Western Society has got Decadent

Cryptopagan · 06-03-2019 12:21pm

Relikk wrote: »

You might want to read the OP again. You're seeing things that aren't there.

The OP posits that there is widespread decadence in Western culture, and cites the examples of transgender issues, Trump and Brexit. It's pretty transparently an attempt to yoke transgender issues to two very unpopular topics, Trump and Brexit, when they have nothing in common.

jimgoose · 06-03-2019 12:24pm

Cryptopagan wrote: »

The OP posits that there is widespread decadence in Western culture, and cites the examples of transgender issues, Trump and Brexit. It's pretty transparently an attempt to yoke transgender issues to two very unpopular topics, Trump and Brexit, when they have nothing in common.

To be quite accurate, he cites Trump and Brexit as examples of extreme reactions to the perceived decadence resulting from transgenderism and so forth. Not that I'd necessarily agree with him on that one, but I do think the Rainbow Gang are inclined to push it a bit. :pac:

DEFTLEFTHAND · 06-03-2019 12:30pm

Cryptopagan wrote: »

The OP posits that there is widespread decadence in Western culture, and cites the examples of transgender issues, Trump and Brexit. It's pretty transparently an attempt to yoke transgender issues to two very unpopular topics, Trump and Brexit, when they have nothing in common.

Unpopular to who though.

Trump and Brexit have just as many supporters as they do detractors. More supporters in fact if we go by democracy.

Relikk · 06-03-2019 12:30pm

Cryptopagan wrote: »

The OP posits that there is widespread decadence in Western culture, and cites the examples of transgender issues, Trump and Brexit. It's pretty transparently an attempt to yoke transgender issues to two very unpopular topics, Trump and Brexit, when they have nothing in common.

He's talking about media as a whole where the content is lacking in credibility by reporting on nonsense, which in turn has influenced the social media sheep that pander to the eternally offended, idiotic politicians who shock and fuel misinformation and cause division, and where people give honest, and sensible, opinions and are attacked by vocal minority groups. All because every idiot has a voice due to social media.

You're the one conflating those points, not the OP.

Tacklebox · 06-03-2019 12:32pm

Decadence is alluring and induces a high which eventually tapers off to a low.
The hangover is mind meltingly painful.

I think it's a good thing for people who have been there and hit the ground with a wallop.
I have all the material stuff, and a job which pays the bills, cant afford foreign holidays, cant save much either. Paid off my last of my depts last year.

I myself was there had it all, still have a lot of designer clothes from the 00's watches and boots, tools furniture.

Luckily I bought a lot of plain but classic cuts and designs, kept it simple.

Looked after the leather and wax jackets, boots and other toys i accumulated.
My sons following suit, he collects pop vinyls and collectors comics and buys any new first edition cult books in hardback on the double, boxes them for selling in the future.

I trool second hand bookshops and found some right jems.

Charity shops are great too, found a pair of size 9 worn redwing iron rangers a few weeks ago, they've been broken in so i don't have to.

Cryptopagan · 06-03-2019 12:33pm

Relikk wrote: »

He's talking about media as a whole where the content is lacking in credibility by reporting on nonsense, which in turn has influenced the social media sheep that pander to the eternally offended, idiotic politicians who shock and fuel misinformation and cause division, and where people give honest, and sensible, opinions and are attacked by vocal minority groups. All because every idiot has a voice due to social media.

You're the one conflating those points, not the OP.

You think that the issue of young people transitioning genders is caused by media "reporting on nonsense"?

Relikk · 06-03-2019 12:39pm

Cryptopagan wrote: »

Not at all surprising.

morebabies · 06-03-2019 12:40pm

Yes OP, and wading through the mire of people's offended feelings, it's very hard to get to the truth of anything anymore. What do we use to measure the truth when our government and media all sing from the same hymnsheet? Where is true diversity of opinion?

Everyone that says they subscribe to the groupthink is "brave", anyone that disagrees is hateful and bigoted, and must be silenced.

#metoo (!)

jimgoose · 06-03-2019 12:42pm

morebabies wrote: »

Yes OP, and wading through the mire of people's offended feelings, it's very hard to get to the truth of anything anymore. What do we use to measure the truth when our government and media all sing from the same hymnsheet? Where is true diversity of opinion?

Everyone that says they subscribe to the groupthink is "brave", anyone that disagrees is hateful and bigoted, and must be silenced.

#metoo (!)

Some earnest beardo on Facebook said to me "What you are speaking is pure Hate!!" last month after I said that there were a lot of travellers that'd take your gate while you're sitting on it, and that's why most regular folks don't trust them. :pac:

Ush1 · 06-03-2019 12:42pm

The people in the hills are China, Russia, ISIS etc...

Sure China are already "colonising" parts of Africa.

Auntie Semite · 06-03-2019 12:54pm

Tabnabs wrote: »

Commonly referred to as the Tytler Cycle

"A democracy is always temporary in nature; it simply cannot exist as a permanent form of government. A democracy will continue to exist up until the time that voters discover that they can vote themselves generous gifts from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates who promise the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that every democracy will finally collapse due to loose fiscal policy, which is always followed by a dictatorship."
“The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations from the beginning of history, has been about 200 years. During those 200 years, these nations always progressed through the following sequence:

From bondage to spiritual faith;
From spiritual faith to great courage;
From courage to liberty;
From liberty to abundance;
From abundance to complacency;
From complacency to apathy;
From apathy to dependence;
From dependence back into bondage

Alexander Tyler, 1787.

Another version is:

Hard Times create strong men
Strong men create good times
Good times create weak men
Weak men create hard times

Potential-Monke · 06-03-2019 12:56pm

First we had Empires with Emperors, then Kingdoms with Kings, now Countries with...

The problem isn't that anyone can have a voice these days, it's that people are willing to listen to anything which fits their agenda. Look at the Momo crap over the last month. Pretty sure not 1 case in Ireland has been linked to it (if at all in the world). But it didn't stop the wannabe 'great' parents from sharing it. No one actually looked into it before forwarding this garbage. I don't read papers anymore, because it's nothing but misery and rich people having fun. The news, while it does concentrate on some actual stories, often includes fluff pieces for the masses. Gossip on a global scale, and I hate gossip.

Common sense will soon have to be renamed uncommon sense, as it's severely lacking these days. Claims up the wazoo, people getting massive compensation for being a stupid coont. Life dolers having a better life than people working 40+ hours a week. People popping out kids like their a fashion trend, regardless of whether they can support them or not. Free houses for life for people who haven't worked a day in their lives. People illegally camping on private property demanding to be paid the cost of the land before moving on... Fuk this country, fuk this world. I'll live in my own little bubble, harming no one.

joe40 · 06-03-2019 1:00pm

morebabies wrote: »

Yes OP, and wading through the mire of people's offended feelings, it's very hard to get to the truth of anything anymore. What do we use to measure the truth when our government and media all sing from the same hymnsheet? Where is true diversity of opinion?

Everyone that says they subscribe to the groupthink is "brave", anyone that disagrees is hateful and bigoted, and must be silenced.

#metoo (!)

So when exactly in the past did this "diversity of opinion" that you talk about exist. 1950s ireland perhaps.
There is plenty of silly opinions expressed online from all quarters but mostly noise. Extreme views are amplified but not representative of the real world.
Strawmen are built up all the time.

conorhal · 06-03-2019 1:09pm

If any article would inspire me to start digging that fallout shelter it's probably this one....

https://www.thejournal.ie/bezos-tops-forbes-rich-list-again-as-zuckerbergs-wealth-slips-4525145-Mar2019/
Social media personality and entrepreneur Kylie Jenner has become the world’s youngest self-made billionaire, according to this year’s (Forbes) list......

Sweet sunny Jesus.. Fan's even set up a gofundme to ensure she would secure that title. Humanity can go F itself at this stage.

batgoat · 06-03-2019 1:13pm

Op seems to think that being transgender is a modern issue. Transitioning might be more modern but otherwise I'd suspect it's always existed.

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Unpopular to who though.

Trump and Brexit have just as many supporters as they do detractors. More supporters in fact if we go by democracy.

Given the mid terms being a historic defeat for GOP. Support for Trump has drastically diminished. Plus put to another referendum, I wouldn't be so sure of brexit passing. Consequences of it are slowly hitting home for the voters.

Cryptopagan · 06-03-2019 1:19pm

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Unpopular to who though.

Trump and Brexit have just as many supporters as they do detractors. More supporters in fact if we go by democracy.

In Ireland both are very unpopular.

joe40 · 06-03-2019 1:20pm

Auntie Semite wrote: »

Another version is:

Hard Times create strong men
Strong men create good times
Good times create weak men
Weak men create hard tines

Heard that one before. It's a load on nonsense but appeals to certain types of people.

Hitler and Stalin were "strong men" what good times did they create.

Tacklebox · 06-03-2019 1:22pm

Potential-Monke wrote: »

First we had Empires with Emperors, then Kingdoms with Kings, now Countries with...

The problem isn't that anyone can have a voice these days, it's that people are willing to listen to anything which fits their agenda. Look at the Momo crap over the last month. Pretty sure not 1 case in Ireland has been linked to it (if at all in the world). But it didn't stop the wannabe 'great' parents from sharing it. No one actually looked into it before forwarding this garbage. I don't read papers anymore, because it's nothing but misery and rich people having fun. The news, while it does concentrate on some actual stories, often includes fluff pieces for the masses. Gossip on a global scale, and I hate gossip.

Common sense will soon have to be renamed uncommon sense, as it's severely lacking these days. Claims up the wazoo, people getting massive compensation for being a stupid coont. Life dolers having a better life than people working 40+ hours a week. People popping out kids like their a fashion trend, regardless of whether they can support them or not. Free houses for life for people who haven't worked a day in their lives. People illegally camping on private property demanding to be paid the cost of the land before moving on... Fuk this country, fuk this world. I'll live in my own little bubble, harming no one.

I hear you, or read you, which ever is politically correct as a response or reply, definitely not a reaction lol

You mention compensation, the irony of the plebs getting compo is its nearly gone back into the exchequer black market within a year, they just spend it on their selfish desires and they will be broke in no time.

Give me thirty grand and ill add 33% to it within a year.

I badly need insulation, a stove, orchard another shed and a new surfboard.
A vw camper would be good.
A new chainsaw would be handy too, and a trailer.

Buy shares in filtration systems is always a good idea.

o1s1n · 06-03-2019 1:35pm

conorhal wrote: »

Fan's even set up a gofundme to ensure she would secure that title. Humanity can go F itself at this stage.

Thankfully, with a little deeper reading, that was a piss take.

dermo888 · 06-03-2019 2:15pm

JupiterKid wrote: »

I am a gay man and firmly believe in equality and fairness but we are indulging ridiculous notions and the eternally offended attack anyone with a common sense approach.

We can't win. If we call the nonsense out, we are accused of going against our own kind, and I'd regard myself on the more conservative side of the gay demographic.

morebabies · 06-03-2019 2:16pm

joe40 wrote: »

So when exactly in the past did this "diversity of opinion" that you talk about exist. 1950s ireland perhaps.
There is plenty of silly opinions expressed online from all quarters but mostly noise. Extreme views are amplified but not representative of the real world.
Strawmen are built up all the time.

I can’t think of a time when there was true diversity of opinion to be honest, but it does seem like we've swung from one extreme to the other. People used to be afraid to speak out against the status quo when the Church / State ruled, now people are afraid to speak out in favour of traditional views.

branie2 · 06-03-2019 2:19pm

freshpopcorn wrote: »

I think your referring to Paddy Manning.

Any relation to Chelsea, a famous transwoman?

mad muffin · 06-03-2019 2:21pm

Rome… before the fall

fxotoole · 06-03-2019 2:22pm

JupiterKid wrote: »

It seems to me that common sense has gone out the window on so many issues that are indulged by media luvvies and (gasp!!) virtue signallers.

The culture of celebrity has been taken to ridiculous extremes (ie the Kardashians and other such non entities), the whole transgender issue (kids being encouraged to "transition" , transgender male to females - pre op in many cases - insisting in competing in womens sport and using women only spaces - tennis legend Martina Navratilova has pointed out the unfair advantage this would give them...

...and she is attacked and called a TERF.
I am a gay man and firmly believe in equality and fairness but we are indulging ridiculous notions and the eternally offended attack anyone with a common sense approach.

Then you have a cultute of politics that is all style and posturing over actual substance. And people reacting to this - Brexit (a clusterf*ck of epic proportions) and Trump come to mind...

There is so much indulging in frivolous issues that IMO are whataboutery and distrations for more important considerations - like economic inequality, the environmental catastrophe, a lack of a long term vision for the world.

Posts on the LGBTQI forum get shot down and locked at the slightest questioning of the cosy consensus and it is not healthy.

Someone had a thread about cliques on boatds? QED...

You lost me at “virtue signallers”

Zorya · 06-03-2019 2:28pm

Ush1 wrote: »

The people in the hills are China, Russia, ISIS etc...

Sure China are already "colonising" parts of Africa.

Yeah, I've been reading some articles lately about China and the BRI. Worth knowing about. Italy is thinking of signing up. Other EU fringe countries too. It's an unexpected consequence of the EU dealing so tough with Greece. China stepped in to offer help. The old Chinese curse springs to mind - May you live in interesting times.

LirW · 06-03-2019 2:29pm

Yes let's talk about the Kardashian cookie jars. Huge glass jars of lovely, perfectly stacked cookies and they never eat a single one of it!
This, my friends, is a proof that we've reached the end times.

freshpopcorn · 06-03-2019 2:40pm

It's hard to get it right.
Some people don't like any discussion on a matter and others take it to far.
It's important when discussing a topic that you don't use slur words or over generalise if you want a topic to be discussed.

sbsquarepants · 06-03-2019 2:44pm

jimgoose wrote: »

Some earnest beardo on Facebook said to me "What you are speaking is pure Hate!!" last month after I said that there were a lot of travellers that'd take your gate while you're sitting on it, and that's why most regular folks don't trust them. :pac:

Those Jim are clearly the words of a man who's gate was never stolen by gypos, thus rendering him seatless. Nothing like the sobering feel of arse on concrete as you ponder the whereabouts of your gates, to focus the mind and make one see our ethnic minority brethren in a new and less rosy light.

As for the decadence - I'm all for it. I love a bit of the auld decadence me:D

I think we are fortunate enough to live in an age where it's medically possible for a man to become a woman and vice versa if they so desire - I say have it. I couldn't care less - if you are born male but want to be a woman, go ahead, knock yourself out - be a half woman half goat for all I care.

It's your body, your life, your choice - none of my business!

ohnonotgmail · 06-03-2019 3:42pm

DEFTLEFTHAND wrote: »

Unpopular to who though.

Trump and Brexit have just as many supporters as they do detractors. More supporters in fact if we go by democracy.

Trump doesn't have more supporters. He lost the popular vote. And brexit did at the time of the vote. I dont think it is as clearcut now.

DEFTLEFTHAND · 06-03-2019 3:50pm

Cryptopagan wrote: »

In Ireland both are very unpopular.

Brexit certainly is.

I think you'd be surprised when it comes to Trump.

Western Society has got Decadent

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