A380 officially cancelled.

jasper100 · 13-02-2019 5:41pm #1

Could be all over tomorrow.

https://simpleflying.com/airbus-a380-production-end/

billie1b · 13-02-2019 6:35pm

No loss really

ED E · 13-02-2019 6:43pm

Point to point services are great for customers. Quiet planes too. Win win.

tipp_tipp_tipp · 13-02-2019 10:54pm

Used to work at Airbus. Left about 2 years ago. Last piece of work I did was on the A380 plus. Was a lot of optimism that Emirates would save the day with a large order, that would a least keep the program ticking over for some years to come. Sad to see it come to an end if this does indeed come to pass tomorrow.

Noxegon · 13-02-2019 11:22pm

billie1b wrote: »

No loss really

Disagree. As a passenger who frequently does high volume trunk routes, I love the A380. I'll be sorry to see it go (though I guess Emirates will get another decade out of the ones they have).

killbillvol2 · 13-02-2019 11:31pm

billie1b wrote: »

No loss really

You've obviously never flown on one.

billie1b · 14-02-2019 12:00am

killbillvol2 wrote: »

You've obviously never flown on one.

No not one but 3 and I genuinely hate them, just my opinion though

beauf · 14-02-2019 12:14am

billie1b wrote: »

No not one but 3 and I genuinely hate them, just my opinion though

Why?

dastardly00 · 14-02-2019 12:26am

I flew once in economy (DXB to CHC) and once in business class (AUK to DXB) with Emirates. The A380 was amazing

Brennus335 · 14-02-2019 6:20am

Now confirmed by Airbus. Last A380 will be delivered in 2021.

Emirates cancels 39 orders, replaces with 40 A330neo's & 30 A350's.

https://www.airbus.com/newsroom/press-releases/en/2019/02/airbus-and-emirates-reach-agreement-on-a380-fleet--sign-new-widebody-orders.html

irishrover99 · 14-02-2019 9:46am

Really disappointing news.
Best airplane ever to fly on as a passenger and pisses all over the 747, at least in my opinion.

sk8board · 14-02-2019 9:57am

I remember reading when it was launched that it was a massive gamble and the first time airbus and Boeing differed completely on the future of passenger travel.
Airbus backed the ‘hub and spokes’, with the world flying in smaller planes to a major hub airport and then get a massive plane to another hub airport and on to their destination.
Meanwhile Boeing figured the world would use medium sized Dreamliner planes and fly direct from any airport, and just upgrade the 747 and 777 to suit the bigger needs.

The airport infrastructure requirement is a big killer of the a380 too. A shame all the same.

My first time was going business on a brand new Air France one Paris to Singapore soon after they started deliveries. Amazing experience at the time.

The future is a bright world of a350’s and 787’s.

14-02-2019 10:01am

Aw man. I only got to fly on an A380 once from Sydney to Auckland. Despite sitting in economy, and having two heavy set men sitting next to me, I've never felt so comfortable on a flight.
Hopefully I'll still get to travel on one again in the future.

irishrover99 · 14-02-2019 10:02am

sk8board wrote: »

I remember reading when it was launched that it was a massive gamble and the first time airbus and Boeing differed completely on the future of passenger travel.
Airbus backed the ‘hub and spokes’, with the world flying in smaller planes to a major hub airport and then get a massive plane to another hub airport and on to their destination.
Meanwhile Boeing figured the world would use medium sized Dreamliner planes and fly direct from any airport, and just upgrade the 747 and 777 to suit the bigger needs.

The airport infrastructure requirement is a big killer of the a380 too. A shame all the same.

My first time was going business on a brand new Air France one Paris to Singapore soon after they started deliveries. Amazing experience at the time.

The future is a bright world of a350’s and 787’s.

Yes, but boring, kinda like Formula E

Wanderer78 · 14-02-2019 10:03am

Deleted User wrote:

Aw man. I only got to fly on an A380 once from Sydney to Auckland. Despite sitting in economy, and having two heavy set men sitting next to me, I've never felt so comfortable on a flight. Hopefully I'll still get to travel on one again in the future.

I'd imagine it ll still be in service for some time yet

14-02-2019 10:35am

its a shame, but I can't help thinking that this was more of a vanity project for Airbus than anything else.

sailing · 14-02-2019 11:12am

I was in Toulouse a couple of years ago collecting a new aircraft from Airbus at their delivery centre. Having spend a few days there a manager told me at the time that 2019 looked like the end of the road for the 380. In his words he said they predicted to just break even by then on the project, which I think was more than just a little white lie and production would stop.
Emirates were their only real major customer and they were starting to twitch about it in a new era of more efficient two engine aircraft with huge ETOPS certification.
Long haul future is the 350/330 Neo for airbus.
Personally never liked the look of it, never matched up to the 747, which itself is also on it’s lap for passenger ops. The days of 4 engines for long haul are unfortunately coming to an end. Too costly.

Nijmegen · 14-02-2019 11:14am

Last one will be produced 2021, so you'll be flying them a while yet. Qatar have said they'll get rid of theirs once they're 10 years old. I wonder if there'll be a secondary market for them that we don't see yet, ala the new lease of life the 757 got after its retirement from production. Maybe someone will figure out how to stick a giant cargo door on one of them or something.

GBX · 14-02-2019 11:29am

I haven't flown one yet but hopefully will before they take them out of service. I love the look of them. Shame production is being stopped.

Gael23 · 14-02-2019 1:05pm

Haven’t had the chance to travel on one. Was hoping to but Emirates fares for this year are way over the top.
End of a chapter in Aviation nonetheless

kilburn · 14-02-2019 1:21pm

I imagine the second hand market would be limited enough considering tbe costs involved with a new fit out

sk8board · 14-02-2019 1:28pm

kilburn wrote: »

I imagine the second hand market would be limited enough considering tbe costs involved with a new fit out

Considering one was already scrapped for parts, I’d say the secondary market will either require MASSIVE depreciation, or else will just be a parts market.

No airport will build the infastructure this late in the game, so It would mean the market is limited to secondary airlines at an existing compatible airport.
That’s a pretty short list

IngazZagni · 14-02-2019 1:37pm

It has been a long time coming. I can only imagine that the losses Airbus have incurred on the A380 have been collosol. Emirates are probably getting their remaining A380s at cost price or less just to keep the factories ticking over.

It also shows that Dublin Airport were absolutely correct to not invest huge sums of money on trying to accommodate this aircraft. Only the spotters wanted that.

It is a nice plane to fly on as a passenger though, I'll give it that.

sk8board · 14-02-2019 2:21pm

I still remember seeing the takeoff from the tail camera and thinking it was the best thing ever fitted to anything in the history of the world, ever

Van.Bosch · 14-02-2019 2:35pm

kilburn wrote: »

I imagine the second hand market would be limited enough considering tbe costs involved with a new fit out

And the limited number of airports that can handle them.

tototoe · 14-02-2019 2:43pm

Never flew in one, but so impressive as a piece of engineering when i saw it in Shannon.

arubex · 14-02-2019 4:49pm

sk8board wrote: »

Meanwhile Boeing figured the world would use medium sized Dreamliner planes and fly direct from any airport, and just upgrade the 747 and 777 to suit the bigger needs.

Yes, but Boeing was wrong too. Point-to-point between secondary airports is still rare and the 787 didn't change that. The vast majority of them replaced 767s and some older 777s on trunk runs from hubs like New York / Chicago / Heathrow / Schiphol / Dublin etc. It's amusing & disappointing to look at FR24 and see a line of 787s behind A380s on final to some mega-airport.

The day I can board a 787 in Belfast and fly to Macau is the day they win that prediction.

Mebuntu · 14-02-2019 4:57pm

Aegir wrote: »

its a shame, but I can't help thinking that this was more of a vanity project for Airbus than anything else.

Yes...and more than a mite of arrogance to boot.

Lorddrakul · 14-02-2019 5:01pm

Never been aboard one, but have always admired the engineering and the direction.

Can't help but feel it is something of a regression.

Not on the order of magnitude of the loss of Concorde from active duty, but still.

I would tend to agree that the writing is simply on the wall for 4 spoolers, but it feels like a loss nonetheless.

CiboC · 14-02-2019 5:45pm

I only flew on it once, from Dubai to Tokyo with Eremites.

12 hour flight in business class, I didn't want to get off at the end - my hotel room in Tokyo was smaller than my 'cabin' on the 380....!

I'll miss it...

Nijmegen · 14-02-2019 5:58pm

In pax config there are currently 425 x 777's on order and 1,258 in service and 700 x 787's on order and 445 in service. 773 x A350 on order and 36 in service, and 327 x A330 on order and 1,183 in service. 1,100 Airbus orders to 1,125 Boeing between the 4 twin types; and 1,703 Boeing in service to 1,219 Airbus. It actually looks pretty evenly matched on orders.

195 x A380 in service and now a much reduced order book. 32 x 747-8I in service and 9 on order. Quads are dead forever for pax, and even in the freight market (where there'll always be a volume capacity requirement) there's only been 67 x 747-8F deliveries and 8 orders on the books.

davepatr07 · 14-02-2019 6:41pm

Shame it’s being finished, it is ugly to look at compared to the elegant Queen of the Skies B747 however as a passenger it’s luxury even for economy.

Along with Qatar and Lufthansa the best experience was Emirates the few times between ME and Oz, for 13-14 hrs it was worth it.

Even though I never flew Premium Economy, Business or First on it there was the one time I flew on the upper deck at the back where Lufthansa have a small economy section, that was luxury in itself.

john boye · 14-02-2019 6:43pm

Nijmegen wrote: »

In pax config there are currently 425 x 777's on order and 1,258 in service and 700 x 787's on order and 445 in service. 773 x A350 on order and 36 in service, and 327 x A330 on order and 1,183 in service. 1,100 Airbus orders to 1,125 Boeing between the 4 twin types; and 1,703 Boeing in service to 1,219 Airbus. It actually looks pretty evenly matched on orders.

195 x A380 in service and now a much reduced order book. 32 x 747-8I in service and 9 on order. Quads are dead forever for pax, and even in the freight market (where there'll always be a volume capacity requirement) there's only been 67 x 747-8F deliveries and 8 orders on the books.

I agree with the point you're making but those orders/deliveries numbers sound about 2 years out of date.

bk · 14-02-2019 7:14pm

kilburn wrote: »

I imagine the second hand market would be limited enough considering tbe costs involved with a new fit out

It is interesting how similar the trends in the airline industry can be similar to the bus/coach market.

Bus Eireann can't sell their big tri-axle double decker coaches. Simply no second hand market for it. Too big for the normal school bus use and too old, big, thirsty and bus like for the touring/coach market.

Wanderer78 · 14-02-2019 7:16pm

bk wrote:

Bus Eireann can't sell their big tri-axle double decker coaches. Simply no second hand market for it. Too big for the normal school bus use and too old, big, thirsty and bus like for the touring/coach market.

More expensive to run to I'd imagine

sk8board · 14-02-2019 7:25pm

arubex wrote: »

Yes, but Boeing was wrong too. Point-to-point between secondary airports is still rare and the 787 didn't change that. The vast majority of them replaced 767s and some older 777s on trunk runs from hubs like New York / Chicago / Heathrow / Schiphol / Dublin etc. It's amusing & disappointing to look at FR24 and see a line of 787s behind A380s on final to some mega-airport.

The day I can board a 787 in Belfast and fly to Macau is the day they win that prediction.

As an example, you can fly the Dreamliner from dublin to Addis (ethiopian), Providence (NAS) and from this June to Calgary (Westjet - I’m taking the family on it June 27th for the summer hols, can’t wait).
All are pretty secondary airports in an a380 context.

bk · 14-02-2019 7:54pm

Wanderer78 wrote: »

More expensive to run to I'd imagine

Yep, just like the A380 I'd guess. Require more fuel then a normal coach. Ok on a per passenger basis, but only if you fill all 100 seats. Much easier to fill 50 seats on a regular coach, then a 100 on one of these. Not many routes with that demand. Just like the A380...

Also big size means you can't fit them down narrow roads. Tourist places like Ring of Kerry, etc. Not a hope. Again like the infrastructure issue (airports) that the A380 face.

The one unique issue if that the lower deck is low floor, which makes the entire lower deck unsuitable for passengers on tourist coaches. They normally want a high view to see the countryside, so kills it for tourist use.

Interestingly what has been more successful are something called overdeckers. Basically a single decker coach, where they slightly increase the roof, but not as much as a double decker, so you can put seats above the driver. Almost looks like a normal single deck coach, but adds an extra 20 seats or so and works perfectly as a tourist coach so in high demand in that market.

The overdeckers kind of remind me of how the airline manufacturers have stretched their dual engine widebodies to fit in more passengers and add more range. An easier to sell product.

Sorry for the OT, I just thought it is an interesting parallel.

no.8 · 14-02-2019 7:58pm

. Personally never liked the look of it, never matched up to the 747, which itself is also on itâ€™s lap for passenger ops. The days of 4 engines for long haul are unfortunately coming to an end. Too costly.[/quote]

While the 747 is the queen of the skies in my eyes, to say that it never matched up to the 747 is a lie, it more than exceeds the jumbo in basically all facets of operations. The industry model has changed. Having said that Singapore airlines 380's (for example) were configured with far too few seats

john boye · 14-02-2019 8:09pm

sk8board wrote: »

As an example, you can fly the Dreamliner from dublin to Addis (ethiopian), Providence (NAS) and from this June to Calgary (Westjet - I’m taking the family on it June 27th for the summer hols, can’t wait).
All are pretty secondary airports in an a380 context.

In fairness, AB didn't get it completely wrong. Their prediction was that hub airports were reaching capacity and were going to be increasing slot-restricted so airlines would need to consolidate flights on VLAs. I think a look at the business now would tell you they pretty much got the first part right but the second part was a much tougher nut to crack.

BlackandGreen · 14-02-2019 8:15pm

Flew on an air france one. It wasn't very comfortable, or at least no more comfortable than other wide body jets.

I had a far more comfortable experience in a 1980's 747 with KLM.

It pretty much boils down to the airline imo, with only a small portion of it being the aircraft itself.

As far as airbusses go the most comfortable one I've flown on is the A330 by a mile with several different airlines.

Lovely aircraft to see though, and certainly an impressive feat of engineering. I presume we'll see these continue to fly for at least another 10-20 years.

pistolpetes11 · 14-02-2019 8:31pm

I was on one on route to Hong Kong back in October 17 , I remember getting up to take stroll to stretch the legs and heard one of the lads I was travelling with call my name .

There he was parked up at A full spirit and champagne bar they had the back of the plane , never seen the likes of it before in my life and may not again but it was some flight

Creamy Goodness · 14-02-2019 8:48pm

lucky enough to have flown on one of these (both Emirates and Etihad). Etihad has the better seat, but Emirates has the better bar, the bar is something else. Really passes the time in style.

jesus_thats_gre · 14-02-2019 9:17pm

TeaBagMania wrote: »

Leave it to Scarebus to come up with such a stupid concept
Boeing was already ramping down 747 production
Yeah lets build a bigger jet, great idea

I do wonder how much they benefited elsewhere from the technology innovations required to make the a380 happen.

Gael23 · 14-02-2019 9:29pm

How long will EK keep the A380 in its fleet for?
Also will be interesting to see what’s next for Airbus

sk8board · 14-02-2019 9:29pm

did the 380s require two take off slots also?

Was on an Emirates 380 one time Melbourne to Auckland and the captain announced that as the reason for a small taxi delay, before he gave it the berries.

donkey balls · 15-02-2019 12:09am

A company I use to work for was going be the launch customer for the freighter version, They reckoned it be able to carry nearly twice the payload of the MD11/DC10 at the time.
I remember at the time of the production of the 380 we upgraded a lot of the hubs so they could accommodate the aircraft, One thing that we wondered about was how would the ULD on the upper deck be off loaded would they have an internal loader (Adding to the MTOW) or build newer main deck loaders.
The company ended up cancelling the order but have options for other aircraft possibly the A330 F, I have only seen one from a distance in LHR and MAN what really stuck out was the tail the size of it a friend of mine travels to China a lot and told me it is really comfortable compared to the 777.

Cookiemunster · 15-02-2019 12:20am

TeaBagMania wrote: »

Ah i see how it work, you don't like someones comment so you call them a troll.
Ok Troll

In fairness, you did refer to Airbus as Scarebus......

plodder · 15-02-2019 12:40am

no.8 wrote: »

. Personally never liked the look of it, never matched up to the 747, which itself is also on it’s lap for passenger ops. The days of 4 engines for long haul are unfortunately coming to an end. Too costly.

While the 747 is the queen of the skies in my eyes, to say that it never matched up to the 747 is a lie, it more than exceeds the jumbo in basically all facets of operations. The industry model has changed. Having said that Singapore airlines 380's (for example) were configured with far too few seats

Actually, I was surprised to read (on wikipedia) today that the 747-8, which is still in production, is more fuel efficient per seat than the A380 on sector lengths up to 13,000 km.

Have seen them up close but haven't flown on one yet. The one thing that puts me off, is the idea of flying with up to 800 people never appealed that much.

Hotblack Desiato · 15-02-2019 1:02am

BlackandGreen wrote: »

As far as airbusses go the most comfortable one I've flown on is the A330 by a mile with several different airlines.

340 was so much quieter inside the cabin than the 330 but its economics are dire.

Hopefully we'll still see passenger 380s in the skies for a couple of decades to come, although it's possible that within ten years most will be converted to freighters, or parted out and scrapped

donkey balls · 15-02-2019 1:12am

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

340 was so much quieter inside the cabin than the 330 but its economics are dire.

Hopefully we'll still see passenger 380s in the skies for a couple of decades to come, although it's possible that within ten years most will be converted to freighters, or parted out and scrapped

Cannot see them getting the freighter conversion when the likes of FEDEX &UPS cancelled the original orders for them, Saying that if they were too I wonder could the nose be reworked that it opens like the 747F.
The nose door is what really separates the 747F from other freighters as it can take long/abnormal loads.

OU812 · 15-02-2019 9:35am

Serious question(s):

Is there any reason Boeing couldn't re-work the 747 airframe into a long haul with two engines? If so, why have they not done it?

A380 officially cancelled.

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