Is getting a council house the equivalent of winning the lotto

Cina · 29-11-2018 11:57AM

Graces7 wrote: »

As a council tenant I am deeply offended by the gross generalising insults here.

Thought we had progressed past the idea that being poor was a disgrace?

If you can work, earn your living, buy a house, then you are blessed. So why carp at anyone else? Why not enjoy all you have?

Grace, nobody in here has said "being poor is a disgrace". Most replied have said that they prefer to work over not working. Nobody has criticized those who get a council house, just said they are blessed to have gotten one.

This is just another example of you getting crazy defensive and making sh*t up to try fit your argument. Get a grip.

greencap · 29-11-2018 12:01PM

Squatter wrote: »

Not really. I genuinely enjoy seeing my taxes given to defence lawyers under the free legal aid scheme.

nothing legally wrong with a home in connaught.

Plumbthedepths · 29-11-2018 12:01PM

Sweet.Science wrote:

Hear me out

Sweet.Science wrote:

The 1st thing people would think of doing if they won the lotto is buying a house or paying off their mortgage.

Sweet.Science wrote:

The thought of living in a house mortgage free is the most appealing aspect of winning the lotto . Not only that but it also Good to know you will leave an inheritance behind for your kids

Sweet.Science wrote:

Is getting a council house the same thing ?

Sweet.Science wrote:

IF you have kids it will be rent free. Only mugs would bother paying any rent knowing you will never be evicted. Your kids also Get to inherit it when you pass away.

Sweet.Science wrote:

People really have struck gold when they get one

You have no idea what you are talking about. However your nonsense will appeal and resonate with many .

Sky King · 29-11-2018 12:03PM

Sweet.Science wrote: »

When i bought my house i was outbid by the council on a number of properties beforehand

Fk me that's really annoying! Your head must have been wrecked.

engiweirdo · 29-11-2018 12:03PM

eviltwin wrote: »

I live in a council house, I bought it. I would say maybe 40% of the houses here are privately owned. I wonder do I get labelled a lazy scrounger because of my address?

You do, but only in the clandestine comfort of boards and peoples living rooms. I wouldnt worry too much about it. Easier to kick down than look up.

Squatter · 29-11-2018 12:07PM

greencap wrote: »

nothing legally wrong with a home in connaught.

One of my holiday homes is near Roundstone, so I concur with that wise observation. It's very hard to get staff to keep it clean, though - we badly need more Eastern Europeans out there.

Rochelle · 29-11-2018 12:09PM

eviltwin wrote: »

I live in a council house, I bought it. I would say maybe 40% of the houses here are privately owned. I wonder do I get labelled a lazy scrounger because of my address?

No, not because of your address...

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 29-11-2018 12:13PM

Well, with a lotto win, you could buy a really nice house. With the greatest of respect, council houses are usually a bit grim. So, no.

greencap · 29-11-2018 12:13PM

Squatter wrote: »

One of my holiday homes is near Roundstone, so I concur with that wise observation. It's very hard to get staff to keep it clean, though - we badly need more Eastern Europeans out there.

if its good enough for you and good enough for the help, then its good enough for anto and dayo.

the decent people of ballyfermot could wave them off.

Graces7 · 29-11-2018 12:13PM

Cina wrote: »

Grace, nobody in here has said "being poor is a disgrace". Most replied have said that they prefer to work over not working. Nobody has criticized those who get a council house, just said they are blessed to have gotten one.

This is just another example of you getting crazy defensive and making sh*t up to try fit your argument. Get a grip.

the word "scrounger"?

And no call for personal critique insults !!!!!! Clearly touched a nerve. I have a perfect grip thank you. We hear little but gripes re council tenants when so many of us are genuinely in need. This is not being defensive by the way. We have no need to be defensive. Just making a point that few council tenants are in fact scroungers.

Graces7 · 29-11-2018 12:14PM

greencap wrote: »

nothing legally wrong with a home in connaught.

I hope not...:D

Graces7 · 29-11-2018 12:16PM

mickdw wrote: »

I wouldn't fancy living in a council estate however the council used to commonly build single houses for families on there own farm, the council taking ownership of the site.
I believe they have started to do this again rurally and I've seen 2 beautiful 1.5 storey homes built not to far from me that by all accounts are council built. Considering that in the past they have sold these houses off to the tenants at maybe 25 percent of market value, you would have to think that getting one of these rural house is the equivalent of a cash Windfall of 200,000.

Yes I rented one such in Donegal. You can recognise them wherever you go. Had been built for the parents who had since died. A very good house that was.

johnnyskeleton · 29-11-2018 12:20PM

Graces7 wrote: »

As a council tenant I am deeply offended by the gross generalising insults here.

Thought we had progressed past the idea that being poor was a disgrace?

If you can work, earn your living, buy a house, then you are blessed. So why carp at anyone else? Why not enjoy all you have?

I think it's because for many people, they work and earn a living but aren't able to afford to buy a house. It isn't millionaires in Foxrock who complain most about social housing, it's the people who have done the right thing by society's standards for years who are struggling and are no nearer to getting secure accommodation for themselves, only to see someone who doesn't, in their eyes, work as hard or doesn't follow the path set out for people, and ends up getting greater security of accommodation than others.

So basically, the resentment comes from someone who works harder and pays more taxes than their neighbour, but has less benefits than their neighbour.

It's the same with healthcare. Someone who works just above the minimum wage and pays taxes gets sick and has to decide whether to spend €60 going to a GP, which would be a significant expense for them. So they only go when they are really, really sick. When they do go, they see people with medical cards going to the GP over a tickly cough or other minor ailement. There is undoubtedly a perception bias, and the people who overuse the medical card would be an exception, rather than the rule, but people see this and they start to think that society sees them as a cash cow to pay for other people to have a better service than they do.

I'm not saying that the above feelings are right, or edifying, or that the should form part of a political ideology. But it's not looking at reality if the debate is shut down as merely criticising poor people.

In order for our society to work properly, the systems must reward work, and the harder one works the better one's life should be. Currently, a lot of people don't feel that that is the case. I don't think addressing the fact that people feel this way about how our social state works is in any way suggesting that someone being poor is a disgrace.

JupiterKid · 29-11-2018 12:22PM

I am rather angry at posters on forums such as this one who think that anyone availing of social welfare/disability or in a low wage job struggling in this nightmare housing market is a wastrel and a scrounger and if they find themselves homeless or on the local authority waiting list, then tough sh*t for them.

The callousness, lack of any shred of empathy and wanton bitterness on some of these forums is shocking and frankly disgusting. It's a case of "I'm doing alright Jack, so I will see fit to sh*t on others from a height." Or alternatively, "well, I have a 4 hour commute a day, so anyone trying to secure a dwelling in Dublin on a low income can go jump!"

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts · 29-11-2018 12:26PM

Squatter wrote: »

My missus still remembers her ma crying her eyes out at a Dublin Corporation 'draw' for council houses in the early 1970's. 'Winning' a house at that draw enabled her family to move from Ballyfermot to a shiny new semi-d house in Dublin 5 which the family then purchased from the Corpo for a song over the next 25 years. It is beyond argument that 'winning' in that draw changed their lives forever and was every bit as significant to them as a lottery win.

The irony (if that's the right word) is that the house - on a large corner site with front, back and side gardens and space to build a second house - will sell for a 7 figure sum when her elderly parents pass on, because it's within walking distance of Beaumont Hospital. So she and her sibling stand to inherit a cool €0.5 million each - almost tax-free - courtesy of their parent's council house. Is that what social housing policy is really all about?

All I can think is good for them. I think the aim is for people to be miffed reading this but it’s not happening for me. They won the draw. It’s not like it was an entitlement that they expected. Fortune smiled on their family.

Berserker · 29-11-2018 12:27PM

incentsitive wrote: »

Much better than a life on welfare.

Is it really though? On welfare, you have a permanent safety net and a guarantee of a consistent standard of living. You don't have that as a working person.

mariaalice wrote: »

As with all similar and relate threads, if its so marvelous why not do it yourself put yourself on the housing waiting list and wait until you get your free 'house'. All you need to do is keep your income under for Dublin City. €35,000. €42,000. Dún Laoghaire. Then wait about 10 years.

How can people on welfare taking in €50,000 a year get council housing then?

JupiterKid · 29-11-2018 12:28PM

Look, its clear that there are a lot of seriously disaffected angry people out there, and that is very understandable. Exhausting daily commutes, being squeezed every way, feeling that they are ignored by the powers that be.

I suggest turning your anger on the government and the policymakers who have created this mess, and not those who are on welfare or those who are really struggling to keep a roof over their head.

Gimme A Pound · 29-11-2018 12:29PM

Sweet.Science wrote: »

You do realise the council are buying private houses all over Dublin for people to live in . When i bought my house i was outbid by the council on a number of properties beforehand

Don't see how this negates what Mr. Incognito said.

If you're referring to one-off council properties in mostly private developments, you should have specified it.

Apart from the scumbags making people's lives a misery, nobody would choose to live in an estate full of the problems he and Makikomi and kcdiom experienced - cheap rent or not. As you can see, they all left.

You're very sheltered if you think absolutely every council tenant is a freeloader. There is no way everyone can afford a mortgage, you know this. And now people can't even afford private rent. Not all jobs pay enough. And what about those who are disabled or long-term ill, or lost their job and are too old to be hired yet too young for a pension. What about those whose spouse died or left them?

People are saying with irony and without irony that it's easy. No it isn't - not to get somewhere decent anyway. When you get on the housing list you have to wait. If you want something quickly, it'll be an absolute sh1t-hole. If you want somewhere nice, you'll be waiting years and years.

Squatter · 29-11-2018 12:33PM

Graces7 wrote: »

the word "scrounger"?

And no call for personal critique insults !!!!!! Clearly touched a nerve. I have a perfect grip thank you. We hear little but gripes re council tenants when so many of us are genuinely in need. This is not being defensive by the way. We have no need to be defensive. Just making a point that few council tenants are in fact scroungers.

How did you manage to find a council house on that God-forsaken island of yours Grace?

Huntergonzo · 29-11-2018 12:33PM

Depends really, I actually used to work in a council maintenance department for a few years so I have plenty of experience in this area. Generally speaking I found the older generation to be more respectful (with plenty of exceptions of course), whereas the younger generation tend to be more, gimme gimme gimme (but again not across the board). Also women tended to ring in a lot more often than men.

Now I can't give exact figures but I would say that roughly speaking about 50% of our annual budget was spent on about 20% of the tenants. These were the people who wouldn't even change a light bulb in the house, 'cause the fúckin useless council should do it for me'.

Without question a disproportionately high amount of money was spent (wasted being a more appropriate term) on the halting sites, not a PC thing to say of course but factually true.

The majority of tenants were fine though, they called in as they were entitled to do for various repairs to be carried out.

As a matter of interest, where I worked, 78% of the tenants were unemployed, but you have to take the elderly and disabled into consideration aswell. They weren't all dole lifers, although sadly many of them are and will forever be.

If you want to see exactly what's being spent on the maintenance of LA houses, check out NOAC's LA service indicators 2017, page 44.

29-11-2018 12:34PM

There was a great comment in the thread about the 70s and 80s along the lines of...There didn't seem to be so many bitter professional around.

29-11-2018 12:35PM

Graces7 wrote: »

As a council tenant I am deeply offended by the gross generalising insults here.

Thought we had progressed past the idea that being poor was a disgrace?

If you can work, earn your living, buy a house, then you are blessed. So why carp at anyone else? Why not enjoy all you have?

I think its because a lot of people work hard for years, working 40 hours a week, commuting 10+ hours a week, paying high rent and trying to save. Maybe after several years they have enough money to buy a house in Kildare, Meath, Wicklow etc and can add a few hours on to their commute as well as mortgage repayments.

Somebody else can choose not to work or commute, put their name on a list and get a decent house in Dublin for free with very little repayments.

Why should doing nothing be rewarded?

SusieBlue · 29-11-2018 12:35PM

Graces7 wrote: »

As a council tenant I am deeply offended by the gross generalising insults here.

Thought we had progressed past the idea that being poor was a disgrace?

If you can work, earn your living, buy a house, then you are blessed. So why carp at anyone else? Why not enjoy all you have?

I don't begrudge anyone a council house, and I don't think anyone from a council estate is automatically scum either.

I just wanted to point out that the reality for myself and for many others is that I work full time, I earn my living, and its unlikely that I'll ever be able to afford to buy my own house.

Its a huge generalisation to say those from council estates are scum, but its equally a huge generalisation to say that those who work are financially well off and own their own properties.
Neither is true.

Sweet.Science · 29-11-2018 12:40PM

mariaalice wrote: »

There was a great comment in the thread about the 70s and 80s along the lines of...There didn't seem to be so many bitter professional around.

Well you see . In the 70s and 80s houses were dirt cheap and widley available for anyone working.

Mortgage repayments were pittance compared to today so they didnt have to care as much at all

Today you can work your ass off for a 2 bed house with repayments of over 1,000 a month while Jacinta down the road has a 3 bed for free, healthcare for free, maintenance for free.

meeeeh · 29-11-2018 12:41PM

When council houses are offered only to hardest cases then you will get getho. If you offer social housing to those on lower or middle incomes and charge rent proportionally to their income you have mixed communities which are not dominated by those who stopped working two generations ago. I don't think housing policies in UK and Ireland are working and ridiculous as it sounds it would probably work out better for society if more people were offered social housing.

29-11-2018 12:42PM

SusieBlue wrote: »

I don't begrudge anyone a council house, and I don't think anyone from a council estate is automatically scum either.

I just wanted to point out that the reality for myself and for many others is that I work full time, I earn my living, and its unlikely that I'll ever be able to afford to buy my own house.

Its a huge generalisation to say those from council estates are scum, but its equally a huge generalisation to say that those who work are financially well off and own their own properties.
Neither is true.

But why direct resentment at those in social housing or why be resentful at all. I do not mean this at anyone in particular but life is not fair. The sun shines on the rich and poor alike.

Squatter · 29-11-2018 12:42PM

Obvious Desperate Breakfasts wrote: »

All I can think is good for them. I think the aim is for people to be miffed reading this but it’s not happening for me.

It is good for them and they thoroughly deserve it as they are decent, honest, hardworking people whose only crime is to have voted for Charlie Haughey and then his son for the past 60 years!

But the objective of my post wasn't to inspire envy, but rather to look at the societal outcome of this particular social housing story.

It goes like this: council tenants buy cheap house (taxpayer subsidised) and live in it for the next 50 years. They die, their kids (middle aged and comfortably off) sell it and make a large killing but little or none of the windfall profit realised will go back to the taxpayer. Cui bono?

Yes, from a purely selfish viewpoint, it's great for the missus - but is that really the ideal way for our public housing policy to function?

Sir Oxman · 29-11-2018 12:44PM

SusieBlue wrote: »

I don't begrudge anyone a council house, and I don't think anyone from a council estate is automatically scum either.

I just wanted to point out that the reality for myself and for many others is that I work full time, I earn my living, and its unlikely that I'll ever be able to afford to buy my own house.

Its a huge generalisation to say those from council estates are scum, but its equally a huge generalisation to say that those who work are financially well off and own their own properties.
Neither is true.

And you are in the category of working people that social housing should be built for.

SusieBlue · 29-11-2018 12:46PM

mariaalice wrote: »

But why direct resentment at those in social housing or why be resentful at all. I do not mean this at anyone in particular but life is not fair. The sun shines on the rich and poor alike.

I don't resent them, I just think its grossly hypocritical to say its unfair to suggest those who have council houses are scroungers, and then in their next breath say all working people are lucky and can afford to buy their own homes, so should be grateful.

Its simply not true and its dismissive of the struggle those of us who are on a low wage but not entitled to social welfare go through.

Sweet.Science · 29-11-2018 12:46PM

Sir Oxman wrote: »

And you are in the category of working people that social housing should be built for.

Working people will never be looked after . We are a welfare state

Is getting a council house the equivalent of winning the lotto

Comments