Are you a Globalist or a Nationalist?

Wanderer78 · 05-12-2018 10:34AM

I do like the idea of internationalism

Chips Lovell · 05-12-2018 10:38AM

"False dichotomy" I think are the words we're looking for.

Raheem Euro · 05-12-2018 10:49AM

Shout out for all the Pan-Galacticists.

The Rape of Lucretia · 05-12-2018 10:49AM

I'm not nationalist, or racist, but, I am proud of Ireland's history as part of the British Isles, the UK, the Empire, and all that that contributed around the world in countless ways economic, legal, cultural, sporting, and technological. Its in the past, but still valid to feel pride in it even if now Ireland is a small region hived off from that greater part.

FunLover18 · 05-12-2018 10:51AM

Chris_Heilong wrote: »

Well I am not a globalist, shudder to even think about. I like having a culture, a country, a nationality, a history and a place from where I can say I came from, I also dont mind foreign people who want to come and share in those things with me on my terms and my values. I agree with multi racial society but not multiculturalism, a little sprinkle here and there(food, music and the odd celebration) is fine but respect the native culture and try to adapt to it as much as possible, parallel cultures within a country only push division/conflict.

Parallel cultures do not push division or conflict but a fear or dislike of other cultures certainly does. The trouble with this viewpoint is that culture is ill-defined and can be subjective, people of the same culture can completely disagree on what aspects of that culture or most important (eg look at the attitudes towards the Irish language). I agree that immigrants have to respect the native culture and I don't think in any way that by emigrating they have forfeited the right to practice their own culture.

FunLover18 · 05-12-2018 10:53AM

Raheem Euro wrote: »

Shout out for all the Pan-Galacticists.

I wouldn't call myself one but I do enjoy their gargle blasters.

Thomas_IV · 05-12-2018 11:08AM

DS86DS wrote: »

And by that I mean that in the full sense of the word. Are you proud of your country and its customs, culture and history going back thousands of years?

You are not only a nationalist and patriot in your own country. You also look at other countries, say France or Hungary and you not only appreciate their cultures. You also accept that these are countries in their own right. When you visit them, you respect them and their culture and history. You wish them to make decisions that benefit their people.

When you visit France or Hungary you appreciate that you are in another part of the world..... you respect that you are a visitor on holidays and do as Romans do when in Rome.

You also understand why Americans might vote for Trump.....it's an expression of nationalism on the behalf of Americans. You may not agree with it, but as a nationalist in your own country........ you respect that other people in other countries, be it in America, France and Hungary......or Bhutan, it doesn't matter.....have a desire for their own nation.

You are a nationalist yourself, and are accepting of nationalism in other people and other countries and accept it is a force of evolution.

I'm certainly not one of that sort of people as I utterly despise any form of nationalism. I don't to have to count myself among these sort of people in order to conduct a civilized behaviour when visiting another country as a Tourist.

Or are you a Globalist? Do you believe that institutions such as the EU and UN are the supreme moral force in the world? Do you believe that we should all strive to be "citizens of the world"?

Neither the EU nor the UN are the supreme moral force in the world, and I say that based on their own record more so in regards of the UN which often failed to prevail as a moral force due to the lack of power it has. The big powers like USA, Russia and China very often vetoed resolutions to follow up their own national interests in the first place.

To strive to be 'citizens of the world' is a good idea because it puts the simple term 'human' at the top and the focus of it and could help to overcome that fecking racism and stupid nationalism which has triggered many wars and inflicted many miseries on the human race in all its long history. But his can't be achieved as long as we have super powers on this planet who are rivals to each one another and won't give up their powers in order to create and establish a world power to rule over the whole planet on the basis of democracy. Therefore it remains in the domain of Utopia.

Do you believe borders are antiquated and that we should be striving for a One World entity where borders have ceased to exist?

As long as there are wars on this planet, borders are never antiquated and should be in place in order to stop conflicts from spreading too far. But as we still live in the age of the atomic bomb, borders are meaningless in this regard cos the nuclear fallout would affect the whole planet and spread world wide.

Poor_old_gill · 05-12-2018 01:28PM

I'm a Kerry-ist, although I dont really like people from North Kerry and find people from Killarney to be fairly smug

The_Kew_Tour · 05-12-2018 01:30PM

I'm a loyalist

Grayson · 05-12-2018 01:56PM

Baron de Charlus wrote: »

"False dichotomy" I think are the words we're looking for.

seamus wrote: »

Or "humanist".

Of course if the OP is an absolutist and cannot see the world in any other terms but "A or B", then trying to explain this seems folly.

Yeah. the OP seems to have made-up meanings for words and is telling us to choose between two false definitions which aren't even mutually exclusive.

I can be Irish and proud of it whilst still wanting to see institutions like the UN and EU. I can like my culture whilst still accepting people from other cultures who move here.

05-12-2018 01:59PM

Grayson wrote: »

Yeah. the OP seems to have made-up meanings for words and is telling us to choose between two false definitions which aren't even mutually exclusive.

I can be Irish and proud of it whilst still wanting to see institutions like the UN and EU. I can like my culture whilst still accepting people from other cultures who move here.

Daddy or chips?

Odhinn · 05-12-2018 02:05PM

theteal wrote: »

Feck sake, somebody couldn’t sleep.

At this hour of the morning questions should be limited to the likes of, “do you drink coffee?”, “do you pee in the shower?”, “do you drink coffee in the shower?”, “have you ever accidentally sharted?” and so forth....

You left out "do you drink coffee and pee in the shower" - might be linkage there to be investigated.

Ubbquittious · 05-12-2018 02:41PM

Isolationist

jmayo · 05-12-2018 03:44PM

DS86DS wrote: »

And by that I mean that in the full sense of the word. Are you proud of your country and its customs, culture and history going back thousands of years?

Somewhat proud of my country, but then like everywhere we have some things we definitely should not be proud about, especially since our independence when we had the power to make our own decisions.

DS86DS wrote: »

You are not only a nationalist and patriot in your own country. You also look at other countries, say France or Hungary and you not only appreciate their cultures. You also accept that these are countries in their own right. When you visit them, you respect them and their culture and history. You wish them to make decisions that benefit their people.

When you visit France or Hungary you appreciate that you are in another part of the world..... you respect that you are a visitor on holidays and do as Romans do when in Rome.

Ehh being a cynical old fecker, I tend to see the things wrong with places, then compare the goods things with here and then see how bad we are.

DS86DS wrote: »

You also understand why Americans might vote for Trump.....it's an expression of nationalism on the behalf of Americans.

Actually as I and others keep saying a lot of Americans voted for trump not out of nationalism in the strict sense, racism or bigotry, but as a form or protest mainly against the governmental system and the encroaching effects of globalisation, the economic globalisation.

DS86DS wrote: »

Or are you a Globalist? Do you believe that institutions such as the EU and UN are the supreme moral force in the world? Do you believe that we should all strive to be "citizens of the world"?

Do you believe borders are antiquated and that we should be striving for a One World entity where borders have ceased to exist?

Ah FFS if you believe in the institution of the UN you are a moron quite frankly.
It is inept, controlled by the major powers, and a waste.
For prime example of how farcical it is see what position the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia was handed.
Need I say anymore. :rolleyes:

The EU used to be something worthwhile and laudable, but the federalistic direction it has been taking and the dictation of power by the major central players is not something that should be in any way welcomed by smaller nations, particularly those on the periphery.

BTW to me current version of globalisation just means rich people, large conglomerates move their production to cheaper locations in order to make themselves more profit, all the while telling the people in the West who used to produce the products how lucky they are to have cheaper products, a chance to have a more worthwhile job, coincidentally which they probably haven't the ability to get or indeed perform.

And if anyone thinks open borders are the way to go whilst most of the world is made up of economic basketcases, culturally backward sh**holes and warzones, they are morons with their heads up their ar**es.

Humphrey BoaGart · 05-12-2018 04:19PM

The Rape of Lucretia wrote: »

I'm not nationalist, or racist, but, I am proud of Ireland's history as part of the British Isles, the UK, the Empire, and all that that contributed around the world in countless ways economic, legal, cultural, sporting, and technological. Its in the past, but still valid to feel pride in it even if now Ireland is a small region hived off from that greater part.

3/10

Ulysses Gaze · 05-12-2018 04:29PM

I am neither.

Globalisation = Neoliberalism: Bad for working people as wages are driven down and jobs get outsourced.

Nationalism = Tyranny: Right/Left wing nutjobs exploiting working people in a different way.

Nothing wrong with being Patriotic however.

greencap · 05-12-2018 04:34PM

Is there no middle ground?

I'm a late-90's, early 2000's -ist.

Things were somewhat sane in those days.

Fcking bonkers nowadays.

brainfreeze · 05-12-2018 04:49PM

Globalist, one step closer to the United Federation of Planets.

sbsquarepants · 05-12-2018 04:50PM

I'm an individualist. I'm very much out for my myself and my family, not necessarily at the expense of others per se, but I'm not predisposed towards sacrificing for them either.

I come from a nationalist / republican family but it hasn't really rubbed off on me. I don't want the north back if it's going to cost me money for example, I don't care if we're in the EU or not for anything other than practical reasons. I don't feel any more "European" than I do Chinese. (I do think it would be madness to leave by the way for those very same practical reasons I mentioned). A European army can go fúck itself though...actually so can the Irish, Australian and Guatemalan for that matter, there's no way I'd go to war for any country, for any reason.

I don't think I'm a citizen of the world - I have absolutely nothing in common with someone from the favelas of Brazil, or the suburbs of Kyoto for example - I don't really care about them. I don't wish them any harm but I also don't waste much time worrying about their lot, I have my own problems - which I wouldn't expect them to give a fúck about either.

I reckon I've maybe got 35 to 40 years left, I just want to get them over with without any major misery or hardship and hopefully leave my kids in a better position than I found myself in (which wasn't too bad to be honest).

That'll do me!

biko · 05-12-2018 04:55PM

Chaya Wide Feather wrote: »

Global issues require global thinking and global institutions.

Yes, as long as these global institutions are still governed by nation states in cooperation.
When a global institution thinks it supersedes nations then nationalists will put the foot down.

stoneill · 05-12-2018 05:28PM

I don't really like anything south of the equator so I see myself as a hemisphericalist.

Are you a Globalist or a Nationalist?

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