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Attacks in Saudi Arabia on two oil factories

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    #32
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    blackwave wrote: »
    Just as well Bolton is gone from the White House, god know's what he would be suggesting right now if he was still there.


    Trump said this an hour ago
    There is reason to believe that we know the culprit, are locked and loaded depending on verification.

    Trump changes his mind often, but reading between the lines expect a military strike soon. They probably attack Iranian backed targets inside Iraq? Attacking targets inside Iran would be very risky, and who knows if they are going to do it?


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    #33
    Sandor Clegane
    Registered Users Posts: 1,064 ✭✭✭Sandor Clegane


    Everyone involved in this situation is so shady and unscrupulous that it's impossible to know what the real story is, or who the real culprits are.


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    #34
    GM228
    Registered Users Posts: 8,925 ✭✭✭GM228


    https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2019-09-15/saudis-race-to-restore-oil-output-after-crippling-aramco-attack?srnd=premium&__twitter_impression=true
    For the global oil market, the 5.7 million barrels a day Saudi halt is the single worst sudden disruption ever, surpassing the loss of Kuwaiti and Iraqi petroleum supply in August 1990, when Saddam Hussein invaded his neighbor. It also exceeds the loss of Iranian oil output in 1979 during the Islamic Revolution, according to data from the U.S. Department of Energy.

    Interesting day ahead on the markets.


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    #35
    Atlantic Dawn
    Registered Users Posts: 81,243 ✭✭✭✭Atlantic Dawn
    M


    GM228 wrote: »
    https://www.bloomberg.com/amp/news/articles/2019-09-15/saudis-race-to-restore-oil-output-after-crippling-aramco-attack?srnd=premium&__twitter_impression=true



    Interesting day ahead on the markets.

    And they can't just pop down to the local Woodies to buy a few lengths of pipe to fix it either.


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    #36
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    GM228 wrote: »
    Interesting day ahead on the markets.


    Already +11.6 & 10.5 (%) for Brent & WTI.


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    #37
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,280 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    If this had happened 20 years ago the market reaction would have been more extreme.

    Still be damaging.

    A repeat of this would warrant a military response.

    He'll, this alone is a declaration of war.

    Same as a blockade of the straits of hormuz would be.

    An attempt to strangle the world economy.


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    #38
    The Phantom Jipper
    Registered Users Posts: 879 ✭✭✭The Phantom Jipper


    AMKC wrote: »
    Assetbacked wrote: »
    Seems far too easy for Iranian drones to just fly in and bomb the oil fields. Especially Trump's escalating verbal threats against Iran and the alliance the US has with the Saudis.

    Iran I would say could have done it if they wanted too. If they actually done it I do not no. But they are saying that the Hooties done it. I don't know about that . These oil fields were not beside each other they were in two different parts of a very big country.
    We will probably never know.

    It's hard to know who was behind it. The Iranians are blaming the Blowfish.


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    #39
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,280 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Saying now that it appears to have been missiles instead of drones.


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    #40
    Usurper.
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13 ✭Usurper.


    Forty Seven wrote: »
    Houthi drones with probably some Iranian expertise and training. Wouldn't be difficult to use off the shelf commercial drones combined with some bomb making skills which they have in droves. Never mind oil prices. If this expertise makes its way through terrorist groups and onto the internet (which it will) then we are facing a time where anyone can be attacked anywhere by anyone else.
    This is a very worrying development.

    The doomsday scenario with Sellafield is here


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    #41
    TommyKnocker
    Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭TommyKnocker


    AMKC wrote: »
    So who here thinks this was done by the Saudi's themselves to push up oil prices?
    If an outside actor is involved then my money would be on the Israeli's, to get the US to attack Iran as the Israeli's love their drones and Nut&Yahoo has been running his mouth off about Iran being close to having a nuke.


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    #42
    galwayllm
    Registered Users Posts: 318 ✭✭galwayllm


    It was a US attack...
    Gawd!

    And Climate change is made up..
    You're all such lemmings


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    #43
    TommyKnocker
    Registered Users Posts: 3,829 ✭✭✭TommyKnocker


    blackwave wrote: »
    Just as well Bolton is gone from the White House, god know's what he would be suggesting right now if he was still there.
    The explosions were still going off and Pompeo was blaming the Iranians and shouting for retaliation, so Bolton is not required to fan any flames of war. There are more than enough nutters in the US government only itching to attack Iran.


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    #44
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,586 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    Another tanker taken within the last hour or so:
    IRG arrests a vessel and 11 crew on 'diesel smuggling charges'.

    BP have traded $9.7bn so far this morning, stock up about 5% (biggest mover of the day).
    Brent spot @$66. Fill up your car.


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    #45
    TheValeyard
    Registered Users Posts: 12,216 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    We sure it was Drones / Cruise Missiles? Just seems odd that the defence systems didnt kick in.

    Fcuk Putin. Glory to Ukraine!



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    #46
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    For those interested, this podcast does a decent job of explaining how drones have been and could be used to cause chaos against a modern military.

    https://open.spotify.com/episode/0gaFGsedvOvm3RPsjE8sB7?si=kK3darWoTauRX7J2FjQGuw


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    #47
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    bigroad wrote: »
    With all the electric cars on the scene now maybe the 5% less oil will make no difference.
    And how exactly is that magic electricity created? Do they use gumdrops and fairy dust to produce that electricity?

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #48
    CrankyHaus
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,281 ✭✭✭CrankyHaus


    TheValeyard wrote: »
    We sure it was Drones / Cruise Missiles? Just seems odd that the defence systems didnt kick in.

    The range involved makes drones unlikely. Anything big enough to fly that far from Yemen should be a big, slow, loud target. In fact it seems likely that the Houthis taking credit for a drone attack is deliberate misinformation.

    Aramco believes it was missiles. Even cruise missiles would be harder to intercept than drones, particularly if they came from a less expected direction. While Saudi Arabia has world class Air Defence systems there is ample evidence that human failings in its military severely undermines the effectiveness of even 1st rate gear.

    This is a good read on it.

    https://www.armscontrolwonk.com/archive/1208062/meet-the-quds-1/


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    #49
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    I love the way everyone turns a blind eye to prices rising instantly despite there being reserves and stock bought at older pricing. Of course prices will drop the moment the fires are put out ;)

    Trump is 'locked and loaded' anyway. It's like having a dumb petulant teenager in the WH. It could be Kuwait all over again. These people have no regard for 'the troops'.

    Puts on tinfoil hat: Mossad?


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    #50
    Boggles
    Registered Users Posts: 39,608 ✭✭✭✭Boggles


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I love the way everyone turns a blind eye to prices rising instantly despite there being reserves and stock bought at older pricing. Of course prices will drop the moment the fires are put out ;)

    Yeah that really is a bug bear of mine.

    Price rises they can't up the prices quick enough, prices come down they claim they have bought old stock at higher prices and the price decrease will take time.


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    #51
    begsbyOnaTrain
    Closed Accounts Posts: 272 ✭✭begsbyOnaTrain


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I love the way everyone turns a blind eye to prices rising instantly despite there being reserves and stock bought at older pricing. Of course prices will drop the moment the fires are put out ;)

    Probably not right away but yeah, given no war or anything you should see a price decrease in time. I mean oil has not risen in price forever.


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    #52
    TheValeyard
    Registered Users Posts: 12,216 ✭✭✭✭TheValeyard


    Boggles wrote: »
    Yeah that really is a bug bear of mine.

    Price rises they can't up the prices quick enough, prices come down they claim they have bought old stock at higher prices and the price decrease will take time.

    I really wouldn't put it past Mossad. They want the Iranian regime gone.

    Fcuk Putin. Glory to Ukraine!



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    #53
    theguzman
    Registered Users Posts: 2,081 ✭✭✭theguzman


    The house of Saud is a US - Israeli client state, the Saudis sell their oil in Dollars, propping up the Dollar hegemony, in return they get security and can rule the country and spread their Wahhabi hate worldwide. Iran is selling oil to China for Yuan and like Saddam Hussein and Colonel Gaddafi abandoning the petrodollar then regime change swiftly follows. Bashar Al Assad refused access for the pipeline and shortly after Mossad and CIA equipped ISIS and unleashed their wardogs of hell in the country, Putin came to Syria's rescue and effectively bombed Islamic State back to the stone age and preserved Bashar Al Assad the legitimate democratic leader of Syria.

    I can see Russia intervening again with Iran if the Saudi's or American's try anything, Russia has a massive slice of the declining oil market. Oil is declining as an energy source even though oil consumption is expanding. Trump's trade war has crushed Chinese demand and oil prices were forecast to go to $25 per barrel next year as European and Asian demand shrinks as the new global recession is only just beginning and Germany is now in recession.

    Trump is embattled all around but no sitting US President at War has ever lost an election. Wise people remarked that when Bolton was got rid off that something worse was surely coming. I can see another false flag coming soon to beat the drums of war against Iran.

    The Iranian economy is being destroyed and they are backed into a corner so war is a certainty now I feel. It will be far worse than Vietnam because Iran is unconquerable unless they carpet bomb it in Nukes, it is a natural fortress and the sort of military numbers required to take the country would see a million US deaths easily, something unachievable without enforced conscription.

    China and Russia won't stand idly by and watch America conquer Tehran either, if America stupidly goes into Iran expect a Chinese Invasion of Hong Kong and maybe even Taiwan simultaneously. The Chinese are itching to have a go off America for what they perceive as Trump's sheer imperialism towards them.


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    #54
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Once all the I's are dotted and T’s are crossed, and everything points to Iran’s regime of religious psychopaths using one its proxies to undertake the oil field attach, they must be punished severely or they will continue their actions. The attack on Saudi Arabia was actually a global attack as the financial repercussions are already being felt around the world. A retaliatory air attack on their oil fields, ports, factories, military installations, and nuclear sites would probably be the best course of action. It might just give the Iranian people the motive needed to finish the job this time and oust the mullahs.

    I saw a pair of A10 Warthogs flying near where I live the other day. Haven’t seen them in quite some time even though a squadron is based about 60 miles south of me. Thought they would make the perfect attack plane to take on the small Iranian swarm boats that have been hijacking tanker ships lately.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #55
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,280 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    American troops won't set foot in Iran, that would take a full scale war effort not the piddling efforts of Iraq or Vietnam.

    They could take out every military base, bridge, power plant over the first few nights.

    Think the initial air strikes on Iraq but with a vastly increased capability of destruction.

    Think Iran is pushing for leverage but it's actions are such a threat to the global economy, it may well lead to military escalation.

    Think both sides will be reluctant for war.


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    #56
    Danzy
    Registered Users Posts: 13,280 ✭✭✭✭Danzy


    Matt Barrett wrote: »
    I love the way everyone turns a blind eye to prices rising instantly despite there being reserves and stock bought at older pricing. Of course prices will drop the moment the fires are put out ;)

    Trump is 'locked and loaded' anyway. It's like having a dumb petulant teenager in the WH. It could be Kuwait all over again. These people have no regard for 'the troops'.

    Puts on tinfoil hat: Mossad?

    Mossad, lol.


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    #57
    punisher5112
    Registered Users Posts: 24,647 ✭✭✭✭punisher5112


    I was going to order kerosene yesterday and as soon as this hit the news prices are up €15-€20 for 500 litres....

    Just had to bite the bullet today as no knowing how much more it could go up.


    I completely forgot to put order through last night.


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    #58
    Cheerful Spring2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,705 ✭✭✭Cheerful Spring2


    Danzy wrote: »
    American troops won't set foot in Iran, that would take a full scale war effort not the piddling efforts of Iraq or Vietnam.

    They could take out every military base, bridge, power plant over the first few nights.

    Think the initial air strikes on Iraq but with a vastly increased capability of destruction.

    Think Iran is pushing for leverage but it's actions are such a threat to the global economy, it may well lead to military escalation.

    Think both sides will be reluctant for war.

    You overlooking something here. What do you think will happen when American aircraft and American ships are hit and sailors and soldiers die? US will prepare for a ground invasion.

    This is not a Iraq. Iran possesses the same missiles as Israel and America and can hit every US base in the region. This is not empty threat.


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    #59
    notobtuse
    Registered Users Posts: 5,424 ✭✭✭notobtuse


    Cheerful Spring2 wrote: »
    You overlooking something here. What do you think will happen when American aircraft and American ships are hit and sailors and soldiers die? US will prepare for a ground invasion.

    This is not a Iraq. Iran possesses the same missiles as Israel and America and can hit every US base in the region. This is not empty threat.
    There will be no ground invasion. Pinpoint air attacks and global boycotts just might be the incentive needed for the Iranian people to accomplish a regime change.

    You can ignorantly accuse me of "whataboutism," but what it really is involves identifying similar scenarios in order to see if it holds up when the shoe is on the other foot!



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    #60
    kravmaga
    Registered Users Posts: 1,945 ✭✭✭kravmaga


    Sources: The US has assessed that the attack on Saudi oil facilities originated inside Iran
    From CNN's Kylie Atwood and Ryan Browne

    The US has told at least one US ally in the Middle East, that they have intelligence showing that the launch was “likely” coming from staging grounds in Iran, but they have not shared that intelligence yet. “It is one thing to tell us, it is another thing to show us,” said a diplomat from the region.

    A US official separately tells CNN that the US has assessed that the attack originated from inside Iran, the official spoke on condition of anonymity because they are authorized to speak to the press.

    No public evidence has been shared.

    What countries in the region decide to do, in reaction to the Saudi oil field attack, largely depends on what the US is willing to do, the source said. CNN reported earlier that Secretary of State is expected to speak with the UAE Crown Prince on Monday and other nations.

    The Pentagon declined to comment. The State Department and the White House did not respond to a request for comment.

    The WSJ first reported that the US was telling countries region that the attacks were launched inside Iran.

    More context: The attack on oil facilities in Saudi Arabia likely involved cruise missiles and attack drones, a separate US official familiar with the intelligence assessment told CNN earlier today. The official said that the attacks did not originate from Iraq but would not say whether they originated from Iran or Yemen. Iraq's Prime Minister issued a statement Monday saying that Secretary of State Mike Pompeo had told him that the attacks had not originated from Iraq. The State Department when asked about the call, said “no comment.”

    The US maintains an enhanced awareness of the airspace over Iraq given US military operations there as part of the counter-ISIS coalition.

    While the Iran-backed Houthis in Yemen have used attack drones in the past, those attacks have typically been launched against Saudi targets close to the border.

    The recent attacks against the Saudi oil facilities would represent a major improvement in the Houthis ability to accurately hit targets at a much greater distance than previously demonstrated.


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    #61
    James Brown
    Closed Accounts Posts: 16,015 ✭✭✭✭James Brown


    notobtuse wrote: »
    Once all the I's are dotted and T’s are crossed, and everything points to Iran’s regime of religious psychopaths using one its proxies to undertake the oil field attach, they must be punished severely or they will continue their actions. The attack on Saudi Arabia was actually a global attack as the financial repercussions are already being felt around the world. A retaliatory air attack on their oil fields, ports, factories, military installations, and nuclear sites would probably be the best course of action. It might just give the Iranian people the motive needed to finish the job this time and oust the mullahs.

    I saw a pair of A10 Warthogs flying near where I live the other day. Haven’t seen them in quite some time even though a squadron is based about 60 miles south of me. Thought they would make the perfect attack plane to take on the small Iranian swarm boats that have been hijacking tanker ships lately.

    So the Alt-Right jury is in is it?
    Last time the people of Iran rose up it was with the help of the CIA. Worked out great didn't it? Maybe if the US just f***ed off out of it for a spell?


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