Advertisement
If you have a new account but are having problems posting or verifying your account, please email us on hello@boards.ie for help. Thanks :)
Hello all! Please ensure that you are posting a new thread or question in the appropriate forum. The Feedback forum is overwhelmed with questions that are having to be moved elsewhere. If you need help to verify your account contact hello@boards.ie
Hi all! We have been experiencing an issue on site where threads have been missing the latest postings. The platform host Vanilla are working on this issue. A workaround that has been used by some is to navigate back from 1 to 10+ pages to re-sync the thread and this will then show the latest posts. Thanks, Mike.
Hi there,
There is an issue with role permissions that is being worked on at the moment.
If you are having trouble with access or permissions on regional forums please post here to get access: https://www.boards.ie/discussion/2058365403/you-do-not-have-permission-for-that#latest

Religious hate-speech in the UK or fearless speaker of truth?

123457

Comments

  • #302
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    recedite wrote: »
    The guy arrived on this thread and immediately called me an asshole, which personal insult has still not been withdrawn.
    In fairness, your response did you no favours and was dealt with by your friendly moderators within a few hours of both uncivil request and uncivil response being posted:

    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108842955&postcount=281

    In future, it would be better to report the post and the forum mods will take whatever action they deem necessary to restore order.


  • #303
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    it would be better to report the post
    Point taken, and you are correct.
    That said, I've never been one for reporting other people.


  • #304
    Strawberry1975
    Registered Users Posts: 70 ✭✭Strawberry1975


    recedite wrote: »
    Point taken, and you are correct.
    That said, I've never been one for reporting other people.
    You sure about that
    Easy thing to do
    It's the living with it ain't easy


  • #305
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    robindch wrote: »
    [...] the essence of recedite's claim is that, in the UK, people who self-describe as islamic are engaged in a range of actions in support of other people who also self-describe as islamic - such actions including attempting to delay or pervert the course of justice.
    Well, around a week has passed since the above request and, in line with the recent charter update:
    robindch wrote: »
    If the moderator judges that the claimant has not provided sufficient evidence to defend the claim, or if the claimant has simply avoided or ignored the request to support, then the moderators will make an inthread note that the claim has not been substantiated.
    ....your friendly mod team has judged, in the absence of any obvious effort by recedite to back up any element of the claim with evidence, that the claim is unsubstantiated. Therefore, should this claim be repeated, the mods reserve the right to declare it a dose of soapboxing, and deal with it appropriately.

    Thanking youze.


  • #306
    AllForIt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,477 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    Crikey - Look at the kind of ppl who make up Luton council.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3531852/Labour-councillor-20-suspended-claims-called-Hitler-greatest-man-history-latest-anti-Semitic-scandal-hit-Corbyn-s-party.htm


  • Advertisement
  • #307
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    AllForIt wrote: »
    Crikey - Look at the kind of ppl who make up Luton council.

    https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-3531852/Labour-councillor-20-suspended-claims-called-Hitler-greatest-man-history-latest-anti-Semitic-scandal-hit-Corbyn-s-party.htm

    Couple of years late there aren't you? Happened in April 2016 according to the BBC She's resigned from the council long since.


  • #308
    AllForIt
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 8,477 ✭✭✭AllForIt


    No but you see I was just wondering if she could have engaged in a range of actions in support of other people who also self-describe as islamic - such actions including attempting to delay or pervert the course of justice. Surely not, she looks like a peaceful Muslim with that nice hijab she's wearing indicative of a her devotion to Islam and peace. I've no proof to say she ever did but I'm just wondering to myself if she ever considered doing such a thing in her position of power in the council.


  • #309
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    AllForIt wrote: »
    No but you see I was just wondering if she could have engaged in a range of actions in support of other people who also self-describe as islamic - such actions including attempting to delay or pervert the course of justice. Surely not, she looks like a peaceful Muslim with that nice hijab she's wearing indicative of a her devotion to Islam and peace. I've no proof to say she ever did but I'm just wondering to myself if she ever considered doing such a thing in her position of power in the council.

    So what, idle speculation with nothing to support it then? Who knows what nefarious plots she hatched during her almost year long tenure in power as one of 48 Councillors for the greater Luton area. You do realise she was 16 when she made the dodgy tweets, 20 when she got into office and 21 when she got turfed back out of office again? What perversions of justice do you reckon she was capable of exactly?

    I'd imagine if you judged the character of any adult by the contents of their social media streams from their teenage years, most of them would be contain plenty of embarrassing stuff. I'd be rather more concerned by the likes of Tommy Robinson still posting hate speech as a supposed 'grown up'


  • #310
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,513 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    smacl wrote: »
    So what, idle speculation with nothing to support it then? Who knows what nefarious plots she hatched during her almost year long tenure in power as one of 48 Councillors for the greater Luton area. You do realise she was 16 when she made the dodgy tweets, 20 when she got into office and 21 when she got turfed back out of office again? What perversions of justice do you reckon she was capable of exactly?

    I'd imagine if you judged the character of any adult by the contents of their social media streams from their teenage years, most of them would be contain plenty of embarrassing stuff. I'd be rather more concerned by the likes of Tommy Robinson still posting hate speech as a supposed 'grown up'


    Or tracking down his critics and turning up at their door mob handed.


  • #311
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,513 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    AllForIt wrote: »
    No but you see I was just wondering if she could have engaged in a range of actions in support of other people who also self-describe as islamic - such actions including attempting to delay or pervert the course of justice. Surely not, she looks like a peaceful Muslim with that nice hijab she's wearing indicative of a her devotion to Islam and peace. I've no proof to say she ever did but I'm just wondering to myself if she ever considered doing such a thing in her position of power in the council.


    "I've got absolutely no basis for saying this but i will say it anyway and hope some of the mud sticks".



    Would that be an accurate summary of your post?


  • Advertisement
  • #312
    King Mob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,323 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    AllForIt wrote: »
    I've no proof to say she ever did but I'm just wondering to myself if she ever considered doing such a thing in her position of power in the council.
    And so, having this wild speculation with no evidence to support it means that it's an absolute fact that all Muslims in positions of power therefore abuse that power to aid and shield other Muslims?


  • #313
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    King Mob wrote: »
    And so, having this wild speculation with no evidence to support it means that it's an absolute fact that all Muslims in positions of power therefore abuse that power to aid and shield other Muslims?
    There you go assigning a falsified "claim" to somebody else again.
    What you have presented there is known as a "false dichotomy". A classic failure of logic.


  • #314
    King Mob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,323 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    recedite wrote: »
    There you go assigning a falsified "claim" to somebody else again.
    What you have presented there is known as a "false dichotomy". A classic failure of logic.
    No, it's more me pointing out how he's missed the point he is responding to.

    He's welcome to elaborate what he meant by bringing up empty baseless and underhanded accusations against someone unrelated.

    But to most of us it seems like it was a very poor attempt to defend yet more unsupported baseless accusations.

    If his argument wasn't what I poked fun at, what do you think it was supposed to be?

    Also, not sure what you mean by "There I go again.."


  • #315
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    King Mob wrote: »
    But to most of us it seems like it was a very poor attempt to defend yet more unsupported baseless accusations.
    If his argument wasn't what I poked fun at, what do you think it was supposed to be?
    It is what it says on the tin. There is a substantive difference between making a specific accusation/claim on the one hand, or just posing a question on the other hand...



    King Mob wrote: »
    Also, not sure what you mean by "There I go again.."
    You know very well that you were unable to quote any specific "false claim" I had supposedly made before embarking on your little witchhunt against me. So you relied on "implications" or "the essence" of my thoughts instead.


    So lets turn this around now, and maybe you answer some questions.


    1. Is it conceivable that a town/county councillor might "look after" their buddies if they got the opportunity?


    2. Is it conceivable that members of a religious community might prioritise "looking after" members of their own community as compared to the general public?
    Have you read the school patronage thread on this forum?


  • #316
    ohnonotgmail
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 40,513 ✭✭✭✭ohnonotgmail


    recedite wrote: »
    It is what it says on the tin. There is a substantive difference between making a specific accusation/claim on the one hand, or just posing a question on the other hand...




    You know very well that you were unable to quote any specific "false claim" I had supposedly made before embarking on your little witchhunt against me. So you relied on "implications" or "the essence" of my thoughts instead.


    So lets turn this around now, and maybe you answer some questions.


    1. Is it conceivable that a town/county councillor might "look after" their buddies if they got the opportunity?


    2. Is it conceivable that members of a religious community might prioritise "looking after" members of their own community as compared to the general public?
    Have you read the school patronage thread on this forum?




    Ahem

    robindch wrote: »
    Well, around a week has passed since the above request and, in line with the recent charter update:....your friendly mod team has judged, in the absence of any obvious effort by recedite to back up any element of the claim with evidence, that the claim is unsubstantiated. Therefore, should this claim be repeated, the mods reserve the right to declare it a dose of soapboxing, and deal with it appropriately.

    Thanking youze.


  • #317
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    There are a couple of posters on this thread whose main purpose in posting is to shut down debate.
    And that of course is related to the topic at hand.

    Whether Free Speech is something that should be sacrificed in the "antifa" and/or the "multi-culture" cause.
    And whether by trying to suppress dissent, you only make it stronger.


  • #318
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    recedite wrote: »
    1. Is it conceivable that a town/county councillor might "look after" their buddies if they got the opportunity?

    2. Is it conceivable that members of a religious community might prioritise "looking after" members of their own community as compared to the general public?

    Saying that something is conceivable is no indication that it is probable or even possible. For example, there are those that conceive of an omnipotent being who created us and watch over us, but on this forum at least, that assertion is considered specious until such time as there is evidence to support it. As per ohnonotgmail's last post, positing something you might find conceivable that suits your own narrative but has no supporting evidence is simple mud slinging.


  • #319
    King Mob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,323 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    recedite wrote: »
    It is what it says on the tin. There is a substantive difference between making a specific accusation/claim on the one hand, or just posing a question on the other hand...
    Sure. One is a blatant accusation.
    The other is a veiled accusation.

    "Just asking questions" is a pretty classic deflection tactic.

    Also, I did frame my point as a question. So does that mean I can use that excuse too?
    recedite wrote: »
    1. Is it conceivable that a town/county councillor might "look after" their buddies if they got the opportunity?


    2. Is it conceivable that members of a religious community might prioritise "looking after" members of their own community as compared to the general public?
    Conceivable, sure.
    Any evidence that this happened or happens?
    Any evidence that such people have also used their influence to pick on your poor old buddy Tony Robinson.

    I'm not trying to shut down discussion here.
    I'm asking you to substantiate your position and elaborate on it and not just ignore points because you find them awkward.
    But you don't seem willing or able to do that...

    Posting links about Muslims doing bad things and ignoring points isn't really a discussion.
    recedite wrote: »
    You know very well that you were unable to quote any specific "false claim" I had supposedly made before embarking on your little witchhunt against me. So you relied on "implications" or "the essence" of my thoughts instead.
    I specifically quoted and outlined it here:
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108863346&postcount=298


  • #320
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    King Mob wrote: »
    Also, I did frame my point as a question. So does that mean I can use that excuse too?
    You know it; that's why you stuck in the question mark at the end. It's a false dichotomy, also a strawman, almost attributed to somebody else but framed as a question. I can see you are a lover of sophistry.
    King Mob wrote: »
    I specifically quoted and outlined it here:
    https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=108863346&postcount=298
    I'm seeing a load of quotes. Can you quote the specific "false claim"?


  • #321
    King Mob
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 25,323 ✭✭✭✭King Mob


    recedite wrote: »
    You know it; that's why you stuck in the question mark at the end. It's a false dichotomy, also a strawman, almost attributed to somebody else but framed as a question. I can see you are a lover of sophistry.
    Again, he's welcome to explain how his vague empty accusation is relevant.
    Or you could take a crack at it since you seem to think his true meaning is so obvious.
    recedite wrote: »
    I'm seeing a load of quotes. Can you quote the specific "false claim"?
    The same one the mods asked you to substantiate.
    I explain it pretty thoroughly in that post.

    So again:
    Conceivable, sure.
    Any evidence that this happened or happens?
    Any evidence that such people have also used their influence to pick on your poor old buddy Tony Robinson?


  • Advertisement
  • #322
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    recedite wrote: »
    There are a couple of posters on this thread whose main purpose in posting is to shut down debate.
    I don't immediately recall any posts whose "main purpose" in any plausible sense "is to shut down debate".

    Which ones, in your opinion, meet this criterion?


  • #323
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Professor Jörg Meuthen, one of the AfD's lead snowflakes, briefly became incandescent at the appalling news that the famous Toblerone chocolate bar, produced next country south in Switzerland, was certified as halal-compliant.

    "Islamization does not take place -- neither in Germany nor in Europe. It is therefore certainly pure coincidence that the depicted, known chocolate variety is now certified as 'HALAL.'", Professor Meuthen raved.

    https://edition.cnn.com/2018/12/19/europe/toblerone-halal-boycott-scli-intl/index.html
    Mondelez, manufacturer of Toblerone wrote:
    The certification did not result in any change to our beloved traditional Toblerone original recipe [...]


  • #324
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,476 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    That's why I never see pork flavour Toblerones in the shops any more.

    Scrap the cap!



  • #325
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    Atheist and Free Speech advocate Douglas Murray discusses the thorny issue of Tommy Robinson.

    Murray famously labelled the whole concept of Islamophobia as "nonsense".
    And was much admired by noted atheist thinker and philosopher Christopher Hitchins, in his time.
    Christopher Hitchins wrote:
    Of course, the most flagrant offenders against morality and common sense are still the nihilistic pseudo-leftists, who claim to see no real difference between Western democracy and those who desire to murder its voters at random.


    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CjeXL7dh4gY


  • #326
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,543 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    Spectator writer approves of Tommy Robinson. Quel surprise.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • #327
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    After receiving another prison sentence for contempt of court and being sent to Belmarsh Prison, a fellow prisoner - this one an old age pensioner - appears to have taken issue with Yaxley-Lennon's attitude in the showers and decked our fearless friend:

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tommy-robinson-punched-prison-shower-18459295


  • #328
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    After receiving another prison sentence for contempt of court and being sent to Belmarsh Prison, a fellow prisoner - this one an old age pensioner - appears to have taken issue with Yaxley-Lennon's attitude in the showers and decked our fearless friend:

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tommy-robinson-punched-prison-shower-18459295
    Except that's all nonsense. You should be more careful with your sources, so you don't perpetuate these kind of lies. TR is actually being held in an isolation unit.
    For a more reliable account of his conditions, see here...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlkOYhqV_Z8


  • #329
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,543 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    recedite wrote: »
    Except that's all nonsense. You should be more careful with your sources, so you don't perpetuate these kind of lies. TR is actually being held in an isolation unit.
    For a more reliable account of his conditions, see here...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlkOYhqV_Z8

    What makes this more reliable, exactly? Hopefully more than just your confirmation bias.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • #330
    magicbastarder
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Arts Moderators, Sports Moderators Posts: 50,167 CMod ✭✭✭✭magicbastarder


    instead of taking the daily mirror at face value, please take someone's youtube channel at face value.
    and a US based one at that?


  • Advertisement
  • #331
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,476 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    recedite wrote: »
    Except that's all nonsense. You should be more careful with your sources, so you don't perpetuate these kind of lies. TR is actually being held in an isolation unit.
    For a more reliable account of his conditions, see here...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlkOYhqV_Z8

    So your vow to not post here again was another lie mis-statement, then :)

    Scrap the cap!



  • #332
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    So your vow to not post here again was another lie mis-statement, then :)

    Mod warning : No calling other posters liars even if you do strike it out and add a smile at the end


  • #333
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    magicbastarder wrote: »
    instead of taking the daily mirror at face value, please take someone's youtube channel at face value.
    and a US based one at that?

    Same report also in the Star, Metro, Examiner Live though all seems to be the same content from the same source. Counter claims by his own PR.

    Interesting article in Vice from a couple of days before the incident, notably
    Mega, 30, is awaiting trial for his role in a drugs conspiracy. If convicted it will be his third strike, and he can expect a hefty sentence. He was raised a Muslim and says that despite coming in and out of the prison community over the years, he has been receiving support from other Muslims on his wing and also via visits from his parents’ Imam.

    “There is no way anyone [Muslim] will plan anything,” Mega says. “He’s more likely to get a busted mouth from some big fella for acting like he owns the place, or a little rat kid trying to make a name for himself.”

    Hit the nail on the head it seems.


  • #334
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,676 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    recedite wrote: »
    Except that's all nonsense. You should be more careful with your sources, so you don't perpetuate these kind of lies. TR is actually being held in an isolation unit.
    For a more reliable account of his conditions, see here...
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jlkOYhqV_Z8
    Levant is hardly a "more reliable' source on anything. He has been successfully sued for libel on at least two occasions, and has avoided libel suits on a number of other occasions by issuing apologies and/or retractions. Furthermore the video says that it simply relays what Tommy Robinson himself says and, as Robinson is a convicted fraudster, you'd have to be exceptionally dim to treat him as a reliable source on any subject in which he himself had an interest or an axe to grind.


  • #335
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    recedite wrote: »
    Except that's all nonsense.
    As Hotblack points out, plenty of other media outlets reported essentially the same story which seems to have originated with a fairly terse report in the Daily Star here.

    BTW, that Daily Star article (for me at least) includes a video of Yaxley-Lennon outside the Old Bailey speaking with no less a luminary than the well-known racist and conspiracy-hack, Katie Hopkins - all the while being treated like a celebrity by the large group of bellowing heavyweights and lightweights who accompany him and line his route.

    Can't see that attitude going down all that well in prison, so the report's main claim that he behaved in the same way inside as he is shown behaving outside, leading to him being decked by an elderly man, seems plausible to me.
    recedite wrote: »
    You should be more careful with your sources, so you don't perpetuate these kind of lies.
    You posted a link to an 18-minute video and I wouldn't imagine that too many people are going to spend that long listening to some Canadian guy ramble on about poor Christopher/Tommeh. Perhaps you could point out where exactly he adequately refutes the central, plausible claim that CYL/TR was clobbered?

    Also, as smacl implies above, it's best to avoid using terms like "lie" here in A+A when referring, even indirectly, to other posters - the term really doesn't add much to any discussion, particularly a discussion about a man who has a distinctly troubled relationship with the truth to start with.


  • #336
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,476 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    robindch wrote: »
    As Hotblack points out

    It wazzn't me

    I can barely be arsed to follow Y-L's antics here, never mind seek out stories about him across a range of media outlets :)

    Scrap the cap!



  • Advertisement
  • #337
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    You posted a link to an 18-minute video and I wouldn't imagine that too many people are going to spend that long listening to some Canadian guy ramble on...
    Peregrinus wrote: »
    ...as Robinson is a convicted fraudster, you'd have to be exceptionally dim to treat him as a reliable source on any subject in which he himself had an interest or an axe to grind.
    Its odd that many people prefer to believe some tabloid nonsense over a first hand account, or indeed the "primary source" which is TR himself.
    I also found it interesting to learn that TR is within shouting distance of that other political prisoner and fearless speaker of truth - Julian Assange.
    Of course, if you refused to listen to the account in the link, you missed all that too.
    I'll leave you guys back in your little bubble now; sorry for interrupting the blissful but blinkered consensus.


  • #338
    ancapailldorcha
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Science, Health & Environment Moderators, Social & Fun Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 39,543 CMod ✭✭✭✭ancapailldorcha


    recedite wrote: »
    Its odd that many people prefer to believe some tabloid nonsense over a first hand account, or indeed the "primary source" which is TR himself.

    When the primary source is literally a proven liar, declaring everything he says as sacrosanct seems to be a very stupid thing to do.

    The foreigner residing among you must be treated as your native-born. Love them as yourself, for you were foreigners in Egypt. I am the LORD your God.

    Leviticus 19:34



  • #339
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Hotblack Desiato wrote: »
    It wazzn't me I can barely be arsed to follow Y-L's antics here, never mind seek out stories about him across a range of media outlets :)
    Ach, you pointed out something else in another thread and - with a few browser tabs open - misattributed smacl's post to you. I'll ensure that I'm whipped soundly later on this evening.


  • #340
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    recedite wrote: »
    Its odd that many people prefer to believe some tabloid nonsense over a first hand account, or indeed the "primary source" which is TR himself.
    And as a fraudster, I frankly wouldn't trust much that CYL/TR says to start with, and as a shameless self-publicist, I'd trust even less whatever prose he might concoct about himself. Nor would I trust outlets like the crowd-funded trash media outlet therebel.media which seems to survive on outrage alone.
    recedite wrote: »
    I also found it interesting to learn that TR is within shouting distance of that other political prisoner and fearless speaker of truth - Julian Assange.
    I wasn't aware that Assange was in Belmarsh and trust that, in due course, he'll end up at Her Majesty's pleasure somewhere, for many years. On a side note, I'd also be interested to learn the truth about Assange's connection to the Kremlin and Kremlin-controlled/leaning organizations, though at this point, Assange's work for them seems mostly done and the Russians will abandon him with all the enthusiasm which which they'd drop an empty vodka bottle.
    recedite wrote: »
    Of course, if you refused to listen to the account in the link, you missed all that too.
    Nope, I watched the first two minutes or so of a rambling, tedious monolog delivered by Ezra Levant - the website's self-styled "Rebel Commander" - but learned nothing about the alleged assault on SYL/TR. During the subsequent quarter hour of video, where exactly does Levant address the point for which you posted the video?


  • #341
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    Nope, I watched the first two minutes or so of a rambling, tedious monolog delivered by Ezra Levant - the website's self-styled "Rebel Commander" - but learned nothing about the alleged assault on SYL/TR. During the subsequent quarter hour of video, where exactly does Levant address the point for which you posted the video?
    Well, if your attention span had stretched an extra 40 seconds to 2.40 you would have learned that he was being kept in solitary, and there are no communal showers in solitary.
    And if it had stretched all the way to 4.40 you would have noted your treasured tabloid headline being specifically debunked.
    robindch wrote: »
    I wasn't aware that Assange was in Belmarsh and trust that, in due course, he'll end up at Her Majesty's pleasure somewhere, for many years.
    On a side note, I'd also be interested to learn the truth about Assange's connection to the Kremlin and Kremlin-controlled/leaning organizations, though at this point, Assange's work for them seems mostly done...
    I doubt he will remain there long, its only a transition on his way to the USA, where he'll be able to shout down the corridor to Chelsea Manning instead of at Tommy Robinson.


    I haven't seen any evidence that Assange worked for the Ruskies. But there is ample evidence that at least one of the < rape > victims was previously kicked out of Cuba because she was working for an American intelligence agency.
    BTW what woman invites a stranger to stay in her apartment while away for the weekend, and then comes home early forgetting he is there? It was a classic honey trap.


  • Advertisement
  • #342
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    recedite wrote: »
    Well, if your attention span had stretched an extra 40 seconds to 2.40 you would have learned that he was being kept in solitary, and there are no communal showers in solitary.
    Thanks for the steer on this - Levant does indeed say that CYL/TR is being kept in solitary - no doubt being there now for his own safety after his unfortunate run-in with a stroppy pensioner in the shower block earlier in the week.
    recedite wrote: »
    And if it had stretched all the way to 4.40 you would have noted your treasured tabloid headline being specifically debunked.
    Well, this evening, I made it as far as eight minutes into Levant's tiresome rant and learn that Levant did not - as you falsely claim - say or imply that "there are no communal showers in solitary" but instead, made a hard-to-verify claim that that "Tommy has not been in communal showers". Levant also claims that while CYL/TR "has no human contact", he also suggests that he's free to visit Julian Assange as well as receive the prison governor daily - is he out of human contact, or are Assange and the governor unhuman replicants? Or was Levant just talking through his ass?
    recedite wrote: »
    I haven't seen any evidence that Assange worked for the Ruskies.
    Didn't say that he worked for the Russians, but I did clearly imply that his contacts, methods and aims - such as one can speculate about them - seem to align closely with the Kremlin's contacts, methods and aims. This is, of course, unlikely ever to feature in Levant's strange world of smoke, mirrors and bluster, but those of us with longer memories and shorter agendas do see significant, and no doubt entirely co-incidental, similarities.

    BTW, Levant is a dreadful reporter - his tedious, self-conscious monolog to camera, delivered from what looks like the back of a luxury taxi - which must have cost well upwards of €200 between Belmarsh and Heathrow - cannot be treated as reliable evidence for much beyond that Levant has access to a well-funded expense account.


  • #343
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    Levant did not - as you falsely claim - say or imply that "there are no communal showers in solitary" but instead, made a hard-to-verify claim that that "Tommy has not been in communal showers".
    I suppose I had better ban myself from the thread post-haste, for making this false claim, before someone else does it.


  • #344
    Hotblack Desiato
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 35,476 ✭✭✭✭Hotblack Desiato


    robindch wrote: »
    I'll ensure that I'm whipped soundly later on this evening.

    It's fine as long as you don't take pleasure in it.

    Scrap the cap!



  • #345
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    recedite wrote: »
    I suppose I had better ban myself from the thread post-haste, for making this false claim, before someone else does it.

    Don't think anyone has ever been banned from A&A for making false claims, given the creationists and rather fervent religious types that number among the regulars here. A&A is clearly a place where a poster can spout all sorts of outrageous nonsense, supernatural fantasy and unsupported assertion once they adhere to the charter and accept that their posts are liable to attract criticism and possibly derision.


  • #346
    recedite
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭recedite


    robindch wrote: »
    After receiving another prison sentence for contempt of court and being sent to Belmarsh Prison, a fellow prisoner - this one an old age pensioner - appears to have taken issue with Yaxley-Lennon's attitude in the showers and decked our fearless friend:

    https://www.mirror.co.uk/news/uk-news/tommy-robinson-punched-prison-shower-18459295


    Oops... it looks like your fake news story above has disappeared from the internet; it appears to have been quietly retracted by the Daily Mirror.


    And the Daily Star cloned version of the same BS story has suffered the same fate...

    https://www.dailystar.co.uk/news/latest-news/793111/tommy-robinson-punched-belmarsh-prison-edl-fight


    Meanwhile those who speak the truth languish in a special wing of prison.
    One on trumped up "rape charges" and the other for an incident which has already been looked at and quashed by the UK Supreme Court. Under the general principle of double jeopardy that should have been the end of the matter.


  • #347
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    recedite wrote: »
    Oops... it looks like your fake news story above has disappeared from the internet

    Really??? A quick google shows the story is still available at metro.co.uk here, leeds live here, liberal.ie here and buzz.ie here. Metro article also covers "How Tommy Robinson could have helped keep Huddersfield rape gang on UK streets" and the chats with Assange.


  • #348
    Peregrinus
    Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 26,676 ✭✭✭✭Peregrinus


    recedite wrote: »
    I also found it interesting to learn that TR is within shouting distance of that other political prisoner and fearless speaker of truth - Julian Assange.
    Of course, if you refused to listen to the account in the link, you missed all that too.
    I was aware of it before I you posted your link, Rec. You, evidently, were not, but you should not project your ignorance of such matters onto others. You might be less ignorant if you didn't filter your information sources through an ideological purity test.
    recedite wrote: »
    I'll leave you guys back in your little bubble now; sorry for interrupting the blissful but blinkered consensus.
    Ooh, ironic, that.


  • #349
    Delirium
    Moderators Posts: 51,847 ✭✭✭✭Delirium


    smacl wrote: »
    Really??? A quick google shows the story is still available at metro.co.uk here, leeds live here, liberal.ie here and buzz.ie here. Metro article also covers "How Tommy Robinson could have helped keep Huddersfield rape gang on UK streets" and the chats with Assange.

    Just FYI, theliberal.ie (run by Cora Sherlocks brother) isn't a site to be using for your argument. They regularly post stories that have been lifted from other news sites (and have been found guilty of copyright) or entirely fictional 'news' stories.

    If you can read this, you're too close!



  • #350
    smacl
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 15,776 Mod ✭✭✭✭smacl


    Delirium wrote: »
    Just FYI, theliberal.ie (run by Cora Sherlocks brother) isn't a site to be using for your argument. They regularly post stories that have been lifted from other news sites (and have been found guilty of copyright) or entirely fictional 'news' stories.

    Something of a cut and paste story for many of the media outlets at a guess and difficult to prove the veracity of it as a prisoner assaulting another prisoner is hardly going to admit liability. I can't see the the prison authorities being likely to comment on it either. That said, SYL/TR's version of events, as a convicted fraudster, would also be highly dubious.


  • #351
    robindch
    Moderators, Society & Culture Moderators Posts: 24,420 Mod ✭✭✭✭robindch


    Russia's Ministry of Foreign Affairs is watching the UK's treatment of SYL/TR - to ensure the "immutability of high human rights standards" no less!

    https://twitter.com/mfa_russia/status/1159807581763854341


  • Advertisement
Advertisement