BusConnects Dublin - Big changes to Bus Network

cgcsb · 30-07-2019 3:54pm

Phibsboro: I'm happy enough with, it's an improvement that can be further improved upon in the future.
Kimmage: not sure what that's about tbh
Terenure: happy enough although it's a long stretch to be depending on bus only signals.

Stoneybatter: Well this is a bit of a clustereff. Aughrim street will become one way but no provision for how this will impact the N2, and more importantly, this will create yet another barrier to cycling; south bound cyclists will instead be diverted from Aughrim st (a pleasant cycle at the moment) to get pinched onto NCR and then a dangerous right turn to Prussia street.

The layout seems to suggest that north bound cyclists on Manor st, wishing to go up Prussia st should turn left onto a short cycle lane and the right again onto a 'shared space and then left to get onto Prussia street, when they can just continue straight. How can this be a serious proposal?

The pinch point between Fancy times and Centra is shown as having a bus lane 2 traffic lanes and a cycle lane, as well all know, the current cycle lane and bus lane are just free parking at the moment, there needs to be some enforcement measures here.

CatInABox · 30-07-2019 4:11pm

I'd missed it back when they tweeted it, but the NTA are waiting on legislation to take over the running of traffic enforcement cameras. This should result in a more effective enforcement regime, as it seems the Guards have absolutely no interest in traffic enforcement.

https://twitter.com/BusConnects/status/1115157869933076480

Qrt · 30-07-2019 4:38pm

Kimmage is...???

I mean, you could bulldoze the area around the Kimmage Road/Sundrive Road junction and it would be an improvement but this???

At least with Templeogue I see bus priority lights, but nothing for Kimmage. Let’s just hope that “work in progress” stamp means just that.

BeerNut · 30-07-2019 5:01pm

Qrt wrote: »

Let’s just hope that “work in progress” stamp means just that.

Maybe the next draft will have bus lanes in it. I think that's part of the project brief.

dfx- · 30-07-2019 5:09pm

CatInABox wrote: »

I'd missed it back when they tweeted it, but the NTA are waiting on legislation to take over the running of traffic enforcement cameras. This should result in a more effective enforcement regime, as it seems the Guards have absolutely no interest in traffic enforcement.

https://twitter.com/BusConnects/status/1115157869933076480

Why would the NTA be better at this? Haven't they enough to be doing/re-doing?

D14Rugby · 30-07-2019 5:18pm

These days with AI most of the stuff cameras are needed to do can be automated. It would be really easy to connect everything up to the car registration db and tell cameras what to look up for then automatically send out fines and points. It's just pure laziness to not do it properly.

alentejo · 30-07-2019 5:29pm

What I see in Kimmage with on street parking, slightly wider footpaths. Bus speeds will still be the normal very slow.

D14Rugby · 30-07-2019 5:45pm

Further up that Kimmage route just where it meets Harold's Cross they're running it up a road that's just about wide enough for the two lanes it currently has with no real gardens in front of the houses so god knows how well that's going to work

Qrt · 30-07-2019 5:51pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

Further up that Kimmage route just where it meets Harold's Cross they're running it up a road that's just about wide enough for the two lanes it currently has with no real gardens in front of the houses so god knows how well that's going to work

Between Sundrive Road and Harold’s Cross by Mount Argus? That section isn’t being touched, just made bus only.

EDIT: Christ are they actually proposing no bus gate there????? It just disappears after the first option.

donvito99 · 30-07-2019 6:17pm

Based on the new Kimmage proposals, has the NTA now decided Bus COnnects should forget about improving Bus and cycling infrastructure and instead refocus, spending the money on beautifying and expanding Dublin's on-street parking?

Original plan:

New "work in progress":

D14Rugby · 30-07-2019 6:38pm

Qrt wrote: »

Between Sundrive Road and Harold’s Cross by Mount Argus? That section isn’t being touched, just made bus only.

EDIT: Christ are they actually proposing no bus gate there????? It just disappears after the first option.

They're calling it a "shared surface for buses, cyclists, taxis and local traffic" easy to implement I'd say in any semi competent country, here though I'm not convinced it'll work

donvito99 · 30-07-2019 6:39pm

D14Rugby wrote: »

"shared surface for buses, cyclists, taxis and local traffic"

Don't we have this already?

In fact, isn't this arrangement exactly why Bus Connects was proposed??

L1011 · 30-07-2019 6:53pm

Local traffic as in residents on the streets. Straight through in under a reasonable time to have actually been two journeys could be fined but I doubt they will and will just rely on very rare AGS enforcement

D14Rugby · 30-07-2019 7:02pm

L1011 wrote: »

Local traffic as in residents on the streets. Straight through in under a reasonable time to have actually been two journeys could be fined but I doubt they will and will just rely on very rare AGS enforcement

It would be relatively simple to set time limits allowed on the road between certain points and have cameras at each entrance to/exit from the road, scan licence plates, check it's registered address, if its that street its good, if its not then check when it leaves, if its under the time limit that's good, if not send out a fine. You could even have a system in place to allow home owners to add other plates that are coming to the house to pick up/drop someone off or staying there temporarily. All this would be pretty easy to implement but I doubt they'll bother and give it a few months and every user of that road will be complaining about each other.

Annasopra · 30-07-2019 7:09pm

cgcsb wrote: »

That's all the radials and orbitals done.

Where does the new 11 start and does it goto Shopriver?

Stephen15 · 30-07-2019 7:16pm

Joeytheparrot wrote: »

Where does the new 11 start and does it goto Shopriver?

Wouldn't surprise me if they kept the 185 but probably with a new number. The 11 seems to be a replacement for the 44 and the NTA were saying they were looking at solutions for the Kilgarron area.

dublinman1990 · 30-07-2019 7:56pm

Oh lord. I just seen the proposals for Kimmage. Tbh I don't understand why the NTA would now propose to not at least put through a shared bus & cycle lane through Kimmage in the last 2 options of this plan. I would give the impression here that these proposals for Kimmage actually defeat the purpose of BC in the first place by not giving any bus passengers any more credible incentives to use the buses more often in the area. They are really taking a big risk for putting these revised plans out to the public which, in theory, could spread more anger from residents by giving them the potential to have a much slower bus service. It's not a good idea in my book. The NTA should stick to implementing Option 1 for Kimmage after the consultation as it is the best looking plan out of a bad lot for maintaining an improved bus service.

Spanish Eyes · 30-07-2019 8:03pm

As a walker, (with a car that I never take into the city), I hope people like me are catered for too. Just saying.

The city needs to look after pedestrians too. The footpaths in the city are rammed. It is not pleasant at all.

Honestly, you just have to look at the Greenway projects. It is (well to my mind) all about cyclists, which is fine, but walkers and families with buggies and maybe wheelchairs etc. need a voice too in all this. Every forum I look at about the Greenways seem to be concentrated on cyclists now. NO. We are all equal. Thank you.

john boye · 30-07-2019 10:57pm

dublinman1990 wrote: »

They are really taking a big risk for putting these revised plans out to the public which, in theory, could spread more anger from residents by giving them the potential to have a much slower bus service.

I'm going to guess you don't have local knowledge. The only reason they've come up these alternatives is to placate the residents( with their community not corridor placards in every window of the house), they couldn't care less how slow the buses are.

Qrt · 30-07-2019 11:16pm

john boye wrote: »

I'm going to guess you don't have local knowledge. The only reason they've come up these alternatives is to placate the residents( with their community not corridor placards in every window of the house), they couldn't care less how slow the buses are.

Has anybody pulled up the people on the stretch between Sundrive and Harold's Cross for objecting to the bus gate? i.e. objecting to less traffic on their road?

MJohnston · 31-07-2019 12:14am

john boye wrote: »

I'm going to guess you don't have local knowledge. The only reason they've come up these alternatives is to placate the residents( with their community not corridor placards in every window of the house), they couldn't care less how slow the buses are.

Indeed, the "Kimmage Residents Association" are obnoxious and transparently pro-car on Twitter. Hopefully they'll get the seized up road network they've demanded, it's just a shame they'll have ruined things for the vast majority of silent residents.

Slutmonkey57b · 31-07-2019 5:00am

Why not put together a boards.ie representation group? Put together lists of suggestions and present them on the same footing as residents. Cycling Ireland were doing that I believe.

BeerNut · 31-07-2019 7:41am

Piece on Kimmage in today's Irish Times. The bus gate zone in the revised plan runs from KCR to Harold's Cross Park.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/south-dublin-trees-and-gardens-could-be-saved-under-new-busconnects-design-1.3972336?mode=amp

sharper · 31-07-2019 8:47am

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Why not put together a boards.ie representation group? Put together lists of suggestions and present them on the same footing as residents. Cycling Ireland were doing that I believe.

There is the Dublin Commuter Coalition which is a similar idea https://www.dublincommuters.ie/
https://twitter.com/DublinCommuters

Qrt · 31-07-2019 9:35am

“Fianna Fáil city councillor Deirdre Conroy said while the NTA had gone to more effort than previously, it did not appear there were sufficient improvements for cyclists, as they would be sharing the bus lane.”

I’d never thought me and Deirdre would get along so well.

CatInABox · 31-07-2019 10:12am

BeerNut wrote: »

Piece on Kimmage in today's Irish Times. The bus gate zone in the revised plan runs from KCR to Harold's Cross Park.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/environment/south-dublin-trees-and-gardens-could-be-saved-under-new-busconnects-design-1.3972336?mode=amp

Saw that earlier, the plans make more sense now.

The NTA said the bus gate would be governed by signage, but it would consider seeking camera enforcement if the system was not respected.

Considering how much "respect" is shown to the College Green bus gate, I'd guess that the camera would be in place sooner rather than later.

I also wonder if they'll start to restrict taxis from these bus gates. College Green is consistently blocked up with taxis, which is just not sustainable.

Evil_g · 31-07-2019 10:18am

Has anyone asked how getting people out of cars and into taxis solves anything?

cgcsb · 31-07-2019 10:38am

That's some length of bus gate though

Qrt · 31-07-2019 10:46am

Evil_g wrote: »

Has anyone asked how getting people out of cars and into taxis solves anything?

Less parking needed. Also, I think the aim is to get them onto buses...

D14Rugby · 31-07-2019 12:37pm

No cameras just signs? I now give it 3 months before there's complete uproar about it. God love anyone that lives in any of the roads around there, going to be mayhem when this comes in.

BusConnects Dublin - Big changes to Bus Network

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