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Memories of corporal punishment

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Comments

  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,131 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    I'm surprised parents didn't complain so.

    Even parental attitudes had started to change quite dramatically at that stage in terms of smacking and how harmful it was or at least how utterly useless it was but would have thought they would have had concerns if teachers were still hitting kids at that stage, 10 years after corporal punishment was banned.

    While I believe you, I'm still in disbelief if you know what I mean.

    Yea but it was very subtle at times. “Light” hitting like stuff with pens flicking ears and knuckles. It definitely happened with regularity- I could name the kids in my class it happened to as they stood beside her desk. It’s clear as day to me. Remember a few times she went too far and she was all remorseful and praising of them after. I’d say she was selective perhaps in what kids she hit as the parents may not have been like my ma would be and came in. This was a school on a small rural town. Even then they still had some authority and possibly the backing of the local bollocks RC priest who was school patron


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 18,992 ✭✭✭✭gozunda


    Ipso wrote: »
    It seems the teaching field attracted many sadists, I wonder if they were just genuine psychos or if the profession was a dumping ground for those in the family who weren't "called' to priesthood.
    Where I went to secondary school it seemed the most abusive teachers were those in the practical/manly subjects like woodwork, technical drawing etc
    I'm surprised there hasn't been more sexual abuse stories towards teachers.

    The thing is it wasn't just teachers - anywhere where there was an abuse of power- teachers, priests, social workers, guards there was a tendency for abuse whether that was beating the sh1te of small children or corruption - it was part and parcel of every day life unfortunately.


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    road_high wrote: »
    Yea but it was very subtle at times. “Light” hitting like stuff with pens flicking ears and knuckles. It definitely happened with regularity- I could name the kids in my class it happened to as they stood beside her desk. It’s clear as day to me. Remember a few times she went too far and she was all remorseful and praising of them after. I’d say she was selective perhaps in what kids she hit as the parents may not have been like my ma would be and came in. This was a school on a small rural town. Even then they still had some authority and possibly the backing of the local bollocks RC priest who was school patron

    Well I know the post could be bad in the 1980's but even a small rural town should have got the memo by 1990 :P

    Maybe in her mind this wasn't "corporal punishment" because she didn't use a leather or a cane/metre stick- sounds like she was a right b1tch, up her own backside, total power in a small rural school.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 5,995 ✭✭✭Ipso


    gozunda wrote: »
    The thing is it wasn't just teachers - anywhere where there was an abuse of power- teachers, priests, social workers, guards there was a tendency for abuse whether that was beating the sh1te of small children or corruption - it was part and parcel of every day life unfortunately.

    Yeah, sometimes it seems to me like it was a class system. The sh!t munchers just knew their place.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 386 ✭✭wyf437gn6btzue


    Didn't go to school anywhere near when corporal punishment was used but still there was teachers who were cruel owl cnuts.

    One teacher when I was in 1st class had a problem with me in particular going toilet. It was an hour before finish one day and she was reading to the class, I had my hand raised for maybe 10-15 minutes and was ignored till I wet myself. When I went home and my mother found out she was livid.

    The same in secondary school, a few particular teachers had the art of psychological abuse down to a tea and made little of many of the venerable characters


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 7,275 ✭✭✭Your Face


    TCM wrote: »
    No pupil deserved to be beaten by a teacher.

    He deserved it.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,131 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Well I know the post could be bad in the 1980's but even a small rural town should have got the memo by 1990 :P

    Maybe in her mind this wasn't "corporal punishment" because she didn't use a leather or a cane/metre stick- sounds like she was a right b1tch, up her own backside, total power in a small rural school.

    Our school was actually pretty big by small town standards, think there was nearly 200 kids in it.
    She was a total skitzo. Could be so nice one part of the day, all affectionate. The next a total nutcase. She was by the far worst I ever had punishment wise.
    For all that she was a good teacher in the sense I learned an awful lot with her.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 17,787 ✭✭✭✭Galwayguy35


    Can remember two occasions where lads in my class got hit and had a black eye after, this was the late 80s when it wasn't supposed to happen, real hard men hitting young kids.

    Reading the thread here is seems like it was happening everywhere.

    It stopped after Inter Cert though when the lads in the class got bigger and would have been able to give one back.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 20,131 ✭✭✭✭road_high


    Didn't go to school anywhere near when corporal punishment was used but still there was teachers who were cruel owl cnuts.

    One teacher when I was in 1st class had a problem with me in particular going toilet. It was an hour before finish one day and she was reading to the class, I had my hand raised for maybe 10-15 minutes and was ignored till I wet myself. When I went home and my mother found out she was livid.

    The same in secondary school, a few particular teachers had the art of psychological abuse down to a tea and made little of many of the venerable characters

    Total torture was common alright! No wonder so many of us still have “issues”! Catholic punishment mindset hangover


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,466 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    I'm shocked it's still permitted in quite a large % of US states (mostly southern ones).


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2, Paid Member Posts: 55,846 ✭✭✭✭tayto lover


    I started Primary school in 1958 and finished in 1966. It was very bad then.
    The reason nobody complained was because our parents were basically uneducated and hadn’t the words or the ability to take on educated people.

    Anyway authority always backed authority and probably still does.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,858 ✭✭✭Church on Tuesday


    Absolutely shocking reading some of these accounts and abuse full stop.

    A real blackmark on the history of education.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,305 ✭✭✭trellheim


    After being in a CBS for primary and most of secondary in the 70s and 80s I didnt mind corporal punishment. What I hated was psycho teachers who made kids life hell

    the three worst teachers were all three lay 2xmale 1 female for this (what I only came many years later to see as mental abuse that was rarely physical/corporal. ) . the brothers were harsh but very fair in my experience , you knew why you were getting the stick or the leather. and it kept us in line which taught me a long life lesson.


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Absolutely shocking reading some of these accounts and abuse full stop.

    A real blackmark on the history of education.

    Here's something for you- One day, our primary school headmaster leathered close to 30 pupils for embarrassing him in front of parents on a parents day. Two nice slaps, one on each hand. The line of pupils to the headmasters office was out the front door- complete bastard nazi - single, paranoid and power crazy. I hope he died a horrible death-alone.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 2,466 ✭✭✭EdgeCase


    What lesson though?

    I mean, the only lesson I can see is that someone would learn that instead of doing something because it's a good thing, beneficial or positive, they did things because they were afraid that otherwise they'd be beaten up with a big stick.

    It doesn't seem like a great lesson or way of motivating people.

    Also someone who has to make threats to get their way has no respect. They just instil fear.
    Once the fear is gone, they crumble into irrelevance. They have no power. No influence. Just a big stick.

    There's a huge difference between that and someone who you actually respect, admire and take seriously.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 183 ✭✭anheneti


    Guess i wouldn't have made it too far in old Ireland. Im just not the type to sit idle and let anyone beat me

    The abuse is probably why a lot of Irish jumped ship to America
    That’s well and good until an 8 year old gets the **** kicked out of him because of something his father/brother/cousin said to him in a pub


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    EdgeCase wrote: »
    What lesson though?

    I mean, the only lesson I can see is that someone would learn that instead of doing something because it's a good thing, beneficial or positive, they did things because they were afraid that otherwise they'd be beaten up with a big stick.

    It doesn't seem like a great lesson or way of motivating people.

    Oh it was certainly discipline by fear, there's no doubt about that. None of this trying to understand the child, reason, explain bollix that happens today :D
    (sarcasm)

    Oh no, it was fear. Looking back, many i (but not all) teachers and headmasters/mistresses just didn't have the capacity, the skills and the emotional intelligence that's required for teaching today, to deal with children any other way. That's why I'd say a lot of teachers struggled post 1982 as they lost a lot of power then and didn't have any other skills to fall back on.

    I saw more than one teacher out on stress leave after nervous breakdowns.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Sorry about that


    I was never hit, but have the most vivid memory of a nun I had in junior infants. My handwriting was bad, and she was rubbing out a mistake I’d made, and the shavings of the rubber got on her skirt. She scolded me and made me brush off them off her skirt with my hands. I obviously didn’t get how weird this was, but still remember it like it was yesterday. I was four.

    All the stories on this thread about violent educators have one common denominator; the church. The insane abuse of power is still mind blowing.


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]



    All the stories on this thread about violent educators have one common denominator; the church. The insane abuse of power is still mind blowing.

    There's a fair amount of lay teachers mentioned on this thread. All of my examples are lay teachers, as are many others.


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 1,628 ✭✭✭orourkeda1977


    It boggles my mind when I think just how backward that Ireland was. A lot of this was in the very recent past.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 23,202 ✭✭✭✭Mam of 4


    I can't be the only one feeling sick reading all the accounts of abuse , and that's what it was, against children by glorified Sadists who relished having such power to do as they did and get away with it .
    I know some of them were held accountable in later years , but most weren't .
    Yes , I'm of that era where it was the "norm" , I don't think anyone in my family didn't suffer at their hands , one way or another .

    Thank fcuk times have changed .

    https://forumofgames.com/



  • Closed Accounts Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Sorry about that


    There's a fair amount of lay teachers mentioned on this thread. All of my examples are lay teachers, as are many others.

    I take the point, but they probably taught in catholic schools for the most part, following the culture set by the brothers/sisters.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,350 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    Am I losing my mind or are there posts going missing from this thread?


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Absolutely shocking reading some of these accounts and abuse full stop.

    .
    It boggles my mind when I think just how backward that Ireland was. .

    It's funny, having been there, done that and bought the t-shirt on more than a few occasions, standard corporal punishment wasn't actually all that bad if dished out fairly and measuredly, which in my experience, it was, up to 1982, when it stopped.

    This is not to be confused by vicious beatings and physical violence and abuse against kids by some bastard teachers/priests/nuns etc- something totally different altogether.

    I confess, having read the entire thread from the start, I'm a bit surprised, maybe even bemused, by how people's minds are "boggled" or "shocked" by standard corporal punishment stories- it didn't have a lasting effect on me at least, nor on my school friends. But then again, our school wasn't known for it's over-use of violence which obviously, was a good thing- but the did administer corporal punishment.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,350 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    Well f*ck me pink there is no doubt about it.

    As if it isn't infuriating enough to be beaten around the head by someone who's being paid to educate you some take-no-risk admin is after quietly binning my post where I named the individual who done it.

    Well done Boards. Playing straight into the hands of these low lifes and the establishment behind them.


  • Posts: 9,106 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Well f*ck me pink there is no doubt about it.

    As if it isn't infuriating enough to be beaten around the head by someone who's being paid to educate you some take-no-risk admin is after quietly binning my post where I named the individual who done it.

    Well done Boards. Playing straight into the hands of these low lifes and the establishment behind them.

    In fairness you can't go around alleging assault and naming people on boards.ie. We could all list off past teachers but back then, it wasn't illegal to administer corporal punishment. You're on dodgy ground naming people.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,208 ✭✭✭jmreire


    To put it in context, you have to remember that all those teachers, nuns etc were treated the same (or maybe even worse ) in their own day..and trace it backwards from that. So for them to behave as they did, was nothing new. To add to the mix, you had religious orders recruiting kids as young as 12 year's of age...so as adults, its not surprising that some ( not all though ) turned out as they did. Its easy known that there was not any compo culture in those days... or we would have all left school with nice bank account. In my day,one particular brother had broken the glass in every picture that hung on the walls.. he did this by lifting the unlucky ( on the day) pupil up by the ears, and banging his head off the glass. The broken glass was never replaced, so he just banged your head off the picture then, or the wall beside it. The classrooms in the school were separated by folding glass partitions, so each teacher knew what was happening in the other class rooms, but they never interfered, even the "Good" ones ( and we had a few of these too, but in the minority.) I remember one day when we were playing in the yard during a break, an irate Father, came into the yard, caught a Brother by the throat and pinned him against the wall, He gave the Brother a firm warning that the next time he laid a hand on his child, he would be back, and next time he would beat him so badly his own mother would not recognize him. For all his classroom toughness against kids, he was a coward ( as all bullies are ) But he never even attempted to teach that child again....just ignored him... but never once hit him again. One thing we all learned though, was that there was a price to be paid if you broke the rules ( and sometimes even if you did not...your Family's standing in the community influenced a teacher's behavior towards you ) So when you did leave school, you always knew that there were boundaries, and you had to respect them. It's something that seems to be lacking nowadays.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 3,985 ✭✭✭Grab All Association


    Hey! Settle down, boys and girls.
    Or Krusty will bring out his friend Corporal Punishment again.

    The Simpsons has really ruined us taking things seriously. In almost every subject on here there’s a Simpsons reference.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 6,350 ✭✭✭Ubbquittious


    In fairness you can't go around alleging assault and naming people on boards.ie. We could all list off past teachers but back then, it wasn't illegal to administer corporal punishment. You're on dodgy ground naming people.


    Back in my day it was in fact illegal. If push came to shove I'd stick to my word in front of any judge. Nothing dodgy about it either as that teacher did get into trouble over this kind of thing before


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  • Closed Accounts Posts: 632 ✭✭✭Sorry about that


    It's funny, having been there, done that and bought the t-shirt on more than a few occasions, standard corporal punishment wasn't actually all that bad if dished out fairly and measuredly, which in my experience, it was, up to 1982, when it stopped.

    This is not to be confused by vicious beatings and physical violence and abuse against kids by some bastard teachers/priests/nuns etc- something totally different altogether.

    I confess, having read the entire thread from the start, I'm a bit surprised, maybe even bemused, by how people's minds are "boggled" or "shocked" by standard corporal punishment stories- it didn't have a lasting effect on me at least, nor on my school friends. But then again, our school wasn't known for it's over-use of violence which obviously, was a good thing- but the did administer corporal punishment.

    I would argue that corporal punishment did have a lasting effect on you, because you are not shocked by it’s use


This discussion has been closed.
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