Compo culture goes to a new level

22-02-2019 07:04PM

blanch152 wrote: »

Do you have a link to back this up?

It's a really well known law, called the nonfeasance rule (as opposed to malfeasance).

We have created legislation to change it, but it's decades-old, and has never been commenced

http://www.pierse.ie/compensation-claims-against-local-authorities-irish-law-still-in-the-18th-century/

Boggles · 22-02-2019 07:22PM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Hang on a sec, from t'internet:

Hemolytic disease of the newborn, also known as hemolytic disease of the fetus and newborn, HDN, HDFN, or erythroblastosis fetalis,[1] is an alloimmune condition that develops in a peripartum fetus, when the IgG molecules (one of the five main types of antibodies) produced by the mother pass through the placenta. Among these antibodies are some which attack antigens on the red blood cells in the fetal circulation, breaking down and destroying the cells (hemolysis). The fetus can develop reticulocytosis and anemia. This fetal disease ranges from mild to very severe, and fetal death from heart failure (hydrops fetalis) can occur. When the disease is moderate or severe, many erythroblasts (immature red blood cells) are present in the fetal blood, and so these forms of the disease can be called erythroblastosis fetalis (or erythroblastosis foetalis).

I then Googled what can cause it:

What causes hemolytic disease of the newborn (HDN)? HDN most frequently occurs when an Rh negative mother has a baby with an Rh positive father. When the baby's Rh factor is positive, like the father's, problems can develop if the baby's red blood cells cross to the Rh negative mother.

I've searched a few places, and not one of them mentions that bumping into something causes this. I thought correlation doesn't prove causation? Apparently not when it comes to compo claims. Also, she said it stopped, but was it not a case of the trolleys lock up on travelators and she walked into the stopped trolley? Something doesn't add up here.

Fetal-maternal hemorrhage, which is the movement of fetal blood cells across the placenta, can occur during abortion, ectopic pregnancy, childbirth, ruptures in the placenta during pregnancy (often caused by trauma), or medical procedures carried out during pregnancy that breach the uterine wall. In subsequent pregnancies, if there is a similar incompatibility in the fetus, these antibodies are then able to cross the placenta into the fetal bloodstream to attach to the red blood cells and cause their destruction (hemolysis). This is a major cause of HDN, because 75% of pregnancies result in some contact between fetal and maternal blood, and 15-50% of pregnancies have hemorrhages with the potential for immune sensitization. The amount of fetal blood needed to cause maternal sensitization depends on the individual's immune system and ranges from 0.1 mL to 30 mL.[2]

.

Geuze · 22-02-2019 07:26PM

Here is another one:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/boy-5-who-saw-mother-injured-by-glass-panel-awarded-20k-for-psychiatric-injuries-37831923.html

"A 15-month-old baby, who saw his mother seriously injured and covered in blood after she walked into a pane of glass, was awarded damages of €20,000 for psychiatric injuries he suffered as a result of the experience."

BrianBoru00 · 22-02-2019 07:28PM

Marie Aggressive Roaster wrote: »

My mother drank and smoked while pregnant on me, i was born with a number of problems, should I sue her, the drinks company and cigarette company?

Just her.

22-02-2019 07:41PM

Geuze wrote: »

Here is another one:

https://www.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/boy-5-who-saw-mother-injured-by-glass-panel-awarded-20k-for-psychiatric-injuries-37831923.html

"A 15-month-old baby, who saw his mother seriously injured and covered in blood after she walked into a pane of glass, was awarded damages of €20,000 for psychiatric injuries he suffered as a result of the experience."

Now that's ridiculous.

The case cited by the OP doesn't come close.

Edgware · 22-02-2019 08:44PM

Marie Aggressive Roaster wrote: »

My mother drank and smoked while pregnant on me, i was born with a number of problems, should I sue her, the drinks company and cigarette company?

That explains a lot

Gatling · 22-02-2019 09:12PM

One my kids was born with jaundice -
Where can I claim

jmayo · 22-02-2019 09:17PM

klaaaz wrote: »

Adelaide is a common name amongst the "well-to-do" fraternity, in other words an entitled wealthy person.

The road she lives on has some very nice houses.

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

Only if the road was badly built to begin with.

It's not possible, in Ireland, to sue a Local Authority for neglecting roads and pavements. It is possible in the UK.

I'm not saying this is the ONLY reason why they have better roads, but it's definitely part of it. Which goes to show that if you start withdrawing incentives, organisations often will sink back into doing the bare minimum.

Ehh I am calling bullshyte on that statement.

Here is one from 2012.

A seamstress has been awarded €260,000 damages at the High Court over wrist injuries suffered when she tripped on an uneven footpath in Dún Laoghaire, Co Dublin.

Olive Loughrey (62), Station Road, Shankill, Dublin, sued Dún Laoghaire County Council over the fall outside the town hall on July 9th, 2002.

The judge found, as a matter of probability, the cause of the deterioration of the footpath slab was either poor design or faulty construction. Ms Loughrey was in no way to blame for the accident, he said.

Here is more about Kerry Co Co

Figures provided to Radio Kerry News show there were 241 claims made against the local authority in 2014. Last year’s figure compares to 205 compensation claims lodged against Kerry County Council in 2013. However, the number of awards made to claimants dropped by almost 13 per cent from 78 in 2013 to 68 the following year. In 2014 the highest number of claims was for potholes followed by trips and falls and miscellaneous claims. There were also claims for road works and flooding. The number of claims for trips and falls increased by a fifth in the period

From July 1, 2017 to July 1, 2018, three claims were received for flooding, 1367 for vehicle/wheel damage or damage relating to road works. 79 claims were received relating to trips and falls.

During that time, a total of €2.494 million was paid out by the Irish Public Bodies Insurance for claims made against the council, however the majority of these payments do not relate to claims submitted in this period, but to claims submitted to Kerry County Council in previous years.

Of this figure, €24,679 relates to flooding claims, €662,220 was for road-related incidents and €1.67 million relates to trip and fall claims.

Ehhh how do potholes occur again ?

The reason I looked up Kerry was because there was story number of years ago of one particular family in Tralee that were very unlucky as they seemed to keep falling over and suing the council.

22-02-2019 10:00PM

jmayo wrote: »

Ehh I am calling bullshyte on that statement.

You need to read the post again.

It's possible to sue a Local Authority over injuries sustained which were caused by a road which was badly-built.

There is no cause of action (no right to sue) in circumstances where a Local Authority has neglected a road, and allows it to fall into disrepair, however dangerous.

I posted a link earlier which already described all of this.

22-02-2019 10:13PM

OMG this is totally wrong! What expert medic gave evidence there? Hemolytic Disease of newborn is an immune mediated condition, absolutely nothing to do with bumps against trolleys or anything else, entirely to do with Rhesus factor. Somebody is totally lying through their teeth there, and obviously it is lucrative to to do so.

kowloon · 23-02-2019 12:51AM

Gatling wrote: »

One my kids was born with jaundice -
Where can I claim

Is Jaundice a supermarket chain? It sounds familiar.

Edgware · 24-02-2019 11:01AM

A Tyrant Named Miltiades! wrote: »

You need to read the post again.

It's possible to sue a Local Authority over injuries sustained which were caused by a road which was badly-built.

There is no cause of action (no right to sue) in circumstances where a Local Authority has neglected a road, and allows it to fall into disrepair, however dangerous.

I posted a link earlier which already described all of this.

Obliged, m,lud
Correct. If the council "repair" it and make a mess they are liable but leave go to hell and they aren't

Ger Roe · 24-02-2019 11:18AM

Marie Aggressive Roaster wrote: »

My mother drank and smoked while pregnant on me, i was born with a number of problems, should I sue her, the drinks company and cigarette company?

The ability to sue the cigarette companies in particular has long passed. The graphic warnings that actually tell you that their product is deadly dangerous, leaves the risk up to you. They have told you, it's your choice to ignore the warnings.

People think those statements and graphics are 'health warnings', they are in fact legal disclaimers ensuring governments and companies can't be sued for negligence.

Coming soon - Alcohol labels to declare that it can be a cause of cancer. Just to head off any future compo claims against companies or states.

'Health' doesn't come into it in the long run, you are being told the risks so that you have no comeback in the future.

Candamir · 24-02-2019 11:47AM

Potential-Monke wrote: »

Hang on a sec, from t'internet:

..........
I've searched a few places, and not one of them mentions that bumping into something causes this. I thought correlation doesn't prove causation? Apparently not when it comes to compo claims. Also, she said it stopped, but was it not a case of the trolleys lock up on travelators and she walked into the stopped trolley? Something doesn't add up here.

Deleted User wrote: »

OMG this is totally wrong! What expert medic gave evidence there? Hemolytic Disease of newborn is an immune mediated condition, absolutely nothing to do with bumps against trolleys or anything else, entirely to do with Rhesus factor. Somebody is totally lying through their teeth there, and obviously it is lucrative to to do so.

Haemolytic disease of the newborn is indeed an immune mediated condition, which can be caused by anything that causes foetal blood to get into the maternal circulation (which then causes the mother to make antibodies against the foetal blood cells). This can include trauma, and is usually, but not always against Rhesus factor. It can also be caused by ABO incompatibility, and incompatibility of other blood antigens. So the medical evidence, unsurprisingly, is not at odds with reality here.

I did think those travellators were designed to lock the trolley wheels though. Otherwise we’d all be getting run down by trolleys! It’s never happened to me ‘without warning’ though, as that’s what’s supposed to happen. I’m assuming there was some other fault with the trolley, otherwise I find it hard to see why Tesco paid out. (Apart from the usual ‘much cheaper to pay than to fight’)

Boggles · 24-02-2019 11:50AM

Deleted User wrote: »

OMG this is totally wrong! What expert medic gave evidence there? Hemolytic Disease of newborn is an immune mediated condition, absolutely nothing to do with bumps against trolleys or anything else, entirely to do with Rhesus factor. Somebody is totally lying through their teeth there, and obviously it is lucrative to to do so.

Again, there is nobody lying or anybody "totally wrong".

Try reading past the first sentence that pops up on google.

When a baby has Rh-positive blood and the mother has Rh-negative blood, the two have Rh incompatibility. As a result, the immune system of an Rh-negative mother may recognize the Rh-positive fetus’s red blood cells as "foreign" and produce antibodies against the Rh factor on the fetus's red blood cells (this process is called Rh sensitization). The mother's antibodies can pass from her blood through the placenta into the fetus's blood before delivery. The mother’s antibodies attach to and destroy (hemolyze) the fetus's red blood cells. The rapid breakdown of red blood cells begins while the fetus is still in the womb and continues after delivery.

A mother who is Rh-negative can produce the Rh antibodies if she is exposed to Rh-positive red blood cells. The most common way women are exposed to Rh-positive blood is when they have a fetus who is Rh-positive. Mothers are exposed to the most blood from the fetus during delivery, so that is when most Rh sensitization occurs. However, mothers also can be exposed earlier in pregnancy, for example, during a miscarriage or elective abortion, during a diagnostic test on the fetus (such as amniocentesis or chorionic villus sampling), if they have an injury to their abdomen, or if the placenta separates too early (placental abruption). Thus, most hemolytic disease happens to a fetus whose mother was sensitized during an earlier pregnancy. However, rarely, a mother may produce antibodies early in a pregnancy and then these antibodies affect the same fetus later during that pregnancy. Exposure may also occur outside of pregnancy, for example if the mother was transfused with Rh-positive blood at any time earlier in her life. Once the mother has been exposed and developed antibodies, problems are more likely with each subsequent pregnancy in which the fetus is Rh-positive.

MrCostington · 24-02-2019 12:06PM

There has been much talk here of the travellator being faulty, but is does not say that in the report.

My theory - firstly I'm not familiar with the shopping center, but in an Aldi I use it has one of these uphill ones instead of an escalator. When you put the trolley on it it locks into position to stop it falling back. The travellator moves much more slow than walking pace, so, if you were not paying attention, the trolley would suddenly be moving at 1 kph, you are still doing 3kph, bang! No fault in travellator.

Boggles · 24-02-2019 12:14PM

MrCostington wrote: »

There has been much talk here of the travellator being faulty, but is does not say that in the report.

My theory - firstly I'm not familiar with the shopping center, but in an Aldi I use it has one of these uphill ones instead of an escalator. When you put the trolley on it it locks into position to stop it falling back. The travellator moves much more slow than walking pace, so, if you were not paying attention, the trolley would suddenly be moving at 1 kph, you are still doing 3kph, bang! No fault in travellator.

banged against her own shopping trolley when it stopped without warning on the travellator

The trolley was doing 0 kph.

MrCostington · 24-02-2019 12:16PM

Boggles wrote: »

The trolley was doing 0 kph.

She would be doing 0kph too then?

Or more likely as I described, while she has head in phone?

The Tetrarch · 24-02-2019 12:32PM

Should have given the mother a few grand for "hard neck".

Boggles · 24-02-2019 12:37PM

MrCostington wrote: »

She would be doing 0kph too then?

If she was locked into position, but she wasn't nor was her daughter because they are not shopping trolleys.

Newton cracked this particular mystery out a while ago.

MrCostington wrote: »

Or more likely as I described, while she has head in phone?

Where does it say she was on the phone?

orourkeda1977 · 24-02-2019 12:41PM

NIMAN wrote: »

Am I being presumptuous thinking what this mother is like, with a daughter names Adelaide?

I had two totally different image run through my mind.

I immediately imagined that she was some Hyacinth Bucket type then thought she may be an absolutely scaldy skanger.

waynerooney · 24-02-2019 12:45PM

Marie Aggressive Roaster wrote: »

What are the chances? Even the judge has said he never heard of it coming before the courts before. I know Tesco offered the settlement, but this has set another new precedent.

https://www.thejournal.ie/payout-unborn-child-4507897-Feb2019/

Are there any demographics to indicate the locations of who's making all these claims? Possibly then get policies based on where I live.

Candamir · 24-02-2019 12:48PM

Boggles wrote: »

If she was locked into position, but she wasn't nor was her daughter because they are not shopping trolleys.

Newton cracked this particular mystery out a while ago.

Where does it say she was on the phone?

So she walked into her trolley, which was stopped on the travellator, as is the design, and injured herself?

Seems strange that millions of travellator journeys occur weekly without incident, but it’s the shops fault when one person and her daughter injure themselves.

Boggles · 24-02-2019 12:55PM

Candamir wrote: »

So she walked into her trolley, which was stopped on the traveller, as is the design, and injured herself?

It was the travelator that abruptly stopped and not the trolley, that was all ready "stopped".

When you are travelling in or on something that abruptly stops, what happens you normally?

Wheety · 24-02-2019 12:55PM

It reads to me that the trolley stopped. The trolleys are meant to stop. Sounds like she walked into when it did stop.

mother collided with her shopping trolley that stopped suddenly on a Tesco travellator.

Candamir · 24-02-2019 01:08PM

Boggles wrote: »

It was the travelator that abruptly stopped and not the trolley, that was all ready "stopped".

When you are travelling in or on something that abruptly stops, what happens you normally?

Going by the linked newspaper article, it says the trolley stopped on the travellator.

And to answer your question, when something I’m travelling in or on stops, the laws of physics apply as normal. My inertia will tend to keep me moving forward, in proportion to my weight, and more importantly, my speed. So on a very slow moving travellator, that would probably mean one small step forward.

But I don’t see that that is what happened in this case.

Boggles · 24-02-2019 01:11PM

Wheety wrote: »

It reads to me that the trolley stopped. The trolleys are meant to stop. Sounds like she walked into when it did stop.

It's badly written and copied from one source.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/3787214/unborn-child-injured-trolley-tesco-compo/

Ironically The Sun explain it better.

was injured when her pregnant mum collided with her shopping trolley after the travelator it was on suddenly stopped without warning.

Candamir · 24-02-2019 01:20PM

Boggles wrote: »

It's badly written and copied from one source.

https://www.thesun.ie/news/3787214/unborn-child-injured-trolley-tesco-compo/

Ironically The Sun explain it better.

And the Irish Times reports

“David K McGrath, counsel for the child, told Judge Eoin Garavan in the Circuit Civil Court that his client was injured when her mother collided with her shopping trolley which stopped suddenly on a travellator.”

From the independent:

“Mr McGrath, who appeared with Sean Miller of Crowley Miller Solicitors, said Siwan’s mother, Elaine Stewart, banged against her own shopping trolley when it stopped without warning on the travellator in Tesco’s at the Bloomfield Shopping Centre, Lower George’s Street, Dun Laoghaire, Co Dublin, in February 2013.”

Boggles · 24-02-2019 01:24PM

Candamir wrote: »

And the Irish Times reports

“David K McGrath, counsel for the child, told Judge Eoin Garavan in the Circuit Civil Court that his client was injured when her mother collided with her shopping trolley which stopped suddenly on a travellator.”

From the independent:

“Mr McGrath, who appeared with Sean Miller of Crowley Miller Solicitors, said Siwan’s mother, Elaine Stewart, banged against her own shopping trolley when it stopped without warning on the travellator in Tesco’s at the Bloomfield Shopping Centre, Lower George’s Street, Dun Laoghaire, Co Dublin, in February 2013.”

Which report do you think is more plausible?

The one that makes complete sense or the one that doesn't make any?

Boggles · 24-02-2019 01:26PM

Candamir wrote: »

And to answer your question, when something I’m travelling in or on stops, the laws of physics apply as normal. My inertia will tend to keep me moving forward, in proportion to my weight, and more importantly, my speed. So on a very slow moving travellator, that would probably mean one small step forward.

Well not necessarily but it would almost certainly result in movement forward.

Compo culture goes to a new level

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