Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

lordlame · 19-11-2018 10:04PM

$4900 now ..

grindle · 19-11-2018 10:21PM

TallyRand wrote: »

Btw, I’ve never argued blockchain isn’t a good tech, just don’t think it’s as amazing as some here view it.

People view it as amazing because businesses and governments using it would be forced into verifiable transparency. A technology that could fully prevent another 2008-style crash is amazing with a capital A, but it requires the public knowing that that's precisely what it's for - which brings me to...

TallyRand wrote: »

...the likes of bitcoin without illicit uses like drug buying would be a pink sheet by now.

Yeah, Bitcoin rose through the nerd ranks by being able to perform one function better than cash - being cash over the internet. BTC's pseudonymity is terrible for drug buying, it isn't fungible. Blockchain analysis firms will be able to map every historical coin shuffle and exchange hop that leads to a Silk Road purchase as long as the price paid for their service is met. If the government/s consider it small fish they won't bother (this will be 99%+ of Silk Road or equivalent buys), if it's worth a lot then they'll pay.

You seem to mistake what Bitcoin was originally about. It's not about hiding anything, it was supposed to be about wresting control of your earned possessions and freedom of movement from totalitarian scumbags. That's changed as the Core dev focus pivoted to becoming "Store of Value" and a bunch of deranged loons think "Yeah, this is for hodling, not spending", but the original idea and execution of it was very smart. The incentivisation still is smart, but much less so now they've deviated from the plan.

And yeah, mining's a heap of shít but it was a clever way to decentralise and secure the system using devices people already owned whilst rewarding those who made it secure.

Sleeper12 · 19-11-2018 11:47PM

lordlame wrote:

$4900 now ..

$4800 now but $4700 an hour or so ago.

Interesting times. Must be stressful for some investors

makeorbrake · 20-11-2018 01:18AM

TallyRand wrote: »

I’m glad we’re all in agreement that the vast majority of “coins” are a scam!

Everyone else can speak for themselves but I didn't say that the majority of coins area a 'scam'. Yes, there have been projects that are blatant scams, there have been and are projects that have no substance. There are also several projects with merit competing for the same use case. In some industries, perhaps there's space for more than one and in others perhaps there's not. Perhaps their differences will be such that only one will win out.

But that doesn't make the majority of projects scams.

TallyRand wrote: »

Btw, I’ve never argued blockchain isn’t a good tech, just don’t think it’s as amazing as some here view it.

When you look at it bare bones, it's simply a digital ledger. Ledgers have been around since the year dot - nothing new there. However, there's a way that digital ledger tech can be used to ensure transparency and that record can be rendered tamperproof. With that, there's a whole host of applications across a multitude of industries where it can be used.

seannash · 20-11-2018 01:26AM

What I'm curious about is the successes in the future.
Projects like vechain, iota, shipchain etc that do seem to have a good product (let's not discuss if you think they do or don't have a good product) yet are pegged to bitcoin. When do they breakaway from that pairing. When do they offer a fiat pairing on their website themselves.

makeorbrake · 20-11-2018 01:29AM

seannash wrote: »

What I'm curious about is the successes in the future.
Projects like vechain, iota, shipchain etc that do seem to have a good product (let's not discuss if you think they do or don't have a good product) yet are pegged to bitcoin. When do they breakaway from that pairing. When do they offer a fiat pairing on their website themselves.

I'd imagine if you really believe in the real tangible potential of a project, then you're best to ignore how it reacts on the market when Bitcoin (or Bitcoin cash or whatever) sneezes. If it is to deliver on that potential, then it will ultimately break free of all that.

seannash · 20-11-2018 01:31AM

makeorbrake wrote: »

I'd imagine if you really believe in the real tangible potential of a project, then you're best to ignore how it reacts on the market when Bitcoin (or Bitcoin cash or whatever) sneezes. If it is to deliver on that potential, then it will ultimately break free of all that.

Yeah but I don't understand why it still needs it now. Surely it's easy to offer fiat pairings themselves for these projects. It must be hampering adoption.

Pintman Paddy Losty · 20-11-2018 01:56AM

ZeroThreat wrote: »

I'm actually surprised Pintman Paddy or Johnny haven't been on here today to gloat!

I'm not one to gloat Zero!

I've been banging the same drum for almost a year now. Those who have listened have saved their bacon. One young chap mentioned he bought a nice leather jacket with his btc money. Now that's a tangible reward for listening to sound advice.

Johnny can't post as he's banned. But no doubt he would be gloating to be fair.

I met him by chance at the aviva on Saturday. The f*cker had had a skinful of pints. In flying form. He was chatting up a group of mollies from munster outside toners when I saw him. Didn't stay long as I had an appointment with a Brazilian lady in Ballsbridge. He did mention the recent developments in the crypto market. He was laughing away. It was hard to make out what he was saying to be honest but the words scam Ponzi and mugs game were slurred out anyway.

But yeah. I'm not one to gloat. Sorry for the losses of those still hodling. Feel particularly bad for the likes of h0neybadger who would have been very badly exposed to the market as a miner. Or others here who were taken in by the so called experts.

Sleeper12 · 20-11-2018 06:40AM

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

I'm not one to gloat Zero!

I've been banging the same drum for almost a year now. Those who have listened have saved their bacon. One young chap mentioned he bought a nice leather jacket with his btc money. Now that's a tangible reward for listening to sound advice.

Johnny can't post as he's banned. But no doubt he would be gloating to be fair.

I met him by chance at the aviva on Saturday. The f*cker had had a skinful of pints. In flying form. He was chatting up a group of mollies from munster outside toners when I saw him. Didn't stay long as I had an appointment with a Brazilian lady in Ballsbridge. He did mention the recent developments in the crypto market. He was laughing away. It was hard to make out what he was saying to be honest but the words scam Ponzi and mugs game were slurred out anyway.

But yeah. I'm not one to gloat. Sorry for the losses of those still hodling. Feel particularly bad for the likes of h0neybadger who would have been very badly exposed to the market as a miner. Or others here who were taken in by the so called experts.

I'm the same. Genuinely sorry for the ones taking the hit. You will always get some trying to talk up the market for their own gain & it's not fair on the small guy who believes it. I see it on the property forum, young asking when the next crash is going to be & then posters knowing better yet talking the market down. Many seem to deliberately confuse blockchain (a good technology in it's own right)with worthless crypto.

Maybe all those financial experts are wrong & it's not the worlds biggest pyramid scheme. Maybe it'll bounce back (temporally) but it is $4,608.36 as I type this.

Benzino · 20-11-2018 10:59AM

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

I'm not one to gloat Zero!

I've been banging the same drum for almost a year now. Those who have listened have saved their bacon. One young chap mentioned he bought a nice leather jacket with his btc money. Now that's a tangible reward for listening to sound advice.

Johnny can't post as he's banned. But no doubt he would be gloating to be fair.

I met him by chance at the aviva on Saturday. The f*cker had had a skinful of pints. In flying form. He was chatting up a group of mollies from munster outside toners when I saw him. Didn't stay long as I had an appointment with a Brazilian lady in Ballsbridge. He did mention the recent developments in the crypto market. He was laughing away. It was hard to make out what he was saying to be honest but the words scam Ponzi and mugs game were slurred out anyway.

But yeah. I'm not one to gloat. Sorry for the losses of those still hodling. Feel particularly bad for the likes of h0neybadger who would have been very badly exposed to the market as a miner. Or others here who were taken in by the so called experts.

You did post though yesterday morning, you just deleted it :P

nomwakao · 20-11-2018 12:14PM

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Many seem to deliberately confuse blockchain (a good technology in it's own right)with worthless crypto.

If your level of information and understanding of blockchain is that limited, you shouldn't invest in cryptocurrencies.

sexmag · 20-11-2018 12:34PM

Benzino wrote: »

You did post though yesterday morning, you just deleted it :P

He also ignored my comments from last week calling him out for being a shyster

Grumpypants · 20-11-2018 12:49PM

I'm sitting in a corner crying and repeating it will bounce back !!!

Some hit in fairness. I took out what i invested in the upturn and now im locked in for the long haul. If nothing comes of it then I've lost nothing.

sexmag · 20-11-2018 01:03PM

Grumpypants wrote: »

I'm sitting in a corner crying and repeating it will bounce back !!!

Some hit in fairness. I took out what i invested in the upturn and now im locked in for the long haul. If nothing comes of it then I've lost nothing.

That's generally what people should have done but greed is an awful temptress

jon1981 · 20-11-2018 02:25PM

You have to wonder, when you hear stories like "More energy is required to mine bitcoin than Gold"... is this dream coming to an end.

Any company I know investing in blockchain are investing the private variety... which is not really going to help investors.

It was a fun time gambling with this stuff, but that's all it is, a gamble. It's over. The technology has shown some value but not in a way that will return any profits to crypto coin holders...be a shareholder of a company that can use this technology within a product that solves real world problems.

bri007 · 20-11-2018 02:28PM

I think cryoto is over, I think it’s hit it’s peak which was last year, all big players (investors) got out in time.

It may rise slightly but will never reach the heights of the past

makeorbrake · 20-11-2018 03:18PM

bri007 wrote: »

I think cryoto is over, I think it’s hit it’s peak which was last year, all big players (investors) got out in time.

It may rise slightly but will never reach the heights of the past

You mean in terms of speculation because nothing has changed in terms of the underlying tech since early last week/month, etc.

As regards a bull market, we will be waiting but there will be an investor lead (rather than retail lead) run up again..but not in the short term. This is what the established money wanted - they now have control over the whole market.

banie01 · 20-11-2018 03:29PM

Grumpypants wrote: »

I'm sitting in a corner crying and repeating it will bounce back !!!

Some hit in fairness. I took out what i invested in the upturn and now im locked in for the long haul. If nothing comes of it then I've lost nothing.

I did ok during the upturn myself, particularly with XRP.
This hit tho, has been deep.
Luckily I'm not relying on crypto gains to pay for xmas this year

I have a good stock portfolio and betwwen that and Crypto it has been an absolutely shít year!
With crypto I'd started offloading most Alts a good while back and had consolidated my own holdings into a split between BTC, BCH, ETH, LTC and some ETC to play with....
Its currently worth @30% of initial investment, but I have taken out gains in the interim so not to bad a sting.
It was always a long term play for me in any case(With scalping when possible)
If I had spare cash, I'd be rolling into BTC now tho.

sexmag · 20-11-2018 03:49PM

banie01 wrote: »

If I had spare cash, I'd be rolling into BTC now tho.

Why is that?

banie01 · 20-11-2018 04:00PM

sexmag wrote: »

Why is that?

As a user of the tech and looking at its utility at the moment in areas of High and Hyper infation (Take Venezuala and Iran as examples) it is a much more easily accessible means of hedging against that.
The open ledger is to my mind at least overhyped.
The transferibility and immediate accessibility that crypto offers, is to my mind at least a reason to keep some at hand.

My current split of investments is 70% equities, 20% crypto and 10% in movable wealth.
In Ireland, moveable wealth such as Gold, precious metals or stones is hard to come by at reasonable prices and for bullion VAT is applicable.
Crypto, while highly volatile is inherently hard to seize and easy to transfer.
I'd roll back into BTC solely because IMO it is the most widely recognized and utilized of the tokens.

Yes you encounter issues with moving back to Fiat, but even that is an easy enough workaround.

listermint · 20-11-2018 04:03PM

banie01 wrote: »

As a user of the tech and looking at its utility at the moment in areas of High and Hyper infation (Take Venezuala and Iran as examples) it is a much more easily accessible means of hedging against that.
The open ledger is to my mind at least overhyped.
The transferibility and immediate accessibility that crypto offers, is to my mind at least a reason to keep some at hand.

My current split of investments is 70% equities, 20% crypto and 10% in movable wealth.
In Ireland, moveable wealth such as Gold, precious metals or stones is hard to come by at reasonable prices and for bullion VAT is applicable.
Crypto, while highly volatile is inherently hard to seize and easy to transfer.
I'd roll back into BTC solely because IMO it is the most widely recognized and utilized of the tokens.

Yes you encounter issues with moving back to Fiat, but even that is an easy enough workaround.

Youll be moving to 70% Crypto 10% Equities and 20% moveable then no doubt

Earleybird · 20-11-2018 04:03PM

banie01 wrote: »

If I had spare cash, I'd be rolling into BTC now tho.

Says it all. You'd probably have spare cash if you hadn't invested in this junk to begin with.

banie01 · 20-11-2018 04:18PM

listermint wrote: »

Youll be moving to 70% Crypto 10% Equities and 20% moveable then no doubt

I see no need to dilute the equity split as it stands.
Crypto is speculative, whatever about projects and other ephemera at the end of day it's a risky investment and far be it from me to try and dissuade anyone of that.
And TBH, if I was to do that now it would cost me more than I'm down in crypto.
Yes I am down money across the board, but I'm not going to go crystallizing actual losses unless something drastic happened in my personal life

makeorbrake · 20-11-2018 04:43PM

Earleybird wrote: »

Says it all. You'd probably have spare cash if you hadn't invested in this junk to begin with.

Your comment is equally telling. The tech stands - the same as it did last week or month. It's highly speculative so of course people can end up with big losses or wins.

However, if you think for a second crypto is dead, you're the one that's deluded here! What changes now is that institutional money will take total control of crypto, there wont be any pump for quite some time but there will be another - and it will be investor led rather than retail led.

will56 · 20-11-2018 04:56PM

makeorbrake wrote: »

Your comment is equally telling. The tech stands - the same as it did last week or month. It's highly speculative so of course people can end up with big losses or wins.

However, if you think for a second crypto is dead, you're the one that's deluded here! What changes now is that institutional money will take total control of crypto, there wont be any pump for quite some time but there will be another - and it will be investor led rather than retail led.

Its funny how last year people were singing the praises of crypto and how it would destabilize the established wealth and financial systems, and now they are most the likely the ones that hold the vast amount of BTC and can pump and dump the price to suit

cravings · 20-11-2018 05:10PM

https://99bitcoins.com/obituary-stats/

makeorbrake · 20-11-2018 05:13PM

will56 wrote: »

Its funny how last year people were singing the praises of crypto and how it would destabilize the established wealth and financial systems, and now they are most the likely the ones that hold the vast amount of BTC and can pump and dump the price to suit

Huh? No...they're not the same two groups of people you're referring to. The original cypherpunks and very early crypto adopters - they'd be sick with this sh1t. However, it's the reality - wall street owns crypto's ass now. I just hope decentralized crypto finds a way to keep developing.

PlanBee · 20-11-2018 05:35PM

cravings wrote: »

https://99bitcoins.com/obituary-stats/

Look at the Bitcoin chart today, it looks Bitcoin is alive and getting back to go up!

cnocbui · 20-11-2018 05:54PM

As I rather suspected, the GFC never ended. About the only place that has convinced itself otherwise is the US, where boosters have been saying 'look at the economy go' while house sales are stagnant or falling. Now investors have realised the 2007 melt down was only paused and is back in gear - just look at those stock markets fall!.

Property market in Australia is crashing - unsettling noises about Oz banks having sub-prime debt. The Chinese have mountain ranges worth of debt. Europe is f'd as ever it has been since 2007.

Investors are getting out of investments and into cash as fast as they can. That's what I think is happening to BTC.

We'll soon be back to Godzilla armies worth of cash sitting at negative interest rates for a while and then there will be an exodus as investors greed overtakes fear and they go on the hunt for returns and asset prices will start to climb again.

Draghi is a smart cookie - he wasn't fooled.

Earleybird · 20-11-2018 06:03PM

makeorbrake wrote: »

Your comment is equally telling. The tech stands - the same as it did last week or month. It's highly speculative so of course people can end up with big losses or wins.

However, if you think for a second crypto is dead, you're the one that's deluded here! What changes now is that institutional money will take total control of crypto, there wont be any pump for quite some time but there will be another - and it will be investor led rather than retail led.

When did I say crypto is dead? I only wrote a few words, you should read them all next time.

I don't expect it to go anywhere. The ridiculous prices placed on all of the coins however is a journey going much further south.

Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

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