Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

KWAG2019 · 08-11-2019 11:24AM

marieholmfan wrote: »

They will have good policies but unless there has been a clear out of teaching staff why believe that those policies will be implemented?

The real worry and I think much more likely is that they were implemented. And failed.

08-11-2019 11:49AM

tuxy wrote: »

Is bullying an evolutionary trait? Things like that can be very difficult to create policies to prevent.

I intervened in bullying incident involving 4 little girls aged 6 to 8, did the usual adult thing told them its not nice, they should paly nice, dont be mean anyway two of the girls had the grace to look ashamed but the not the Queen B of the group, if she is like that at aged say 7 what will she be like as a teenager

A few week ago I came across a sort of nerdy looking male teen with a nerdy-looking girl walking home from school a few young lads walk around them saying things like is she your girlfriend while making monkey sounds and sniggering and laughing, they stoped when they say me. The two who were the target just keep their heads up and ingnored the bullies.

These are young people and children who would have received talks and workshops ad Infinitum about bullying, yet it's still happening.

Why.

BattleCorp · 08-11-2019 12:13PM

mariaalice wrote: »

These are young people and children who would have received talks and workshops ad Infinitum about bullying, yet it's still happening.

Why.

You think a few workshops is going to get rid of bullying?

08-11-2019 12:16PM

BattleCorp wrote: »

You think a few workshops is going to get rid of bullying?

No of course not, but what is your answer.

tigger123 · 08-11-2019 01:43PM

pc7 wrote: »

I would say they probably now have the best anti-bullying set up of any school

No harm in asking the school about it though. If I were sending a teenager there I'd want to know the changes they're making to address it.

mrjoneill · 08-11-2019 01:46PM

sbsquarepants wrote: »

This is the kind of thing i was speaking about earlier - some people are just bad to the bone and there is a trend these days to ignore this and make excuses for it. These 2 are scum, they were born scum and they will die scum.

The teachers certainly didn't cover themselves in glory, but in reality they can only do so much.

Their parents, i've no idea what their home lives were like but B's father is clearly a fúcking arsehole so i doubt he helped matters in any way at a bare minimum.

But ultimately practically all the responsibilty (99%+) lies with the 2 pieces of **** themselves. They are just bad people. They won't ever be anything else, and that's why they should never see the outside of a cage again.

Yes indeed 100% agree no school could accommodate these 2 pieces of filth. Just cant get my head around the savagery of the assault for 13yr old; vicious beating about the head causing broken eye socket & serious head injury & then following on repeatedly striking with a concrete block about the head, on a beautiful innocent classmate. And not satisfied with that, while Ana unconscious sexually assaulted her. And these 2 led the bullying in school. Society will need to be forever protected from this evil.

For the school in question the problem was there they totally failed to address it. They got prior warning of the vulnerability of Ana and they did little or nothing about it. They had an anti-bullying policy in place yet they failed to implement it, as I believe its on the walls of every classroom. The school in question inc peers of Ana they all have a culpability in this but the final culpability rest with the 2 pieces of filth.

mrjoneill · 08-11-2019 02:11PM

pc7 wrote: »

I would say they probably now have the best anti-bullying set up of any school

Had an anti-bullying policy but did not effectively implement, prob now best implemented school.

BattleCorp · 08-11-2019 03:04PM

mariaalice wrote: »

No of course not, but what is your answer.

I replied in such a manner because I felt your statement below seemed a bit naive.

These are young people and children who would have received talks and workshops ad Infinitum about bullying, yet it's still happening.

I don't believe there is a 100% effective solution to bullying. I think it will always be present in society. We can try and reduce it as much as possible, but I can't see it ever being eradicated.

Classes may be one way to try and minimise it. But that won't be effective on its own. We need parents and society in general doing their bit, but in this age of no personal responsibility, it's hard to see it being tackled effectively.

skallywag · 08-11-2019 05:59PM

mariaalice wrote: »

No of course not, but what is your answer.

I do not think that there is one unfortunately, and it will always go on to some extent. I was bullied at school, I still think about it from time to time, I just put my head down and got on with it as best I could. I have confronted some of those involved many years afterwards and have somehow managed to get some closure.

I think the problem is always going to be there. People, kids in particular, are always going to be jealous of someone who can do something that they cannot, or who is simply different, etc.

Gadgetman496 · 08-11-2019 07:16PM

Earliest release dates for Kriégel killers revealed.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/1108/1089615-boy-a-boy-b/

tuxy · 08-11-2019 07:29PM

Gadgetman496 wrote: »

Earliest release dates for Kriégel killers revealed.

https://www.rte.ie/news/courts/2019/1108/1089615-boy-a-boy-b/

Yes that's what was expected based on the sentences, I guess the judge is making it very clear exactly what the process should be going forward.
I really hope that any denial of accountability even at this stage would be considered when the review comes up but it probably won't.

gimli2112 · 08-11-2019 07:33PM

I think in the US the victims family are allowed to address the parole board anytime the issue arises. Have mixed feelings about this as it must make them relive the events all over again (not that they don't anyway) but maybe it helps them too in some way, it must have some impact on the decision.

mrjoneill · 08-11-2019 10:02PM

The changing face of schools, in the US the majority of schools have an armed police presence. Obv the proliferation of weapons is one of the issues there, having an armed police presence to deter armed violence but there are also the issues which becomes the duty of the police there assoc with schools in Irl & Brit such as bullying, drugs, violence. sexual assault, theft, enforcing rules & security implementation .
https://www.urban.org/urban-wire/prevalence-police-officers-us-schools

Road-Hog · 09-11-2019 11:53AM

mrjoneill wrote: »

Yes indeed 100% agree no school could accommodate these 2 pieces of filth. Just cant get my head around the savagery of the assault for 13yr old; vicious beating about the head causing broken eye socket & serious head injury & then following on repeatedly striking with a concrete block about the head, on a beautiful innocent classmate. And not satisfied with that, while Ana unconscious sexually assaulted her. And these 2 led the bullying in school. Society will need to be forever protected from this evil.

For the school in question the problem was there they totally failed to address it. They got prior warning of the vulnerability of Ana and they did little or nothing about it. They had an anti-bullying policy in place yet they failed to implement it, as I believe its on the walls of every classroom. The school in question inc peers of Ana they all have a culpability in this but the final culpability rest with the 2 pieces of filth.

I am on same page as you about these two ‘freaks’ but do we know they actually were classrooom/yard bullies....ddI they actively engage in bullying of Ana or were they more just the hard men of the yard/class that you didn’t mess with. Animal A definitely would appear to have been the latter...?

banie01 · 09-11-2019 12:00PM

mrjoneill wrote: »

The changing face of schools, in the US the majority of schools have an armed police presence. Obv the proliferation of weapons is one of the issues there, having an armed police presence to deter armed violence but there are also the issues which becomes the duty of the police there assoc with schools in Irl & Brit such as bullying, drugs, violence. sexual assault, theft, enforcing rules & security implementation .
https://www.urban.org/urban-wire/prevalence-police-officers-us-schools

Are you seriously insinuating that we install police men in our schools?

The police presence in US schools is indicative of societal failure.
It's the most imprisoned population in the world, yet still incredibly violent.
Indeed the move from any police presence from being one of "Protectors" of the peace, to being active enforcers is something that is completely contrary to what our Gardaí are designed and indeed legislated to be.

Moving towards enforcing a modicum of societal norms by threat of force or police sanction is frankly ridiculous.

qo2cj1dsne8y4k · 09-11-2019 12:01PM

Well given even AFTER they brutally murdered her and assaulted her
A) I think they’ve bigger fish to fry than worrying about if they came across as bullies and

they still referred to her as a freak in their statements and as if she was less than them, even after what they’d done to her.

Safe to assume they weren’t the most respectful in school either given the child had no friends whatsoever.

brendanwalsh · 09-11-2019 12:09PM

These two horrible sub human freaks will hopefully be denied parole at every chance

You wouldn’t do it to a dog what these c unts did

take everything · 09-11-2019 03:48PM

The murder of a seven year old in 1973 in Dublin by a sixteen year old in a satanic ritual has echoes of this case.

The murderer Lorcan Bale now lives in relative obscurity in London working as an Environmental Services manager.

This guy crucified a seven year old in an attic in a case that really stinks. A lot of weird satanic stuff probably covered up and not reported on.
This link details the case better.

https://www.broadsheet.ie/2016/page/382/

vriesmays · 09-11-2019 03:48PM

Kyle Curran, 1987 was another case.

Eric Cartman · 09-11-2019 03:57PM

tigger123 wrote: »

No harm in asking the school about it though. If I were sending a teenager there I'd want to know the changes they're making to address it.

Be interested to know the changes, their policy over a decade ago was to shove disruptive kids into the LCA program and a guidance councillor who loved removing parental responsibility by telling them their bully child just had ADHD. The amount of kids on adhd meds there was shocking.

tayto lover · 09-11-2019 04:00PM

Eric Cartman wrote: »

Be interested to know the changes, their policy over a decade ago was to shove disruptive kids into the LCA program and a guidance councillor who loved removing parental responsibility by telling them their bully child just had ADHD. The amount of kids on adhd meds there was shocking.

It’s as bad now.
Loads of kids with something to get them on disability. They all have a “D”
ADD, ADHD. It’s like a feckin qualification.

Vicarious Function · 10-11-2019 10:43AM

Dublin Live News

The Ana Kriegel Murder: A Young Life Lost airs on Virgin Media One on Sunday night at 10pm.

Tonight!

Read:

Ana Kriegel: Boy A and Boy B will be offered new identities after jail release

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/ana-kriegel-boya-boyb-jail-17231512?utm_source=dublin_live_newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=EM_DublinLive_Nletter_News_Mediumteaser_Text_Story1&utm_campaign=daily_newsletter

10-11-2019 11:21AM

Vicarious Function wrote: »

Dublin Live News
Tonight!

Read:

Ana Kriegel: Boy A and Boy B will be offered new identities after jail release

https://www.dublinlive.ie/news/dublin-news/ana-kriegel-boya-boyb-jail-17231512?utm_source=dublin_live_newsletter&utm_medium=email&utm_content=EM_DublinLive_Nletter_News_Mediumteaser_Text_Story1&utm_campaign=daily_newsletter

"A source told Dublin Live 'It is understood that'"

Would ya feck off Dublin Live - this is gossip, not news.

Vicarious Function · 10-11-2019 11:23AM

I find Dublin Live News fairly reliable.

seenitall · 10-11-2019 11:24AM

That is so wrong. I have a young daughter growing up, and it is so frightening to know that one of these (especially the item A) could one day be living in our locality, socialise at the same places she does or worse, and no one any the wiser. It is almost asking for trouble. Like with Gerald Barry. And once there is another victim, it is too late, and the system washes its hands like there isn't something profoundly wrong with it. Protect the murderer over protecting the public.

Vicarious Function · 10-11-2019 11:35AM

seenitall wrote: »

That is so wrong. I have a young daughter growing up, and it is so frightening to know that one of these (especially the item A) could one day be living in our locality, socialise at the same places she does or worse, and no one any the wiser. It is almost asking for trouble. Like with Gerald Barry. And once there is another victim, it is too late, and the system washes its hands like there isn't something profoundly wrong with it. Protect the murderer over protecting the public.

Valid points, seenitall!

No matter what the outcome, these two scumb*gs have got life sentences to live with no matter what they choose. Even if they do choose a change of identity, same as Thompson and Venobles, they will never be truly incognito - same as them. There will always be reporters that will be able to track them down and report on them. Or they will disclose their former identities themselves while under the influence of drink.

seenitall · 10-11-2019 11:45AM

Vicarious Function wrote: »

Valid points, seenitall!

No matter what the outcome, these two scumb*gs have got life sentences to live with no matter what they choose. Even if they do choose a change of identity, same as Thompson and Venobles, they will never be truly incognito - same as them. There will always be reporters that will be able to track them down and report on them. Or they will disclose their former identities themselves while under the influence of drink.

Thinking on it, of course G.B. is not an analogy to this case, but I suppose another one who will be out way before his time (which should be never, obviously).

10-11-2019 12:01PM

tayto lover wrote: »

It’s as bad now.
Loads of kids with something to get them on disability. They all have a “D”
ADD, ADHD. It’s like a feckin qualification.

Awful isn't it - bloody medics diagnosing medical conditions. Next thing you know they'll be treating the conditions - where will we all be then?

McCrack · 10-11-2019 01:43PM

seenitall wrote: »

That is so wrong. I have a young daughter growing up, and it is so frightening to know that one of these (especially the item A) could one day be living in our locality, socialise at the same places she does or worse, and no one any the wiser. It is almost asking for trouble. Like with Gerald Barry. And once there is another victim, it is too late, and the system washes its hands like there isn't something profoundly wrong with it. Protect the murderer over protecting the public.

It will be impossible for these two to live anonymous in Ireland

iamwhoiam · 10-11-2019 01:43PM

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2019/nov/10/i-reported-every-detail-of-their-trial-yet-have-no-idea-why-two-boys-called-ana

interesting article in the Guardian

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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