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Western Rail Corridor

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  • 19-06-2019 10:18pm
    #1
    Frozen Veg
    Registered Users Posts: 512 ✭✭✭


    A public consultation survey on the Western Rail corridor which would join the lines at Claremorris-Tuam-Athenry. Have your say whether positive or negative.

    https://emea.focusvisi...elfserve/214c/190513

    Personally think it would be a great addition to the West. Could get the train from Galway all the way through to Westport and serviced towns. Also providing link ups to Dublin and other lines.


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    #2
    Lord Glentoran
    Closed Accounts Posts: 876 ✭✭✭Lord Glentoran


    Frozen Veg wrote: »
    A public consultation survey on the Western Rail corridor which would join the lines at Claremorris-Tuam-Athenry. Have your say whether positive or negative.

    https://emea.focusvisi...elfserve/214c/190513

    Personally think it would be a great addition to the West. Could get the train from Galway all the way through to Westport and serviced towns. Also providing link ups to Dublin and other lines.

    Indeed, but just wait for the queue of posters who will say this must NORT happen. 5..4..3..2..1...

    Either that or this thread will be closed.


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    #3
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Frozen Veg wrote: »
    A public consultation survey on the Western Rail corridor which would join the lines at Claremorris-Tuam-Athenry. Have your say whether positive or negative.

    https://emea.focusvisi...elfserve/214c/190513

    Personally think it would be a great addition to the West. Could get the train from Galway all the way through to Westport and serviced towns. Also providing link ups to Dublin and other lines.

    Link doesn't work.

    ****



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    #4
    railer201
    Registered Users Posts: 968 ✭✭✭railer201


    Del.Monte wrote: »
    Link doesn't work.

    Try this - https://emea.focusvision.com/survey/selfserve/214c/190513#?


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    #5
    intellectual dosser
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    Survey completed.

    As we look towards our 2030 and 2050 climate change targets I think the more rail possibilities the better, but if it costs the exchequer a lot of money to rebuild and then a lot of money to run then you'd have to imagine the capital would be better served elsewhere in chasing out targets. Have IE produced cost estimates for restoring the lines in both phases?

    The Limerick - Galway line is a good example of 'if you build it they will come', but it still feels like a shot in the dark?


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    #6
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,795 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The Limerick Galway line is vastly below it's predicted numbers. We built it, they took the X51 bus


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    #7
    intellectual dosser
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    OK, I was going off this IT article saying passenger numbers on Phase 1 Ennis - Athenry grew 288% over the seven years.

    I don't know what the forecasts were in the beginning, and again that seems to be where we're at now with Phases 2 and 3, a lack of forecast numbers.


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    #8
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,795 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The better numbers given are Galway-Limerick; Ennis-Athenry itself is pathetically below target. The new-ish Oranmore Station has made a decent impact on the figures; it is not on the reopened section.


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    #9
    intellectual dosser
    Registered Users Posts: 1,826 ✭✭✭intellectual dosser


    Do you have these numbers, forecast vs actual on any of the sectors?

    Doing further searching and I find this Connacht Tribune article from last September saying passenger numbers on Limerick - Galway are 353,000 vs a business case of 200,000 in 2010.

    I'm starting to sound like I'd be in favour of Phases 2 and 3, but really I think we all need understand costs and returns before anyone can make an informed decision. Obviously plenty of emotionally driven opinions going around.


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    #10
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,795 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    The 200k five years on business case was for the reinstated section, not the existing sections. They have been fudging the figures by merging in journeys on the existing sections to hide how badly its been doing, but an FOI got the real one of 137k ten years on

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110368733&postcount=906


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    #11
    XPS_Zero
    Registered Users Posts: 910 ✭✭✭XPS_Zero


    If the folk out west wanna do it the proper way like us in the East with our Busconnects consultation they should demand that all those straight lines get bent into branches that serve Marys farmhouse and Joes dairy farm because Joe is blind and the Irish Times says if a blind person is mildly inconvenienced by a PT project the entire project must be scrapped because IT'S DISCRIMINATION I TELLS YA!


    Then all the local councilors and TDs can start making up outright lies that they pulled str8 out of their asses to whip people up into a frenzy of opposition.
    Hmmm...how to pander though when the locals out west WANT the WRC you ask? Oh have no fear! You blame the *say it with me* ''dem f---ers UP DERE in Dubin!"..we have the Luas afterall...we have the Luas...which is, apparently, an argument....sorry sorry public life is making me bitter...I think I'm starting to hate the Irish people and all their representatives....


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    #12
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    L1011 wrote: »
    The better numbers given are Galway-Limerick; Ennis-Athenry itself is pathetically below target. The new-ish Oranmore Station has made a decent impact on the figures; it is not on the reopened section.

    I'm under the impression that the rail is way above target. I use that train and it's well busy.

    Furthermore, I've counted the numbers getting off in Athenry at 9:05am from Limerick, they're more than 27 per train, about 70% are school kids, they can't drive and they're not coming from as far as Gort. There's no bus from Craughwell to Athenry. The train is the reason I (and many others) moved to Athenry. It's also the reason my sister, who became disabled, was able to move out to us. She can no longer drive and needs to live with family, and have good public transport. Athenry has a huge student population who don't drive. We build rail for the future... also, the train takes bikes for free


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    #13
    L1011
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Motoring & Transport Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 67,795 Mod ✭✭✭✭L1011


    You've just linked figures that demonstrate it is wildly below target. Go look at the business case for the line.


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    #14
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    The so called WRC is outside of the Greater Dublin Area ergo it should be closed down.

    ****



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    #15
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    Ballyglunin Railway Restoration Project are doing loads of event for Heritage week

    Thursday 22nd of August from 10-6
    Ballyglunin Station


    Bats of Ballyglunin 9pm – 10pm
    At 9pm Batwoman comes to Ballyglunin – Learn about the local bat varieties and dispel the myths associated with our furry friends. Hot chocolate will be provided for those brave enough to join!

    Other activities we have planned for the day include:
    • Memory Train - We often find people have their own memories of the station. On this day we want to capture some audio recordings of these stories. If you have a story, whether it’s simple, personal or funny, please let us know so we would like to preserve it!
    This can be done on the day, in a quiet corner, or it can be arranged for another time.
    • Purchase Jams, pickles and preserves by Ability West on sale
    • Art exhibition by local artist Nora ZolzerBryce
    This is a free, plastic free, sweet free event. This is an event that will appeal to all ages.
    For more information please contact our PRO, Leonie Finn on 0867328848 or leonief@ymail.com


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    #16
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Greaney wrote: »
    Ballyglunin Railway Restoration Project are doing loads of event for Heritage week

    Thursday 22nd of August from 10-6
    Ballyglunin Station


    Bats of Ballyglunin 9pm – 10pm
    At 9pm Batwoman comes to Ballyglunin – Learn about the local bat varieties and dispel the myths associated with our furry friends. Hot chocolate will be provided for those brave enough to join!

    Other activities we have planned for the day include:
    • Memory Train - We often find people have their own memories of the station. On this day we want to capture some audio recordings of these stories. If you have a story, whether it’s simple, personal or funny, please let us know so we would like to preserve it!
    This can be done on the day, in a quiet corner, or it can be arranged for another time.
    • Purchase Jams, pickles and preserves by Ability West on sale
    • Art exhibition by local artist Nora ZolzerBryce
    This is a free, plastic free, sweet free event. This is an event that will appeal to all ages.
    For more information please contact our PRO, Leonie Finn on 0867328848 or leonief@ymail.com

    On a Thursday ?
    A weekday ?

    Do they not want anyone to attend - 'cos if that's the target, they're on to a winner.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #17
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,761 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    L1011 wrote: »
    The better numbers given are Galway-Limerick; Ennis-Athenry itself is pathetically below target. The new-ish Oranmore Station has made a decent impact on the figures; it is not on the reopened section.

    Craughwell or Athenry - Galway would do much better if it was priced fairly.

    The equivalent journey (15 mins) from Clonsilla is 1/3 the price. But sure, gotta keep the M50 clientele happy and screw the rest.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #18
    tabbey
    Registered Users Posts: 1,943 ✭✭✭tabbey


    galwaytt wrote: »
    On a Thursday ?
    A weekday ?

    Do they not want anyone to attend - 'cos if that's the target, they're on to a winner.

    This is heritage week, there are events on every day, throughout the state.


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    #19
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    galwaytt wrote: »
    On a Thursday ?
    A weekday ?

    Do they not want anyone to attend - 'cos if that's the target, they're on to a winner.

    Heritage week is the same time every year... the week before children goes back to school. It's been the same week for years, and it's not been a 'failure'. Families do their last 'hooray' on this week. Also, many folk take their holidays in August, so they may not be local.


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    #20
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    galwaytt wrote: »
    On a Thursday ?
    A weekday ?

    Do they not want anyone to attend - 'cos if that's the target, they're on to a winner.

    So I popped down. Fairly busy, a fair few volunteers serving tea in the pop up tea rooms (Teenagers etc). I attended the gardening talk to a full room. Parking was pretty busy They had the film playing. There were childrens colouring area and I chatted to folk. My sister and nephew had a nice day. Weather was very good and children played outside

    Yup, it was a nice turn out. I was there after lunch for a couple of hours, I'd say they had over 50 people between 2-4. it was going on till 6 and then there's the bat walk at night.

    I talked to the folk in Ballyglunin about what they wanted. They have students struggling to get to college in Galway and school in Athenry (don't drive, too young, etc.). There are no buses that will run the route. If there was a train many would like to be one car households (like in Athenry). Most of them work in Galway City and the commute means most folk have to have a second car which costs about €4-6k a year where as a yearly train ticket is less than €1.5k. They believe mass transit it in the best interest of the community.

    The the Post office closed down so older residents need transit to the nearest town with a post office (Athenry or Tuam) and the fire officer closed down the glamping camp, so their one tourist attraction is gone. They also honestly didn't see themselves as a tourist hot spot. They knew the station would be too much facility for Irish rail to use all of it as a ticket station so the plans for that were very varied, from a hot desk centre to a community hall. I think they were very realistic about the communities needs.

    Interestingly, as I drove there, I saw a cycle track all the way from Abbeyknockmoy to the turn off to Ballyglunin (about 4km) on the Roscommon road. 2km down that road and you come to the bridge with the river, and then the railway. They river looks fairly easy flowing that runs through Ballyglunin (blueway?) and if they linked the cycle-track on the Roscommon road, they're would be other options for a greenway/blueway trail that don't involve ripping up the rail!!


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    #21
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    I had long wondered where folk got their impression about the numbers being so low on phase one of the Western Rail Corridor Between Galway & Limerick. I've seen a huge jump in figures in the last two years. I've talked to Iarnrod Eireann staff and they too say it's growing bit by bit.

    I know this won't convince people rail is worth it because the conviction for the rail to be replaced by a greenway is so strong that plan 'b' or 'c' is out of the question, but since traffic is moving at 4mph in Galway...

    ...this was the train departing Athenry to go to Limerick just after Lunch today.... plenty of students. I imagine they don't drive....



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    #22
    ShaneC1600
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭ShaneC1600


    Would anyone know who did the original business case for the WRC? Also alot of people state a review carried out previously returned a 100/6 business but I can never find that report, any idea where this report might be found?
    Thanks.


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    #23
    dowlingm
    Registered Users Posts: 5,309 ✭✭✭dowlingm


    ShaneC1600 wrote: »
    Would anyone know who did the original business case for the WRC? Also alot of people state a review carried out previously returned a 100/6 business but I can never find that report, any idea where this report might be found?
    Thanks.
    You’re probably making a common mistake of looking for that stuff in non-fiction shelves.


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    #24
    Greaney
    Registered Users Posts: 1,247 ✭✭✭Greaney


    Well done to the Ballyglunin Train Station Group. A sold out event with 'Polar Express'.
    https://www.facebook.com/events/2585540961532901/

    Meanwhile, a meeting regarding the Western Rail Corridor in Athenry next week...
    https://www.facebook.com/events/2336790123301860/


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    #25
    ezstreet5
    Registered Users Posts: 356 ✭✭ezstreet5


    ShaneC1600 wrote: »
    Would anyone know who did the original business case for the WRC? Also alot of people state a review carried out previously returned a 100/6 business but I can never find that report, any idea where this report might be found?
    Thanks.

    That metric was quoted by Minister Ciarán Cannon. However, I don't believe it pertains to any actual analysis or report. That is, his numbers are made up out of thin air. You might ask Minister Cannon to provide the source for his data, but I'm willing to bet that there is no source whatsoever.


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    #26
    ShaneC1600
    Registered Users Posts: 212 ✭✭ShaneC1600


    ezstreet5 wrote: »
    That metric was quoted by Minister Ciarán Cannon. However, I don't believe it pertains to any actual analysis or report. That is, his numbers are made up out of thin air. You might ask Minister Cannon to provide the source for his data, but I'm willing to bet that there is no source whatsoever.

    I actually did ask the Minister, a few times and the result was to be banned from the Facebook page! He has some fantastic statistics but never a reference!


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    #27
    metrovick001
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭metrovick001


    Ciaran Cannon is as anti-railway as can be (for a PD / FG td), that is a fact.
    As long as people like him are involved there will be no progress whatsoever unfortunately.


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    #28
    Jamie2k9
    Registered Users Posts: 10,669 ✭✭✭✭Jamie2k9


    Greaney wrote: »
    I had long wondered where folk got their impression about the numbers being so low on phase one of the Western Rail Corridor Between Galway & Limerick. I've seen a huge jump in figures in the last two years. I've talked to Iarnrod Eireann staff and they too say it's growing bit by bit.

    I know this won't convince people rail is worth it because the conviction for the rail to be replaced by a greenway is so strong that plan 'b' or 'c' is out of the question, but since traffic is moving at 4mph in Galway...

    ...this was the train departing Athenry to go to Limerick just after Lunch today.... plenty of students. I imagine they don't drive....


    Jump in figures but also a jump in losses, IE have slashed fares when every other route saw fares rise. Agree or not the business case for the route was weak plus the significant failure by IE and others who constructed the line.

    Tuam-Galway will never appeal to commuters having to reverse en route plus Limerick-Claremorris is a non runner.


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    #29
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    Jamie2k9 wrote: »
    Jump in figures but also a jump in losses, IE have slashed fares when every other route saw fares rise. Agree or not the business case for the route was weak plus the significant failure by IE and others who constructed the line.

    Tuam-Galway will never appeal to commuters having to reverse en route plus Limerick-Claremorris is a non runner.


    Why would Tuam-Galway involve reversing en route as the junction with the Tuam line faces the Galway direction?

    ****



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    #30
    metrovick001
    Registered Users Posts: 420 ✭✭metrovick001


    ZERO marketing, ZERO Jamie.
    It actually amazing numbers are as high as they are considering.


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    #31
    Del.Monte
    Registered Users Posts: 12,363 ✭✭✭✭Del.Monte


    metrovick001 wrote: »
    ZERO marketing, ZERO Jamie.
    It actually amazing numbers are as high as they are considering.


    A bit like the Rosslare line so.

    ****



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