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16-07-2019 07:38PM

All time English league draft

Morzadec wrote: »

I'd argue it might not be fair to compare them. It's not far off comparing Beckham to Salah.

But broadly I'd agree. Giggs never had a season in numbers anywhere near like Bale's best (again maybe not a fair comparison based on positions / systems). I believe Giggs won his only pfa award when probably past his peak (though still playing at a very high standard) at centre mid.

Giggs will always deservedly be far higher than Bale in any list of top premier league players, but if you were to make a list of best individual seasons, bale's likely going to have a top 10 entry

I don't know about that. Bale was inconsistent in the league until he moved to Madrid imo. His heavier touches got punished a lot more on the left than on the right and while he was very good I think a lot of people remember his CL performances in that time when thinking of him. There were better players the year he won the PFA award.

Edit: just realised that's true for both Welsh left wingers haha

Skylinehead · 16-07-2019 07:39PM

redzerdrog wrote: »

I disagree, I don't think Giggs ever had a season like Bale had around 2013

He said Bale on the left....not in 2013.

redzerdrog · 16-07-2019 07:45PM

All time English league draft

Skylinehead wrote: »

He said Bale on the left....not in 2013.

2012 - 2013 his last season with Spurs iirc he did play on the left and scored 20+ goals

I don't recall him playing much on the right until he moved to Madrid

bucketybuck · 16-07-2019 08:17PM

redzerdrog wrote: »

I think the Giggs v Bale is the perfect example of longevity v peak ability

Two things I don't like about Giggs, the man himself, and this revisionist thing where he is known as the guy played a long time instead of the world class winger that he originally was.

Giggs in the 90's was a superstar to match anybody, he was a huge part of United coming to the fore from the mid 90's on and there isn't a team in the world that wouldn't have immediately signed him if they had the choice.

I know what the stats say and they don't tell the full story, anybody watching PL football during that period knows just how good Giggs was and how much influence he had. Forget the 20 years playing or whatever it was, had Giggs retired in 2003 aged 30 he would still be a first round pick in a PL draft.

Also, I detest the man. What he and John Terry did is the lowest of the low.

Lucas Hood · 16-07-2019 08:27PM

Current Premier League Draft

redzerdrog wrote: »

2012 - 2013 his last season with Spurs iirc he did play on the left and scored 20+ goals

I don't recall him playing much on the right until he moved to Madrid

Bale played right wing a fair bit for Spurs and behind the striker in his last season.

Bale in that season was one of best in the world. He came 9th in Balon dor. I don't think Giggs ever hit those levels personally.

Skylinehead · 16-07-2019 08:43PM

redzerdrog wrote: »

2012 - 2013 his last season with Spurs iirc he did play on the left and scored 20+ goals

I don't recall him playing much on the right until he moved to Madrid

Pretty much behind the striker that season, but free-roaming. Certainly not a classic left winger.

redzerdrog · 16-07-2019 08:44PM

All time English league draft

I do remember the odd game in a free role but still mostly from the left. Genuinely don't think he played on the right until madrid

Edit: according to the internet he played that season:
32 on the left scoring 19 goals
10 behind the striker
1 at left back
1 on the right

Lucas Hood · 16-07-2019 09:02PM

Current Premier League Draft

Excuse the shïty source but he admits it himself here.

http://www.realmadridnews.com/gareth-bale-prefer-playing-right-wing-7763

"Last season with Tottenham I didn’t play as much on the left, I was playing more down the middle or on the right – like with Wales. I feel comfortable playing on the right wing, I’m happy there.”

redzerdrog · 16-07-2019 09:13PM

All time English league draft

Lucas Hood wrote: »

Excuse the shïty source but he admits it himself here.

http://www.realmadridnews.com/gareth-bale-prefer-playing-right-wing-7763

"Last season with Tottenham I didn’t play as much on the left, I was playing more down the middle or on the right – like with Wales. I feel comfortable playing on the right wing, I’m happy there.”

I wouldn't take anything a footballer says as gospel to be honest and that can be interpreted as he didn't play only on the left and was playing more and more in different positions.

The stats are above he was mostly on the left but either way he is not my player so I don't really care. For voting wise for this draft I will be considering him better than Giggs but if I end up facing him in it I will be sure to use your arguments against him :-)

Trigger · 16-07-2019 10:00PM

All time English league draft

redzerdrog wrote: »

I wouldn't take anything a footballer says as gospel to be honest and that can be interpreted as he didn't play only on the left and was playing more and more in different positions.

The stats are above he was mostly on the left but either way he is not my player so I don't really care. For voting wise for this draft I will be considering him better than Giggs but if I end up facing him in it I will be sure to use your arguments against him :-)

I'm not saying you are wrong here, I can definitely remember him playing all left right and centre during that year, the problem with stats like that through transfermarkt and the like is that they use the starting position, basically from the lineup, you would need to get the average position in each match to determine the true position, statistic sites like that probably wouldnt do that unless you are search each game and getting the heat map.

Also the bold, any argument you make now will be deemed as a total contradiction of what you really think so if you do come up against him your argument will be torn apart

martyos121 · 17-07-2019 07:03PM

All time European cup competitions draft

Just noticed that MNG mentioned Rose’s form in the Champions League this past season in his pick. It just made me think, are people going to take into account how a player fared in European and domestic cup competitions during their peak in the Premier League as well, or is it strictly based on league form? Will some people look upon form in other competitions as either validation or doubt of their quality that they could or couldn’t perform to the same level against European clubs? I have a feeling the answer to all the above is a firm no, but I’d be interested to hear if anyone has a different opinion.

That’s not a slight at you for bringing that up MNG, it just raised a thought in my head is all.

martyos121 · 17-07-2019 07:05PM

All time European cup competitions draft

Also, here’s the table after round 9:

I’ll leave this alone until the last round has been completed, it’s much handier doing two rounds at once and it’s not hugely important either.

Lucas Hood · 17-07-2019 07:42PM

Current Premier League Draft

Can see that being a contentious pick.

I stand by my reasoning though.

17-07-2019 10:12PM

All time English league draft

Was a coin flip for myself between Lehmann and Lloris. Went for Lloris as he was more dependable I thought.

Morzadec · 17-07-2019 11:13PM

All time English league draft

martyos121 wrote: »

Just noticed that MNG mentioned Rose’s form in the Champions League this past season in his pick. It just made me think, are people going to take into account how a player fared in European and domestic cup competitions during their peak in the Premier League as well, or is it strictly based on league form? Will some people look upon form in other competitions as either validation or doubt of their quality that they could or couldn’t perform to the same level against European clubs? I have a feeling the answer to all the above is a firm no, but I’d be interested to hear if anyone has a different opinion.

That’s not a slight at you for bringing that up MNG, it just raised a thought in my head is all.

Yeah i will, it gives an idea of how good they were at the time and to show they won big trophies at their peak, particularly when you're going way back. Like i pointed to the fact Desailly was part of a rock solid France defence that won a WC and European Cup while at Chelsea to illustrate that he was at his peak there.

Carrick as well, the fact he was part of a side that consistently faught at the top end of europe (3 CL finals) came into it a bit for me.

Anyone picking any of the current Liverpool players too I'm sure were swayed by the recent CL win

redzerdrog · 18-07-2019 03:14PM

All time English league draft

Have my team finished yet still finding it torturous when the picks slow down

Ferris_Bueller · 18-07-2019 05:01PM

Current Premier League Draft

Sorry lads have been away since Sunday so haven't been on as much, final pick made and next poster PM'd

duffman13 · 18-07-2019 09:00PM

Current Premier League Draft

I'll miss PMing KBurke and Ferris

Picks finally done for me, nearly there now!

Donnielighto · 18-07-2019 09:04PM

Love these. Think it'll be good for the forum too.

correction · 19-07-2019 12:41PM

Current Premier League Draft

Was a coin flip for me between Bould and Mertesacker. I originally wanted to pair Mert and Koscielny again but was worried public opinion of the Arsenal defense in general during that era is so poor it would count against me but those 2 were a genuinely very good partnership. Between that and the feeling of Bould being that more commanding, leader type I went with him.

bucketybuck · 19-07-2019 01:07PM

When I see some of the players being picked it makes my toes hurt!

All opinions of course but there are still some real gems still available, I think some people could get a real bargain in this round.

IncognitoMan · 19-07-2019 01:48PM

Current Premier League Draft

bucketybuck wrote: »

When I see some of the players being picked it makes my toes hurt!

All opinions of course but there are still some real gems still available, I think some people could get a real bargain in this round.

That's the thing with an all time PL draft, it's so easy to miss a name and forget someone.

There's three players I can think of for my last pick that were all world class at one stage in the league.

What I need to figure out is which will be looked at as the best and also fit into the formation.

But whichever I pick I'll be leaving what I think are two world class players on the board still and I'm fairly sure they won't be picked looking at the teams behind me.

Trigger · 19-07-2019 01:49PM

All time English league draft

bucketybuck wrote: »

When I see some of the players being picked it makes my toes hurt!

All opinions of course but there are still some real gems still available, I think some people could get a real bargain in this round.

There is plenty of gems, that havent been picked,that I only remembered after I had selected selected a player in similar position, I'm sure the same will happen with this round

IncognitoMan · 19-07-2019 01:52PM

Current Premier League Draft

For fun if you're interested, bucketybuck you can throw together a best of the rest side at the end.

Could lead to a few "ah ****e" moments for the rest of us :pac:

duffman13 · 19-07-2019 01:53PM

Current Premier League Draft

There is loads of class players left really, but beauty is in the eye of the beholder! There's probably two or three other teams could be made of whats left or what will be left that would look well

jayo26 · 19-07-2019 01:56PM

All time English league draft

IncognitoMan wrote: »

For fun if you're interested, bucketybuck you can throw together a best of the rest side at the end.

Could lead to a few "ah ****e" moments for the rest of us :pac:

Are we not doing 12th pick then? I think it be a missed chance for varying tactics would make it fun.

correction · 19-07-2019 01:59PM

Current Premier League Draft

I don't mind a sub round but my team is set so for me it would be a waste of time.

bucketybuck · 19-07-2019 02:01PM

IncognitoMan wrote: »

For fun if you're interested, bucketybuck you can throw together a best of the rest side at the end.

Could lead to a few "ah ****e" moments for the rest of us :pac:

And then have some smartarse come along and tell me how bad it is and point out how wrong I am?

Ok, just for the craic.

IncognitoMan · 19-07-2019 02:09PM

Current Premier League Draft

bucketybuck wrote: »

And then have some smartarse come along and tell me how bad it is and point out how wrong I am?

Ok, just for the craic.

Hopefully you're not that sensitive :pac:

IncognitoMan · 19-07-2019 02:11PM

Current Premier League Draft

jayo26 wrote: »

Are we not doing 12th pick then? I think it be a missed chance for varying tactics would make it fun.

Sure we'll test the waters so. I'll put up two post. One for a sub pick, one against.

Whichever has the most likes at the end of the current round of picks we'll go with.

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