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Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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Comments

  • #4502
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,992 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    pablo128 wrote: »
    He was cute enough to wait until the judge had left the court before he started mouthing off. At best he's an insensitive muppet. He knew the Kriegels were sitting there.

    According to a couple of newspaper reports he started mouthing off whilst the judge was thanking the jury. He then stormed out only to return - when the judge had left. Imo he was left off lightly to do that in a court of law and in full hearing of the Kreigel family


  • #4503
    LiamoSail
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,294 ✭✭✭LiamoSail


    mrjoneill wrote: »
    Mortgages have to be paid, food has to be put on the table, clothes have to be washed and cleaned and life has to go on no matter the circumstance which can't be easy.

    I too would find it very hard to assoc with him if he was my son, I deffo would not be holding his hand in court or he leaning on me. I just wouldn't trust him. In the case of Boy B not only been part of the murder but lied & lied & inc to protect Boy A to exonerate him, has lost all trusts. I would feel he was winding me too. Don't know about going to see him in detention but I would make it clear the winding died a death the day he was invol in Ana's death. Everything would be on my terms from then on. U could not be true to yourself if you did otherwise and I would want a full account of what he did, just to let him know where I was at. Boy B thinks he is too smarts for everyone and I would imagine he is still in that territory.


    As for Boy A parents, its incomprehensible how one could have any friendship with someone capable of such evil. I would feel dirty after it. He not only planned and executed the deed but carried on after it as if nothing happened. He spend 30 min battering a naive girl to death and then sexually assaulted her and he was only 13. You couldn't turn your back to someone so evil. I would feel I was letting Ana down by assoc. His crime can't be ever forgiven. He seems to have a generous forgiving grandfather who bailed him out for Christmas to where he lived which was outside the Lexlip-Lucan area.

    It's a horrible thing for any family to experience. I thought the family of Jastine Valdez's killer did it with remarkable respect and sympathy for their son's victim.

    I think the parents in this case are right to stand by their kids. They certainly shouldn't be complicit in the attempted cover up by their sons that they appear to have been, but standing by them is another matter.

    Regardless of everything, these are still kids. God only knows what got in to them or prompted them to do what they did. This killing will define those boys forever, but the parents are right to be there for their kids and do everything possible in aiding their reform. They still have that responsibility to the their children


  • #4504
    mrjoneill
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 536 ✭✭✭mrjoneill


    LiamoSail wrote: »
    It's a horrible thing for any family to experience. I thought the family of Jastine Valdez's killer did it with remarkable respect and sympathy for their son's victim.

    I think the parents in this case are right to stand by their kids. They certainly shouldn't be complicit in the attempted cover up by their sons that they appear to have been, but standing by them is another matter.

    Regardless of everything, these are still kids. God only knows what got in to them or prompted them to do what they did. This killing will define those boys forever, but the parents are right to be there for their kids and do everything possible in aiding their reform. They still have that responsibility to the their children
    What is standing by them, is it saying its ok what they did. Is unconditional love saying that. Quite honest I could never get my head around dealing with the perpetrator of such a criminal act esp what Boy A did. I see it different than gun crime typical of teenagers in the US, while it all ends up with the loss of life but shooting has a more remote aspect to it. Where someone kills one with beating them to death over a prolonged period after obv a pre-planning they cant be but sadistic and in this case a totally innocent naive victim.


  • #4505
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    You’d have to wonder were either of them honest with their parents. From here it looks like B at least continued to lie to them. Possibly leading to his fathers outburst.

    It’s probably naive to think both sets didn’t ask them for the truth and what happened at some point. They both probably continued to lie.
    I’m not sure i could stand by either of them in the court as a parent. I don’t have kids though.


  • #4506
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,692 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Many many posts this thread wish violence against these boys and their family. There have already been attacks on their family's. That is why they are anonymous. Few cases bring out the mob like this one so no, not every defendant needs to be anonymous. The ironic thing is, we would know who they were and be able to protect ourselves if it were not for the vigilantes who want to "protect" us

    Yeah so the mob mentality as endangered everyone :rolleyes:

    Nothing to do with the fact that these animals by their own actions pose a threat.


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  • #4507
    Hannibal_Smith
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators, Paid Member Posts: 7,692 Mod ✭✭✭✭Hannibal_Smith


    mrjoneill wrote: »
    What is standing by them, is it saying its ok what they did. Is unconditional love saying that. Quite honest I could never get my head around dealing with the perpetrator of such a criminal act esp what Boy A did. I see it different than gun crime typical of teenagers in the US, while it all ends up with the loss of life but shooting has a more remote aspect to it. Where someone kills one with beating them to death over a prolonged period after obv a pre-planning they cant be but sadistic and in this case a totally innocent naive victim.

    I think it's one of those situations where you don't know what you'd do unless you're there. I couldn't imagine my son leaning on my shoulder for support and me rejecting him. For me to do that I have to imagine he did something as atrociously wrong as this. I can't even do that. Not that I think he can do no wrong but my brain or imagination can't even go there.


  • #4508
    Dirkziggler
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 948 ✭✭✭Dirkziggler


    When is the sentencing date?


  • #4509
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    pablo128 wrote: »
    He was cute enough to wait until the judge had left the court before he started mouthing off. At best he's an insensitive muppet. He knew the Kriegels were sitting there.

    He sees the Kriegels as his enemies.
    In his head, their dead daughter is causing him all this inconvenience. And really, if she hadn’t been such a slut and a weirdo, she’d still be alive today.


  • #4510
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Seems to me he was probably known to gardai hence their address being on pulse. And the way he blanked them when the mother and son were at the door.
    Would also help explain his outburst.


  • #4511
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    splinter65 wrote: »
    He sees the Kriegels as his enemies.
    In his head, their dead daughter is causing him all this inconvenience.
    And really, if she hadn’t been such a slut and a weirdo, she’d still be alive today.

    Thats very unfair. He is an innocent man and loving father who has had his son taken from him for god knows how many years. His outburst was raw emotion the levels of which you or I will never understand thankfully. Yes the Kriegels were there to see it but they are so strong, it would have been nothing to them and they probably understand the emotions he was feeling better than you think


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  • #4512
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    Seems to me he was probably known to gardai hence their address being on pulse. And the way he blanked them when the mother and son were at the door.
    Would also help explain his outburst.

    I dont know much about pulse. How does one end up on it? Is there any innocent way to be put on it? Say having been burgled for example?


  • #4513
    Dirkziggler
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 948 ✭✭✭Dirkziggler


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I dont know much about pulse. How does one end up on it? Is there any innocent way to be put on it? Say having been burgled for example?

    Any interactions with AGS is logged on Pulse. If you are a victim in a crime, applying for passport, everyone has a pulse ID


  • #4514
    dudara
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 33,518 ✭✭✭✭dudara


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    I dont know much about pulse. How does one end up on it? Is there any innocent way to be put on it? Say having been burgled for example?

    Most interactions with the Gardaí results in a Pulse record. So yes, it’s entirely possible to have one for completely innocent reasons. It doesn’t automatically mean that you are “known to Gardaí” as we like to say in ireland.


  • #4515
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Dirkziggler wrote: »
    Any interactions with AGS is logged on Pulse. If you are a victim in a crime, applying for passport, everyone has a pulse ID

    Wasn’t aware of that. My apologies about the assumption on the father.


  • #4516
    corpusvile
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31 ✭corpusvile


    CollyFlower wrote: »
    After all they did they just seemed to carry on as normal, for like 10 days, I think it was 10 days after Ana was found that they were charged.

    "act normal like nothing happened"
    Seems those helpful rules from their homework club came in handy for them.


  • #4517
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,409 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    Kidchameleon wrote: »
    Thats very unfair. He is an innocent man and loving father who has had his son taken from him for god knows how many years. His outburst was raw emotion the levels of which you or I will never understand thankfully. Yes the Kriegels were there to see it but they are so strong, it would have been nothing to them and they probably understand the emotions he was feeling better than you think

    It would have been nothing to them ? Are you actually series ? How would you know how the Kriegels feel or what upsets them . Have some little grain of empathy. How disrespectful to second guess a grieving families emotions


  • #4518
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    LiamoSail wrote: »
    It's a horrible thing for any family to experience. I thought the family of Jastine Valdez's killer did it with remarkable respect and sympathy for their son's victim.

    I think the parents in this case are right to stand by their kids. They certainly shouldn't be complicit in the attempted cover up by their sons that they appear to have been, but standing by them is another matter.

    Regardless of everything, these are still kids. God only knows what got in to them or prompted them to do what they did. This killing will define those boys forever, but the parents are right to be there for their kids and do everything possible in aiding their reform. They still have that responsibility to the their children

    The 16 year old boy Aaron Campbell found guilty in April of abducting raping and murdering a 6 year old girl on the island of Bhute last year was supported by his mother every day in court.
    She even met his demand that she buy him a tartan suit to wear.
    He too protested his innocence ferociously AND not only testified on his own behalf in the witness box but blamed a totally innocent person naming her and pointing her out in court in a slanderous allegation.
    His mother totally accepted the decision of the jury and he has since admitted his guilt in totality.
    She has not suffered any vigilantism and has returned to the tiny island to live in close proximity to the family of his victim.
    Despite originally telling the media that she wouldn’t disown him, the prison where he’s being held has said that he has had no visitors since he arrived.


  • #4519
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    corpusvile wrote: »
    "act normal like nothing happened"
    Seems those helpful rules from their homework club came in handy for them.

    It wasn’t a homework club, it was a satanic club they set up. Best to stick to the facts.


  • #4520
    corpusvile
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31 ✭corpusvile


    splinter65 wrote: »
    It wasn’t a homework club, it was a satanic club they set up. Best to stick to the facts.

    I was attempting flippancy which doesn't always carry over well on the internet so my apologies.

    According to Boy B it was a homework club which his schoolmates verified according to the IT article. A homework club with decidedly weird sounding rules re acting normally as if nothing happened but a homework club nonetheless with the Satanic thing just to dissuade others from joining. (As homework clubs are apparently very popular with today's teenagers with queues of prospective members probably out the door.)

    To clarify I don't believe Satanism or the occult had anything to do with Ana's murder but I'd also take the homework club explanation with a grain of salt even if it was verified by other teens.


  • #4521
    splinter65
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    corpusvile wrote: »
    I was attempting flippancy which doesn't always carry over well on the internet so my apologies.

    According to Boy B it was a homework club which his schoolmates verified according to the IT article. A homework club with decidedly weird sounding rules re acting normally as if nothing happened but a homework club nonetheless with the Satanic thing just to dissuade others from joining. (As homework clubs are apparently very popular with today's teenagers with queues of prospective members probably out the door.)

    To clarify I don't believe Satanism or the occult had anything to do with Ana's murder but I'd also take the homework club explanation with a grain of salt even if it was verified by other teens.

    Yes my apologies I can see that now. I didn’t mean to criticize you at all.
    We all messed about in my day with ouija boards and sat around holding hands having seances trying to call spirits from the other side.
    Scared the **** out of ourselves too.


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  • #4522
    corpusvile
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 31 ✭corpusvile


    Not at all it's all good, but I found their demeanours combined with these rules rather coincidental. I don't think the full story of this horrific murder will come out for several years personally in bits & pieces but I've a feeling there's more to this case overall than we know, at present. Not necessarily significantly more but just other aspects that haven't come to light yet.


  • #4523
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Something I have thought about is they must have approached her or spoken to her prior to B knocking into her. Then the video and pic on her phone of her tied to a chair and blindfolded. There’s a connection between those two things I’d say. Could they have put her up to it?


  • #4524
    Gerianam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 124 ✭✭Gerianam


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    Something I have thought about is they must have approached her or spoken to her prior to B knocking into her. Then the video and pic on her phone of her tied to a chair and blindfolded. There’s a connection between those two things I’d say. Could they have put her up to it?

    That was some kind of silly game with her cousin - damsel in distress to see who would rescue them..


  • #4525
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Gerianam wrote: »
    That was some kind of silly game with her cousin - damsel in distress to see who would rescue them..

    That’s what she told her mam. Sure. But she doesn’t come across as that kind of kid despite being so lonely and isolated. Can’t help think there’s a link. But as the other poster said, there’s a whole lot we will just never know. The mind will fill in the blanks with its own theories. This one has haunted me since the verdict and reading all the lengthy court reports.


  • #4526
    Penn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 37,247 ✭✭✭✭Penn


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    Something I have thought about is they must have approached her or spoken to her prior to B knocking into her. Then the video and pic on her phone of her tied to a chair and blindfolded. There’s a connection between those two things I’d say. Could they have put her up to it?

    Sometimes things have very simple answers and are irrelevant even when it appears there might be some link. I'm sure detectives and investigators looked into that video and other stuff like that thoroughly and if they felt there was any just reason for including it in the trial, they would have.


  • #4527
    Stop moaning ffs
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 4,850 ✭✭✭Stop moaning ffs


    Would you say her parents will do the late late or something after the sentencing? I can kinda see that happening somehow


  • #4528
    mattser
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 2,425 ✭✭✭mattser


    The judge was spot on. Too many online idiots.


  • #4529
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    Omackeral wrote: »
    Wrong. It's because they're underage.

    Eh no im not wrong. They will have their id's protected into adulthood


  • #4530
    Kidchameleon
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,482 ✭✭✭Kidchameleon


    iamwhoiam wrote: »
    It would have been nothing to them ? Are you actually series ? How would you know how the Kriegels feel or what upsets them . Have some little grain of empathy. How disrespectful to second guess a grieving families emotions

    I have nothing but respect & sympathy for the Kriegels and I am assuming they would have dealth with B's fathers outburst like water off a ducks back. Do I know that for sure? Of course not but judgeing by the strength and dignity they have shown throughout, I think it is safe to assume. It is also possible that B's father has since given them his apologies. We dont know & it is unfair to judge him.


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  • #4531
    El_Bee
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 933 ✭✭✭El_Bee


    Stop moaning ffs wrote: »
    Would you say her parents will do the late late or something after the sentencing? I can kinda see that happening somehow


    Well the Late Late will definitely reach out to them, they had the parents of that boy who was choked to death a few years back didn't they? His killer got some crappy sentence then went off to live in England iirc.


This discussion has been closed.
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