Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

tayto lover · 03-11-2018 04:10PM

EOTR,

You could say that about any party I.e. SF's economic policies as explained by Gerry Adams, the Water issue ad explained by Phil Hogan etc etc.

SafeSurfer · 03-11-2018 04:12PM

Has anyone read the full page article in today’s Irish Times by Rosita Boland?
“Abusing Travellers is racism for liberals”

During the journalists visit to a traveller encampment a child brought in an anonymous note from a letter box which the journalist had to read because the parents couldn’t read. The note contained 2 cartridges and a threat that if they didn’t stop racing their horses on the road one of them would be killed.

One of the Travellers later said “we saw Peter Casey on the TV. We were shocked at what he said. He didn’t say anything good at all about us. He is definitely a racist”.

nullzero · 03-11-2018 04:14PM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Has anyone read the full page article in today’s Irish Times by Rosita Boland?
“Abusing Travellers is racism for liberals”

During the journalists visit to a traveller encampment a child brought in an anonymous note from a letter box which the journalist had to read because the parents couldn’t read. The note contained 2 cartridges and a threat that if they didn’t stop racing their horses on the road one of them would be killed.

One of the Travellers later said “we saw Peter Casey on the TV. We were shocked at what he said. He didn’t say anything good at all about us. He is definitely a racist”.

Oh, it's official so, he's a racist.
His saying he feels everyone is equal was a dog whistle for "I hate those travellers".

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:14PM

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Is that the Wikipedia definition?

Yes it is. Handier than quoting the 1984 Act cited in our complaint.

2.—(1) It shall be an offence for a person—

(a) to publish or distribute written material,

(b) to use words, behave or display written material—

(i) in any place other than inside a private residence, or

(ii) inside a private residence so that the words, behaviour or material are heard or seen by persons outside the residence,

or

(c) to distribute, show or play a recording of visual images or sounds,

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

nullzero · 03-11-2018 04:16PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes it is. Handier than quoting the 1984 Act cited in our complaint.

Casey said he felt all people are equal and he is in no way racist.

Perhaps that may have some effect on what you're claiming.

People like you are making out that he was goose stepping out onto the studio floor and quoting directly from Mein Kampf.

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:18PM

nullzero wrote: »

Casey said he felt all people are equal and he is in no way racist.

Perhaps that may have some effect on what you're claiming.

People like you are making out that he was goose stepping out onto the studio floor and quoting directly from Mein Kampf.

That isn't all he said though. :rolleyes:

tayto lover · 03-11-2018 04:19PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

Yes it is. Handier than quoting the 1984 Act cited in our complaint.

Did it mention sulky racing, fist fights, goading "Shyte in a bucket" videos, crimes against the elderly etc? Many people feel offended by that. Any mention?

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:20PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Did it mention sulky racing, fist fights, goading "Shyte in a bucket" videos, crimes against the elderly etc? Many people feel offended by that. Any mention?

nullzero · 03-11-2018 04:20PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

That isn't all he said though. :rolleyes:

He didn't say anything that could be described as hate speech.

If you want to see it that way that's your problem. Hell of you want to believe the earth is flat you can do that too, it doesn't make it right however.

Also, rolleyes? Come on, you can do better than that.

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:21PM

nullzero wrote: »

He didn't say anything that could be described as hate speech.

If you want to see it that way that's your problem. He'll of you want to believe the earth is flat you can do that too, it doesn't make it right however.

Also, rolleyes? Come on, you can do better than that.

I never said it was anything more than a matter of opinion. Get over it maybe?

nullzero · 03-11-2018 04:22PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

I never said it was anything more than a matter of opinion. Get over it maybe?

Your opinion is wrong. I'm well over it too as it's your problem.

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:23PM

nullzero wrote: »

Your opinion is wrong. I'm well over it too as it's your problem.

It isn't a problem for me, as I believe he indulged in hate speech and incited it. look at this thread as an example.

The Bishop Basher · 03-11-2018 04:27PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

It isn't a problem for me, as I believe he indulged in hate speech and incited it.

You believing does not make it so.

Your “complaint” is in a bin somewhere.

Get over it and move on..

You won’t get anywhere on that point

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:29PM

Rennaws wrote: »

You believing does not make it so.

Your “complaint” is in a bin somewhere.

Get over it and move on..

You won’t get anywhere on that point

They fulfill the test outlines in this section of the Act:

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

Read this thread for numerous examples of the hate he stirred up.

You can keep on rubbishing the idea, you cannot disprove it though.

Uncharted · 03-11-2018 04:32PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

They fulfill the test outlines in this section of the Act:

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

Read this thread for numerous examples of the hate he stirred up.

You can keep on rubbishing the idea, you cannot disprove it though.

You love this craic,don't ya Francie.

You're like a less interesting but more doggedly determined Aongus Von Bismarck.

Never change Francie,please never change...

Plumbthedepths · 03-11-2018 04:36PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

They fulfill the test outlines in this section of the Act:

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

Read this thread for numerous examples of the hate he stirred up.

You can keep on rubbishing the idea, you cannot disprove it though.

Casey didn't engage in hate speech though. Seems though you are trying to make him answerable for what others have said. That's funny.

Plumbthedepths · 03-11-2018 04:37PM

Uncharted wrote: »

You love this craic,don't ya Francie.

You're like a less interesting but more doggedly determined Aongus Von Bismarck.

Never change Francie,please never change...

Judging by his post count on here, I'd say he does.

The Bishop Basher · 03-11-2018 04:38PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

They fulfill the test outlines in this section of the Act:

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

Read this thread for numerous examples of the hate he stirred up.

You can keep on rubbishing the idea, you cannot disprove it though.

The only people who stir up hatred are travelers themselves through their antisocial, aggressive and threatening behavior..

coolshannagh28 · 03-11-2018 04:39PM

Varadker has a lot to answer for here , prior to winning the leadership of FG he was seen to be on the right of the party spectrum and gained a lot of support for that , however since he became Taoiseach he has pushed a very liberal agenda and left room for a disillusioned right of centre portion of the electorate to gravitate towards the likes of Casey.
FF have moved left with FG so there is room for an articulate right of centre party/leader.

end of the road · 03-11-2018 04:39PM

tretorn wrote: »

People are upset because Tubridy presented a non threatening group of travellers to the country last night. I predicted this is what he would do but it’s another kick in the teeth to rural people to see this response by the national broadcaster to the misery that led to them voting for Casey.

If the majority of the thirty thousand travellers are good law abiding citizens who go to college and then work why did 347,000 people vote for Peter Casey.

RTE should remember who pays the licence fee and who doesn’t.

Tubridy and his rude questions about where Casey got his money, I think this was the first question asked. Tubridy is on a huge salary and every licence payer is being fleeced to pay for his nose in the trough. He isn’t afraid to leave his house in case someone arrives pretending to be selling something but in reality looking for an opportunity to rob it.

Why didn’t Tubridy ask the travellers how come many appear to be wealthy but officially the vast majority claim welfare payments, if its ok to ask Casey where he made his money then ask the travellers the same question.

tuberty asked the questions that needed to be asked. he was interviewing casey, not discussing travelers as such. i have no doubt people are upset because casey was challenged and they do not like their heroes or anyone who tells them what they want to hear being challenged but that is their problem. casey couldn't answer a simple question, but that's not tuberty's fault and i don't particularly rate the guy in terms of presenting the lls. being challenged and being unable to answer is not a kick in the teeth to rural people or anyone, rural people are not a homogenous group who think the same.
it's not rte's job to only have people in the audience that suit your agenda. that's not how this works. casey made mostly generalisations and therefore he was fair game for being asked the same questions toards him, that you would like to have been asked toards travelers, but for which is irrelevant given the context of the show and who it was interviewing.

tretorn wrote: »

Casey didnt make attacks on anyone.

He said he couldnt understand why travellers got ethnic status and can you reply to the question I put previously.

What is there about their culture that is deserving of ethnic status, why is it being proposed that my children should learn about their culture in school. How would you fill even one lesson time if after hundreds of posts here no one can explain what traveller culture is.

The rest of your post is just nonsense and its people like you are the major stumbling block in the State not enforcing the right of traveller children to a decent lifestyle beginning with their right to education being enforced without exception even if that means a Garda escort to school in the morning.

Keep on keeping on the way you are going and in twenty years time the current travellers infants will mostly still be uneducated and therefore unemployable and untrustworthy. The girls will still be taken out of school at sixteen and married off because their parents have ensured they have no escape route because they have been denied an education, the resistance to education is probably mostly coming from male travellers because how can they exert their dominance through their fists if their wives and daughters have economic independence and arent pregnant every nine months from age sixteen.

ETA, people voted for Casey for one reason and one reason only and that was to do with real concerns about travellers.

If you look at the pattern of voting Caseys main support came from areas where travellers are present in large numbers, things have never been worse between travellers and people who abide for the most part rules in civi society and for the most part dont cause problems for their neighbours.

Its time now to stop Government funding of Pavee Point, its serving no purpose, for the love of God wouldnt you think someone from that outfit would acknowledge that the travellers are responsible for Peter Caseys success and no point in deflecting the elephant in the room by shouting racism. Own up to the effects members of your community are having on rural Ireland for the love of God.

it's a mix of culture, genetics and more that determines ethnic status as far as i understand. i'm sure those making the determination can be trusted to know what they are doing.
it is being proposed that children should learn about traveler culture and history so that people can understand where travelers came from and learn the trials and tribulations of this ethnic minority throughout history.
it is actually others who are the stumbling block to the state not enforcing a traveler's right to a decent lifestyle and education, by voting in the same 2 parties, who will not give all of the relevant authorities the resources they need to enforce the rules, and by complaining about the government spending money on programs to specifically help travelers.

professore wrote: »

A government that gives the likes of Margaret Cash €50k tax free in benefits and free heqlthcare for having 7 kids. And a free house down the road. Something the vast majority of working families could only dream about. And yet they are supposed to feel sorry for her???

That's extreme left socialism.

I have no problem feeling sorry for her kids. Not for the likes of her though.

the reason she gets those supports is for the sake of the children. if she was a single person she would not be a priority, rightly or wrongly.

end of the road · 03-11-2018 04:40PM

Idbatterim wrote: »

People keep saying his vote was about the travelers. Yes a part of it was that. Another part was speaking the truth and his rightful claim of workers not being rewarded! You’re made feel like a pariah here, for someone who would probably agree with the conservatives, ie those currently governing Britain!!!

speaking the truth that happens to be more opinion then truth? certainly a thing for the likes of casey and his followers.
how are workers not being rewarded? what should we get as a reward for doing what we need to do to survive? why should we be rewarded? surely the services we get, while far from perfect, are in theory at least, the reward.
it's not surprising people would have an issue with people agreeing with the conservative party of britain, a party who has effectively attempted to destroy britain from within. destruction of public services. large scale inequality and large parts of the country in terminal decline and deprivation. all of this since 1979. and now, the removal of britain from a large trading block which has hugely benefited it in terms of trade deals and more. deals they are in no way going to get outside the EU.

Idbatterim wrote: »

He already called RTÉ a joke on RTÉ in one of the last presidential debates ... how much of a vote winner do you guys think RTÉ license fee abolition would be and make it a subscription service or they rely on advertising and sponsorship income to fund their services only...

rte isn't going to be made a subscription service. it's a public service and while far from perfect, a lot of it is streets ahead in terms of some of the other offerings about.

Idbatterim wrote: »

We have an outrageous welfare state and fifty percent marginal tax rate over a very low income ... I’d call it left leaning government. Large public service , unsackable public and civil servants. What would you call it?!

realistic. we need a public service to deliver public services. to insure those services can operate effectively they will need manpower and resources. that means lots of people working within them.
the wellfare state is over-exaggerated. the amount on wellfare in terms of the population is small. there is never going to be enough work for everyone or enough jobs that pay a fair wage. that is why we simply throw the few who are unemployable wellfare but they are a tiny minority of welfare recipients. pensions, disability, even children's allowence.

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:41PM

Plumbthedepths wrote: »

Casey didn't engage in hate speech though. Seems though you are trying to make him answerable for what others have said. That's funny.

if the written material, words, behaviour, visual images or sounds, as the case may be, are threatening, abusive or insulting and are intended or, having regard to all the circumstances, are likely to stir up hatred.

His comments on 'travellers are basically people who camp on other people's land' would to any reasonable ear be covered by the bolded word in the Act.

If you don't think that was an 'insulting' comment then of course you won't see it as hate speech.
But then again, Casey's comments were intended to incite people like you.

tayto lover · 03-11-2018 04:44PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

His comments on 'travellers are basically people who camp on other people's land' would to any reasonable ear be covered by the bolded word in the Act.

If you don't think that was an 'insulting' comment then of course you won't see it as hate speech.
But then again, Casey's comments were intended to incite people like you.

Can you prove that Casey "intended" to incite people?
If you cannot then your point is moot.

FrancieBrady · 03-11-2018 04:46PM

tayto lover wrote: »

Can you prove that Casey "intended" to incite people?
If you cannot then your point is moot.

That is for the authorities to decide.

He was making a 'pitch' to be elected.

dxhound2005 · 03-11-2018 04:47PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

It doesn't matter that Casey is unpolished in media performances, because that is what they are, performances. It is his message however garbled that is important. People have been silenced up to his arrival on the scene, now they feel they may after all have a voice at last.

The fact that he was a bit muddled was kinda fun, and I reckon he is winding up everyone with talk of the P Park, joining FF and becoming Teeshock and so on, but his primary message still stands. Travellers are NOT a different race, they are Irish with an often nasty sub culture, but that is all.

In fact by gaining ethnic status Travellers have further corralled themselves into a corner with labels galore. At the end of the day they are Irish and really should abide by the rules that all the rest of us have to observe day in day out.

Casey is also a champion for those out working paying into the SW fund. Pensioners Disabled and Carers excepted, most people working are fed up of the long term unemployed cohort who appear to have everything handed to them, whilst those out working and paying for it get absolutely nothing apart from Child Benefit and an under six MC.

Think about the equality there. Or lack thereof. That is the message I am getting from Casey anyway. About bloody time too.

If Casey or anyone else wants to make big reforms then they need to look at where the tax money and the borrowed money goes. No point in tinkering round the edges with plans to replace Air Corps planes with helicopters, or put all the travellers in a reservation in Phoenix Park. The big money goes on Social Welfare, Health and Education.

https://whereyourmoneygoes.gov.ie/en/

If all the unemployment payments were eliminated, and all the travellers killed off, it would only make a small dent in overall spending. He did not address the question of how much he would take away from the social welfare payments going to Middle Ireland.

tayto lover · 03-11-2018 04:51PM

FrancieBrady wrote: »

That is for the authorities to decide.

He was making a 'pitch' to be elected.

Simple answer - impossible to prove.
You wasted your time.

Spanish Eyes · 03-11-2018 04:51PM

SafeSurfer wrote: »

Has anyone read the full page article in today’s Irish Times by Rosita Boland?
“Abusing Travellers is racism for liberals”

During the journalists visit to a traveller encampment a child brought in an anonymous note from a letter box which the journalist had to read because the parents couldn’t read. The note contained 2 cartridges and a threat that if they didn’t stop racing their horses on the road one of them would be killed.

One of the Travellers later said “we saw Peter Casey on the TV. We were shocked at what he said. He didn’t say anything good at all about us. He is definitely a racist”.

Yes I read it. But nothing new there. No voice for anyone other than the Travellers really.

tayto lover · 03-11-2018 04:53PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Yes I read it. But nothing new there. No voice for anyone other than the Travellers really.

Tugging at heartstrings.
Rubbish journalism.

Spanish Eyes · 03-11-2018 04:55PM

dxhound2005 wrote: »

If Casey or anyone else wants to make big reforms then they need to look at where the tax money and the borrowed money goes. No point in tinkering round the edges with plans to replace Air Corps planes with helicopters, or put all the travellers in a reservation in Phoenix Park. The big money goes on Social Welfare, Health and Education.

https://whereyourmoneygoes.gov.ie/en/

If all the unemployment payments were eliminated, and all the travellers killed off, it would only make a small dent in overall spending. He did not address the question of how much he would take away from the social welfare payments going to Middle Ireland.

Yes sure, you have a point. But realistically people want a voice. Start small, and work upwards.

All people want is a voice. The big picture can wait a bit to catch up after we have found our voice!

dxhound2005 · 03-11-2018 04:58PM

Spanish Eyes wrote: »

Yes sure, you have a point. But realistically people want a voice. Start small, and work upwards.

All people want is a voice. The big picture can wait a bit to catch up after we have found our voice!

It's hardly very original to give out about travellers. People have been having a go at them for years.

Peter Casey believes Travellers should not be recognised as an ethnic minority

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