Avengers: Endgame [ SPOILERS FROM POST 613 ]

26-04-2019 08:04PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

The infamous circular shot from the first Avengers movie was also during a climatic section of the movie. They also managed to ram in one into AoU, in the church during the final battle.

This is arguably the most forced, but it isn't by much. I'm pretty confident that if it was any other group of characters, other than female heros, then it wouldn't get more than a passing comment. Some people are just hypersensitive about these sort of nods.

I was going to point to the Ultron one too. It was shot in a (contrived yes) way to bring them together and had the small-ish principal cast but there was a reason that they were all there defending that one point.

Endgame one was that but pushed way past 11, they were a group of people with no real reason to know/find/come together on the battle field and NOT for the group shot of Avengers 1&2 but for a committee driven reason.
Most of those characters were absolutely owning it, in their battle scenes. They did not need a pandering shot.

Foxtrol · 26-04-2019 08:27PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I was going to point to the Ultron one too. It was shot in a (contrived yes) way to bring them together and had the small-ish principal cast but there was a reason that they were all there defending that one point.

Endgame one was that but pushed way past 11, they were a group of people with no real reason to know/find/come together on the battle field and NOT for the group shot of Avengers 1&2 but for a committee driven reason.
Most of those characters were absolutely owning it, in their battle scenes. They did not need a pandering shot.

They didn’t need this shot, but they didn’t need the other clearly forced group shots either. They’re all there as ‘f*ck yeah’ moments and though this one might not resonate for you, I’m sure it did for many (especially a group that has been grossly underrepresented by the MCU thus far).

I don’t disagree with most of your points, I just feel the consistency of the complaints is over the top and a sign of hypersensitivity we see from a lot of people when it comes to blockbusters these days.

AMKC · 26-04-2019 09:01PM

So seen it today. I thought it took to long to get going nearly an hour with very little happening and then the rest was ok but nothing great. It was better than Infinity War which was hardly going to be hard is it was only a below average film anyway but Id say this is an average film. A lot of it was predictable and while there was some humour there was not much.
I thought there was a lot of bits that did not link well like Nebula ended up back with them in the future even do she did not come back with your man but we did not see her coming back either. What I mean is we see her on the ad but not coming back with him so she should have not been there and then there was Cap A able to use Thors Hammer like Why and How? Also I was disappointed that Captain Marvel did not get that much to do it was obvious who was going to die. Sure I knew that from last year.

So ye just 5 out of 10 from me.

Oh ye and by the way its only 2hours 40mins long not 3hours long.

johnny_ultimate · 26-04-2019 09:05PM

I’ll just say this: this whole bloody movie is pandering :pac:

It’s an endless stream of fan service, cameos, callbacks, references, winks and nods. There’s 30-odd seconds, in a 180 minute film, where the women group up to kick some ass. Is it silly and contrived? Absolutely. It hardly makes up for the franchise’s weak record in giving its female stars their due. But it’s a film where the Hulk is a glasses-wearing nerd, there’s an alien rock monster with a New Zealand accent playing Fortnite, and a (final) completely unnecessary Stan Lee cameo (RIP to him and all, but his scenes throughout the MCU are the ultimate case of pulling the viewer right out of the story). If a few young girls or boys get a kick out of finally seeing the Marvel women team up for a couple of seconds, that’s the most important thing

Mitch Connor · 26-04-2019 09:06PM

AMKC wrote: »

So seen it today. I thought it took to long to get going nearly an hour with very little happening and then the rest was ok but nothing great. It was better than Infinity War which was hardly going to be hard is it was only a below average film anyway but Id say this is an average film. A lot of it was predictable and while there was some humour there was not much.
I thought there was a lot of bits that did not link well like Nebula ended up back with them in the future even do she did not come back with your man but we did not see her coming back either. What I mean is we see her on the ad but not coming back with him so she should have not been there and then there was Cap A able to use Thors Hammer like Why and How? Also I was disappointed that Captain Marvel did not get that much to do it was obvious who was going to die. Sure I knew that from last year.

So ye just 5 out of 10 from me.

Oh ye and by the way its only 2hours 40mins long not 3hours long.

THe nebula in the second half of the movie is the 'evil' nebula from the past. the present day one never returns (kinda sad that, hadn't thought of it.)

Cap America was worthy. that is why he could weild the hammer. It was hinted at in Age of Ultron.

ixoy · 26-04-2019 09:10PM

AMKC wrote: »

Oh ye and by the way its only 2hours 40mins long not 3hours long.

No, it's 3 hours long. I checked my watch when it began and when it ended. The running time includes the credits as the listed time always does.

SaltSweatSugar · 26-04-2019 09:15PM

Just saw it this evening, really enjoyed it but I was kind of surprised that Captain Marvel didn’t feature more heavily in it, given all the hype that there was around her when Captain Marvel was released and in the run up to this being released.

Slutmonkey57b · 26-04-2019 09:16PM

Foxtrol wrote: »

They didn’t need this shot, but they didn’t need the other clearly forced group shots either. They’re all there as ‘f*ck yeah’ moments and though this one might not resonate for you, I’m sure it did for many (especially a group that has been grossly underrepresented by the MCU thus far).

I don’t disagree with most of your points, I just feel the consistency of the complaints is over the top and a sign of hypersensitivity we see from a lot of peoplemen when it comes to blockbusters anything these days.

Slight correction for emphasis. There have been a couple of commenters mention their daughters thought the bit was cool, neither seem to have paused much to consider whether their hot take on the "misstep" is in any way proportionate.

Amazing the way superman never gets the same complaints about being unnecessary or spoiling a film due to being "overpowered" only a female captain marvel.

Also strange the way black panther doesn't get the same level of vitriol for being "token" or "pandering". Captain marvel was a great film, made a billion dollars in less than a month, had people clapping at the end of my showing but strangely there are queues of men desperately spinning "everyone knows..." tales pulled out of their arse about how captain marvel and brie larson are personally the death knell for the mcu. Some "I'm not sexist" men might not like it but the only character / actor to kill marvel buzz was Iron fist, and even her detractors can't tell me brie larson ****ed up captain marvel like Iron fist single handedly ****ed up 3 different TV series.

If there is a death knell for the mcu it is more likely to be over exposure and viewer fatigue. They did the opposite of what most people expected ; instead of falling on their arse after one film they exceeded expectations and a lot of watchers are exhausted. The Netflix shows started to see that.

paulbok · 26-04-2019 09:25PM

Midnight_EG wrote: »

If that scene makes my daughter/niece/missus feel in any way empowered and want to enjoy and love what I do most (movie-wise) well then I'm all for it. It was 15 seconds, it affected nobody personally and if it did then I'd consider carefully looking at yourself and wondering why you're offended at 10 women in the biggest movie ever made

I don't think anyone is 'offended' that there are women in that scene, just in the manner it occurred. It felt unnatural in the overall battle scene, and very deliberate and to me looked like "get all the girleens together for a shot" tokenism.

paulbok · 26-04-2019 09:33PM

Jayson Small Fur wrote: »

Yes, I know, it's not an excuse but there you have it.

That being said, I'm pretty sure I saw her doing a little bit of work on the top of the roof. She was doing her finger wavey thing and cutting a couple of the riders in half or am I imagining it?

Think she was just protecting the sanctum from debris or stray fire.

Cows Go µ · 26-04-2019 09:33PM

SaltSweatSugar wrote: »

Just saw it this evening, really enjoyed it but I was kind of surprised that Captain Marvel didn’t feature more heavily in it, given all the hype that there was around her when Captain Marvel was released and in the run up to this being released.

I think that was a deliberate to throw us off. Make us think that she was going to be the key to stopping Thanos when she was a very minor character

Foxtrol · 26-04-2019 09:36PM

paulbok wrote: »

I don't think anyone is 'offended' that there are women in that scene, just in the manner it occurred. It felt unnatural in the overall battle scene, and very deliberate and to me looked like "get all the girleens together for a shot" tokenism.

Posters felt 'offended' enough to make it the most consistent negative comment when I went through the thread and the shot only lasted for a couple of seconds.

As johnny_ultimate said, the whole movie is pandering to get audience reactions by working characters into certain situations/shots, but the number of posters who felt the need to comment on this and only this shot is interesting.

paulbok · 26-04-2019 09:41PM

ixoy wrote: »

No, it's 3 hours long. I checked my watch when it began and when it ended. The running time includes the credits as the listed time always does.

The Chinese edit of the movie is 2:40, which is what the leaked torrent is supposed to be from.......

AMKC · 26-04-2019 09:43PM

Drumpot wrote: »

Do not read spoilers if you Haven’t seen movie!!!!

Biggest cheer in cinema I was at was when
cap uses Thor’s hammer

Think I might have to see it again before judging. I enjoyed it but after 6 hours of avengers in the cinema, I’m still sweaty, only getting home and a bit
sad that iron man and the Cap are retired

Mitch Connor wrote: »

THe nebula in the second half of the movie is the 'evil' nebula from the past. the present day one never returns (kinda sad that, hadn't thought of it.)

Cap America was worthy. that is why he could weild the hammer. It was hinted at in Age of Ultron.

Awe ok.

The nebula in the second half of the movie is the 'evil' nebula from the past. the present day one never returns (kinda sad that, hadn't thought of it.)

I got that.

I think the present day one does return. She is on the ship with Gomorow is she not?

Foxtrol · 26-04-2019 09:43PM

SaltSweatSugar wrote: »

Just saw it this evening, really enjoyed it but I was kind of surprised that Captain Marvel didn’t feature more heavily in it, given all the hype that there was around her when Captain Marvel was released and in the run up to this being released.

Actually very close to how they treated Black Panther last year for Infinity War. Between the logistics of shooting the solo movies alongside and knowing what the fan reception would be like it is probably hard to put them in central roles, especially with this being the swansong for the older guys. Say if Captain Marvel was a disaster making her a central character could doom this movie too.

Duane Dibbley · 26-04-2019 09:46PM

Went to see it and loved it but didn’t get one part.

In Infinity Wars Thanos clicked his fingers to wipe out half of all living creatures.

In this movie Hulk clicked his fingers to bring the half back again

Then Tony Stark seem to be able to select who he wiped out when he clicked his fingers.

So if that was possible Why didn’t Thanos wipe out all threats to him in the first click

AMKC · 26-04-2019 09:47PM

paulbok wrote: »

The Chinese edit of the movie is 2:40, which is what the leaked torrent is supposed to be from.......

You telling me the cinema I seen the film in used a Chinese edit version of the film. It started at 3.14 finished at 5.55 but I did not stay for all the credits so maybe there was another 20 mins after that.

AMKC · 26-04-2019 09:51PM

Duane Dibbley wrote: »

Went to see it and loved it but didn’t get one part.

In Infinity Wars Thanos clicked his fingers to wipe out half of all living creatures.

In this movie Hulk clicked his fingers to bring the half back again

Then Tony Stark seem to be able to select who he wiped out when he clicked his fingers.

So if that was possible Why didn’t Thanos wipe out all threats to him in the first click

If he done that then you would have no Avengers Endgame.

I say Tony just thought wipe out all the bad guys and done that where as Thanos was only thinking of wiping out half of all living creatures. He really did not care who or what got wiped out. That or did not think about before doing it.

Slydice · 26-04-2019 10:13PM

Duane Dibbley wrote: »

Went to see it and loved it but didn’t get one part.

In Infinity Wars Thanos clicked his fingers to wipe out half of all living creatures.

In this movie Hulk clicked his fingers to bring the half back again

Then Tony Stark seem to be able to select who he wiped out when he clicked his fingers.

So if that was possible Why didn’t Thanos wipe out all threats to him in the first click

You could think of the glove (well the combined infinity stones) like a genie granting wishes.

Thanos wished to remove half of all the living
Then Thanos wished to destroy the infinity stones so no-one else could make a wish

Avengers brought a set of infinity stones back together

Hulk wished to restore the half of all the living who Thanos had removed using his wish... and Nat.

He said he also included Nat. He loves Nat. He wanted Nat back. Well, that's what he said. I mean we're not guaranteed that it didn't work. Just because we haven't seen Nat.. doesn't guarantee it didn't work. It may well have worked. She's getting a film. Maybe it worked or.. Maybe the film is a prequel. Who knows.

anyway, that's besides the point and what you asked about Thanos.

Thanos1 is dead. Thanos2 did have a similar thought as you though.

Thanos1 was all like.. I've removed half the living... Everyone will love me! .. but nah, Thor chopped off his head.

Thanos2 was all like.. hmmm maybe I should try something a little different.. try to keep a head etc.. so he said he was gonna wish to remove all .. then rebuild everything from scratch .. except to not let anyone know what he did.. you know.. so Thor wouldn't chop off his head presumably because he hadn't met Captain Marvel who would likey have just broke Thanos2 into two.. or more.. parts

titan18 · 26-04-2019 10:28PM

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Amazing the way superman never gets the same complaints about being unnecessary or spoiling a film due to being "overpowered" only a female captain marvel.

Also strange the way black panther doesn't get the same level of vitriol for being "token" or "pandering".

Superman constantly has that complaint. No stakes for most of his fights. It's not just a female thing, it's a complaint every overpowered superhero has gotten.

Black panther had the exact same token complaint. A lot of people thought it was only given Oscar consideration cos of it's tokenism. Black Panther also had the benefit of having a likeable lead and it being an excellent film.

As for that girl power scene, it was incredibly forced that took you of the action. There was no issue with it in Infinity War as it made sense, or no one is giving out about Scarlet Witch ripping Thanos apart so Thanos has to call down rockets. It's not a female vs male thing, it was an eye rolling scene that was not done for any consideration of the actual film or story, it was done just for social media/metoo bullsh1t.

AidoEirE · 26-04-2019 10:42PM

Juat back from it, thought it was brilliant. So many good points but i'll just ramble here on out.

I thought the way it went back to the old films was a laugh, the different angles and getting to see what happens after.

I liked that ant man got a lot more time in this movie rudd does play him well.

Havent decided yet how i feel about hulk/banner. I was hoping for more from him action wise, but loved everything else he was in.

Thor seemed a lot weaker i thought and the him getting fat jokes started to wear off fast.

Got goosebumps with the thanos, cap, IM, and thor fight. Just cap left against this whole army and theres a shot of him standing on this rock. Looked unbelievable and then you hear falcon, "on your left" i was like ****ing lets go!!

(The on your left, now that i think about is a nice nod to the park run when falcon and cap first meet)

Im off to see it again tomorrow so will get a better feel for it but overall really enjoyed it.

Btw, Why didnt nebula tell everyone on how to get the soul stone, as in a life a life.

One huge gripe i have is not with the film but people in the cinema.
There were a load young kids in my viewing, i thought **** here we go so sat in the middle beside some indian family.......not a peep out of the any of the kids there, they were glued to the screen.

But this ****ing family, the husband would not shut the **** up. On the phones, talking to each other in indian.

The funeral scene got to a few of the kids and i heard a few wet noses, people having a little cry. Its an emotional scene, wrecked by this couple going on talking. Totally ruined it for people, along woth many scenes.

I told them several times to stop talking as did others. If you dont want to see a film, why the **** are you there. Really grinded me.
As i left they got some verbal abuse off people who had enough of theor ****. Rightly so, i love going to the cinema and being totally engrossed in a film, has to be one of the worst when people start acting up during it.

Thats the rant over

paulbok · 26-04-2019 10:43PM

titan18 wrote: »

Superman constantly has that complaint. No stakes for most of his fights. It's not just a female thing, it's a complaint every overpowered superhero has gotten.

Black panther had the exact same token complaint. A lot of people thought it was only given Oscar consideration cos of it's tokenism. Black Panther also had the benefit of having a likeable lead and it being an excellent film.

As for that girl power scene, it was incredibly forced that took you of the action. There was no issue with it in Infinity War as it made sense, or no one is giving out about Scarlet Witch ripping Thanos apart so Thanos has to call down rockets. It's not a female vs male thing, it was an eye rolling scene that was not done for any consideration of the actual film or story, it was done just for social media/metoo bullsh1t.

Yep. In IW there was an all female scene with Scarlet Witch, Okoye and Black Widow vrs Proxima Midnight that was well done and completely fitted into the flow of the battle scene.

Paddy Cow · 26-04-2019 11:00PM

Mitch Connor wrote: »

THe nebula in the second half of the movie is the 'evil' nebula from the past. the present day one never returns (kinda sad that, hadn't thought of it.)

Cap America was worthy. that is why he could weild the hammer. It was hinted at in Age of Ultron.

The present day one shoots evil Nebula.

Paddy Cow · 26-04-2019 11:03PM

Slutmonkey57b wrote: »

Also strange the way black panther doesn't get the same level of vitriol for being "token" or "pandering".

In fairness, Black Panther has taken heaps of abuse for being an average movie, over-hyped because it has so many black cast members in it. South Park even made an episode on it.

bur · 26-04-2019 11:07PM

So when Cap goes back in time and lives out a normal life, what happened the Cap that actually belonged in that timeline, wouldn't there now be two?

Slutmonkey57b · 26-04-2019 11:12PM

titan18 wrote: »

Superman constantly has that complaint. No stakes for most of his fights. It's not just a female thing, it's a complaint every overpowered superhero has gotten.

You know the number of people making that complaint is orders of magnitude smaller, to the point its a niche, and nobody questions why superman movies get made, do they? Try and pitch a super"girl" (notice the character is called "girl") and suddenly it's tokenism.

The slow-mo scene in age of ultron is staged far worse and only exists for the fan reaction. This scene wasn't aimed at you, or internet man babies, that doesn't make it a film breaker. It's not great but it's not anywhere near as horrific as people have made it out to be.

If the problem with the scene was that it ruined the flow of the film, then the whingers wouldn't mention the feminist aspect of it. But strangely, there seems to be a problem with the very concept of such a scene existing.

Personally, I'm thrilled that black panther, wonder woman, captain marvel, star wars are starting to throw things in the faces of self important men and saying "don't like it? Look at this pile of cash from people who do. Welcome to the other side of what everyone else thinks of the overblown crap you love."

titan18 · 26-04-2019 11:16PM

paulbok wrote:

Yep. In IW there was an all female scene with Scarlet Witch, Okoye and Black Widow vrs Proxima Midnight that was well done and completely fitted into the flow of the battle scene.

Yup, all they needed was something like that again. You could have Okoye and her guard running up to Captain Marvel to help her through the area. You could have had her try and make it through herself and run into trouble and Scarlet Witch using her powers to get people across, or Pepper flying in and picking up Okoye and have Wasp on her back to help. Fair enough that they want to do it, and as meh as it is that it's committee made rather than director or story led, there are far better ways of doing it than what happened.

titan18 · 26-04-2019 11:19PM

Slutmonkey57b wrote:

You know the number of people making that complaint is orders of magnitude smaller, to the point its a niche, and nobody questions why superman movies get made, do they? Try and pitch a super"girl" (notice the character is called "girl") and suddenly it's tokenism.

No one really calls Wonder Woman tokenism tbf. Captain Marvel got abuse cos Larsen is quite unlikeable, and Disney made it worse by powering up Marvel and saying she's now the most powerful hero whereas comic book wise, she's never held a candle to the likes of Thor.

Paddy Cow · 26-04-2019 11:23PM

titan18 wrote: »

No one really calls Wonder Woman tokenism tbf. Captain Marvel got abuse cos Larsen is quite unlikeable, and Disney made it worse by powering up Marvel and saying she's now the most powerful hero whereas comic book wise, she's never held a candle to the likes of Thor.

I saw a couple of interviews with her with Thor/War Machine and Hawkeye and it was clear they don't like her. The interviews were so awkward and uncomfortable.

26-04-2019 11:24PM

bur wrote: »

So when Cap goes back in time and lives out a normal life, what happened the Cap that actually belonged in that timeline, wouldn't there now be two?

You're not thinking fourth dimensionally!

Avengers: Endgame [** SPOILERS FROM POST 613 **]

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Avengers: Endgame [ SPOILERS FROM POST 613 ]