Prosecution for neglecting a goldfish

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 12:33PM

Riskymove wrote: »

the Animal Health and Welfare Act is the starting point

basically if you decide to keep a pet you have obligations to look after it to a reasonable level, feed it and not be cruel to it

I don't see a problem with that.

There is a maximum penalty outlined but the reality is no one is going to be put in jail for neglecting a goldfish

I don't have a problem with any of that either. No one does.

Franz Von Peppercorn II · 07-08-2019 12:35PM

I think while we arrest people for goldfish negligence there will be dead and beaten horses all over the country.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 12:37PM

Franz Von Peppercorn II wrote: »

I think while we arrest people for goldfish negligence there will be dead and beaten horses all over the country.

Yep.

auspicious · 07-08-2019 12:42PM

Fish experience pain. We experience pain. Our dogs and cats feel pain. All sentience feels pain.
Fish when hauled form their home, often from a depth of 10 metres or more, can and usually experience horrific trauma due tp pressure change. If they have a swim bladder, it can expand rapidly and seriously damage surrounding organs; their eyeballs can fill with bubbles and bulge out of their heads; intestines squeeze out of rectums and stomachs are pushed out of mouths. Then they slowly suffocate as their gills dry out. All the while they are alive.

..Fish produce the same opioids—the body’s innate painkillers—that mammals do. And their brain activity during injury is analogous to that in terrestrial vertebrates: sticking a pin into goldfish or rainbow trout, just behind their gills, stimulates nociceptors and a cascade of electrical activity that surges toward brain regions essential for conscious sensory perceptions..
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/fish-feel-pain-180967764

Stevieluvsye · 07-08-2019 12:46PM

auspicious wrote: »

Fish experience pain. We experience pain. Our dogs and cats feel pain. All sentience feels pain.
Fish when hauled form their home, often from a depth of 10 metres or more, can and usually experience horrific trauma due tp pressure change. If they have a swim bladder, it can expand rapidly and seriously damage surrounding organs; their eyeballs can fill with bubbles and bulge out of their heads; intestines squeeze out of rectums and stomachs are pushed out of mouths. Then they slowly suffocate as their gills dry out. All the while they are alive.

..Fish produce the same opioids—the body’s innate painkillers—that mammals do. And their brain activity during injury is analogous to that in terrestrial vertebrates: sticking a pin into goldfish or rainbow trout, just behind their gills, stimulates nociceptors and a cascade of electrical activity that surges toward brain regions essential for conscious sensory perceptions..
https://www.smithsonianmag.com/science-nature/fish-feel-pain-180967764

1. Fish do not have the same pain receptors in their brain to feel "Pain"
2. On the scale of 1-10, how Vegan are you (10 being you only eat grass)

auspicious · 07-08-2019 12:55PM

Stevieluvsye wrote: »

1. Fish do not have the same pain receptors in their brain to feel "Pain"
2. On the scale of 1-10, how Vegan are you (10 being you only eat grass)

"..Fish do feel pain. It’s likely different from what humans feel, but it is still a kind of pain."

On the scale of 1-10 , how much do you consume animal products ( 10 being you elbow the calf out of the way and suck the cow's udder directly)?

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 01:02PM

auspicious wrote: »

s ( 10 being you elbow the calf out of the way and suck the cow's udder directly)?

:eek:
ABUSE!

Stevieluvsye · 07-08-2019 01:12PM

auspicious wrote: »

"..Fish do feel pain. It’s likely different from what humans feel, but it is still a kind of pain."

On the scale of 1-10 , how much do you consume animal products ( 10 being you elbow the calf out of the way and suck the cow's udder directly)?

Pull the udder one

Badumbash

auspicious · 07-08-2019 01:19PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

:eek:
ABUSE!

Exactly. Now you're getting it. Abuse! Just the same as sticking and yanking on a hook in a creature's mouth for fun.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 01:37PM

auspicious wrote: »

Exactly. Now you're getting it. Abuse! Just the same as sticking and yanking on a hook in a creature's mouth for fun.

I sowy.

Timberrrrrrrr · 07-08-2019 01:58PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

It was a police horse.

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2475009/Newcastle-fan-Barry-Rogerson-jailed-12-months-punching-police-horse.html

https://www.independent.ie/videos/world-news/warning-explicit-content-newcastle-fan-punches-police-horse-29564541.html

Horse didn't back down.

That area is really sensitive on a horse though. They have special riot protection to protect the nasal area and eyes.

Still 12 month in a bit much.

Wasn't enough imo

Heres another in jail, stabbed a police dog.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/08/05/criminal-convicted-first-time-finns-law-premeditated-knife-attack/amp/

gmisk · 07-08-2019 02:01PM

Timberrrrrrrr wrote: »

Wasn't enough imo

Heres another in jail, stabbed a police dog.

https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2019/08/05/criminal-convicted-first-time-finns-law-premeditated-knife-attack/amp/

I agree and only 3 months of that was for stabbing the dog

JDD · 07-08-2019 02:03PM

I dunno. Would I want my tax dollars spent on jailing someone for mistreating an animal that we regularly purposefully kill for food? I mean, I know we don't kill guinea pigs for food but I sort of lump them in with mice in the "sentient animal" scale and we have no problem with extermination companies killing them en masse if they are an inconvenience. I mean, fining someone would be better, as long as it included the cost of prosecuting the person as well.

All animals aren't equal. We'd be horrified if it was a dog, or a horse, or any kind of more sentient animal. But clearly killing an ant or a fly isn't the same as killing a dog. And picking the wings off a fly (disgusting as that is and slightly disturbing) isn't the same as cutting a dogs tail off. And there are scales how morally reprehensible mistreatment of animals is for those animals that fall between flies and dogs (such as goldfish and guinea pigs).

For me, what it comes down to is whether I would prefer my tax money is spent on prosecuting individuals who have mistreated say, a chicken, when I'm happy that it is not illegal to battery farm chickens and kill them to eat them, over the money being spent by the government in other ways that I believe are of better use e.g. homeless services, health service, etc.

Riskymove · 07-08-2019 02:19PM

JDD wrote: »

the money being spent by the government in other ways that I believe are of better use e.g. homeless services, health service, etc.

off topic I guess but a lack of money is not the reason for the problems we have in housing and health

Ecce No Homo · 07-08-2019 02:32PM

JDD wrote: »

I dunno. Would I want my tax dollars spent on jailing someone for mistreating an animal that we regularly purposefully kill for food? I mean, I know we don't kill guinea pigs for food but I sort of lump them in with mice in the "sentient animal" scale and we have no problem with extermination companies killing them en masse if they are an inconvenience.

I wonder have you ever kept guinea pigs. Mine used to leave their cage at 9am on the dot and call for me at the foot of the fridge because that's where their food was along with many other charming eccentricities such as sun bathing on little cushions.

Animal abuse is animal abuse. I think you would be in the minority to be concerned about tax money when it comes to punishing offenders.

anewme · 07-08-2019 02:42PM

There is enough money being spent on homeless. Its just not being channelled correctly.

Personally, I'm fatigued by the "homeless" crisis and believe it is the biggest misuse of funds.

Chris_Heilong · 07-08-2019 02:43PM

I cant agree with the proposed law, some animals are worth more than others, one life is not equal to another life in the great scheme of things, every Vegan is killing millions of micro animals every time they bite into a lettuce leaf, Guinea pigs are only domestic now as they were kept as a food source in South America. A ban on keeping animals would be a better punishment for neglect.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 02:44PM

anewme wrote: »

There is enough money being spent on homeless. Its just not being channelled correctly.

Personally, I'm fatigued by the "homeless" crisis and believe it is the biggest misuse of funds.

Let me guess you would open a donkey sanctuary?

Riskymove · 07-08-2019 02:45PM

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

I cant agree with the proposed law,

nothing "proposed" here

it is the law right now

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 02:45PM

I have been noticing lately a lot of animal rights activists are becoming very right wing in social/class politics.
Not criticizing it just an observation.

Maybe its the bubble thing.

Animals are in their bubble a lot of social issues aren't.

Stevieluvsye · 07-08-2019 02:45PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Let me guess you would open a donkey sanctuary?

Good to see you have upped your game a bit today Vibes.

Keep it up

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 02:47PM

Someone needs their bubble bursting.

anewme · 07-08-2019 03:01PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Let me guess you would open a donkey sanctuary?[/QUOTE

Going major off topic, but ........

Set up at a proper task force for Social Welfare/Homeless and Insurance fraud and empower them.

Look at the pension gap for those who are funding the country but will not get their State pension until 68.

anewme · 07-08-2019 03:02PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Someone needs their bubble bursting.

Must be yourself you are talking about.

It's not a dictatorship around here. Its not just your way or the highway.

The rest of us have opinions and views that are just as valid as yours and dont need to be patronised or talked down to.

Its not your remit to police other peoples opinions or dictate who or why people need their bubble bursting according to you.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 03:11PM

anewme wrote: »

Must be yourself you are talking about.

It's not a dictatorship around here. Its not just your way or the highway.

The rest of us have opinions and views that are just as valid as yours and dont need to be patronised or talked down to.

No. Just certain people i have encountered. Not you or anything.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 03:13PM

anewme wrote: »

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

Let me guess you would open a donkey sanctuary?[/QUOTE

Going major off topic, but ........

Set up at a proper task force for Social Welfare/Homeless and Insurance fraud and empower them.

Look at the pension gap for those who are funding the country but will not get their State pension until 68.

So you think people on the dole are committing fraud you are with leo on that one right?

Seems very ...facist.

I don't think i would leave a goldfish with you anewme. I don't think you are as nice as you pretend.

anewme · 07-08-2019 03:22PM

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

anewme wrote: »

So you think people on the dole are committing fraud you are with leo on that one right?

Seems very ...facist.

I don't think i would leave a goldfish with you anewme. I don't think you are as nice as you pretend.

Rest assured, all animals are very safe with me.

I would be described by those who know me as a person you would want in your corner when something goes wrong or in a crisis, or something needs to be spoken out about. However, I am not an expert on everything and would never claim to be.

I really don't think though I would be your cup of tea though.

ILoveYourVibes · 07-08-2019 03:27PM

anewme wrote: »

ILoveYourVibes wrote: »

I really don't think though I would be your cup of tea though.

I never said you were.

Prosecution for neglecting a goldfish

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