Turning left in car with cyclist behind you

07Lapierre · 24-07-2019 03:57PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I think most of us have ridden a bicycle at some stage in our lives..usually as children.

It's a lot less complicated to learn than driving a vehicle and in no way relevant to one's skill at driving.

The fact that most people have not cycled since they were kids is correct. That's what makes them so intolerant/ignorant of cyclists actions and needs on the road. They have grown up under the impression that bicycles are toys and have no place on our roads.

07Lapierre · 24-07-2019 03:59PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

.far better to stay left

Seth Brundle · 24-07-2019 04:01PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Well in terms of numbers there are far more drivers of MPVs on the roads so this is going to stack up.

Unfortunately cyclists are more likely to injure or kill themselves when cycling like idiots because they have none of the protection of a steel-bodied vehicle and no seatbelts.

This is what cyclist forget when they're doing stupid stuff on the roads,..they are the ones who will come off worse with any encounter with a vehicle..far better to stay left and stay away from cars,use signals,stop at lights and all the rest of it.

Hang on. Cyclists generally don't kill themselves. Tehy tend to be killed by motorists!
Staying left is not good advice - it is bad advice, very bad. It encourages dangerous overtaking. Even the RSA with their car-centric heads shoved up their ass have begun to realise this!

The Enbalmer wrote: »

When i'm cycling i behave exactly as i would when driving,especially when it comes to indicating my intentions...

...and how does you indicating your intentions stop a small minority of motorists from being a cock?
it doesn't!

Duckjob · 24-07-2019 04:02PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

That's not your concern..cyclists are not permitted on motorways.

You are aware that something like 85-90% of adult cyclists are also motorists right?

I don't consider myself a "cyclist" any more than I consider myself a motorist. I'm a person first and foremost, a person that sometimes uses a car to get around and other times uses a bike to get around.

Driver behaviour on the M50 may not be my concern today when I'm on the bike, but could very much be my concern tomorrow when I'm driving on the M50.

You have one of most tragically simplistic us vs them mentalities I've ever come across. Reality is not either/or.

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 04:05PM

Dominique Fresh Tween wrote: »

What utter rubbish, you obviously never cycled in ireland. There are some lunatic anti cycling drivers out tgere, and on this forum.

I cycle to work at least 3 days a week and i have to say my ire is largely directed at other cyclists.

Apart from the usual list of gripes about RLJ and failure to indicate as a cyclist you also have to contend with idiots (usually MAMIL types) agressively overtaking you,wheel sucking and veering from one lane into another.

I saw a guy today,no helmet absolutely flying along,weaving through the traffic at custom house quay today and through 2 red lights travelling so dangerously and so fast that not even the best driver in the world would have time to react to him.
I saw similar character in howth village yesterday..flying through traffic on a downward slope with his head down in excess of 40kph..he would have absolutely no chance in a collision and represents the most fleeting of visible hazards to anybody using the road (myself included).

We can bang on about how dangerous cars are til the cows come home but there ARE dangerous cyclists and they will never admit to being in the wrong.

Utter Consternation · 24-07-2019 04:07PM

Seth Brundle wrote: »

We have allowed our country to become heavily car dependent. This led to urban sprawl, poor bus and train services, etc. Also people now need space outside their house to accommodate their cars, which despite the size will spend most of their time carrying only one person. It is a (and I say this as a petrolhead) completely stupid approach that cannot continue.
Dublin is a great city to cycle in, if it is allowed. It is largely flat which suits cycling.
The problem is that the car has been allowed to dominate and options such a the bycicle were given the Thatcher treatment. This has led to poor cycling infrastructure. Our councils spend large amounts of money on something that cyclists won't use because, had they been consulted, the councils would have been told that it was more dangerous or whatever.

However, moving back towards our topic, this attitude that cyclists are all kamakazi muppets out to scratch your car or whatever is an ignorant one.
Not all of us charge up behind a car that looks to be turning left. Personally, I probably would have been further right on the road (1m from left) and so will have the option to move in behind the car. Therefore should the driver be checking their mirrors, they know what I'm planning.

The amount of single occupancy car use in Dublin CC in the morning is borderline ridiculous. Every second one of them on their phones at traffic lights too.

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 04:08PM

Duckjob wrote: »

You are aware that something like 85-90% of adult cyclists are also motorists right?

I am aware that this figure is absolute nonsense..a huge proportion of cyclists cycle because they do not have a car..this applies especially to students and service workers as well as those less fortunate financially.

meeeeh · 24-07-2019 04:15PM

Seth Brundle wrote: »

Hang on. Cyclists generally don't kill themselves. Tehy tend to be killed by motorists!
Staying left is not good advice - it is bad advice, very bad. It encourages dangerous overtaking. Even the RSA with their car-centric heads shoved up their ass have begun to realise this!

...and how does you indicating your intentions stop a small minority of motorists from being a cock?
it doesn't!

In fairness that's basic stuff. People can't read your mind and if you are not able to indicate on the bike you shouldn't be cycling. And drivers who can't use indicators annoy me just as much.

By the way I don't buy this simplistic absolution of bad road behaviour for non drivers. Some of the worst offenders at crossing the road are people with prams. They are putting in danger their own and their children's lives. Same for cyclists and other pedestrians.

Tombo2001 · 24-07-2019 04:22PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I am aware that this figure is absolute nonsense..a huge proportion of cyclists cycle because they do not have a car..this applies especially to students and service workers as well as those less fortunate financially.

I don't think this is true Embalmer.

Most cyclists are commuters and they are doing it because (I) its convenient and (ii) its a good way to keep fit.

They don't choose cycling because its cheap. The bus would be cheaper.

Nonetheless - happy to see any statistics or evidence you have to back this up - apart from "its what I see from my car".

Duckjob · 24-07-2019 04:23PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I am aware that this figure is absolute nonsense..a huge proportion of cyclists cycle because they do not have a car..this applies especially to students and service workers as well as those less fortunate financially.

According to Official Department for Transport figures in UK in 2017:

31% of the people who held driving licences also cycled;
85% of the people aged 18+ who cycled also held a driving licence.

https://www.cyclinguk.org/statistics
point 10

...but I'm going to bow out now as I can see we're in Trump style debate territory where facts don't matter.

Tombo2001 · 24-07-2019 04:24PM

Duckjob wrote: »

According to Official Department for Transport figures in UK in 2017:

Yeah but

Seth Brundle · 24-07-2019 04:30PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I am aware that this figure is absolute nonsense..a huge proportion of cyclists cycle because they do not have a car..this applies especially to students and service workers as well as those less fortunate financially.

Assuming that's the case, does this make them less aware of traffic around them?
Does not having a car make them less safe on the roads?

magicbastarder · 24-07-2019 04:48PM

Not sure if I'm the first to ask - what exactly does an enbalmer do?

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 04:55PM

Duckjob wrote: »

According to Official Department for Transport figures in UK in 2017:

.

Are we part of the UK now??

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 04:56PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

They don't choose cycling because its cheap. The bus would be cheaper.

The bus is about 3 euro per journey..cycling is free!

Tombo2001 wrote: »

Nonetheless - happy to see any statistics or evidence you have to back this up - apart from "its what I see from my car".

No..it's what i see from my bike.

Spook_ie · 24-07-2019 04:57PM

Duckjob wrote: »

According to Official Department for Transport figures in UK in 2017:

https://www.cyclinguk.org/statistics
point 10

...but I'm going to bow out now as I can see we're in Trump style debate territory where facts don't matter.

Holding a drivers license doesn't mean that you do drive though, or even that you know how to drive! It's like me saying "Well I used to cycle" (which I did when I was much younger ) so I'm a cyclist, even when the roads and traffic have changed so much.

Tombo2001 · 24-07-2019 05:01PM

The Enbalmer has just posted the following in the "Now ye're talking - to a bus driver" thread, in the AMA: Ask Me Anything forum:

"In your opinion how dangerous is the average cyclist?"

Spook_ie · 24-07-2019 05:02PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

The Enbalmer has just posted the following in the "Now ye're talking - to a bus driver" thread, in the AMA: Ask Me Anything forum:

"In your opinion how dangerous is the average cyclist?"

We have ourselves a stalker ladies and gentlemen.

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 05:04PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

The Enbalmer has just posted the following in the "Now ye're talking - to a bus driver" thread, in the AMA: Ask Me Anything forum:

"In your opinion how dangerous is the average cyclist?"

Yes..i thought it would be interesting to get a perspective from a professional driver as opposed to a bunch of cyclists.

beauf · 24-07-2019 05:07PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I cycle to work at least 3 days a week ...

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Yes..i thought it would be interesting to get a perspective from a professional driver as opposed to a bunch of cyclists.

Well you're a cyclist. How dangerous are you?

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I am aware that this figure is absolute nonsense..a huge proportion of cyclists cycle because they do not have a car..this applies especially to students and service workers as well as those less fortunate financially.

So are you one of these since you're a cyclist?

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 05:09PM

beauf wrote: »

Well you're a cyclist. How dangerous are you?

So are you one of these since you're a cyclist?

Not even slightly..i never get beeped and i certainly don't spend all day ranting about motorists.

if you don't find your cycling relaxing you're doing something wrong!

..oh just saw your sneaky edit..bad form old boy..very bad form!

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 24-07-2019 05:12PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

I cycle to work at least 3 days a week and i have to say my ire is largely directed at other cyclists.

Apart from the usual list of gripes about RLJ and failure to indicate as a cyclist you also have to contend with idiots (usually MAMIL types) agressively overtaking you,wheel sucking and veering from one lane into another.

I saw a guy today,no helmet absolutely flying along,weaving through the traffic at custom house quay today and through 2 red lights travelling so dangerously and so fast that not even the best driver in the world would have time to react to him.
I saw similar character in howth village yesterday..flying through traffic on a downward slope with his head down in excess of 40kph..he would have absolutely no chance in a collision and represents the most fleeting of visible hazards to anybody using the road (myself included).

We can bang on about how dangerous cars are til the cows come home but there ARE dangerous cyclists and they will never admit to being in the wrong.

It sounds to me that you are choosing to ignore the crazy drives that other cyclists see on a daily basis. There's absolutely no denying that there are lunatic cyclists too. The common denominator between Cyclists and other road users is humans. It's irrelevant what mode of transport people use, an arsehole is an arsehole. They also exist on trains and buses too

The sooner the better people stop this "but cyclists" "but motorist" crap. There's too much of a divide between the two groups.

Do dangerous drivers normally admit to being in the wrong? Or are you looking for cyclists on here to admit to the shíttery they get up to? Again, the mode of transport is totally irrelevant. I'm currently living in Germany, supposedly some mecca for cyclists, but guess what. There's a plethora of idiots in both cars and on bicycles.

What's the problem with a cyclist travelling "fast", what is fast anyway? 40Kmph? 50Kmph?

Also, what's with the issue with lycra or other cycling gear? What do you suggest somebody wear on their commute, giving the atrocious weather one has to deal with in Ireland. It's just pigeonholing people and making easier to insult, ridicule or bully. Wearing certain types of clothing, or riding certain types of bikes is also irrelevant. Would it be fair to say that all BMW, Audi or Merc drivers are snobby tossers who can't drive for crap? You might think that, but it's only because you have subconsciously decided that they are and have ignore the terrible driving from all other car types.

I see more cars breaking the rules because I see more cars. It's that simple. I don't pass nearly as many cyclists in traffic because the cyclists are moving much faster than the cars. When there is not a lot of traffic, a lot more cars are passing me than cyclists. It's that simple.

In keeping with the theme of the thread, here's a video of a commute I took in Ireland a couple of years ago. It's all on the same day. These were just the worst I took from my 20-25 minute commute into work. The first video personifies the "I'm in a car, I always have the right of way". It's exactly how NOT to turn left, the driver was indicating before overtaking me. It's some sort of magic switch. Second clip has a similar video (I caught up with this one and had a word with her "OMG I am so sorry, I didn't see you", she was checking facebook on her phone while driving and trying to maneuver around a roundabout. Facebook.... 3rd clip I could have been killed by the two lunatics who couldn't slow down and wait another, 8-10 seconds? Racing for red... They may not seem like it, but they were hauling ass.

I have said it many many times. No amount of high viz, lights or helmets is competition for these idiots. As a cyclist you are just an obstacle and deserve every bit of vitriol you receive. These imbicils couldn't comprehend the fact that cyclists help reduce traffic and their commuting times.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gwFcAGDLWxs

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 24-07-2019 05:18PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Yes..i thought it would be interesting to get a perspective from a professional driver as opposed to a bunch of cyclists.

Buses are horrendous, an absolute nightmare on the roads. The close calls I have had with buses and taxis are far more serious than other commuters. Dublin bus and Aircoach are absolute road terrorists.

beauf · 24-07-2019 05:19PM

Tombo2001 wrote: »

The Enbalmer has just posted the following in the "Now ye're talking - to a bus driver" thread, in the AMA: Ask Me Anything forum:

"In your opinion how dangerous is the average cyclist?"

He's now answered his own question...

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Not even slightly...never get beeped and ...certainly don't spend all day ranting about motorists....

...:D

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 05:31PM

Dominique Fresh Tween wrote: »

Buses are horrendous, an absolute nightmare on the roads. The close calls I have had with buses and taxis are far more serious than other commuters. Dublin bus and Aircoach are absolute road terrorists.

Horses,buses,cars,pedestrians,taxis...no bad cyclists at all it would seem..it's everybody else who is wrong!

I expected no less and posted earlier to that effect

The Enbalmer · 24-07-2019 05:32PM

beauf wrote: »

He's now answered his own question...

...:D

You chatting away to yourself there

:D

J Mysterio · 24-07-2019 05:47PM

Pawwed Rig wrote: »

I doubt that is true tbh. Maybe teenagers or young adults but most cyclists over the age of 25 would have a driving licence and probably a car at home.

Just not true for Dublin though, maybe the rest of the country.

beauf · 24-07-2019 05:55PM

J Mysterio wrote: »

Just not true for Dublin though, maybe the rest of the country.

I think its highly likely many of the cyclists commuting in from the suburbs have licences.

In all 12,227 cyclists crossed the cordon (Commuter traffic crossing over Dublin’s canals) in the morning rush hour - still up 153% since 2006.

You'd have to assume the group of cyclists we are mainly talking about are the ones on the road commuting.

Even if we are not lots of people get a licence but then don't buy a car for many years later.

magicbastarder · 24-07-2019 06:05PM

J Mysterio wrote: »

Just not true for Dublin though, maybe the rest of the country.

One of the more startling stats about cycling is that more female secondary School students drive to school than cycle.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i · 24-07-2019 06:11PM

The Enbalmer wrote: »

Horses,buses,cars,pedestrians,taxis...no bad cyclists at all it would seem..it's everybody else who is wrong!

I expected no less and posted earlier to that effect

What are you talking about? I like how you completely ignored my other post... :rolleyes:

Typical...

Turning left in car with cyclist behind you

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