Drew Harris armoured jeep flung into the air at Garda HQ

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2019 08:26AM

Remind me wrote: »

If the ERU are top and tailing the vehicle the PSNI officers might not be armed because ERU would be providing the protection.

A lot of what Tom Conlan said in that piece is inaccurate.

Have you a link to the proceedure?

Are the PSNI met at the border by another PSNI unit to hand over their arms or did they hide them behind a rock until they got back?

09-04-2019 08:27AM

Remind me wrote: »

If the ERU are top and tailing the vehicle the PSNI officers might not be armed because ERU would be providing the protection.

A lot of what Tom Conlan said in that piece is inaccurate.

Who said they top & tail them? And how did the psni go from being armed protection in Northern Ireland to being unarmed in the south? Did they hide the guns under a bush somewhere to pick up on the way home?
A lot of what he said is correct

McMurphy · 09-04-2019 08:28AM

Remind me wrote: »

If the ERU are top and tailing the vehicle the PSNI officers might not be armed because ERU would be providing the protection.

A lot of what Tom Conlan said in that piece is inaccurate.

Which parts out of interest?

Remind me · 09-04-2019 08:31AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Have you a link to the proceedure?

Are the PSNI met at the border by another PSNI unit to hand over their arms or did they hide them behind a rock until they got back?

If the call was made before they even departed the event that they would be going all the way to the weapons could have been secured before departure.

If visiting vips are coming in with protection who have not received permission to carry firearms AGS take custody of them before they get off the plane and return them on departure.

ERU, if it is ERU provide adequate protection for them not to have their weapons.

Not saying this happened in this case.

Remind me · 09-04-2019 08:33AM

bubblypop wrote: »

Who said they top & tail them? And how did the psni go from being armed protection in Northern Ireland to being unarmed in the south? Did they hide the guns under a bush somewhere to pick up on the way home?
A lot of what he said is correct

A lot of what he said is correct yes, but he takes a leap at automatically presuming they were armed and had no permission even though he talks about the procedures for a foreign police service. There is nothing to say this procedure was not followed if they were armed.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2019 08:37AM

Remind me wrote: »

If the call was made before they even departed the event that they would be going all the way to the weapons could have been secured before departure.

If visiting vips are coming in with protection who have not received permission to carry firearms AGS take custody of them before they get off the plane and return them on departure.

ERU, if it is ERU provide adequate protection for them not to have their weapons.

Not saying this happened in this case.

Have you a link to the proceedures?

I would find it highly unlikely that a professional team would allow him travel in a vehicle without an armed presence in the actual vehicle. That would seem most irregular and irresponsible.
What happened at the gate shows very clearly what can happen if there is separation.
Doesn't stack up to be honest.

Remind me · 09-04-2019 08:43AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Have you a link to the proceedures?

I would find it highly unlikely that a professional team would allow him travel in a vehicle without an armed presence in the actual vehicle. That would seem most irregular and irresponsible.
What happened at the gate shows very clearly what can happen if there is separation.
Doesn't stack up to be honest.

If the Taoiseach, President or any Irish VIP is abroad and AGS are not permitted to carry their weapon they could regularly be in a car with no armed security.

Likewise on incoming visits here, a VIP who has armed protection in their home state permission may not be given if Justice feel the threat assessment does not warrant it so they would have no armed protection at all.

When AGS are in the UK they do not carry firearms.

Remind me · 09-04-2019 08:44AM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

Which parts out of interest?

To say PSNI can’t carry firearms here for starters. If they have permission they can.

minikin · 09-04-2019 08:56AM

Remind me wrote: »

If the ERU are top and tailing the vehicle the PSNI officers might not be armed because ERU would be providing the protection.

A lot of what Tom Conlan said in that piece is inaccurate.

Do you seriously think they drove through the north unarmed?
Maybe they threw out their weapons at the border?

I can see the only mangled solution to this mess being that their Landrover is designated as a diplomatic vehicle, so they can act (remain armed) as if they’re effectively still in the U.K.

Very uncomfortable with the idea of armed foreign personnel in the state but this was a foreseeable consequence of appointing a former psni officer... bonkers.

Yurt2 · 09-04-2019 08:56AM

Remind me wrote: »

To say PSNI can’t carry firearms here for starters. If they have permission they can.

That's not in dispute. However, it takes more than the wave of a hand from a Garda Commissioner to allow an extra-territorial agency or police force to carry arms in the state. The weapons don't magically become legal in the state because the Garda Commissioner says so on the Newry Bypass.

McMurphy · 09-04-2019 08:57AM

Remind me wrote: »

To say PSNI can’t carry firearms here for starters. If they have permission they can.

If they've been granted permission, (even a reciprocal one) there'd be a paper trail that the justice minister would have signed off on.

Charlie Flannigan should come out and clarify this, and it could get put to bed.

That's not happening, or at least hasn't happened yet.

Why?

janfebmar · 09-04-2019 09:00AM

Harris would have had his own arms and the protection of those in the garda escort vehicle. That should have been enough. No proof the psni were armed,like the us bodyguards were for the us President. Who would want to attack a Garda anyway.
Any truth in the rumour the vehicle was stopped at the checkpoint when the Garda activated the button for the bollard, and she did not know the bollard was under the jeep Instead of in front of it?

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:01AM

minikin wrote: »

Do you seriously think they drove through the north unarmed?
Maybe they threw out their weapons at the border?

You know they were probably escorted through the North and escorting vehicles drop off at the border and the vehicle is picked up by AGS?

sjb25 · 09-04-2019 09:01AM

I know it’s unlikely but say he was attacked in say Dublin in the psni jeep and a psni officer protecting him shoots and kills the attackers where does that leave the psni officer

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:03AM

Johnny Dogs wrote: »

If they've been granted permission, (even a reciprocal one) there'd be a paper trail that the justice minister would have signed off on.

Charlie Flannigan should come out and clarify this, and it could get put to bed.

That's not happening, or at least hasn't happened yet.

Why?

Why would they release it?

It has been said correct procedures were followed.

I don’t know if they were armed or unarmed, I’m just explaining what normally happens.

If it is the case that they were armed, without permission it is a massive boo boo and should rightly be followed up and acted on.

Yurt2 · 09-04-2019 09:03AM

sjb25 wrote: »

I know it’s unlikely but say he was attacked in say Dublin in the psni jeep and a psni officer protecting him shoots and kills the attackers where does that leave the psni officer

If proper authorization procedure wasn't followed, at the centre of a political and legal sh*tstorm.

janfebmar · 09-04-2019 09:04AM

minikin wrote: »

Do you seriously think they drove through the north unarmed?
Maybe they threw out their weapons at the border?

They probably had a psni escort vehicle to the border, where the Garda escort vehicle took over. Poor form of the Garda escort vehicle not to notify hq or the Garda on security at the checkpoint outside he though.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2019 09:04AM

sjb25 wrote: »

I know it’s unlikely but say he was attacked in say Dublin in the psni jeep and a psni officer protecting him shoots and kills the attackers where does that leave the psni officer

Very easy to be separated from a lead vehicle in a city.
I would be astounded if the PSNI detail were not armed, why would they be even in the car...day trip to Dublin Zoo?

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:07AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Very easy to be separated from a lead vehicle in a city.

Not really

minikin · 09-04-2019 09:08AM

Remind me wrote: »

You know they were probably escorted through the North and escorting vehicles drop off at the border and the vehicle is picked up by AGS?

Do you seriously think close protection officers can provide such protection when unarmed? There would be no point in having them accompanying him in the car if they are unarmed. Let’s get real for a moment.

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2019 09:09AM

Remind me wrote: »

Not really

Look what happened at the gate.

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:10AM

minikin wrote: »

Do you seriously think close protection officers can provide such protection when unarmed? There would be no point in having them accompanying him in the car if they are unarmed. Let’s get real for a moment.

Christ.

He is in 1 vehicle, there is a vehicle in front and behind with armed officers. He is in a bullet proof vehicle. Surely you can see where the protection is?

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:11AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Look what happened at the gate.

Is the gates of Garda HQ a city now?

janfebmar · 09-04-2019 09:12AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Very easy to be separated from a lead vehicle in a city?

Not by properly trained police. I would say the Garda who destroyed the vehicle which was stopped or almost stopped will be transferred to some country town far away.

Odyssey 2005 · 09-04-2019 09:14AM

janfebmar wrote: »

They probably had a psni escort vehicle to the border, where the Garda escort vehicle took over. Poor form of the Garda escort vehicle not to notify hq or the Garda on security at the checkpoint outside he though.

So,lastnight it was the sentinels fault and now it's the escort vehicles occupants fault ?. Why not just blame the commissioner ?

FrancieBrady · 09-04-2019 09:15AM

Remind me wrote: »

Is the gates of Garda HQ a city now?

In a few seconds the Harris car was taken out accidentally. The Garda car might as well have been in Belfast.

Odyssey 2005 · 09-04-2019 09:16AM

janfebmar wrote: »

Not by properly trained police. I would say the Garda who destroyed the vehicle which was stopped or almost stopped will be transferred to some country town far away.

Were you there ?? Stopped or almost stopped ?. Now I'm convinced your trolling.

minikin · 09-04-2019 09:16AM

Remind me wrote: »

Christ.

He is in 1 vehicle, there is a vehicle in front and behind with armed officers. He is in a bullet proof vehicle. Surely you can see where the protection is?

Why does he need ‘unarmed’ protection officers with him so if he’s so protected by the vehicle? Protect him from boredom and loneliness?

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:16AM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

In a few seconds the Harris car was taken out accidentally. The Garda car might as well have been in Belfast.

And?

The Gardai would have been within metres of it and if it was driving down a busy road they would have been at the scene.

Remind me · 09-04-2019 09:20AM

minikin wrote: »

Why does he need ‘unarmed’ protection officers with him so if he’s so protected by the vehicle? Protect him from boredom and loneliness?

He needs someone to drive the car, unless PSNI are in for google self drive vehicles

Drew Harris armoured jeep flung into the air at Garda HQ

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