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Madeleine McCann

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Comments

  • Posts: 7,272 ✭✭✭ Salvatore Cool Bubble


    That’s disgusting.

    What’s disgusting is going out to dinner and leaving 3 small children alone in an apartment or hotel or whatever it was. If anyone else had done what they did they’d never see their children again. It’s absolute ****e.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,129 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    What’s disgusting is going out to dinner and leaving 3 small children alone in an apartment or hotel or whatever it was. If anyone else had done what they did they’d never see their children again. It’s absolute ****e.

    But they were/are doctors. That matters.


  • Posts: 7,272 ✭✭✭ Salvatore Cool Bubble


    But they were/are doctors. That matters.

    Somehow that makes it worse imo. A doctor would be well aware of the things that could happen to a small child unsupervised (in a medical sense) not to speak of the common sense required to know leaving a small child alone is just a stupid idea. And they did it with three children. Baffling.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,094 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    Babysitters can be hired and are. I know that's what my family members do when they go away with their young kids, and then go downstairs for a drink or two!

    It is a small price to pay for peace of mind and shows they care a lot for their children too. Most hotels will provide babysitters if needed.

    Toddler drowns at babysitter's house; twin brother on life support

    And there are so many incidents with daycare, schools, babysitters, friends that one could post links all day long. 5hit happens - ask the McCanns.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 7,694 ✭✭✭the_pen_turner


    Something Else
    cnocbui wrote: »
    Toddler drowns at babysitter's house; twin brother on life support

    And there are so many incidents with daycare, schools, babysitters, friends that one could post links all day long. 5hit happens - ask the McCanns.

    5hit happens even when there is someone there to help. what chance did maddie have with no one there .


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    cnocbui wrote: »
    Toddler drowns at babysitter's house; twin brother on life support

    And there are so many incidents with daycare, schools, babysitters, friends that one could post links all day long. 5hit happens - ask the McCanns.

    Yes indeed accidents happen . In your link above she also should have been more careful . **** happens which is why adults try to avoid it happening their kids
    Big big difference between an accident and leaving kids vulnerable and at risk
    I think you actually know this and are well aware of the difference


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,129 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    Personally I think the children were sedated probably with something like Phenergan which is an anti histamine that knocks you out relatively safely. I've used it myself on long haul flights and it is brilliant. No script required.

    The parents are doctors. They possibly thought the kids would be knocked out for the night (the twins didn't move a muscle when all the commotion was going on for example).

    Anyway, and it is just a theory, Madeleine woke up, was groggy, went out the door and got lost or something. Or indeed she could have had an accident, fell hit her head and died. It can happen.

    Just a theory or two, but we will never know now I reckon.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    Ridiculous analogy. Being downstairs while your child is upstairs asleep is not even remotely the same as leaving them alone in a strange apartment (when they had cried and asked for you the night before) while you wine and dine yourself across the resort incapable of seeing or hearing a thing. Jesus my sister would barely leave her toddlers alone to hang the clothes out on the line. I’m aware there’s a massive divide in opinion in relation to whether or not people think they were involved; but I had assumed that their complete negligence of their children’s welfare that night is something we could all agree on.
    How can anyone defend that?

    Do you think they should have availed of the baby sitting service provided by the complex?


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 12,653 ✭✭✭✭Plumbthedepths


    cnocbui wrote: »
    All parents leave their children alone at some point, sometimes for 7 or 8 hours at a time - particularly at night.

    That's an absolutely ridiculous comment, but part of me thinks you knew that already.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    That's an absolutely ridiculous comment, but part of me thinks you knew that already.

    It’s not ridiculous. Parents put children down for the night and they close the bedroom door and go to their own bedroom and go to sleep. Anything could happen any child in its own room while it’s parent is asleep or outside cutting the grass.
    Unless you sit in your child’s bedroom while they sleep then they are being left unattended.
    The children were all being checked at regular intervals, in a Rota involving 3 sets of parents that’s how she was discovered missing.
    You prefer to imply that the children were dumped into bed and abandoned by careless unloving neglectful parents.
    People seem to get particularly gleeful pleasure out of sitting in pious judgment over the McCanns because they were medical professionals who both came from very ordinary backgrounds, so working class kids made “good” so to speak.
    This seems to irk a certain section of society, who in years gone by would have derided G McCann in particular as an “upstart”, cheeky and brash who’d “got above himself”.
    The unfortunate woman who took her own life after being outed by Sky News as one of the internet trolls who spent vast hours trying to destroy Kate McCann was particularly irked by what she imagined was the lavish lifestyle Mrs McCann enjoyed as a GP married to a consultant cardiologist.
    The disappeance of Maddie McCann. The gift that keeps on giving to those who sit and judge.


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,129 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    splinter65 wrote: »
    It’s not ridiculous. Parents put children down for the night and they close the bedroom door and go to their own bedroom and go to sleep. Anything could happen any child in its own room while it’s parent is asleep or outside cutting the grass.
    Unless you sit in your child’s bedroom while they sleep then they are being left unattended.

    That's why sensible caring parents have either baby monitors within range, or CCTV in the kids bedrooms.

    I think it is called responsible parenting.


  • Posts: 2,799 ✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The parents did it
    cnocbui wrote: »
    Toddler drowns at babysitter's house; twin brother on life support

    And there are so many incidents with daycare, schools, babysitters, friends that one could post links all day long. 5hit happens - ask the McCanns.

    And many many more are avoided because of caring, attendant people.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,345 ✭✭✭limnam


    So when people here go to hotels and put the children to bed they don’t leave the room? Or just one at a time?


    Why are you comparing leaving a bedroom and staying in the same apartment


    to putting your kids to bed and fecking off out to a restaurant ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    That's why sensible caring parents have either baby monitors within range, or CCTV in the kids bedrooms.

    I think it is called responsible parenting.

    So before there was CCTV or baby monitors parents were taking huge risks and being irresponsibly reckless every time their child napped?!?
    You do know that there was a time before baby monitors....?!?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    And many many more are avoided because of caring, attendant people.

    My grandparents were farmers. When the dinner things were washed up at around 1.30 pm my granny left my mother asleep in her cot while she went down and scoured the milk Parlour.
    Was that uncaring and unattendent?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 1,294 ✭✭✭Deusexmachina


    What’s disgusting is going out to dinner and leaving 3 small children alone in an apartment or hotel or whatever it was. If anyone else had done what they did they’d never see their children again. It’s absolute ****e.

    Leaving their children was wrong. Calling for them to lose their other children and to be incarcerated is frankly unhinged.


  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 410 ✭✭Dog Man Star


    splinter65 wrote: »
    My grandparents were farmers. When the dinner things were washed up at around 1.30 pm my granny left my mother asleep in her cot while she went down and scoured the milk Parlour.
    Was that uncaring and unattendent?

    If Madeline McCann had slept in a cot, she would be alive today. Cots are pretty safe.

    An empty Portugese tiled apartment less so, particularly when you are three years old, alone and heavily sedated.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    If Madeline McCann had slept in a cot, she would be alive today.

    Not many children of nearly 4 sleep in a cot, nor could they be confined to a cot ( my niece aged 30 months couldn’t be confined to a cot) but please, explain your theory.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    If Madeline McCann had slept in a cot, she would be alive today. Cots are pretty safe.

    An empty Portugese tiled apartment less so, particularly when you are three years old, alone and heavily sedated.

    So you have evidence of sedation that hasn’t been discovered/uncovered by 2 different police forces investigating over 10 years at a cost of millions of €\£ ? Have you shared this evidence ? Or are you just spouting bull?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    Leaving their children was wrong. Calling for them to lose their other children and to be incarcerated is frankly unhinged.

    But it’s what the baying mob of pitchforking Mumsnet cave dwellers demanded.....


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  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    splinter65 wrote: »
    My grandparents were farmers. When the dinner things were washed up at around 1.30 pm my granny left my mother asleep in her cot while she went down and scoured the milk Parlour.
    Was that uncaring and unattendent?

    How far away was she ? Could she hear the baby ? Was her back door open and accessible from a public road ? How long was she gone ? Was the baby at risk if anyone could walk in ?
    We risk assess as adults and factors like that matter . As parents you see a risk and take steps to avoid it for your children .


  • Closed Accounts Posts: 437 ✭✭Charmeleon


    Leaving their children was wrong. Calling for them to lose their other children and to be incarcerated is frankly unhinged.

    According to Pamela Fenn, who lived in the apartment directly above, on the night of the 1st of May she heard a child cry for at least 1 hour and 15 minutes, getting louder and more distressed until she heard someone arrive home after 11pm. The morning of the 3rd Kate admittted Madeleine asked her why she didn’t come when they were crying the night before ie. the 2nd. So we know the children were alone and distressed for at least two previous nights and both parents were aware of this before they went on to leave them entirely alone yet again. One child is never seen again.

    This is not a ‘ooops!’ scenario. It is willful neglect.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    splinter65 wrote: »
    So before there was CCTV or baby monitors parents were taking huge risks and being irresponsibly reckless every time their child napped?!?
    You do know that there was a time before baby monitors....?!?

    There was indeed . I reared my eldest with no monitor . So his door was open , our door was open and we could hear him breathe . Our doors to the outside were locked , his window was locked and everytime we woke we peeped in to see he was ok . Its called keeping them as safe as you can in the circumstances


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 9,420 ✭✭✭splinter65


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    iamwhoiam wrote: »
    There was indeed . I reared my eldest with no monitor . So his door was open , our door was open and we could hear him breathe . Our doors to the outside were locked , his window was locked and everytime we woke we peeped in to see he was ok . Its called keeping them as safe as you can in the circumstances

    So you were asleep but you could hear your baby breathing. I see. So I assume that you consider all the parents who suffered a cot death to be neglectful because, well, they didn’t hear the baby had stopped breathing ?


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,250 ✭✭✭✭iamwhoiam


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    splinter65 wrote: »
    So you were asleep but you could hear your baby breathing. I see. So I assume that you consider all the parents who suffered a cot death to be neglectful because, well, they didn’t hear the baby had stopped breathing ?

    Thats a low thing to say even for you . I just said parents do the best in the circumstances . They do need to sleep
    But I think you know that don't you

    I have been in A and E when parents ran in with dead babies in their arms from a cot death . Its not a matter for discussion or comparison in this case


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,129 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    splinter65 wrote: »
    So you were asleep but you could hear your baby breathing. I see. So I assume that you consider all the parents who suffered a cot death to be neglectful because, well, they didn’t hear the baby had stopped breathing ?

    I really hope you are not trolling.

    There is a world of difference having your children in the next room, monitor or not, compared to leaving two babies and a child of four unattended in an unlocked apartment out of view. Come on now.


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 21,094 ✭✭✭✭cnocbui


    She wandered out herself, something happened (car accident/paedo)
    That's why sensible caring parents have either baby monitors within range, or CCTV in the kids bedrooms.

    I think it is called responsible parenting.

    So now we have arrived at a society where anything less than 24/7 CCTV monitoring of children is bad parenting?

    Is it bad parenting to let and encourage your children to climb trees? How about letting them walk or ride a bike to school?


  • Posts: 7,272 ✭✭✭ Salvatore Cool Bubble


    cnocbui wrote: »
    So now we have arrived at a society where anything less than 24/7 CCTV monitoring of children is bad parenting?

    Is it bad parenting to let and encourage your children to climb trees? How about letting them walk or ride a bike to school?

    Keep building those strawmen :rolleyes:


  • Registered Users, Registered Users 2 Posts: 16,129 ✭✭✭✭Spanish Eyes


    cnocbui wrote: »
    So now we have arrived at a society where anything less than 24/7 CCTV monitoring of children is bad parenting?

    Is it bad parenting to let and encourage your children to climb trees? How about letting them walk or ride a bike to school?

    The word I used was "responsible" parenting. That can be achieved in many ways, but leaving three kids under four in an unlocked apartment in a foreign country out of view of their parents is just not on.

    And the eldest child is gone now because of it.


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  • Banned (with Prison Access) Posts: 410 ✭✭Dog Man Star


    splinter65 wrote: »
    So you have evidence of sedation that hasn’t been discovered/uncovered by 2 different police forces investigating over 10 years at a cost of millions of €\£ ? Have you shared this evidence ? Or are you just spouting bull?

    The twins were not tested in time for sedatives.

    Madeline woke the previous night crying for a long time, 75 minutes according to a neighbour. http://www.mccannpjfiles.co.uk/PJ/PAMELA_FENN.htm

    Stands to reason they upped the dose on the night she died. Kate McCann's father stated they had used Calpol to sedate the children before https://gazetadigitalmadeleinecase.blogspot.com/2007/09/madeleines-grandfather-admits-kate-may.html


This discussion has been closed.
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