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Ana Kriegel - Boys A & B found guilty [Mod: Do NOT post identifying information]

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Comments

  • #2192
    screamer
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,194 ✭✭✭screamer


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    Two wrongs don’t make a right.

    As far as we know they came from good families and their parents don’t deserve to be punished for their sons crimes.

    No in this case two wrongs made a rape and a murder, but sure protect everyone related to them..... give me a break


  • #2193
    iamwhoiam
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,409 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    To what end? And it is a question I grapple with myself at the moment.

    What would we (society) be hoping to achieve in doing so?

    Protecting our daughters and grandchildren maybe ?


  • #2194
    omega man
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,422 ✭✭✭omega man


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    Exactly and that’s why I completely disagree with naming them on social media.

    Revenge helps no one, the Kriegels least of all.

    This. They may also have siblings who’d be possibly targeted also.


  • #2195
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,685 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    To what end? And it is a question I grapple with myself at the moment.

    What would we (society) be hoping to achieve in doing so?

    Knowing who they are? The most recent case involving a child murder had his name published after release as part of an exclusion order on where he could go


  • #2196
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    screamer wrote: »
    Ana’s family did nothing wrong either, it hadn’t spared them this nightmare, and all the publicity that they’ve had to endure. I have zero sympathy for their families you know your kids and you know well when they’re lying. After everything they did to Ana, they could at least have had the balls and decency to admit it, and I’m sorry but that’s on their parents.

    NO YOU DO NOT.

    You might for instance consult the testimony of, I don't know, Ana's mother who learned from strangers that her own daughter, with home she had a very good and communicative relationship that certain issues were arising.

    It might make you as a some banal internet rando feel better to take such a heartless pathetic approach. It doesn't make it true.


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  • #2197
    Boom_Bap
    Moderators, Music Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,740 Mod ✭✭✭✭Boom_Bap


    I don't care what the parents of Boy A and Boy B done before that day or how they raised their children.
    But I do want to know what they done in the aftermath of the event and the days leading up to Ana being found and between the interviews.
    They need to tell their truth or be investigated.

    Although them 2 f*ckin low life cretins have got the proper verdict, this case should not be closed and the truth of everything should be discovered.


  • #2198
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    Stheno wrote: »
    Knowing who they are? The most recent case involving a child murder had his name published after release as part of an exclusion order on where he could go

    A child murderer, or a child who committed a murder?


  • #2199
    Happy4all
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,089 ✭✭✭Happy4all


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    Two wrongs don’t make a right.

    As far as we know they came from good families and their parents don’t deserve to be punished for their sons crimes.

    Boy B's father sounds classy. While the parents of Ana where dealing with the verdict he was roaring at the Gardai that they were scumbag pr1icks


  • #2200
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    screamer wrote: »
    No in this case two wrongs made a rape and a murder, but sure protect everyone related to them..... give me a break

    You’re assuming the families were in on it but there is absolutely nothing to suggest that is the case.

    I’ll say it again - let go of the emotion and desire for revenge for a moment and think clearly.

    Would you expect to be punished for your children’s wrong doing? Of course not nor should you.


  • #2201
    brendanwalsh
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 991 ✭✭✭brendanwalsh


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    brendanwalsh wrote: »
    Thank everyone of ye who is naming these boys online and posting pics.

    The country needs to know and be protected from these animals.

    Rip ana, gone too soon from a world too cruel.

    How do you know the names and faces in the photos are in fact A and B?

    There Is enough people posting and people from the area it happened who are posting confirming it's them


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  • #2202
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    screamer wrote: »
    No it’s being done because the law is an ass. I don’t have any revenge fantasies but I want to know if there’s a monster in my neighborhood so that I can keep my kids and family well away from them. Self protection it’s the most basic human trait.

    So its not a revenge fantasy... its a defender fantasy.

    Just as destructive and equally moronic.


  • #2203
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    brendanwalsh wrote: »
    There Is enough people posting and people from the area it happened who are posting confirming it's them

    Are there honestly people so dumb, so dim, so dull as to not to have ever heard of the many, multiple miscarriages of justice based on eye witness testimony?

    Are we to forever have to tolerate this ignorant grunts as equally valid opinions?


  • #2204
    nehemiah
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 128 ✭✭nehemiah


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    To what end? And it is a question I grapple with myself at the moment.

    What would we (society) be hoping to achieve in doing so?

    Very true. On the one hand, there is the view that justice should be seen to be done in public. There’s also the view that once they reach 18 they should be no longer be protected by the Children’s Act. And third...the revenge fantasies.

    But on the other hand if Thompson and Venables are anything to go by then the State would likely create (expensive) aliases for them, which people would hate of course. It could also lead to a risk to the safety of their families, including younger siblings. And of course...the revenge fantasies.


  • #2205
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    brendanwalsh wrote: »
    There Is enough people posting and people from the area it happened who are posting confirming it's them

    Can you really be sure they aren’t just jumping on the bandwagon like you have done yourself?


  • #2206
    Igotadose
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 15,460 ✭✭✭✭Igotadose


    screamer wrote: »
    Ana’s family did nothing wrong either, it hadn’t spared them this nightmare, and all the publicity that they’ve had to endure. I have zero sympathy for their families you know your kids and you know well when they’re lying. After everything they did to Ana, they could at least have had the balls and decency to admit it, and I’m sorry but that’s on their parents.

    There is absolutely ZERO way these kids didn't give off indications of their behavior. Their parents ignored/minimized/buried their heads in the sand, and played the 'we're shocked I tell you, SHOCKED' at their behavior.


  • #2207
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    Happy4all wrote: »
    Boy B's father sounds classy. While the parents of Ana where dealing with the verdict he was roaring at the Gardai that they were scumbag pr1icks

    I hadn't realized this was a dating competition?

    A desperate man, who believed in his sons innocence in respect of a horrific crime lashed out in the very seconds following a contrary verdict. String him from the nearest lampost.


  • #2208
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,685 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    A child murderer, or a child who committed a murder?

    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/irish-news/i-can-relax-now-and-not-be-nervous-that-i-would-see-him-mum-after-sons-killer-banned-from-town-35711934.html

    Darren Goodwin who as a 15 year old murdered a 14 year old.

    He was actually named during his trial as a 16 year old in 2004


  • #2209
    Boom_Bap
    Moderators, Music Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 25,740 Mod ✭✭✭✭Boom_Bap


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    I hadn't realized this was a dating competition?

    A desperate man, who believed in his sons innocence in respect of a horrific crime lashed out in the very seconds following a contrary verdict. String him from the nearest lampost.

    That's what I'd love to be the truth. But I personally am certain that it's not the truth.


  • #2210
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    AudreyHepburn wrote: »
    You’re assuming the families were in on it but there is absolutely nothing to suggest that is the case.

    I’ll say it again - let go of the emotion and desire for revenge for a moment and think clearly.

    Would you expect to be punished for your children’s wrong doing? Of course not nor should you.

    Nothing to be gained from losing the run of yourself and craving revenge at all.
    The courts will deal with the guilty.
    These boys will be spend many years in detention and rightly so,


  • #2211
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    Stheno wrote: »
    https://www.google.com/amp/s/amp.independent.ie/irish-news/i-can-relax-now-and-not-be-nervous-that-i-would-see-him-mum-after-sons-killer-banned-from-town-35711934.html

    Darren Goodwin who as a 15 year old murdered a 14 year old.

    He was actually named during his trial as a 16 year old in 2004

    As a Laois man who was 15 at the time of the murder, I remember it well. I remember being coddled and worried over. I remember how people feared Goodwin. I remember too how we changed our laws in the wake.


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  • #2212
    AudreyHepburn
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 5,673 ✭✭✭AudreyHepburn


    Happy4all wrote: »
    Boy B's father sounds classy. While the parents of Ana where dealing with the verdict he was roaring at the Gardai that they were scumbag pr1icks

    Or maybe he, like I imagine the vast majority of parents were they in his shoes, doesn’t want to believe his son is the evil little thug he’s been shown to be?

    I actually find his reaction understandable if poorly timed. He could and probably should have waited until he was outside the court to start ranting.


  • #2213
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,685 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    As a Laois man who was 15 at the time of the murder, I remember it well. I remember being coddled and worried over. I remember how people feared Goodwin. I remember too how we changed our laws in the wake.

    The laws around naming children? Were they not in affect from 2001? I may well be mistaken about that


  • #2214
    Sunflower 27
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,955 ✭✭✭Sunflower 27


    jobbridge4life wrote: »
    Are there honestly people so dumb, so dim, so dull as to not to have ever heard of the many, multiple miscarriages of justice based on eye witness testimony?

    Are we to forever have to tolerate this ignorant grunts as equally valid opinions?

    The boys will no longer be in school.

    Any local boy still in school is pretty safe from false accusations.


  • #2215
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    Boom_Bap wrote: »
    That's what I'd love to be the truth. But I personally am certain that it's not the truth.

    You have no right, no information and (excuse me if i'm wrong) no special powers of psychic insight, to allow you legitimately assert your personal certainties.

    The man raised a child. The man loved a child. The child stands accused of murder. For which, in the case of his child, there is no forensic evidence, and clear forensic evidence against another child.


  • #2216
    Odyssey 2005
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,051 ✭✭✭✭Odyssey 2005


    Happy4all wrote: »
    Kids these days won't leave a phone out of there hand. Strange to lose two.

    Learned a thing or two from former garda commissioners ;)


  • #2217
    Sunflower 27
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,955 ✭✭✭Sunflower 27


    Stheno wrote: »
    The laws around naming children? Were they not in affect from 2001? I may well be mistaken about that

    Not sure, but be interesting to know.


  • #2218
    tayto lover
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 56,647 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    Stheno wrote: »
    The laws around naming children? Were they not in affect from 2001? I may well be mistaken about that

    They were in even before the Children Act 2001.


  • #2219
    gozunda
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,992 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Sunflower 27 wrote: »
    For clarification, I was not saying Boy B didn't have a backpack. Not sure how you read that into it. I think he did and that was identified on CCTV.

    No didnt read into that tbh. The comment was in addition.
    Sunflower 27 wrote: »
    The question I was responding to was did Boy B bring the murder gear and my response was it's unlikely he did as he would have had to give it to A without Ana seeing, who would then have to get changed before attacking Ana. It makes no sense. I also think the mask was A's from the previous Halloween.

    Also, B is cunning. I think he knew the less he did the better. Yes, he could say he was seen with her, but beyond that there was nothing linking him to her actual attack. He got to see her brutally murdered but could still say he wasn't there as no DNA would link him.

    I believe he felt safe in that knowledge. Possibly so did his father and that explains his outburst. I'm sure B was told by his legal team that they had nothing on him directly linking him to the crime. He probably felt he had a good chance of getting off.

    Surely the gear was tested for B's DNA as well as A's and Ana's? I didnt read anywhere his DNA was on it.

    Its possible that boy b had 'gear' as well. He was observed carrying a backpack when he called for Ana. I don't believe that backpack was found tbh


  • #2220
    jobbridge4life
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,759 ✭✭✭jobbridge4life


    iamwhoiam wrote: »
    Protecting our daughters and grandchildren maybe ?

    I don't, not for a second, question that impulse. It is one I share, frankly, violently.

    I just do not for one second believe that naming these children will protect anyone. Not a single person. Not one.


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  • #2221
    Stheno
    Moderators, Business & Finance Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 51,685 Mod ✭✭✭✭Stheno


    tayto lover wrote: »
    They were in even before the Children Act 2001.

    So how is it that Darren Goodwin aged 16 was named during his murder trial in 2004 for a crime he committed aged 15?


This discussion has been closed.
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