Madeleine McCann

MmmChocolate · 14-11-2018 03:04PM

bubblypop wrote: »

This doesn't make sense . You think the parents as innocent until proven guilty, however you don't believe they can be declared innocent?

Let me rephrase. I don't necessarily default to the belief that they were involved, which I guess isn't exactly the same as thinking they're innocent. I would be more inclined to think they were not involved than they were. But there are too many questions for them to be conclusively declared innocent.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 04:00PM

MmmChocolate wrote: »

I suspect Deusexmachina feels that any theory that doesn't exonerate the parents 100% is not a credible theory.

Absolutely. Anything else is frankly rubbish. Cadaver dogs sniff a hired car - HIRED WEEKS AFTER THE CHILD GOES MISSING.

How the hell did they hide the body for weeks in the apartment in the full view of police, friends, family, worlds media - and then smuggle this stinking rotten corpse out to the car and then bury it without anyone noticing??

I mean really - this is the stuff we are asked to take seriously...

retro:electro · 14-11-2018 04:10PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

MmmChocolate wrote: »

I've read this whole thread but I may have missed this so apologies if it was posted already. It's an unnerving theory but it seems to fit the facts - as I know them anyway. The points are well made but be warned - it's upsetting enough that you might end up wishing you hadn't read it because yes, there are people out there capable of doing the things it suggests.

https://threadreaderapp.com/thread/1052261768909733888.html

“I ain't even done yet bitch let me tell you about how they sold her into sex trafficking”

Wow.

badabing106 · 14-11-2018 04:10PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

But it’s not simply because they are her parents. Not at all.

Nobody has ever been able to develop a reasonable scenario backed up with proper evidence which expliains how and why her parents killed her and/or disposed of her body.

Any scenario I have ever read from conspiracy theorists have more holes in them than swizz cheese.

The British and Portuguese detectives working on the case finished their investigation and their conclusion was that Madeleine mcann died in the apartment because of an accident, and the mcann were responsible, upon discovering her,of concealing and transporting the body somewhere and faking an abduction attempt

iamwhoiam · 14-11-2018 04:14PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Absolutely. Anything else is frankly rubbish. Cadaver dogs sniff a hired car - HIRED WEEKS AFTER THE CHILD GOES MISSING.

How the hell did they hide the body for weeks in the apartment in the full view of police, friends, family, worlds media - and then smuggle this stinking rotten corpse out to the car and then bury it without anyone noticing??

I mean really - this is the stuff we are asked to take seriously...

I think personally if you made your arguments politely and not so shouty and rude people would tend to listen to you
Shouting people down rarely makes them listen , just my opinion of course

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 04:17PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

I think personally if you made your arguments politely and not so shouty and rude people would tend to listen to you
Shouting people down rarely makes them listen , just my opinion of course

I am not being shouty. I am simply calling out some really nasty rumour and innuendo that has caused this family incredible hurt.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 04:18PM

badabing106 wrote: »

The British and Portuguese detectives working on the case finished their investigation and their conclusion was that Madeleine mcann died in the apartment because of an accident, and the mcann were responsible, upon discovering her,of concealing and transporting the body somewhere and faking an abduction attempt

Really??????

iamwhoiam · 14-11-2018 04:21PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

I am not being shouty. I am simply calling out some really nasty rumour and innuendo that has caused this family incredible hurt.

You have tended to shoutsince the thread started with such posts as " leave them alone " etc . Just my experience that people who shout their opinion rarely get listened to . Explaination and measured reasons for your opinion will far more likely be heard . I too have bourne the brunt of your shouting despite make valid points and basically being open minded .
But of course that is just an opinion also

cnocbui · 14-11-2018 04:24PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

badabing106 wrote: »

The British and Portuguese detectives working on the case finished their investigation and their conclusion was that Madeleine mcann died in the apartment because of an accident, and the mcann were responsible, upon discovering her,of concealing and transporting the body somewhere and faking an abduction attempt

The detectives made no such conclusion. Pure fantasy.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 04:24PM

iamwhoiam wrote: »

You have tended to shoutsince the thread started with such posts as " leave them alone " etc . Just my experience that people who shout their opinion rarely get listened to . Explaination and measured reasons for your opinion will far more likely be heard . But of course that is just an opinion also

You keep criticising me personally. Why not just discuss the points raised?

(I am actually a decent enough person - I just don't like to see these people being treated so badly online. No need for personal jibes)

Boom_Bap · 14-11-2018 04:26PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Enough with the personal jabs, it's already had the thread on shakey ground, and I don't want to see a repeat.

iamwhoiam · 14-11-2018 04:27PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

You keep criticising me personally. Why not just discuss the points raised?

(I am actually a decent enough person - I just don't like to see these people being treated so badly online. No need for personal jibes)

Actually you persistently told me I was banging on about the same points . Works both ways . But if you prefer I can completely ignore your posts and keep my distance

cnocbui · 14-11-2018 04:31PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Absolutely. Anything else is frankly rubbish. Cadaver dogs sniff a hired car - HIRED WEEKS AFTER THE CHILD GOES MISSING.

How the hell did they hide the body for weeks in the apartment in the full view of police, friends, family, worlds media - and then smuggle this stinking rotten corpse out to the car and then bury it without anyone noticing??

I mean really - this is the stuff we are asked to take seriously...

It's very easy - Portuguese trained tracker and SAR dogs are completely incompetent, unlike dogs trained in the UK. You don't expect a foreign SAR dog to be able to find a hidden body, do you?

The McCanns clearly aren't really medical professionals, they are actually magicians. Amazing what you can hide up your sleeve.

badabing106 · 14-11-2018 04:35PM

cnocbui wrote: »

The detectives made no such conclusion. Pure fantasy.

Below is a statement from the chief inspector of the Madeleine McCann case and the conclusion of the entire investigation. He was confronted in court , when team McCann took a lawsuit against a book written by one of its leading investigators.

Chief Inspector Tavares de Almeida told the court that he believed the couple, from Rothley, Leicestershire, were directly involved in Madeleine’s disappearance – a theory he said was shared by Portuguese and British officers working on the case

He said: “The conclusion that was arrived at was that Madeleine McCann died at the apartment and the McCann couple simulated the abduction to hide the fact that they had not taken care of their children.

“There was a tragic accident in the apartment that night and they neglected the care of their children. It was the conclusion of both Portuguese and British police. We have always spoken of a tragic accidental death. There was no homicide.”

Asked if he thought Madeleine was dead, Mr de Almeida replied: “Yes. She is dead. It was not only the police who believed this but the public prosecutor. The McCanns did not kill her but they concealed the body.”

Mr de Almeida was giving evidence on behalf of his former colleague Goncalo Amaral who is seeking to overturn a ban on the book he wrote about the Madeleine case entitled Maddie: The Truth Of The Lie.

The detective described the book as a “true history of the facts”. He said: “Goncalo Amaral was very careful to come to this conclusion with the facts.”

Luis Neves, the head of Portugal’s anti-terrorism unit, told the court they had employed a British profiler who gave him the impression that the McCanns were guilty of involvement in Madeleine’s disappearance.
Mr de Almeida said their suspicions about the couple appeared to be confirmed when sniffer dogs found traces of blood and the smell of death at the McCanns’ holiday apartment.
One of the dogs was in a nervous, excitable state and wanted to get into the room, said Mr de Almeida.

He said: “Inside the apartment there were two places where the dogs gave a sign. One was in the bedroom, the other was in the dining room.
“It was also found in the McCanns’ new apartment on a piece of clothing and in the rental car.”

Asked if it was the dog’s reaction that led police to make the McCanns formal suspects in the investigation, he said: “No, they were already suspected of simulating a kidnapping and concealing the body.”

[URL="http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/151405/Maddie-died-in-apartment-court-hearsMaddie-died-in-apartment-court-hearsMaddie-][/url]

14-11-2018 04:46PM

The parents did it

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Absolutely. Anything else is frankly rubbish. Cadaver dogs sniff a hired car - HIRED WEEKS AFTER THE CHILD GOES MISSING.

How the hell did they hide the body for weeks in the apartment in the full view of police, friends, family, worlds media - and then smuggle this stinking rotten corpse out to the car and then bury it without anyone noticing??

I mean really - this is the stuff we are asked to take seriously...

I don't think it would have to be a corpse that the dog scented in the car, maybe something a corpse had been in was put in the car. A bag with odour maybe? So a corpus wouldn't have to be kept for weeks

gozunda · 14-11-2018 04:58PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

I am not being shouty. I am simply calling out some really nasty rumour and innuendo that has caused this family incredible hurt.

The real victim of all this is a child - a child no one has heard of since the 3rd of May 2007.

Whether the mccanns are innocent or otherwise remains to be seen. Children statistically are more likley to be hurt or killed by those closest to them than a stranger. It is fact that the parents were less than cooperative with the original investigation. It remains that investigation came to a premature end partially as result of the lack of cooperation of the mccanns and their friends who were on holiday with them.

A little less shouting about the 'feelings' or otherwise of the parents and more on the fate of the victim and a discussion of the evidence which does exist is a heluva more constructive imo.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:04PM

gozunda wrote: »

The real victim of all this is a child - a child no one has heard of since the 3rd of May 2007.

Whether the mccanns are innocent or otherwise remains to be seen. Children statistically are more likley to be hurt or killed by those closest to them than a stranger. It is fact that the parents were less than cooperative with the original investigation. It remains that investigation came to a premature end partially as result of the lack of cooperation of the mccanns and their friends who were on holiday with them.

A little less shouting about the 'feelings' or otherwise of the parents and more on the fate of the victim and a discussion of the evidence which does exist is a heluva more constructive imo.

Nope. The REAL victims are a child, her parents, her brother and sister, her grandparents, aunts and uncles, and friends of the family.

A child does not die without incredible hurt caused to her family. To dismiss this is callous.

iamwhoiam · 14-11-2018 05:05PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Poor little Madeleine the real victim in this sad story . Let down by those who should have protected her . But I often worry too about the twins . They are at an age where they will be questioning and wondering . Being 14 is not easy and they will worry and be uneasy about decisions made .

robwen · 14-11-2018 05:06PM

She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)

Does Amarals book put forward a theory as to how or when the McCann's allegedly disposed of the body?

gozunda · 14-11-2018 05:09PM

Something Else

[Deleted User] wrote: »

I don't think it would have to be a corpse that the dog scented in the car, maybe something a corpse had been in was put in the car. A bag with odour maybe? So a corpus wouldn't have to be kept for weeks

Some off the places investigated by the Portugese police during the investigation was a cold storage facility and the crypt of a local church. Portugal in early May is not as warm as areas further south in neighbouring Spain - with temperatures averaging between 12.5 - 17c for the Month.

Possible methods which would have caused delayed decomposition was one of the areas of the original investigation afaik. Such a scenario would also have meant that the body would not have needed to have been disposed of until much later.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:09PM

Deleted User wrote: »

I don't think it would have to be a corpse that the dog scented in the car, maybe something a corpse had been in was put in the car. A bag with odour maybe? So a corpus wouldn't have to be kept for weeks

So an item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) that the child wore, or was wrapped in, was taken from her corpse and then, weeks later, the McCanns brought that item of clothing with them in their hired car. And then this item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) was removed from that car and buried or burnt or hidden.
And then weeks after that, the cadaver dogs smelt the scent of the dead body from the item of clothing having been in the hired car some weeks previously......

Hardly the smoking gun, is it? (Its actually impossible). And yet this has some people totally convinced.

Ultimate Seduction · 14-11-2018 05:12PM

Something Else

Heard on the news this morning the government have given 150k to police searching for her. How many kids have gone missing since her 11 years ago and nothing said, no money from the government. It's really weird.

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:13PM

gozunda wrote: »

Some off the places investigated by the Portugese police during the investigation was a cold storage facility and the crypt of a local church. Portugal in early May is not as warm as areas further south in neighbouring Spain - with temperatures averaging between 12.5 - 17c for the Month.

Possible methods which would have caused delayed decomposition was one of the areas of the original investigation afaik. Such a scenario would also have meant that the body would not have needed to have been disposed of until much later.

Was it hidden in the crypt for the weeks previous?

gozunda · 14-11-2018 05:14PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

So an item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) that the child wore, or was wrapped in, was taken from her corpse and then, weeks later, the McCanns brought that item of clothing with them in their hired car. And then this item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) was removed from that car.
And then weeks after that, the cadaver dogs smelt the scented the dead body from the item of clothing having been in the hired car some weeks previously......

Hardly the smoking gun, is it? An yet this has some people totally convinced.

I would disagree. The issue of the scent in the car used by the mccanns is yet another piece of evidence to suggest a cover up or that not all the facts of the case have came to light.

It remains that piece of evidence is unexplained in the context of what the parents claimed to have happened.

14-11-2018 05:16PM

The parents did it

Deusexmachina wrote: »

So an item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) that the child wore, or was wrapped in, was taken from her corpse and then, weeks later, the McCanns brought that item of clothing with them in their hired car. And then this item of clothing (or blanket or whatever) was removed from that car and buried or burnt or hidden.
And then weeks after that, the cadaver dogs smelt the scent of the dead body from the item of clothing having been in the hired car some weeks previously......

Hardly the smoking gun, is it? (Its actually impossible). And yet this has some people totally convinced.

Is it impossible? Why? May not be clothing, may be a luggage?

gozunda · 14-11-2018 05:16PM

Something Else

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Was it hidden in the crypt for the weeks previous?

The details of that investigation is contained in the files. It was just one of the areas investigated as to possibility that the body had been kept hidden for a period after death

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:17PM

gozunda wrote: »

The details of that investigation is contained in the files. It was just one of the areas investigated as to possibility that the body had been kept hidden for a period after death

Do you realise how ludicrous that sounds? (Not you - the Portuguese Police)

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:19PM

Deleted User wrote: »

Is it impossible? Why? May not be clothing, may be a luggage?

How on earth does the scent go from the body of a child to a car weeks later - then staying in the car after the luggage has been removed weeks later?

And how on earth did the McCanns manage all this?

Deusexmachina · 14-11-2018 05:20PM

gozunda wrote: »

I would disagree. The issue of the scent in the car used by the mccanns is yet another piece of evidence to suggest a cover up or that not all the facts of the case have came to light.

It remains that piece of evidence is unexplained in the context of what the parents claimed to have happened.

But its NOT evidence of anything. A false alert. Dismissed by experts.

14-11-2018 05:22PM

Dogs!
I've seen explosives dogs walk past explosive hides & not register a thing.
I've seen drug dogs in the same room as drugs & not find a thing.
I wouldn't put too much time into any results from dogs Tbh.

Madeleine McCann

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