallest .

What have we come to

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