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Mobile phones and other electronic devices in school

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  • 10-02-2019 2:20pm
    #1
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭


    I'm not even sure what my overall question is but being a sub in and out to different school the whole mobile phone and devices is something I see all the time. Some kids want to have phones out in class all the time,some trying to listen to music when my back is turned and I am helping a student with work.In another school some of the class had tablets and some had phones with e books on them.That was hard to manage too as I wondered were all the kids with the phones using their ebooks or looking at something else and I was going around trying to check tiny screens, ( actually I think those kids had actual books as the e books can't be displayed on a mobile phone )

    I know schools have filters or whatever to block social media sites but I just think we need to talk about all of this or at least I do anyway.Do schools have a whole school policy around phones and use of technology or is it down to each individual teacher? Can a teacher collect phones at start of class and give back at the end? I have so many questions but have found that sometimes the phones and technology can interfere with the learning and be distracting. It's a challenge.I realise that technology has a place in the classroom but it's trying to manage it and make sure everyone is on the same page literally.

    Any thoughts/ advice / discussion on this topic would be most welcome.


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    #2
    rainbowtrout
    Registered Users Posts: 15,381 ✭✭✭✭rainbowtrout


    If you are subbing in a school best thing to do when you go in is ask what is the policy on mobile phones and then follow that. My school has a ban on phones, if they are caught with them it's confiscated for three weeks. It works very well.


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    #3
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    rainbowtrout wrote: »
    If you are subbing in a school best thing to do when you go in is ask what is the policy on mobile phones and then follow that. My school has a ban on phones, if they are caught with them it's confiscated for three weeks. It works very well.

    Thank you Rainbow Trout I will do that.It's just hard to know from school to school.My own kids primary school is very strict and notes come home regularly reminding us that the children must not bring in mobile phones or devices but it seems to me that in some schools that it seems to be a grey area and I don't know if I am within my right to take the phones and leave on teacher desk till the end of class.Then as I have said if some children have e books on devices etc. It's just not easy to manage.


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    #4
    TheDriver
    Registered Users Posts: 12,398 ✭✭✭✭TheDriver


    There needs to be a definite policy for the whole school. Having said that, it's the one thing that parents just don't get from a school policy perspective i.e. They wouldn't break any rules but mobile phone ones seem to be OK to break.


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    #5
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,118 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Greatest curse ever.


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    #6
    amacca
    Registered Users Posts: 6,756 ✭✭✭amacca


    spurious wrote: »
    Greatest curse ever.

    yup in my experience,for every time they are useful (calculator, research, educational apps/feedback etc) there are ten more times where they get in the way/distract/derail... even when they have a use as above its very hard if not impossible to police their use

    I also wonder if there is potential for GDPR related risks with them now also?


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    #7
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    amacca wrote: »
    yup in my experience,for every time they are useful (calculator, research, educational apps/feedback etc) there are ten more times where they get in the way/distract/derail... even when they have a use as above its very hard if not impossible to police their use

    I also wonder if there is potential for GDPR related risks with them now also?

    Yip really hard to police their use, as you say fine if they are using them for educational purposes but what of the rest, possible distraction etc. Almost every student at secondary has a phone now and that isn't going to change so I suppose it is about how this is managed but that's the difficult part.As regards GDPR very good question.


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    #8
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    TheDriver wrote: »
    There needs to be a definite policy for the whole school. Having said that, it's the one thing that parents just don't get from a school policy perspective i.e. They wouldn't break any rules but mobile phone ones seem to be OK to break.

    That's true actually probably because most people have one and maybe some parents don't stop to think about how distracting they can be in a school environment.


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    #9
    happywithlife
    Registered Users Posts: 1,324 ✭✭✭happywithlife


    up until recently we allowed them "at teacher's discretion" as some of us - myself included- found it handy for taking a pic of the board maybe at end of class to help with homework; or they snapped a picture of the page in their textbook as they tend to leave them in the classrooms (DEIS school and no culture of doing work at home. vast majority of "homework" is done in free classes)
    anyway due to a few instances of misuse across a few years phones are now completly banned this year. to be honest it's a pain in the rear. although the offical rule is phones are to be confiscated if seen not one teacher has gone that route - at best its a put it on the teacher's desk until the end of class. even this has resulted in several stand off's so far.
    I counted out of interest how many phones I could see sticking out of student's pockets during the pre's the other day and let's just say it was into double digits. I don't know how the school plan to tackle a particular cohort during the state exams as they literally will point blank refuse to be separated from their phones. some of these are just going through the motions till they are of age to leave school and so the threat of being barred from the state exams / results withheld are no deterrent
    But to the OP I'd find out from each school what their policy is and stick to that.


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    #10
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    happywithlife wrote: »
    up until recently we allowed them "at teacher's discretion" as some of us - myself included- found it handy for taking a pic of the board maybe at end of class to help with homework; or they snapped a picture of the page in their textbook as they tend to leave them in the classrooms (DEIS school and no culture of doing work at home. vast majority of "homework" is done in free classes)
    anyway due to a few instances of misuse across a few years phones are now completly banned this year. to be honest it's a pain in the rear. although the offical rule is phones are to be confiscated if seen not one teacher has gone that route - at best its a put it on the teacher's desk until the end of class. even this has resulted in several stand off's so far.
    I counted out of interest how many phones I could see sticking out of student's pockets during the pre's the other day and let's just say it was into double digits. I don't know how the school plan to tackle a particular cohort during the state exams as they literally will point blank refuse to be separated from their phones. some of these are just going through the motions till they are of age to leave school and so the threat of being barred from the state exams / results withheld are no deterrent
    But to the OP I'd find out from each school what their policy is and stick to that.

    Easy to picture the stand offs as kids won't be easily parted from their phones and some just don't care re school rules.Never thought about the state exams but wow that is some absolute headache and nightmare for management.It's just gone crazy.


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    #11
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,118 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    Every year the Superintendents send phones to Athlone along with lots of reports about them being used/on the person/found in exam halls. There is no excuse from the candidate's side. There is no 'I did not know'. It is announced and on posters everywhere. It's basic cop-on, which admittedly is in short supply these days.

    I know of an exam where the candidate had been merrily answering away (clearly aided by internet searches) but following the removal of the phone was suddenly not so good at their factual recall.

    Stupid chances to take. I suppose it will only be when one of their pals is caught that some will get the message.


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    #12
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    spurious wrote: »
    Every year the Superintendents send phones to Athlone along with lots of reports about them being used/on the person/found in exam halls. There is no excuse from the candidate's side. There is no 'I did not know'. It is announced and on posters everywhere. It's basic cop-on, which admittedly is in short supply these days.

    I know of an exam where the candidate had been merrily answering away (clearly aided by internet searches) but following the removal of the phone was suddenly not so good at their factual recall.

    Stupid chances to take. I suppose it will only be when one of their pals is caught that some will get the message.

    Extremely foolish but as has been said already some kids just won't be parted from their phones completely hooked and dependent on them. And maybe the younger they start with phones the harder it is for them to disengage . Totally unacceptable in a state exam though or any exam. And you'd have to wonder where are the parents in all of this surely they would be telling their kids that phones are a no go in an exam hall.Not saying all kids will listen of course but still state exams are a biggie.


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    #13
    judeboy101
    Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 3,246 ✭✭✭judeboy101


    rainbowtrout wrote: »
    If you are subbing in a school best thing to do when you go in is ask what is the policy on mobile phones and then follow that. My school has a ban on phones, if they are caught with them it's confiscated for three weeks. It works very well.

    Out of curiosity, does that apply to students 18 yrs old? Surely that's illegal?


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    #14
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,192 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    rainbowtrout wrote: »
    If you are subbing in a school best thing to do when you go in is ask what is the policy on mobile phones and then follow that. My school has a ban on phones, if they are caught with them it's confiscated for three weeks. It works very well.

    This post kind of amazed me. That it worked well.
    When I went to secondary school we all had basic camera phones up until about 5th year and some got smart phone when they started to appear.(Mainly Blackberrys)
    We had a policy if were caught with your phone it would be confiscated for a month first offence. Second until the end of the term and third until the end of the year.
    It didn't stop any of us using phones for a lot of the day even in the strictest teachers class.
    Parents didn't care and would often text for son at school.
    Have kids/teenagers gone all good all of a sudden regarding this if it works really well?
    If you did get caught you'd just pull an old phone out of your bag and hand it up.
    One guy had an iPhone for when we were doing our leaving cert and he took photos of his notes and spent the majority of the time looking at them and a good few copied him in the next few days.
    To the OP. Just follow the schools policy. I wouldn't collect phones at the start of class. You could just end up with a lot of hassle.


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    #15
    spurious
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Education Moderators Posts: 27,118 CMod ✭✭✭✭spurious


    I dream of the day when someone invents a Faraday cage that can block out mobile signals around a whole building.

    The world will not fall in. People will not stop breathing.


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    #16
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,192 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    spurious wrote: »
    I dream of the day when someone invents a Faraday cage that can block out mobile signals around a whole building.

    The world will not fall in. People will not stop breathing.

    You'd probably be still be able to use basic apps if they did!


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    #17
    joebloggs32
    Registered Users Posts: 1,592 ✭✭✭joebloggs32


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    This post kind of amazed me. That it worked well.
    When I went to secondary school we all had basic camera phones up until about 5th year and some got smart phone when they started to appear.(Mainly Blackberrys)
    We had a policy if were caught with your phone it would be confiscated for a month first offence. Second until the end of the term and third until the end of the year.
    It didn't stop any of us using phones for a lot of the day even in the strictest teachers class.
    Parents didn't care and would often text for son at school.
    Have kids/teenagers gone all good all of a sudden regarding this if it works really well?
    If you did get caught you'd just pull an old phone out of your bag and hand it up.
    One guy had an iPhone for when we were doing our leaving cert and he took photos of his notes and spent the majority of the time looking at them and a good few copied him in the next few days.
    To the OP. Just follow the schools policy. I wouldn't collect phones at the start of class. You could just end up with a lot of hassle.

    Imagine the chaos when the phones are being handed back. Johnnys the last one up to collect it and someone already pocketed johnny's iPhone x.


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    #18
    magister71
    Registered Users Posts: 11 ✭magister71


    As far as I know, from the days I last was a superintendent, around 2012, if a phone went off, you wouldn't/couldn't take the phone, but rather made a report etc. My daughter, in fifth-year, tells me that a number of her friends are going to bring in phones into the L Cert and when going to the toilet etc. will look up the answers. I told her not to dare to do anything as stupid, but I imagine a number of students might do this as it's hard really to monitor.

    As for the OP, check in each school and see what the policy is, but I think that technology is part of life now, so rather than trying to have blanket bans, which never really work, discretion for legitimate purposes should be allowed.


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    #19
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    joebloggs32 wrote: »
    Imagine the chaos when the phones are being handed back. Johnnys the last one up to collect it and someone already pocketed johnny's iPhone x.

    Worked in a UK school where kids had to hand over their phones at the school reception each morning and they got them back at the end of the school day. Couple of school secretaries collected them and the kids would queue up I don't know how they managed it but it seemed to work.But then maybe the odd day Johnny ended up with the wrong phone !


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    #20
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,192 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    Blaizes wrote: »
    Worked in a UK school where kids had to hand over their phones at the school reception each morning and they got them back at the end of the school day. Couple of school secretaries collected them and the kids would queue up I don't know how they managed it but it seemed to work.But then maybe the odd day Johnny ended up with the wrong phone !

    If you had this policy wouldn't you just hand in old phone and use your phone during the day.


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    #21
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    freshpopcorn wrote: »
    If you had this policy wouldn't you just hand in old phone and use your phone during the day.

    Maybe so but it didn't seem to happen in the school I was in, perhaps they hadn't thought of it but this was over ten years ago when phones probably weren't as popular and certainly not as advanced as now so maybe they didn't feel they were loosing out so much by handing them over. But now yes they could easily hand up an old one and keep the good one in their pocket.


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    #22
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    magister71 wrote: »
    As far as I know, from the days I last was a superintendent, around 2012, if a phone went off, you wouldn't/couldn't take the phone, but rather made a report etc. My daughter, in fifth-year, tells me that a number of her friends are going to bring in phones into the L Cert and when going to the toilet etc. will look up the answers. I told her not to dare to do anything as stupid, but I imagine a number of students might do this as it's hard really to monitor.

    As for the OP, check in each school and see what the policy is, but I think that technology is part of life now, so rather than trying to have blanket bans, which never really work, discretion for legitimate purposes should be allowed.

    From watching the students in LC exams during supervision they're fairly tight for time in most exams. So say if you were stuck on a question and you had all your notes and 4g it would be a good bit of time to go out and get the answer then head back in and recall it and write it down. If it's a detailed essay I suppose you'd remember a good few points. But I think you'd have to be pretty organised to have all your ducks in a row with all the solutions on hand, so in that case you're probably organised enough to study.

    No doubt it would give you and edge, but i reckon it would be of more benefit to the mid grades than those at the higher grades.

    I was supervising the mocks and noticed a student had gone out 3 times during a 2 hour exam. What can you do though, we request that students leave heir phones on the teacher's table before the exam, should all be obliged to do it?


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    #23
    joebloggs32
    Registered Users Posts: 1,592 ✭✭✭joebloggs32


    Blaizes wrote: »
    Maybe so but it didn't seem to happen in the school I was in, perhaps they hadn't thought of it but this was over ten years ago when phones probably weren't as popular and certainly not as advanced as now so maybe they didn't feel they were loosing out so much by handing them over. But now yes they could easily hand up an old one and keep the good one in their pocket.

    If you had 1000 pupils in the school it would take all morning to get them in. Same in the afternoon as they leave, and then kids leaving early constantly looking for their phone back.
    Then safely securing 1000 phones each worth say an average of €300 would be a real headache.


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    #24
    Uinseann_16
    Registered Users Posts: 757 ✭✭✭Uinseann_16


    spurious wrote: »
    I dream of the day when someone invents a Faraday cage that can block out mobile signals around a whole building.

    The world will not fall in. People will not stop breathing.

    Its called a signal jammer and its illegal to use as it could prevent someone calling the emergency services...
    its about the size of a phone with a small antenna attached you can buy them off aliexpress and the likes


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    #25
    evolving_doors
    Closed Accounts Posts: 11,812 ✭✭✭✭evolving_doors


    joebloggs32 wrote: »
    If you had 1000 pupils in the school it would take all morning to get them in. Same in the afternoon as they leave, and then kids leaving early constantly looking for their phone back.
    Then safely securing 1000 phones each worth say an average of €300 would be a real headache.

    then who's responsible if one come out scratched.

    That would be a full time post managing all those phones.

    Might be a way to generate some cash for the school if they rented out charging points.


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    #26
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,192 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    evolving_doors wrote: »
    From watching the students in LC exams during supervision they're fairly tight for time in most exams. So say if you were stuck on a question and you had all your notes and 4g it would be a good bit of time to go out and get the answer then head back in and recall it and write it down. If it's a detailed essay I suppose you'd remember a good few points. But I think you'd have to be pretty organised to have all your ducks in a row with all the solutions on hand, so in that case you're probably organised enough to study.

    No doubt it would give you and edge, but i reckon it would be of more benefit to the mid grades than those at the higher grades.

    I was supervising the mocks and noticed a student had gone out 3 times during a 2 hour exam. What can you do though, we request that students leave heir phones on the teacher's table before the exam, should all be obliged to do it?

    I've seen people in secondary school and college take photos of their books/notes and take them out in the exam and get away with it.


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    #27
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    joebloggs32 wrote: »
    If you had 1000 pupils in the school it would take all morning to get them in. Same in the afternoon as they leave, and then kids leaving early constantly looking for their phone back.
    Then safely securing 1000 phones each worth say an average of €300 would be a real headache.

    Our school was smaller and not every student had a phone but I'd still say they took in well over a hundred phones a day and it was crazy in reception with several secretaries running around putting them in trays, no way would any school here have the manpower to do it and with 1,000 phones yes you can definitely forget it.And then as you say there is the issue of safety and insurance. It would be interesting to know if they still do it in UK schools or maybe they can't now due to privacy laws, etc plus it just simply being unmanageable by sheer scale.


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    #28
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    evolving_doors wrote: »
    then who's responsible if one come out scratched.

    That would be a full time post managing all those phones.

    Might be a way to generate some cash for the school if they rented out charging points.

    Great TY project idea there for some of the kids!


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    #29
    kccamper
    Registered Users Posts: 14 ✭kccamper


    I work in a large mixed school (over 1000 pupils) and phoned are banned. Any use or sighting of a phone results in a three week ban and parents have to sign the phone out at the end. I confiscated one phone in 5 years and have not seen any others. Every teacher enforces the rule and as a result we have zero use in class or in corridors. Students have their phones in their bags but the prospect of being without their most important limb dissuades the vast majority. Our school is 11 years old and this rule has always been in place. I can imagine it would be a nightmare to introduce retrospectively and I sincerely empathise with the OP but unless there is a whole school policy, with implementation across the board, it is very difficult to manage.


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    #30
    freshpopcorn
    Registered Users Posts: 30,192 ✭✭✭✭freshpopcorn


    kccamper wrote: »
    I work in a large mixed school (over 1000 pupils) and phoned are banned. Any use or sighting of a phone results in a three week ban and parents have to sign the phone out at the end. I confiscated one phone in 5 years and have not seen any others. Every teacher enforces the rule and as a result we have zero use in class or in corridors. Students have their phones in their bags but the prospect of being without their most important limb dissuades the vast majority. Our school is 11 years old and this rule has always been in place. I can imagine it would be a nightmare to introduce retrospectively and I sincerely empathise with the OP but unless there is a whole school policy, with implementation across the board, it is very difficult to manage.

    Ye must have very good students!
    Our rule was even stricter than years and very few people followed it.
    I don't know if the teachers didn't see it or they didn't care.
    I know one would pounce on a phone anytime she could and you'd still chance it.


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    #31
    Blaizes
    Closed Accounts Posts: 809 ✭✭✭Blaizes


    kccamper wrote: »
    I work in a large mixed school (over 1000 pupils) and phoned are banned. Any use or sighting of a phone results in a three week ban and parents have to sign the phone out at the end. I confiscated one phone in 5 years and have not seen any others. Every teacher enforces the rule and as a result we have zero use in class or in corridors. Students have their phones in their bags but the prospect of being without their most important limb dissuades the vast majority. Our school is 11 years old and this rule has always been in place. I can imagine it would be a nightmare to introduce retrospectively and I sincerely empathise with the OP but unless there is a whole school policy, with implementation across the board, it is very difficult to manage.

    That sounds brilliant and well managed but as you say how to apply that retrospectively when kids are joined at the hip to their phones and so used to using them. Some completely addicted to them too probably.


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