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Slot machines

2

Comments

  • #32
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    janfebmar wrote: »
    Gambling is an awful addiction for some unfortunate people, and can have devastating effects on their families.

    Now you hit the nail on the head. Its about addiction, not about fun or gaming, there is no skill. If you were ever to enter a gaming place they are full of losers who are addicted to the thrill of the spin and the sound of the ping. It sends a reward of Dopamine to the brain and which is quickly used up and its back on the machine again.

    Fiance sells lotto scratch cards in the shop, and parents are buying them for kids.

    I used to work with a sad sap, we used to "Tony the Liar". So many people used to call him it I thought his name was "Tony DeLoire". He used to tell me about the time he had 5 numbers when the lotto was 8 million and he was married to a solicitor and he had two girls and they were living in a scenic well to do area outside the city.

    The truth was he was a gambling addict and used to spend 80 euro a week on lotto and he was married to an ordinary girl in a factory, they had no kids and lived in a council house in an ordinary country town. I was reckoning the gambling was covering up more serious head problems. When the recession hit last time I saw him, he was packing up the wife and kids and moving to Australia and letting the house until everything blew over.

    And you are wondering why they called him "Tony the liar"?


  • #33
    antodeco
    Registered Users, Subscribers, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,722 ✭✭✭✭antodeco


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    When the recession hit last time I saw him, he was packing up the wife and kids and moving to Australia and letting the house until everything blew over.

    The kids he doesn't have and the council house he doesn't own?


  • #34
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,129 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    Now you hit the nail on the head. Its about addiction, not about fun or gaming, there is no skill. If you were ever to enter a gaming place they are full of losers who are addicted to the thrill of the spin and the sound of the ping. It sends a reward of Dopamine to the brain and which is quickly used up and its back on the machine again.

    Nonsense. Plenty of people enjoy gambling and aren't addicted. Same as how not all people who drink are alcoholics.


  • #35
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    antodeco wrote: »
    The kids he doesn't have and the council house he doesn't own?

    Yeah so he was telling me. Australia doesnt want to know a 50 year old man who is only a general operator and with no money. I just let it in one ear and out the other.


  • #36
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Nonsense. Plenty of people enjoy gambling and aren't addicted. Same as how not all people who drink are alcoholics.

    I am talking specifically about slot machines. I was in betting shop once but it wasnt as bad. I saw one sad sap betting on a horse, he had his glasses like Jack Duckworth with the plaster on the hinge. I have a friend who used to be like that, luckily when he got married the wife knocked it on the head.


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  • #37
    whisky_galore
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,266 ✭✭✭✭whisky_galore


    They're no loss. Hate the sight of them.

    Now if we could get rid of Paddy Power outlets, a blight on the streetscapes.


  • #38
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    whisky_galore wrote: »
    They're no loss. Hate the sight of them.

    Now if we could get rid of Paddy Power outlets, a blight on the streetscapes.

    If only we could .... but the real betting is on the mobile app so you dont have to go down to the shops. Financial institutions also keep an eye on this and if you have a gambling app they wont give you a mortgage.


  • #39
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,129 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    I am talking specifically about slot machines. I was in betting shop once but it wasnt as bad. I saw one sad sap betting on a horse, he had his glasses like Jack Duckworth with the plaster on the hinge. I have a friend who used to be like that, luckily when he got married the wife knocked it on the head.

    I enjoy the slots myself, and know plenty of non addicts who do too but where I live they are fun and you can actually win a decent amount on them. The whole experience is going to a casino or bar, having a few drinks, nice food and a gamble. It's not just sitting in a dark corner pressing a button. I agree that the ones in betting shops in Ireland are **** and depressing, and the fruit machine things they have in the UK pubs are even worse. I don't understand those at all and you can only win pennies on them it seems. In particular the roulette machines seemed designed to get people addicted. These are the only kind I've seen people have a problem with and its when I've been back in the UK. I used to work in the head office of a major UK bookmaker and each of those machines generated thousands per week and each shop had several of them. Those and the high roller customers were their bread and butter at the time


  • #40
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    I enjoy the slots myself, and know plenty of non addicts who do too but where I live they are fun and you can actually win a decent amount on them. The whole experience is going to a casino or bar, having a few drinks, nice food and a gamble. It's not just sitting in a dark corner pressing a button. I agree that the ones in betting shops in Ireland are **** and depressing, and the fruit machine things they have in the UK pubs are even worse. I don't understand those at all and you can only win pennies on them it seems. In particular the roulette machines seemed designed to get people addicted. These are the only kind I've seen people have a problem with and its when I've been back in the UK. I used to work for ladbrokes in the head office and each of those machines generated thousands per week and each shop had several of them.

    I am sure you can win decent amounts on them, just like the lotto. But do you win? My sad sap of an uncle lost 3 farms betting on slow horses and grey hounds when he should have been looking after his own farm.


  • #41
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,129 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    I am sure you can win decent amounts on them, just like the lotto. But do you win? My sad sap of an uncle lost 3 farms betting on slow horses and grey hounds when he should have been looking after his own farm.

    Yes I do win sometimes, decent amounts. But I don't lose more than go I in prepared to lose and I don't expect or need to win. It's a bit of fun. I won't be losing my house that's for sure! It's possible to gamble within your limits, not everyone goes off the rails


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  • #42
    worded
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,915 ✭✭✭worded


    The Highwayman wrote: »
    In Germany they are everywhere

    Spielhalle, they are especially prevalent in poor areas. Losers in there all day and night, very depressing.

    Lotto scratch ticket sales are best in poor areas also


  • #43
    Irish Guitarist
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,736 ✭✭✭Irish Guitarist


    What should be illegal are those coin pushers. A couple of years ago I wasted almost a tenner on one before I figured out how they worked. There's a compartment inside them where most of the money you should win goes instead of coming out. They're far worse than slot machines because they give the false hope that it's possible to win a decent amount of money.


  • #44
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    Irish Guitarist wrote: »
    What should be illegal are those coin pushers.

    How can they be made illegal when there is a UK station broadcasting a gameshow where these coin pushers are the sole attraction of the game? They actually focus how to focus on timings and positions to push the most coins. Its unconsciously hinting to you, "learn the game and there is easy money here".


  • #45
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    Yes I do win sometimes, decent amounts. But I don't lose more than go I in prepared to lose and I don't expect or need to win. It's a bit of fun. I won't be losing my house that's for sure! It's possible to gamble within your limits, not everyone goes off the rails

    Every gambler will tell you about their wins and never the losses. I have known gambling addicts and they bet on anything. They dont seem to realise the house is stacked against them. I have seen a guy eventually lose his house through gambling, little by little until he lost the run of his finances through credit cards. Every gambling addict is similar to a criminal in that they believe that they are going to get that one sweet tip/job and once after that they will go straight or be even with the bookie.

    I realise I have have an addictive traits to my personality hence I stay away.


  • #46
    4068ac1elhodqr
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,577 ✭✭✭4068ac1elhodqr


    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    I enjoy the slots myself, and know plenty of non addicts who do too but where I live they are fun and you can actually win a decent amount on them. The whole experience is going to a casino or bar, having a few drinks, nice food and a gamble. It's not just sitting in a dark corner pressing a button.

    Disagree with this, slots are specifically singularly designed for 'sensory dopamine-reward overload'. It is exactly 'sitting in a dark corner pressing a button'. There is zero skill, knowledge, ability nor even any social factoring in these.
    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    I agree that the ones in betting shops in Ireland are **** and depressing, and the fruit machine things they have in the UK pubs are even worse. I don't understand those at all and you can only win pennies on them it seems. In particular the roulette machines seemed designed to get people addicted.

    The RNG on any of these is hard-set to sub-96 ROI% (or less), never more. Roulette is not as bad, less sensory and slower. Again little skill in any of these, and punters are always, always at a disadvantage from the getgo.
    ceadaoin. wrote: »
    These are the only kind I've seen people have a problem with and its when I've been back in the UK. I used to work in the head office of a major UK bookmaker and each of those machines generated thousands per week and each shop had several of them. Those and the high roller customers were their bread and butter at the time

    Agree with this, after recent reg changes in the uk (FOTB max reductions), they're talking of closing thousands upon thousands of shops (and about 10,000 staff), which shows just how much they were creaming.

    Circa 50% of all action is online now, and 'non-real-world' (non-sports/events), is the fastest grower, so expect to see plenty more ads for the horrid virtual stuff (bingo, games{slots}, casino) as bookies try to recover massive uk FOTB revenue losses, and share prices that have taken a kicking.


  • #47
    Esel
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 24,808 ✭✭✭✭Esel
    Not Your Ornery Onager


    ^ Good post. What are RNG and FOTB?

    Not your ornery onager



  • #48
    ceadaoin.
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,129 ✭✭✭ceadaoin.


    Jay Uninterested Candlestick wrote: »
    Disagree with this, slots are specifically singularly designed for 'sensory dopamine-reward overload'. It is exactly 'sitting in a dark corner pressing a button'. There is zero skill, knowledge, ability nor even any social factoring in these.



    The RNG on any of these is hard-set to sub-96 ROI% (or less), never more. Roulette is not as bad, less sensory and slower. Again little skill in any of these, and punters are always, always at a disadvantage from the getgo.



    Agree with this, after recent reg changes in the uk (FOTB max reductions), they're talking of closing thousands upon thousands of shops (and about 10,000 staff), which shows just how much they were creaming.

    Circa 50% of all action is online now, and 'non-real-world' (non-sports/events), is the fastest grower, so expect to see plenty more ads for the horrid virtual stuff (bingo, games{slots}, casino) as bookies try to recover massive uk FOTB revenue losses, and share prices that have taken a kicking.

    I know there is no skill involved, I never said there was. I'm not worried that my once a fortnight or so gambling habit is going to bankrupt me.

    I'm in the US where online betting has just opened up and for now it's all about sports betting, especially in play which is a new thing here and growing a lot.

    I do agree that the industry in the UK has become quite predatory. Back when I worked there they were buying up high Street locations just to get more machines in because there was a limit per shop. That's why there would be multiple shops along the same street. Obviously the tightening of legislation around them left them screwed after relying on it for so long


  • #49
    raze_them_all_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,794 ✭✭✭raze_them_all_


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    If only we could .... but the real betting is on the mobile app so you dont have to go down to the shops. Financial institutions also keep an eye on this and if you have a gambling app they wont give you a mortgage.

    This is false.


  • #50
    bodhrandude
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 13,321 ✭✭✭✭bodhrandude


    Esel wrote: »
    ^ Good post. What are RNG and FOTB?

    RNG means Random Number Generator, not too sure what FOTB means though.

    If you want to get into it, you got to get out of it. (Hawkwind 1982)



  • #51
    lbc2019
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,291 ✭✭✭lbc2019


    bodhrandude wrote: »
    RNG means Random Number Generator, not too sure what FOTB means though.

    Fixed Odds Betting Terminal


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  • #52
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    raze_them_all_ wrote: »
    This is false.

    You think in the face of the Facebook scandal that booking shops arent selling information to banks? I didnt say it was legal I said it was going on.
    You know every time you download cookies its not for your benefit?
    Hence I binned mysmart phone. I empty my history and dump cookies every night and invest in internet security and antivirus. Anything you get for free, then you are the product.


  • #53
    raze_them_all_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,794 ✭✭✭raze_them_all_


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    You think in the face of the Facebook scandal that booking shops arent selling information to banks? I didnt say it was legal I said it was going on.
    You know every time you download cookies its not for your benefit?
    Hence I binned mysmart phone. I empty my history and dump cookies every night and invest in internet security and antivirus. Anything you get for free, then you are the product.

    Your statement of banks will not give you a mortgage is a lie. If you spend and lose thousands then yes like anything it will effect your credit. I've a mate up 43 odd thousand this year from online poker. Think he won't get a mortgage even though he has a good job also??


  • #54
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    raze_them_all_ wrote: »
    Your statement of banks will not give you a mortgage is a lie. If you spend and lose thousands then yes like anything it will effect your credit. I've a mate up 43 odd thousand this year from online poker. Think he won't get a mortgage even though he has a good job also??

    "ONLINE gambling and evidence on your credit card statements of paying Paddy Power and other internet bookies is a 'red flag' that may stop you getting a mortgage, the Sunday Independent has learned."

    https://www.independent.ie/business/personal-finance/property-mortgages/online-gambling-might-harm-mortgage-chances-30138464.html

    Have that from someone else in the bank who I asked for advice. Just looking at that sad sap Oisin McConville. In a cash business or where a person (eg Accountant/Solicitor Michael Lynn) has both deeds and cash in large amounts. Would you trust a person with that gambling personality? Other examples would be Nick Leeson with Baring banks?


  • #55
    kowloon
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 14,187 ✭✭✭✭kowloon


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    If only we could .... but the real betting is on the mobile app so you dont have to go down to the shops. Financial institutions also keep an eye on this and if you have a gambling app they wont give you a mortgage.

    Unless they're the bank you're paying out from is there any way they would know?


  • #56
    worded
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 4,915 ✭✭✭worded


    kowloon wrote: »
    Unless they're the bank you're paying out from is there any way they would know?

    Yes, via your credit card statements you have to give them.

    Online gambling accounts + ted flag


  • #57
    raze_them_all_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,794 ✭✭✭raze_them_all_


    worded wrote: »
    Yes, via your credit card statements you have to give them.

    Online gambling accounts + ted flag
    The fact you think it blanket stops you shows you are wrong. If I spent 10 grand a month on cars I'd not get one either.


  • #58
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    raze_them_all_ wrote: »
    The fact you think it blanket stops you shows you are wrong. If I spent 10 grand a month on cars I'd not get one either.

    The debate is about AI being to spot a gambler and assess them as a risk. You are very naive to think that banks dont buy databases and marketing survays. When I was college I was looking to buy a computer and approach both Dell and Gateway. They guy at Gateway spelt the name of my village wrong. Sure enough when I was due to come out of college a letter came from BoI, a bank I have nothing to do with and they spelt the name of my village the same way. Someone sold the Database. It doesnt matter if it was done with Gateways approval or not but BoI bought it. I am sure it is one of their more minor infractions.


  • #59
    raze_them_all_
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,794 ✭✭✭raze_them_all_


    skooterblue2 wrote: »
    The debate is about AI being to spot a gambler and assess them as a risk. You are very naive to think that banks dont buy databases and marketing survays. When I was college I was looking to buy a computer and approach both Dell and Gateway. They guy at Gateway spelt the name of my village wrong. Sure enough when I was due to come out of college a letter came from BoI, a bank I have nothing to do with and they spelt the name of my village the same way. Someone sold the Database. It doesnt matter if it was done with Gateways approval or not but BoI bought it. I am sure it is one of their more minor infractions.

    You ignoring my point by choice or inability to read??


  • #60
    skooterblue2
    Closed Accounts Posts: 6,816 ✭✭✭skooterblue2


    raze_them_all_ wrote: »
    You ignoring my point by choice or inability to read??

    Your point is not ignored but you would be better applying for a mortgage without having used this app than having this app as demonstrated by the above article.


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  • #61
    Church on Tuesday
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    Murray TheDemonic TalkingSkull wrote: »
    I'm really glad our pubs over here do not have them. Hate to see them when drinking in UK pubs

    That and the fact that the typical English boozer has all the atmosphere of a funeral.

    Like drinking in your kitchen.


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