Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

TheBoyConor · 20-06-2019 01:13PM

I can't get my head around how the parents of boys a and b could brazenly maintain that they were innocent despite the overwhelmingly convincing and damning evidence against them.
Personnally, I think I would like to see those family members also punished up to and including imprisonment for this, for two reasons. Firstly trying to pervert the course of justice by denying the actions of their sons and secondly for doing/not doing whatever it was as parents that make these boys likely to do something. As I see it their actions have basically made them accomplices or enablers of sorts.
I accept that imprisoning the family members of someone who commits a horrible crime might be considered harsh but in such a horrible case as this it is a pity it cannot be done as they have a certain level of cuplability. Sure one of them even washed a blood sodden hoodie! How the hell did they think that was right? I think it was an effort to destroy evidence.

razorblunt · 20-06-2019 01:13PM

Penn wrote: »

I remember years ago, either during or after the Raoul Moat manhunt, either The Sun or The Mirror had a story about Moat which included a photo of him at about 6 months old. The photo of this 6-month old smiling child included the caption "...with fist already clenched in anger..." because his hand was closed.

If only the parents had noticed he looked rough at that young age...

Nothing has yet to beat the "with sadness in his eyes" from Kay Burley..

Boom_Bap · 20-06-2019 01:16PM

Prominent_Dawg wrote: »

Anonymity gives the public and media the opportunity to speculate, which makes every great story, the family couldn't even keep their mouth closed in court, I can see a million euro book deal down the road "Boy B".

I wonder how many revisions of the book there will be.

Patrick2010 · 20-06-2019 01:19PM

TheBoyConor wrote: »

I can't get my head around how the parents of boys a and b could brazenly maintain that they were innocent despite the overwhelmingly convincing and damning evidence against them.
Personnally, I think I would like to see those family members also punished up to and including imprisonment for this, for two reasons. Firstly trying to pervert the course of justice by denying the actions of their sons and secondly for doing/not doing whatever it was as parents that make these boys likely to do something. As I see it their actions have basically made them accomplices or enablers of sorts.
I accept that imprisoning the family members of someone who commits a horrible crime might be considered harsh but in such a horrible case as this it is a pity it cannot be done as they have a certain level of cuplability. Sure one of them even washed a blood sodden hoodie! How the hell did they think that was right? I think it was an effort to destroy evidence.

Wasn't it boy As mother that washed his clothes twice?

CityRoad · 20-06-2019 01:20PM

fryup wrote: »

@ cityroad....i take it you're from the area?

if so...did these kids have a reputation as bad brats?

Strazdas wrote: »

It's very likely that Ana was naive and innocent, despite looking older. A more streetwise girl would have smelled a rat when that yoke came looking for her and especially having to walk miles to a deserted location.

Yes she was, that was not the question, the question was were they known to be brats/bullies. I mention it because Ana's mother was also worried when she found out who she left with.

Grayson · 20-06-2019 01:20PM

razorblunt wrote: »

Nothing has yet to beat the "with sadness in his eyes" from Kay Burley..

"Five murders, in six weeks - do you think if you'd had a better sex life he wouldn't have done them?"

That's still her best.

Strazdas · 20-06-2019 01:21PM

captbarnacles wrote: »

I guess sheer happiness at being called for by a peer and asked to come out with them overrode any concerns she had. Hard to take that bit.

Absolutely. A more streetwise girl may have been far more suspicious, especially having to walk miles to an abandoned house in the middle of nowhere ("why can't he meet me here in the park?" etc)

It's very likely A and B targeted Ana precisely because they saw her as being naive and gullible.

BarryD2 · 20-06-2019 01:22PM

Apparently the school can't even be named now. How on earth would naming the school facilitate the identification of the convicted? Of course you can say, why should the school be named - nothing to do with them? Unless you consider the bullying?

However I still think the efforts to limit public commentary in this area is a little concerning.

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 20-06-2019 01:22PM

MaccaTacca wrote: »

<snipped>

What exactly is the point of this post?

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 20-06-2019 01:23PM

Strazdas wrote: »

Absolutely. A more streetwise girl may have been far more suspicious, especially having to walk miles to an abandoned house in the middle of nowhere ("why can't he meet me here in the park?" etc)

It's very likely A and B targeted Ana precisely because they saw her as being naive and gullible.

Sadly that seems to be the case.

Sardonicat · 20-06-2019 01:28PM

BarryD2 wrote: »

Apparently the school can't even be named now. How on earth would naming the school facilitate the identification of the convicted? Of course you can say, why should the school be named - nothing to do with them? Unless you consider the bullying?

However I still think the efforts to limit public commentary in this area is a little concerning.

I imagine not publishing the name of the school would be to protect the pupils from being approached by less savoury elements of the press for comment. A bit pointless really because if you have any knowledge of the area it's not hard to figure out which school it is. I lived in Leixlip 10 years ago and have been able to work it out very easily just from the reporting of the case.

tayto lover · 20-06-2019 01:30PM

Nerdlingr wrote: »

None of that means a thing/or comes to light if he doesnt talk.
They only have him on CCTV and an eye witness who saw him. Thats it.
Far far far from a murder conviction. Miles away.

We’ll have to agree to differ then.
The miles away bit I forgot to include. Why not outside her home or in anywhere there might be others not intent on harming Ana.
I would have convicted him on what I posted if I was on a jury. Maybe it’s a blessing i wasn’t and that it didn’t come to that.t
He’s as guilty as sin as we all know now anyway.

CityRoad · 20-06-2019 01:32PM

Ace Attorney wrote: »

Jesus, if it was boy a or b involved in that serious assault, that school needs to answer some questions about its running

They were. Boy A and B are not very pleasant individuals. If the child I know had a different as personality, it could have been them. It's been a very sobering and upsetting time.

80sChild · 20-06-2019 01:35PM

BarryD2 wrote: »

Apparently the school can't even be named now. How on earth would naming the school facilitate the identification of the convicted? Of course you can say, why should the school be named - nothing to do with them? Unless you consider the bullying?

However I still think the efforts to limit public commentary in this area is a little concerning.

Ridiculous, all the articles from the period she was missing not yet found state her school - have all newspapers worked overnight to purge these? They were still there yesterday.

EDIT: There are tweets still up with people @'ing the school with questions around their bullying policy. You cannot unring a bell.

Apollinaris · 20-06-2019 01:36PM

Strazdas wrote: »

Absolutely. A more streetwise girl may have been far more suspicious, especially having to walk miles to an abandoned house in the middle of nowhere ("why can't he meet me here in the park?" etc)

It's very likely A and B targeted Ana precisely because they saw her as being naive and gullible.

Your comment is beyond ridiculous and victim blaming, shame on you. It was a 14 yo girl for crying out loud, what kind of life experience did she have?

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 20-06-2019 01:37PM

Apollinaris wrote: »

Your comment is beyond ridiculous and victim blaming, shame on you. It was a 14 yo girl for crying out loud, what kind of life experience did she have?

No one's 'victim blaming'. What a stupid comment.

20-06-2019 01:37PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

I imagine not publishing the name of the school would be to protect the pupils from being approached by less savoury elements of the press for comment. A bit pointless really because if you have any knowledge of the area it's not hard to figure out which school it is. I lived in Leixlip 10 years ago and have been able to work it out very easily just from the reporting of the case.

Sure the school posted about Ana (their 1st year pupil) being missing.

SirGerryAdams · 20-06-2019 01:38PM

This nonsense about not publishing it is pointless.

Anyone who wants to find out the identity will find it.

20-06-2019 01:40PM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Sure the school posted about Ana (their 1st year pupil) being missing.

And it’s still on their fb page!

Strazdas · 20-06-2019 01:40PM

Apollinaris wrote: »

Your comment is beyond ridiculous and victim blaming, shame on you. It was a 14 yo girl for crying out loud, what kind of life experience did she have?

Victim blaming? I'm sticking up for poor Ana and condemning those two scumbags out of hand. There would be nothing wrong with Ana being innocent. I'm saying they deliberately went after her because they perceived her to be different. Ana did nothing wrong and everything they did was wrong - a good person vs two horrible ones.

Sardonicat · 20-06-2019 01:42PM

Strawberry Milkshake wrote: »

Sure the school posted about Ana (their 1st year pupil) being missing.

Yup, but my point is, even without public naming of the school anyone with knowledge of the area could figure it out anyway. Just like anyone living in the area already knows who these 2 boys are.

Franz Von Peppercorn II · 20-06-2019 01:44PM

CityRoad wrote: »

An Eimear Cotter article on the 20 May 2019 Irish Independent talks about the DNA evidence and the unknown DNA, I cannot post a link because I am new.

I do not know what the parents of Boy A did, my friend did not tell me, and the local parents wanted this to be brought to court, we only discussed the case in how it related to her child. Her child was one of their targets in the first half of the year.

If this third set of DNA indicates a third person, the boys are still lying.

Here it is.

https://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/ana-kriegel-murder-trial-dna-profile-from-one-of-accused-boys-found-on-clothes-at-scene-38128930.html

The new dna was not traceable but that doesn’t mean it was a different person to who we already know.

retro:electro · 20-06-2019 01:45PM

I don’t think she was naïve to not know she was going to be led to her death and battered so brutally by the guy she liked. I don’t like when people say “if only she was wiser”, because however well intended that comment may be, (and I know all the comments here are) it takes a little portion of the blame from the two delinquents who murdered her and places it on her shoulders for not being street wise enough. All over the country you have boys and girls knocking into each other and teens “going out for a minute” and it’s extremely rare that anything fatal ever comes of these instances. She was probably thinking this is what normal people do, and so happy to have someone call for her that she didn’t think twice about any danger. And Jesus why would she? It’s not something anyone would envision, naive or not. What happened to her isn’t a reflection of her nativity, rather a reflection on how disturbed and fcuked up the two boys are.

80sChild · 20-06-2019 01:45PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

Yup, but my point is, even without public naming of the school anyone with knowledge of the area could figure it out anyway. Just like anyone living in the area already knows who these 2 boys are.

Or anyone who knows anyone (who knows anyone else) who goes to said school. Dogs in street know the names at this point. Ireland is too damn small to keep a lid on something like this.

joe40 · 20-06-2019 01:47PM

Lefty Bicek wrote: »

We need to pause before referencing that story...

https://www.pressgazette.co.uk/a-tale-told-too-much-the-paediatrician-vigilantes/

The story as quoted is accurate, there was "paedo" graffiti daubed on a paediatrician house.
Later exaggerations about beatings etc are false.

The point about mob/vigilante violence is still valid, mistakes can and are made.

Ace Attorney · 20-06-2019 01:47PM

CityRoad wrote: »

They were. Boy A and B are not very pleasant individuals. If the child I know had a different as personality, it could have been them. It's been a very sobering and upsetting time.

Thats seriously ****ed up then, was it phyiscal in nature or worse....

Also i cant help think the school didnt pursue bc it didn't want trouble

Franz Von Peppercorn II · 20-06-2019 01:48PM

Omackeral wrote: »

Read this and you'll get your answer

Self-styled vigilantes attacked the home of a hospital paediatrician after apparently confusing her professional title with the word "paedophile", it emerged yesterday.
Dr Yvette Cloete, a specialist registrar in paediatric medicine at the Royal Gwent hospital in Newport, was forced to flee her house after vandals daubed it with graffiti in the middle of the night.

The word "paedo" was written across the front porch and door of the house she shared with her brother in the village of St Brides, south Wales.

This piece describes that as exaggerated.

https://www.pressgazette.co.uk/a-tale-told-too-much-the-paediatrician-vigilantes/

c68zapdsm5i1ru · 20-06-2019 01:48PM

retro:electro wrote: »

I don’t think she was naïve to not know she was going to be led to her death and battered so brutally by the guy she liked. I don’t like when people say “if only she was wiser”, because however well intended that comment may be, it takes a little portion of the blame from the two delinquents who murdered her and places it on her shoulders for not being street wise enough. All over the country you have boys and girls knocking into each other and teens “going out for a minute” and it’s extremely rare that anything fatal ever comes of these instances. She was probably thinking this is what normal people do, and so happy to have someone call for her that she didn’t think twice about any danger. What happened to her isn’t a reflection of her nativity, rather a reflection on how disturbed and fcuked up the two boys are.

I don't think anyone has said otherwise. We are actually saying that the two boys made a calculated decision to target Ana because she wasn't streetwise and savvy. That reflects on them, not on her. It in no way takes 'a little portion of the blame from them'.

Are you seriously saying that if someone is a little innocent or naive that it might be partly their fault if they are taken advantage of? It would never have crossed my mind to think such a thing.

20-06-2019 01:49PM

Sardonicat wrote: »

Yup, but my point is, even without public naming of the school anyone with knowledge of the area could figure it out anyway. Just like anyone living in the area already knows who these 2 boys are.

Just officially name them. They haven’t been sentenced yet and even if emotions die down for a few weeks everything will be full on again when that happens. Least then no innocent kids will be tarnished with being them as is happening now.

Neyite · 20-06-2019 01:50PM

veryangryman wrote: »

Without looking for the pictures, can anyone who has seen them confirm whether they look rough?

In the picture I saw, assuming that it was the correct boys, no they didn't. They looked like they could be your son. Or mine. They weren't scruffy or tough looking, just regular boys. No more than the pictures of Venables and Thompson, your instinctive reaction is that they ARE just kids and your mind doesn't compute that they could be capable of such horror.

I don't think that they should be named. They are locked up and any names or pictures being bandied about will likely result in either any potential siblings of the boys being targeted and bullied, or another innocent kid getting targeted mistakenly.

Sharing the pictures makes no odds either. In a year or so their appearances will change and by the time they reach 18 may look very different to the kids they were starting their prison sentence. If you had a picture of 13yo Larry Murphy, you'd not recognise him if you saw him in the street.

Now, I'm less sure about anonymity when they reach 18 or on release whenever that will be. I understand why it's necessary now but I wonder is it a kind of a safety net for teens now to do what they like as a juvenile knowing that their identity will forever be protected after they come of age. I'm not sure I'm comfortable with that either...

Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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