General Election and Government Formation Megathread (see post #1)

is_that_so · 24-01-2020 03:54PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

Pay them a bit more and cut the expenses.
Especially unvouched.
I mean, what other public sector job has unvouched expenses?

Politics is a very different profession to all the rest of the PS as they are called upon to do a lot of things apart from run an office/clinic. In addition, rules are agreed by the lawmakers themselves, whereas everyone else has to do what Revenue says.

quokula · 24-01-2020 03:55PM

Geuze wrote: »

The pension is the exact same as any other PS pension,

except

that they only need 20 years service to accrue a full pension.

I'm not an expert, but I imagine the 20 years is because, unlike other jobs, they can be voted out on a whim without any kind of employment protection. So if they're 19 years in when that happens they're out of luck. The longer the service required, the more likely they are to find themselves in that position.

I always find talk of politician's salaries a bit pointless though, because they're such a microscopically tiny part of the budget that there would not be any perceptible difference to public services if you tripled them or if you halved them. And I'd rather pay them well and make it a viable career path for competent and talented people.

blanch152 · 24-01-2020 04:23PM

https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/2020/0124/1110527-election-2020-campaign/

The election manifestos are coming out. What struck me immediately about Fianna Fail's was the pledge to cut CGT from 33% to 25%. If ever there was an election promise for the wealthy, that is it.

beggars_bush · 24-01-2020 04:52PM

blanch152 wrote: »

https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/2020/0124/1110527-election-2020-campaign/

The election manifestos are coming out. What struck me immediately about Fianna Fail's was the pledge to cut CGT from 33% to 25%. If ever there was an election promise for the wealthy, that is it.

Not really
Most people will sell a house at some stage
Reducing the cgt will encourage people to sell

Edited

Dytalus · 24-01-2020 05:01PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

Not really
Most people will sell a house or inherit something during their lifetime.

CGT is not charged on inheritance. That would be CAT.

While most people will sell a house -and some might make a profit on it that exceeds the CGT-free allowance - your average homeowner is unlikely to benefit as much from a CGT drop as investment and property traders.

Geuze · 24-01-2020 05:59PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

I mean, what other public sector job has unvouched expenses?

All of them?

How the expenses works is daily subsistence rates.

If you are away overnight, you claim the 24hr allowance, that's it.

It doesn't matter where you actually sleep, you simply get the 24hr allowance.

Geuze · 24-01-2020 06:02PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

Not really
Most people will sell a house at some stage
Reducing the cgt will encourage people to sell

Bear in mind that PPR is exempt from CGT.

blanch152 · 24-01-2020 06:05PM

beggars_bush wrote: »

Not really
Most people will sell a house at some stage
Reducing the cgt will encourage people to sell

Edited

Nope. PPR is exempt from CGT.

This will benefit those who own multiple properties, those who own shares and those who own commercial properties i.e. the wealthy.

It will do nothing for the ordinary Joe Soap except to reduce the amount of money available for public expenditure. It is one of the very few election promises this time round that will very directly benefit the rich and wealthy of this country.

Gunmonkey · 24-01-2020 06:20PM

blanch152 wrote: »

Nope. PPR is exempt from CGT.

This will benefit those who own multiple properties, those who own shares and those who own commercial properties i.e. the wealthy.

It will do nothing for the ordinary Joe Soap except to reduce the amount of money available for public expenditure. It is one of the very few election promises this time round that will very directly benefit the rich and wealthy of this country.

But can imagine FF spinning it as "well err people will be more inclined to sell houses now so more houses will be on the market" like its some saving grace to the housing crisis.

droidus · 24-01-2020 09:16PM

Sure, but I was around in 2008 and didn't see people with good jobs queuing for food banks and soup kitchens, armies of homeless people or workers spending 70% of their income on rent. Its also been estimated that 44% of employment in Ireland is precarious.

My point is that there's a load of people in worse situations than they were in 2008 (they dont conduct SILC questionnaires with people in tents), less secure employment and less secure housing. A major economic shock would have a disproportionate effect on them.

seamus wrote: »

It's important not to allow the narratives from other countries taint our view of how things are going in our own. Stories of people working 3 jobs in the US, or overrun food banks in the UK, do not translate to the same things happening here.

We should be very cognisant of the experiences of the US and UK, because their economic ideology also forms the basis of many policy decisions here, especially in recent years.

droidus · 24-01-2020 09:58PM

Geuze wrote: »

Ok.

Social benefits expenditure has been rising since 2014.

Ireland's social protection expenditure was half the EU average in 2017, and we were significantly behind in nearly every other category of public spending.

Its not even remotely controversial to suggest that the current govt prefers 'market solutions' over public spending.

Water John · 24-01-2020 10:02PM

This stat is incorrect because the baseline of GDP doesn't reflect true economic activity in Ireland. It's distorted by multinational cos based here.
We know for example that we have high social welfare and OAP in this country.
GNP gives a more realistic picture. Not sure how one would correct the anomoly to arrive at a true picture.

tom1ie · 24-01-2020 10:28PM

So I was planning on voting Green Party no1 and possibly fg no 2 (as let’s face it one of fg or ff will get in and fg are supposed to be a bit more financially astute- nch aside), as I like their transport policies and general message of Improving city living etc, and then I read this:
https://politics.ie/threads/greens-call-for-end-of-tax-veto.273487/page-3

Wtf is this about!! How could a party supposedly acting on Ireland’s behalf, look to give away a veto on setting our own corporation tax rate.
If our 12.5% goes we’re knackered I imagine.

L1011 · 24-01-2020 10:53PM

GNI* is the figure to be using considering the surreal distortions that aircraft leasing cause even to figures adjusted for the multinationals tax shenanigans.

markodaly · 25-01-2020 12:50AM

beggars_bush wrote: »

Not really
Most people will sell a house at some stage
Reducing the cgt will encourage people to sell

Edited

I dont think CGT is charged on people's primary home.

Good loser · 25-01-2020 01:00AM

Geuze wrote: »

All of them?

How the expenses works is daily subsistence rates.

If you are away overnight, you claim the 24hr allowance, that's it.

It doesn't matter where you actually sleep, you simply get the 24hr allowance.

That's correct.

I spent 30 plus years on that system.

is_that_so · 25-01-2020 10:46AM

tom1ie wrote: »

So I was planning on voting Green Party no1 and possibly fg no 2 (as let’s face it one of fg or ff will get in and fg are supposed to be a bit more financially astute- nch aside), as I like their transport policies and general message of Improving city living etc, and then I read this:
https://politics.ie/threads/greens-call-for-end-of-tax-veto.273487/page-3

Wtf is this about!! How could a party supposedly acting on Ireland’s behalf, look to give away a veto on setting our own corporation tax rate.
If our 12.5% goes we’re knackered I imagine.

That has been their position for a while and they supports the CCCTB. The issue with our rate has been more about where sales are booked and therefore taxes paid. It's a French driven thing as they think they are missing out on the tax generation of MNCs because of it. It's also mired in the global tax avoidance schemes of MNCs.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Common_Consolidated_Corporate_Tax_Base

Jin luk · 25-01-2020 01:32PM

Just wondering how big the party is getting around the country?

Our main candidate for my area is matt mccarthy and the feeling is hes gonna smash the constituency and beat heather humphreys to the No.1 seat, seems this election alot more people around here are getting behind him and sinn fein

Remind me · 25-01-2020 01:34PM

Jin luk wrote: »

Just wondering how big the party is getting around the country?

Our main candidate for my area is matt mccarthy and the feeling is hes gonna smash the constituency and beat heather humphreys to the No.1 seat, seems this election alot more people around here are getting behind him and sinn fein

Carthy - not McCarthy.

Never like seeing people get elected into Europe knowing there is a general election on the horizon and they are running.

Paul Donnelly is in my area, Dublin West. He’d be 50/50 on being elected. He was 1/100 in 2016 and didn’t get in.

is_that_so · 25-01-2020 01:34PM

Had a read of the Green manifesto. Some stuff you could say yes to straight off, some they've nicked from current government plans and some of it is from the bike and walk brigade. Auction politics of a slightly different type and it all lacks that really key ingredient - "how?"

https://www.rte.ie/news/election-2020/2020/0125/1110817-green-party-manifesto/

Harry Palmr · 25-01-2020 01:36PM

Probably poll topper in Waterford - David Cullinane has long been well regarded.

is_that_so · 25-01-2020 01:38PM

There will be one in Louth. Their vote in the locals was down nearly 8% and their second seat is very much in play.

Jin luk · 25-01-2020 01:39PM

Remind me wrote: »

Carthy - not McCarthy.

Never like seeing people get elected into Europe knowing there is a general election on the horizon and they are running.

Paul Donnelly is in my area, Dublin West. He’d be 50/50 on being elected. He was 1/100 in 2016 and didn’t get in.

Always seem to make that mistake even when saying it too lol

He and his brother are very good politicians colm is our local councillor and sure to be in the dail in the future alongside matt theyve done alot for the area more so than any other elected offiicals. Who got his place in 2016 in dub west? Was it because of the green party surge?

25-01-2020 01:42PM

David Cullinane is in my constituency. Finished 2nd last time around and currently bookies favourite to top the poll.

There's quite a few people that like Cullinane himself but could never vote for Sinn Fein.

Whatever happens, he'll be reelected at a trot.

Panda Killa · 25-01-2020 01:42PM

Kerry..home of Martin Ferris... but both he...and Toireasa have stepped aside, and Pa Daly, a local solicitor has taken to the campaign trail.....
Local polls have him fighting for the last seat with Norma Foley of FF ...it's going to be close

meeeeh · 25-01-2020 01:47PM

They burst into flames the moment they cross the village border where I live.

I think one of them was brave enough to venture in during the first election campaign after the crash. I haven't seen them since. It's a FF area and I think even FG approach it with trepidation.

Carol Nolan got in the last election. She doesn't have a chance and neither does who ever is replacing her as candidate in the constituency. I don't think they ever bother with the posters.

Remind me · 25-01-2020 01:56PM

Jin luk wrote: »

Always seem to make that mistake even when saying it too lol

He and his brother are very good politicians colm is our local councillor and sure to be in the dail in the future alongside matt theyve done alot for the area more so than any other elected offiicals. Who got his place in 2016 in dub west? Was it because of the green party surge?

Varadkar, jack chambers, Coppinger and Burton. No green but he will get in this time.

SF just messed up in the area and didn’t cover the whole constituency

McMurphy · 25-01-2020 02:02PM

Reada Cronin in my area, I know little to nothing about her, but highly doubt she'll get in.

It will be a tough battle for a four seat constituency , but I think it will be the following.

Catherine Murphy (probably top the poll) SD
James Lawless(FF)
Frank O'Rourke (FF)
Bernard Durkin or Anthony Lawlor (FG)

SmartinMartin · 25-01-2020 02:10PM

Mary Lou. But the shinners never canvas in our area. They know where her votes lie.

DJIMI TRARORE · 25-01-2020 02:11PM

Jin luk wrote:

Our main candidate for my area is matt mccarthy and the feeling is hes gonna smash the constituency and beat heather humphreys to the No.1 seat, seems this election alot more people around here are getting behind him and sinn fein

Not much interest in politics, but the bookies had Heather one of the favourites to be the top no1 vote nationwide, ps:what's the rationale of getting into Europe and less than a year later going for a TD

General Election and Government Formation Megathread (see post #1)

Comments