In tears listening to the radio

Deusexmachina · 24-09-2018 08:58PM

Snotty wrote: »

Banks lend money themselves and then sell it to you at a premium. This premium covers all the banks costs, including bad debt. More bad debt, the more banks need to recoup and rates go up, pretty basic principles that the banks even explain themselves, there's no conspiracy.

The billions of bad debts came from reckless lending and greed. Banks have a fiduciary responsibility too you know.

Renegade Mechanic · 24-09-2018 08:59PM

Snotty wrote: »

Assuming your about 12 year old?

You owe money on something, the bank will recoup money by selling it and that comes off your debt. But you think it would be better to burn it down? Actually my 12 year nephew has more brains that you.

Good for him, maybe he won't be a mechanic.
And I stand by it. If My 300k house that I ran into difficulty at 100k with was going to go to someone for, say the 100k it was now worth and I was still going to have to come up with the remaining 100k? Down she goes

amcalester · 24-09-2018 09:01PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

Good for him, maybe he won't be a mechanic.
And I stand by it. If My 300k house that I ran into difficulty at 100k with was going to go to someone for, say the 100k it was now worth and I was still going to have to come up with the remaining 100k? Down she goes

Conspiracy forum is that way ———->

Snotty · 24-09-2018 09:05PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

Good for him, maybe he won't be a mechanic.
And I stand by it. If My 300k house that I ran into difficulty at 100k with was going to go to someone for, say the 100k it was now worth and I was still going to have to come up with the remaining 100k? Down she goes

So the house is worth 100k and you owe 100k, so you could probably walk away and maybe owe only a few grand in costs. Debt few in literally months.

Or you could burn it down and owe 100k, this is your choice cause you dont want someone else to buy it and pay your debt for you?

11...10...am I close?

amcalester · 24-09-2018 09:07PM

Snotty wrote: »

So the house is worth 100k and you owe 100k, so you could probably walk away and maybe owe only a few grand in costs. Debt few in literally months.

Or you could burn it down and owe 100k, this is your choice cause you dont want someone else to buy it and pay your debt for you?

11...10...am I close?

That poster doesn’t understand how equity works.

TitianGerm · 24-09-2018 09:08PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

If My 300k house that I ran into difficulty at 100k with was going to go to someone for, say the 100k it was now worth and I was still going to have to come up with the remaining 100k?

You borrowed the money so pay your bloody debts and don't be a child about it.

newspower · 24-09-2018 09:12PM

If you won't, don't or can't pay your mortgage you will lose your house. Its that simple. I have had a difficult time in the past paying mine when interest rates went through the roof. I didn't stop paying my mortgage, instead I did exactly what someone else said earlier. I had to cutback on everything, no socialising, drove a banger, no treats for us, no drinking, no holidays and no unnecessary spending on our kids. That is whats missing in the last few years, I know people who continued with all the trappings but decided not to pay their mortgage in the hope they got debt forgiveness further down the road, didnt happen and now they have no house anymore. I do feel sympathy for someone who genuinely cannot maintain their debt anymore through change of circumstance but they took out the mortgage and signed on the dotted line and there is nothing they can do except move on.

Pkiernan · 24-09-2018 09:14PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Sean O Rourke had a report today from the repossession court in Tralee. I found it really upsetting. There was a very quietly spoken gentle woman in tears about how the bank is threatening her to take her home from her. She has two children and, as a result of a marriage separation, is struggling to cope. The banks don’t care and are scaring her to death.
Then there was a man who was trying to deal with a vulture fund who bought out his loan from Irish Permanent and who is also getting threatened and terrified by these mafioso bully boys.
We bailed out these banks with our income tax. We watched in horror as unsecured bond holder walked away with our money. We propped up their outrageous salaries.
Where are our politicians now? When are we going to stop being so damned passive in the country. We need to defend our citizens from this attack.
I will not forget that poor woman and that poor man I heard this morning. I will not forget at the next election.

Why don't you do something useful and send the woman some money?

Renegade Mechanic · 24-09-2018 09:14PM

Snotty wrote: »

So the house is worth 100k and you owe 100k, so you could probably walk away and maybe owe only a few grand in costs. Debt few in literally months.

Or you could burn it down and owe 100k, this is your choice cause you dont want someone else to buy it and pay your debt for you?

11...10...am I close?

300k
I've paid 100 of it.
Big Crash.
House worth 100k
Repossessed and sold/mortgaged to someone else for 100k

What's 100k +100k? I think it's just a little smidge off the 300k I signed up for, leaving the bank short 100k still, that they're entitled to chase me for, but my maths could be wildly wrong there..

Now, I didn't sign up for ****. I wouldn't, specifically because of this. But many did and found themselves in that situation. Unable to rent because banks are pursuing them for the money they didn't legally have to bother making. Be it 100k or 50. And I'm smiling at the utter knobs people here are being about it.

Yer Da sells Avon · 24-09-2018 09:16PM

What is a mortgage, but a method of allowing people who can't afford to buy a house to push prices up to a level where people who might otherwise have been able to afford one can't either?

Ban mortgages.

Renegade Mechanic · 24-09-2018 09:17PM

TitianGerm wrote: »

You borrowed the money so pay your bloody debts and don't be a child about it.

I'll be as big a feckin child as I want, matey!
Bank wants the house, bank gets the house and nothing more, THAT would stop the over-inflated values people were taking on loans for far more effectively than simply saying "hurr, don't get a loan then, go be homeless somewhere else".

10000maniacs · 24-09-2018 09:18PM

Alannah Refined Greengrocer wrote: »

The whole "pay your ****ing debts" thing isn't much use to someone whose partner dies or becomes seriously ill so has to give up work permanently, or does a runner. Could happen to any of us.

Eviction is the absolute last resort though - don't mind the bullsh1t from the media. It's for "won't pay"/"won't engage" not "can't pay". If you engage with your creditors instead of sticking your head in the sand, and if you pay whatever little bit you can, you are in a much stronger position than those who adopt the bizarre "all or nothing" approach.

And it's not bullying to issue reminders for payments that you have agreed to and for a service you are still using.

It's the irresponsible media scaremongering that have a lot to answer for.

Yeah it is sad but not "free house for all" sad.

august12 · 24-09-2018 09:18PM

dark crystal wrote:

'We' are all just one lost job or an unexpected illness/ marriage separation away from being in the same position.

Exactly, have some compassion, we walked the streets in protest against water charges, but we allowed our tax paying citizens to bail out the banks, we really have our priorities in the right order.

BrokenArrows · 24-09-2018 09:19PM

If they had paid their mortgages they wouldn't be in this situation.

What do you expect? Should they be allowed to continue living there for free?

Snotty · 24-09-2018 09:21PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

300k
I've paid 100 of it.
Big Crash.
House worth 100k
Repossessed and sold/mortgaged to someone else for 100k

What's 100k +100k? I think it's just a little smidge off the 300k I signed up for, leaving the bank short 100k still, that they're entitled to chase me for, but my maths could be wildly wrong there..

Now, I didn't sign up for ****. I wouldn't, specifically because of this. But many did and found themselves in that situation. Unable to rent because banks are pursuing them for the money they didn't legally have to bother making. Be it 100k or 50. And I'm smiling at the utter knobs people here are being about it.

Ah, so you don't have a mortgage, don't understand how they work and don't want one either. But you choose to regale us with a story about what you would do if you had one, thanks.

relax carry on · 24-09-2018 09:24PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

And who is charging those rates?

The banks whose role is to make money by selling financial products. Remember they aren't a charity. One of the reasons for the high interest rates are the low level of repossessions in the country. Part of the high interest rate goes to cover the non performing loans where the bank won't be able to recoup it's loan for years until all options have been exhausted. Terms and conditions apply for lending on both the bank and the borrower. If the bank is meeting there end and the borrower isn't then once all the correct steps have been followed by the bank why shouldn't the property be repossessed?

Rubberchikken · 24-09-2018 09:24PM

Ive no sympathy for anyone who borrowed probably above and beyond their means for a house and then cries when someobe says either repay the loan or get out.

Imo people have learned nothing from the crash. The roads are littered with compact suvs 181/182 vintage. Because god forbid we're seen driving a bog standard old car. People want the big wedding/engagement part/baby shower/stag/hen/perfect house/ whatever crap.

The concept of saving, doing without, going cheaper
Seems alien and unacceptable.

Renegade Mechanic · 24-09-2018 09:26PM

Snotty wrote: »

Ah, so you don't have a mortgage, don't understand how they work and don't want one either. But you choose to regale us with a story about what you would do if you had one, thanks.

We homeless have to find something to entertain us!
So again I'll ask. You lose your house and the bank sells it for less than the outstanding amount on your mortgage, and chases you for the remainder.
Are you in the boat that says that does not happen at all, that's it's a crazy conspiracy, or are you in the boat that says it's perfectly fine to do it?

I'm personally in the boat that says **** em out, take the house and do their credit rating but, that's it, they pay nothing more.
Why do ye so badly want them to keep paying, might I ask? I strikes me almost as schadenfreude tbh.

amcalester · 24-09-2018 09:28PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

We homeless have to find something to entertain us!
So again I'll ask. You lose your house and the bank sells it for less than the outstanding amount on your mortgage, and chases you for the remainder.
Are you in the boat that says that does not happen at all, that's it's a crazy conspiracy, or are you in the boat that says it's perfectly fine to do it?

I'm personally in the boat that says **** em out, take the house and do their credit rating but, that's it, they pay nothing more.
Why do ye so badly want them to keep paying, might I ask? I strikes me almost as schadenfreude tbh.

Time for bankruptcy at that stage.

There’s your debt forgiveness.

Yer Da sells Avon · 24-09-2018 09:28PM

Rubberchikken wrote: »

Ive no sympathy for

I see those four words far more frequently on After Hours than anywhere else.

Drifter50 · 24-09-2018 09:29PM

Deusexmachina wrote: »

Sean O Rourke had a report today from the repossession court in Tralee. I found it really upsetting. There was a very quietly spoken gentle woman in tears about how the bank is threatening her to take her home from her. She has two children and, as a result of a marriage separation, is struggling to cope. The banks don’t care and are scaring her to death.
Then there was a man who was trying to deal with a vulture fund who bought out his loan from Irish Permanent and who is also getting threatened and terrified by these mafioso bully boys.
We bailed out these banks with our income tax. We watched in horror as unsecured bond holder walked away with our money. We propped up their outrageous salaries.
Where are our politicians now? When are we going to stop being so damned passive in the country. We need to defend our citizens from this attack.
I will not forget that poor woman and that poor man I heard this morning. I will not forget at the next election.

This thread has gone wildly off the point and been hijacked by a number wishing to push their own agenda. I am coming into more and more conflict with 28/45 year olds who seem to think anyone who can`t,shan`t or won`t pay their mortgage should move out of the way and let prospective mortgage holders who can earn enough salary so they can pay the crazy repayments on new huge mortgages. The OP was making a couple of simple points about our government and the kind of support that should be available to ordinary decent mortgage holders who run into illness, unemployment, separation.

Lets wind back a bit

24-09-2018 09:30PM

Almost 7 years ago a friend of mine decided not to pay the mortgage for the month of December, so to give her kids a good Christmas.
She hasn't paid a single penny on it since.
She knows she will be evicted eventually but in the meantime she has had 7 years of no mortgage or rent payments.
I don't know how the banks allow it to go on for so long.

Stone Deaf 4evr · 24-09-2018 09:31PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

We homeless have to find something to entertain us!
So again I'll ask. You lose your house and the bank sells it for less than the outstanding amount on your mortgage, and chases you for the remainder.
Are you in the boat that says that does not happen at all, that's it's a crazy conspiracy, or are you in the boat that says it's perfectly fine to do it?

I'm personally in the boat that says **** em out, take the house and do their credit rating but, that's it, they pay nothing more.
Why do ye so badly want them to keep paying, might I ask? I strikes me almost as schadenfreude tbh.

You do realise that the banks don't just manufacture money? They have to borrow it from someone else so that they give it out to you. They can't just sit on properties and hope that the prices will go up enough to cover the initial cost of the borrowing when the property is sold. They sell it off to recoup as much as they can, then follow up for the balance with the original owner.

Snotty · 24-09-2018 09:32PM

Renegade Mechanic wrote: »

We homeless have to find something to entertain us!
So again I'll ask. You lose your house and the bank sells it for less than the outstanding amount on your mortgage, and chases you for the remainder.
Are you in the boat that says that does not happen at all, that's it's a crazy conspiracy, or are you in the boat that says it's perfectly fine to do it?

I'm personally in the boat that says **** em out, take the house and do their credit rating but, that's it, they pay nothing more.
Why do ye so badly want them to keep paying, might I ask? I strikes me almost as schadenfreude tbh.

I'm in the boat where I have a mortgage and I don't want to pay for people who takes out mortgages of their own free will and then don't pay back for whatever reason.

You take out a contract with the bank, one of the fundamental stipulations is you are responsible for the full loan amount, not just the amount the house is worth, or just the amount you feel like paying back, if you don't like it, then great, don't take out the mortgage in the first place.

Deusexmachina · 24-09-2018 09:34PM

TitianGerm wrote: »

You borrowed the money so pay your bloody debts and don't be a child about it.

‘Don’t be a child about it’ ‘
‘xBox One gamer tag TitianGerm’

Gimme A Pound · 24-09-2018 09:34PM

bubblypop wrote: »

Almost 7 years ago a friend of mine decided not to pay the mortgage for the month of December, so to give her kids a good Christmas.
She hasn't paid a single penny on it since.
She knows she will be evicted eventually but in the meantime she has had 7 years of no mortgage or rent payments.
I don't know how the banks allow it to go on for so long.

Aye, the media narrative would have you believe that you get tormented for one missed payment. It doesn't work like that.

doolox · 24-09-2018 09:36PM

The banks will simply add penalties and interest to the unpaid loans and costs and any monies paid out to enforce the debt will be added to the accumulating bill.

Only way to get away with it is to be completely broke and have no assets.

You will never be able to borrow again.

looksee · 24-09-2018 09:40PM

Don't you have to have mortgage insurance against such possibilities as illness or death of a partner?

pm1977x · 24-09-2018 09:42PM

Drifter50 wrote: »

This thread has gone wildly off the point and been hijacked by a number wishing to push their own agenda. I am coming into more and more conflict with 28/45 year olds who seem to think anyone who can`t,shan`t or won`t pay their mortgage should move out of the way and let prospective mortgage holders who can earn enough salary so they can pay the crazy repayments on new huge mortgages. The OP was making a couple of simple points about our government and the kind of support that should be available to ordinary decent mortgage holders who run into illness, unemployment, separation.

Lets wind back a bit

There's tonnes of supports for these exact people, some choose not to engage in the blind hope it will all go away and after several years of not engaging may eventually be turfed out, but they're in the minority. The bleeding hearts club need to take a look at the actual repossession figures rather than latching onto 'hard luck' stories and taking them at face value.

Renegade Mechanic · 24-09-2018 09:51PM

Stone Deaf 4evr wrote: »

You do realise that the banks don't just manufacture money? They have to borrow it from someone else so that they give it out to you. They can't just sit on properties and hope that the prices will go up enough to cover the initial cost of the borrowing when the property is sold. They sell it off to recoup as much as they can, then follow up for the balance with the original owner.

Seriously? You watched the ECB print the guts of a trillion euros - most of which went to buying European bonds and you came to the conclusion that banks aren't "just manufacturing money"?
It's exactly what they're doing. Next year should be fun..

Snotty wrote: »

I'm in the boat where I have a mortgage and I don't want to pay for people who takes out mortgages of their own free will and then don't pay back for whatever reason.

You shouldn't have to, obviously. But the idea that you're having to, because they're falling short in a market value deliberately allowed to inflate isn't true. Banks having to take the house and only the house would not make you pay more.

Look, people didn't take out mortgages that they had no intention of paying. They were given them. There was nothing stopping the financial system from looking at people and going "yeah, nah, you can **** off, mr 9 quid an hour".
But they didn't because that would have overall restrained the amount they could throw out, restraining the money people could even get together to put towards a house, restraining prices. People are thick,they're not going to just go "eh, no actually, I won't get that mortgage for the only house within an hour of my job, I'll hold off". That would do it.

Snotty wrote: »

You take out a contract with the bank, one of the fundamental stipulations is you are responsible for the full loan amount, not just the amount the house is worth, or just the amount you feel like paying back, if you don't like it, then great, don't take out the mortgage in the first place.

I didn't. Guess that gives me more foresight than the "scumbags" out there falling short? You probably think "Johnny Badneck Nightmares" with his fraudulent insurance claim is the reason you're car insurance went up, too.

In tears listening to the radio

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