Ionity charging network

liamog · 06-12-2019 01:54PM

Post on FB is saying the other two units will be available in the new year. That's the first time I've seen them do that.

Lumen · 06-12-2019 02:09PM

ELM327 wrote: »

100-150kW peak vs 70kW tapering to 50kW at 60% in the slower charging triplets

This is what I saw at Ionity in a Kona.

You might hang around for the 80% (0:08) but not 1:16 for 100%!

edit: the value of that last 20% is about €1 at night rate. Nobody values their time that little they'd want to hang around a motorway service station for an extra hour to save 1 euro.

liamog · 06-12-2019 02:16PM

Lumen wrote: »

This is what I saw at Ionity in a Kona.

You might hang around for the 80% (0:08) but not 1:16 for 100%!

edit: the value of that last 20% is about €1 at night rate. Nobody values their time that little they'd want to hang around a motorway service station for an extra hour to save 1 euro.

You've clearly never met an Outlander driver.

ELM327 · 06-12-2019 02:18PM

Lumen wrote: »

This is what I saw at Ionity in a Kona.

You might hang around for the 80% (0:08) but not 1:16 for 100%!

edit: the value of that last 20% is about €1 at night rate. Nobody values their time that little they'd want to hang around a motorway service station for an extra hour to save 1 euro.

That's what I'm saying the Kona etc charge too slowly.
I think 30-45 minutes is the max stop you'd make. Even with paying the 8 quid. Especially sitting waiting in the car.

Mike9832 · 06-12-2019 07:42PM

Will the 9 superfast chargers be up and running by end of year?

McGiver · 06-12-2019 07:42PM

redcup342 wrote:

The Irish Solution would be to tax the hole out of standard cars even further (more VRT more Motor Tax) and bring EVs to the same level as ICE vehicles

That's exactly what Norway does. Ain't Irish.

McGiver · 06-12-2019 07:44PM

So is there only going to be 1 more Ionity in RoI? Let's bet on whereabouts it will be.

eddhorse · 06-12-2019 07:54PM

McGiver wrote: »

So is there only going to be 1 more Ionity in RoI? Let's bet on whereabouts it will be.

Well M1, M6, M8 and M11 done.
So M7 or M4 , M9?
I'm hoping M4 towards sligo

graememk · 06-12-2019 09:04PM

McGiver wrote: »

So is there only going to be 1 more Ionity in RoI? Let's bet on whereabouts it will be.

Galway direction.. is there one in cork?

thos · 06-12-2019 09:56PM

Took a little visit to M1 CityNorth IONITY, so 2 working chargers in place, and 4 ‘stumps’ for future development.

First time using IONITY. Paying via the app is fairly clunky definitely worth getting an RFID card for regular use.

A fair old hum off the charger when it’s going, even when only at 50kw. Don’t recall Tesla’s Supercharger doing that.

Great to see them expanding, let’s hope there are more to come.

graememk · 06-12-2019 10:40PM

thos wrote: »

Took a little visit to M1 CityNorth IONITY, so 2 working chargers in place, and 4 ‘stumps’ for future development.

First time using IONITY. Paying via the app is fairly clunky definitely worth getting an RFID card for regular use.

A fair old hum off the charger when it’s going, even when only at 50kw. Don’t recall Tesla’s Supercharger doing that.

Great to see them expanding, let’s hope there are more to come.

I think the business end of the superchargers are off to the side in a big box nearby and not in where you plug in (rectifiers etc)

McGiver · 06-12-2019 11:19PM

graememk wrote:

Galway direction.. is there one in cork?

Galway unlikely.

M7 or M8

charlieIRL · 07-12-2019 11:21AM

Lumen wrote: »

the value of that last 20% is about €1 at night rate. Nobody values their time that little they'd want to hang around a motorway service station for an extra hour to save 1 euro.

They might if they don’t know all they are saving is €1
For anyone not on boards or not informed by the dealer they bought the car off, they just won’t know. I’d say a lot of drivers don’t know how the charge speed tapers off either.

Lumen · 07-12-2019 01:53PM

charlieIRL wrote: »

They might if they don’t know all they are saving is €1
For anyone not on boards or not informed by the dealer they bought the car off, they just won’t know. I’d say a lot of drivers don’t know how the charge speed tapers off either.

Even if you don't notice or can't understand the charge speed, you would have to be quite unobservant not to notice that it takes and age to get from 80% to 100%.

zg3409 · 07-12-2019 02:08PM

Power outage at the new Ionity this morning. Who was testing their model 3 charge rate?

Edit- back working again

BigAl81 · 11-12-2019 04:19PM

Great update on the Ionity Facebook page yesterday...

"Great news from our team:
Plug & Charge combines the ultimate in user-convenience with the highest level of data security. Paying with a credit card, using an app to scan a QR code, or finding that easy-to-lose RFID card will become a thing of the past.

#emobility #Elektromobilitaet #IONITY #PlugandCharge"

So seems you'll be able to just plug in, and it will start charging, just like a Tesla. Happy days!

Coming in 2020 apparently

ELM327 · 11-12-2019 04:20PM

I saw that.
Great news, like the Tesla SuC experience. Plug and play. Bill online later to chosen payment method. Painless.

Mickeroo · 11-12-2019 04:23PM

How do they match the session to the user/car?

I know Tesla can tell the specific car that's charging but how would Ionity have access to that sort of thing?

ELM327 · 11-12-2019 04:28PM

Mickeroo wrote: »

How do they match the session to the user/car?

I know Tesla can tell the specific car that's charging but how would Ionity have access to that sort of thing?

CCS protocol transmits the vin to the charger
They already know the vin when you plug in. Info transmission begins before you start charging.

KCross · 11-12-2019 04:57PM

ELM327 wrote: »

CCS protocol transmits the vin to the charger
They already know the vin when you plug in. Info transmission begins before you start charging.

I wonder will it be a matter of time before someone figures out how to intercept/change the VIN thats passed to the charger somehow and cause someone else to get charged for your session!

ELM327 · 11-12-2019 05:02PM

KCross wrote: »

I wonder will it be a matter of time before someone figures out how to intercept/change the VIN thats passed to the charger somehow and cause someone else to get charged for your session!

That would be interesting indeed

I presume it is technically possible via ECU/BMS modification.

Someone call rich rebuilds!

zg3409 · 11-12-2019 05:16PM

KCross wrote: »

I wonder will it be a matter of time before someone figures out how to intercept/change the VIN thats passed to the charger somehow and cause someone else to get charged for your session!

There will soon be open source CCS software for DIY EVs (there is already DIY Chademo)

with the highest level of data security.

I doubt there is any security in the international CCS standard.

I managed to program my immobiliser to allow an unknown key on my ICE using dodgy software, so it as secure as a car key... I know Tesla ban cars from supercharging if you have not paid or if they believe it is a right off and not repaired by a Tesla approved repairer, for your safety.

What VIN do you use on a vw 1960s campervan with a Tesla motor and a CCS connector as I have seen in person?

You can also clone and make up RFID cards too including touch to pay credit cards, a free charge is the least of my worries

Old diesel · 11-12-2019 08:32PM

With this talk of open CCS software......

Will it or is it possible to convert a Leaf to CCS - if you can figure a way to make a new port for CCS fit in a suitable part of the Leaf body.

graememk · 11-12-2019 08:47PM

zg3409 wrote: »

What VIN do you use on a vw 1960s campervan with a Tesla motor and a CCS connector as I have seen in person?

I think the VIN stays with the chassis? If there is one on the car.. We used to have a landrover discovery built on a range Rover 1978 chassis (to get windows and seats in a commercial, loophole since closed, had one year of high tax before it turned vintage)

Shell was from a test article from landrover, running gear and engine from a crashed discovery,

After about 10 yrs it needed a facelift, ended up putting a td5 body on it then.

The original mechanic that built&serviced it bought it off us a few years ago - needless to say he knew the full history of it..... What were we talking about again lol

McGiver · 11-12-2019 09:23PM

Old diesel wrote:

Will it or is it possible to convert a Leaf to CCS - if you can figure a way to make a new port for CCS fit in a suitable part of the Leaf body.

Technically potentially possible, commercially not viable to develop and sell. Won't happen anytime soon.

McGiver · 11-12-2019 09:25PM

BigAl81 wrote:

"Great news from our team: Plug & Charge combines the ultimate in user-convenience with the highest level of data security. Paying with a credit card, using an app to scan a QR code, or finding that easy-to-lose RFID card will become a thing of the past.

QR codes are welcome. Already in place in Prague for one-off/no subscription charging payments.

liamog · 11-12-2019 10:32PM

ISO 15118 is much fancier than simple CCS MAC address tagging as implemented by Fastned.

It's all managed using a Public Key Infrastructure. There will be a central authority in each region called the V2G Root. Think of them as a Root CA in SSL certs.
Signing Certs are then issued to each Charge Point Operator (CPO) (i.e. Ionity), Mobility Operator (MO) (i.e. Maingau), and the manufacturer (OEM) (i.e. Volkswagen).
They'll use their certs to issue the intermediate going down to the 1 car, 1 charger, 1 customer level.

So for instance when an ID.3 pulls up to an Ionity charger and plugs in, the charger will provide it's charging station certificate and it's charge point operator certificate. This allows the car to verify the charger is trustworthy.
The car then needs to present a contract certificate which contains an E-Mobility Account Identifier (EMAID). Effectively we now have a trustworthy charger, and a signed contract that allows the CPO to bill the MO including the EMAID of the user)
Contract Certificates are installed in the car following a similar process where the OEM and the MO have to trust each other's ability to provide and install contract certificates.

Afaic the process is very similiar to what Tesla use with the supercharger network, the only difference being they are the OEM, CPO and MO, but the general private key approach is the same.

KCross · 11-12-2019 10:35PM

Is that a proposed standard Liam or something real that’s already in rollout phase?

i.e Are the OEMs after buying into it?

liamog · 11-12-2019 10:50PM

When you see the term Plug and Charge, like the Ionity tweet, it usually refers to the ISO15118 implementation. The standard was updated in April this year, we're now starting to get the first implementations.

KCross · 12-12-2019 12:17AM

Looks like Daimler and VW are on board

https://media.daimler.com/marsMediaSite/en/instance/ko/Convenient-charging-of-electric-vehicles-without-the-need-for-a-card-or-app-Hubject-and-Daimler-pilot-a-solution-for-PlugCharge-that-is-ready-for-production.xhtml?oid=40049481

Ionity charging network

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