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Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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Comments

  • #6422
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    What’s the plan for the building she was found in?


  • #6423
    skallywag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,088 ✭✭✭skallywag


    Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »
    What’s the plan for the building she was found in?

    Is that somehow relevant?


  • #6424
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 13,839 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    skallywag wrote: »
    Is that somehow relevant?

    It’s an honest question. Would it be knocked now that the trial is over? A memorial garden?

    It shouldn’t remain as is that’s for sure.


  • #6425
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,409 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »
    What’s the plan for the building she was found in?

    All the windows have been bricked up so to block any access . Apart from that it looks exactly as it did before .


  • #6426
    skallywag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,088 ✭✭✭skallywag


    Somebody just vanished into thin air?


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  • #6427
    Force Carrier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 594 ✭✭✭Force Carrier


    Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »
    A memorial garden?


    That's a very good idea.

    The state should buy that land and property. knock the building and make a memorial garden.


  • #6428
    skallywag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,088 ✭✭✭skallywag


    Force Carrier wrote: »
    That's a very good idea.

    The state should buy that land and property. knock the building and make a memorial garden.

    While it may seem like a good idea to some, in the heat of the current moment, it probably is not the wisest thing to do upon reflection.

    What happens, God forbid, when the next heinous crime occurs? Does the state then have to act in the same way? If not, why not? Why was this not as important as Ana. Etc.

    Etc.

    It is a very emotive topic but we need to keep our sanity at the same time and not get lost in it all.


  • #6429
    Lefty Bicek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,625 ✭✭✭Lefty Bicek


    Force Carrier wrote: »
    That's a very good idea.

    The state should buy that land and property. knock the building and make a memorial garden.

    That's a bit tacky, I'm sorry to be so direct.

    Could I, as an alternative, suggest something small, practical, and useful. In fact suggested by Ana's parents.

    I link to a previous post, from where I got the idea...

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=110474502&postcount=1764

    RIP Ana Kriégel


  • #6430
    Force Carrier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 594 ✭✭✭Force Carrier


    skallywag wrote: »
    While it may seem like a good idea to some, in the heat of the current moment, it probably is not the wisest thing to do upon reflection.

    What happens, God forbid, when the next heinous crime occurs? Does the state then have to act in the same way? If not, why not? Why was this not as important as Ana. Etc.

    Etc.

    It is a very emotive topic but we need to keep our sanity at the same time and not get lost in it all.

    I don't think you should get too wound up about it. It's just a garden. It could be funded privately if you think public money would set a problematic precedent. There already are plenty of memorials around the country to various tragedies.


  • #6431
    skallywag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,088 ✭✭✭skallywag


    Force Carrier wrote: »
    I don't think you should get too wound up about it. It's just a garden. It could be funded privately if you think public money would set a problematic precedent. There already are plenty of memorials around the country to various tragedies.

    I have no objection to some class of memorial, nor would I object to State money being used for the same. If someone wishes to do something privately then all the best to them. I would contribute myself if asked to.

    Purchasing the land itself through the State though for this purpose is not the way to proceed in my opinion. It would just open a can of worms any time another tragedy were to happen in the future.


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  • #6432
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,409 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Force Carrier wrote: »
    That's a very good idea.

    The state should buy that land and property. knock the building and make a memorial garden.

    There is a memorial garden in Anas estate made and funded by her neighbours .

    And a tree planted and bench in Anas memory in Leixlip Manor


  • #6433
    Force Carrier
    Closed Accounts Posts: 594 ✭✭✭Force Carrier


    skallywag wrote: »
    I have no objection to some class of memorial, nor would I object to State money being used for the same. If someone wishes to do something privately then all the best to them. I would contribute myself if asked to.

    Purchasing the land itself through the State though for this purpose is not the way to proceed in my opinion. It would just open a can of worms any time another tragedy were to happen in the future.

    As I said already the state doesn't need to be involved. It can be done privately.


  • #6434
    Quantum Erasure
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 10,442 ✭✭✭✭Quantum Erasure


    It's a protected structure, although I don't know if that will continue

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/calls-to-safeguard-house-months-before-ana-murder-38236586.html
    In 2016, Sherborough Properties got planning permission for a 62-bed nursing home to be built on the Glenwood site.

    In its application, the proposed development will consist of the change of use and refurbishment of the house and its associated outbuildings.


  • #6435
    0xzmro3n4y7lb5
    Closed Accounts Posts: 686 ✭✭✭0xzmro3n4y7lb5


    I don’t agree with the anonymity. Perhaps the most punitive action is to name such offenders

    They chose a particularly vulnerable girl and the judiciary deciding to protect offenders from vulnerability seems wrong.

    I’m not for one second suggesting anything vigilante but perhaps society should Review anonymity like This once a minor turns 21.


  • #6436
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,409 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Quantum Erasure wrote: »
    It's a protected structure, although I don't know if that will continue

    https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/calls-to-safeguard-house-months-before-ana-murder-38236586.html
    I would be surprised at that . There is already a large nursing home a mile or so up the road . They have just built a large extension on it


  • #6437
    Senature
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 355 ✭✭Senature


    A memorial might seem a nice idea, but that building and site is at the side of a fairly narrow but busy road, probably 10 minutes walk from Lucan village, and about the same from the closest car park in St Catherine's. In other words, not likely to get many genuine visitors. I think the current owners have tried to get planning permission for a nursing home in the last few years, so it will possibly be redeveloped in the not too distant future.

    The memorial in her estate is a lovely gesture by the community.


  • #6438
    skallywag
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,088 ✭✭✭skallywag


    Force Carrier wrote: »
    As I said already the state doesn't need to be involved. It can be done privately.

    :confused:

    You said that The state should buy that land and property?

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=111694983&postcount=6443


  • #6439
    pjohnson
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 27,589 ✭✭✭✭pjohnson


    JPF82 wrote: »
    From what I have heard vigilante attacks have occurred. Older brother of one of of the boys regularly gets beaten up. A gang of lads where the culprits just last week. Feel so sorry for the brother having to put up with that. I know one of his friends but not him so that's where my info is from.

    Suprised they havent moved away IF this is true.


  • #6440
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,692 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    LillySV wrote: »
    These little pricks didn’t show any emotion or remorse throughout the trial....they don’t give a damn other Than the affect it has on them.... they shouldn’t be considered for release ever!

    Who is considering them for release?


  • #6441
    Lefty Bicek
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,625 ✭✭✭Lefty Bicek


    Hannibal_Smith wrote: »
    Who is considering them for release?

    :(:rolleyes:


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  • #6442
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    Faugheen wrote: »
    You identify them, you identify the school and with it people who were in their class who had nothing to do with this but are put under the microscope anyway.

    Not rocket science.

    .....and siblings and cousins etc all of whom some on this thread genuinely feel are fair game for abuse, just because they are connected.


  • #6443
    The Black Oil
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Entertainment Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Regional East Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 19,638 CMod ✭✭✭✭The Black Oil


    retro:electro wrote: »
    Good report on the six one news just now. The Gardai really did follow procedure with remarkable precision in order to minimise any chance of unfair treatment accusations by the defence. While you might have felt like they were getting “preferential” treatment before and during the trial, it really was all done in order to secure an honest and just conviction. An amazing job considering children murdering children is a rarity in Ireland and so it would be such new ground.

    Reading about it all again today, horrendous. Let's also acknowledge the work of the forensic services. They had a very difficult job given the nature of the crime scene and what happened to Ana.

    Moderator: Television, Psychology and Dublin County North.

    CMod: Entertainment



  • #6444
    mick malones mauser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 576 ✭✭✭mick malones mauser


    retro:electro wrote: »
    Good report on the six one news just now. The Gardai really did follow procedure with remarkable precision in order to minimise any chance of unfair treatment accusations by the defence. While you might have felt like they were getting “preferential” treatment before and during the trial, it really was all done in order to secure an honest and just conviction. An amazing job considering children murdering children is a rarity in Ireland and so it would be such new ground.

    Surely Gardai should ALWAYS follow correct procedure !!!!


  • #6445
    retro:electro
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,039 ✭✭✭✭retro:electro


    mick malones mauser wrote: »
    Surely Gardai should ALWAYS follow correct procedure !!!!

    Well yes, ideally you would hope so. My point is that they performed to exceptional standards and by doing so prevented the defence from poking holes/ appealing/ whatever what have you. For such an atypical case they were flawless.


  • #6446
    RandomName2
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,575 ✭✭✭RandomName2


    Lara Breezy Groceries wrote: »
    I don’t agree with the anonymity. Perhaps the most punitive action is to name such offenders

    They chose a particularly vulnerable girl and the judiciary deciding to protect offenders from vulnerability seems wrong.

    Well yes, but capital punishment would be more straight forward if you're going down that route, and capital punishment would at least prevent attacks on the perpetrators' families from occurring.

    I don't see what benefit removing anonymity would have. Discussing the length of the sentences is a different matter though. Remember that reviews can increase the length, if deemed necessary.


  • #6447
    SEPT 23 1989
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 43,038 ✭✭✭✭SEPT 23 1989


    splinter65 wrote: »
    .....and siblings and cousins etc all of whom some on this thread genuinely feel are fair game for abuse, just because they are connected.

    My daughter knows Boy B’s brother a really nice quiet boy according to her

    He received a terrible hiding a few weeks ago for the sins of his brother

    It made me feel sick when she told me


  • #6448
    BarryD2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,717 ✭✭✭BarryD2


    RandomName2 wrote: »
    I don't see what benefit removing anonymity would have.

    It's a question of transparency. The state prosecutes criminal cases on behalf of the people and the norm is that the identities of people convicted are public. That's what happens every day up and down the state, just read the court cases. If you get done for drink driving, rape, or public disorder.. whatever, you may expect your name to be possibly published in the local and/or national press.

    Minors get anonymity but once they reach the age of 18, I can see no reason why they should be protected beyond that. It would appear perverse that the judgement in this case will protect them from public identification when they are adults. Has the good judge overstepped?

    The public should have it's pound of flesh at the end of the day. That's why we have a judiciary rather than lynch mobs.


  • #6449
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,692 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Lefty Bicek wrote: »
    :(:rolleyes:

    You alright?


  • #6450
    DelBoy Trotter
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,506 ✭✭✭DelBoy Trotter


    BarryD2 wrote: »
    It's a question of transparency. The state prosecutes criminal cases on behalf of the people and the norm is that the identities of people convicted are public. That's what happens every day up and down the state, just read the court cases. If you get done for drink driving, rape, or public disorder.. whatever, you may expect your name to be possibly published in the local and/or national press.

    Minors get anonymity but once they reach the age of 18, I can see no reason why they should be protected beyond that. It would appear perverse that the judgement in this case will protect them from public identification when they are adults. Has the good judge overstepped?

    The public should have it's pound of flesh at the end of the day. That's why we have a judiciary rather than lynch mobs.

    The post right above yours shows exactly why they won’t be named


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  • #6451
    Gadgetman496
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,547 ✭✭✭Gadgetman496


    DelBoy Trotter wrote: »
    The post right above yours shows exactly why they won’t be named

    Where is the protection for innocent people unwittingly becoming involved with these boys upon their release in the future?

    "Everybody is a genius. But if you judge a fish by its ability to climb a tree, it will live its whole life believing that it is stupid."



This discussion has been closed.
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