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Informal Adoption - Passport Query - Help Needed

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  • 29-11-2019 3:27pm
    #1
    D12C
    Registered Users Posts: 57 ✭✭


    Hi there,

    I wonder if anyone can offer any advice on my mother's situation.

    My mother was given away informally as a baby in the 1950's. She was born in the UK to Irish parents, and moved back here as a baby and has lived here all her life. She owns property here, votes here, was married and had children here. She had no contact with her birth parents, and therefore is unable to attain their long form birth certificate. She doesn't know full details of parent's dates of births etc either.

    She has tried various times to obtain an Irish passport but is unable to do so, due to the lack of the long form birth cert. I've rang various agencies but none seem to know what to do, and often direct me somewhere else. Some have mentioned the possibility of naturilisation, but this is obviously an expensive process.

    Has anyone had any similiar experience, or can they offer any advice as to the best way of obtaining a passport. Is naturilisation the only method?

    Thanks in advance.


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    #2
    Moonbeam
    Moderators, Education Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 18,952 Mod ✭✭✭✭Moonbeam


    Does she have an adoption cert ? Adopted people don't get birthcerts but a copy of our entry into the adoption register .
    That is an awful situation to be in :( there has to be away around it . Surely it was needed for other things ?
    D12C wrote: »
    Hi there,

    I wonder if anyone can offer any advice on my mother's situation.

    My mother was given away informally as a baby in the 1950's. She was born in the UK to Irish parents, and moved back here as a baby and has lived here all her life. She owns property here, votes here, was married and had children here. She had no contact with her birth parents, and therefore is unable to attain their long form birth certificate. She doesn't know full details of parent's dates of births etc either.

    She has tried various times to obtain an Irish passport but is unable to do so, due to the lack of the long form birth cert. I've rang various agencies but none seem to know what to do, and often direct me somewhere else. Some have mentioned the possibility of naturilisation, but this is obviously an expensive process.

    Has anyone had any similiar experience, or can they offer any advice as to the best way of obtaining a passport. Is naturilisation the only method?

    Thanks in advance.


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    #3
    D12C
    Registered Users Posts: 57 ✭✭D12C


    Thanks for your reply. Just to clarify, she has her own (British) birth cert but not her parent's which is a requirement to get a passport.

    She doesn't have an adoption cert, as it was never a formal adoption.

    Thanks!


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    #4
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,278 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    Is she aware of their names and approximate dates of birth?
    Birth certificates are public records- and she could in theory get a copy of their birth certificates- if she just has their names and dates of birth.
    She has her own British birth certificate. What information is on it?

    It would seem if she is in possession of her own original birth cert- it would have her parents names on it- and she could in theory do a little bit of research into her parents- possibly in the GRO's research rooms- to try and get copies of their original birth certificates.

    Being in possession of her own original birth cert- is a treasure trove of information in its own right- there is no reason you shouldn't leverage the information on it to try and get her parents original certs.


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    #5
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    D12C wrote: »
    Thanks for your reply. Just to clarify, she has her own (British) birth cert but not her parent's which is a requirement to get a passport.

    She doesn't have an adoption cert, as it was never a formal adoption.

    Thanks!

    If she was born in Britain and has a British birth certificate then she’s entitled to a British passport.


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    #6
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,278 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    OP- are you certain that her parents were Irish?
    If so- there is nothing whatsoever to stop her from getting copies of her parents birthcerts from the GRO here- just use the research room the same as any of us. As I mentioned in my earlier post- birth certs are documents of record- you can get a copy of *any* birth cert here in Ireland- you just need to know the details (and you can research most of them- esp. if you have your mother's British birth cert- which presumably has her parents names on it).

    Its going to involve some work- and possibly a couple of days research- but its very very doable.


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    #7
    The_Conductor
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 32,278 Mod ✭✭✭✭The_Conductor


    splinter65 wrote: »
    If she was born in Britain and has a British birth certificate then she’s entitled to a British passport.

    However, with Brexit- an Irish passport might be preferable. And if the OP doesn't have an Irish passport themselves- it would entitle them to one too.........


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    #8
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 18,749 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    splinter65 wrote: »
    If she was born in Britain and has a British birth certificate then she’s entitled to a British passport.

    And if her parents are Irish & she wants an Irish passport, then she is entitled to one.


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    #9
    Heart Break Kid
    Registered Users Posts: 834 ✭✭✭Heart Break Kid


    Hi OP

    Some of the above comments aren't exactly accurate and this is actually a current issue being worked on by Joan Burton TD but Its at very early stages from the looks of it and will probably be stalled with an election looming. It may even be worthwhile to send her an email on the progress of the bill.

    https://www.oireachtas.ie/en/debates/debate/dail/2019-01-29/4/


    Other than that and the link above it seems like your mother is in a current state of limbo and if she wished to proceed to get a passport for travel she would need to get a British one or begin the naturalize process of becoming an Irish citizenship via residence in the State:.

    Tulsa seem to be managing elements of informal adoptions and also providing social case workers to provide advice and consultation.

    https://www.tusla.ie/services/alternative-care/adoption-services/tracing-service/st-patricks-guild-adoption-records/
    Where can I get more information?
    This is an extremely sensitive issue and one which we acknowledge may cause upset and anxiety for those affected, as well as adopted people, adoptive parents and birth parents across the country. If you require further information you may contact us on 076 6957261 Monday to Friday 10am to 1pm - 2pm to 4pm.


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    #10
    splinter65
    Registered Users Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    bubblypop wrote: »
    And if her parents are Irish & she wants an Irish passport, then she is entitled to one.

    Yes she’s entitled to one, and she’ll be able to apply for one as long as she can get a long form birth certificate for either of her parents. It’s a question of trying to establish a DOB and location for the birth of either of them.
    But if that’s not possible (and given the circumstances it mightn’t be) and she wants to travel or have the prospect of travelling, then she can simply apply for a British passport or apply for Irish citizenship.
    I think the OP may have been wondering if there was any way of circumventing either of these processes but there’s not.


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