Homelessness on the rise

oceanman · 10-09-2018 8:33pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

That mi worry people but they are not Tennants. No lease & you can feck them out anytime you want. They could even be company for older people.

I wonder are 1000s more doing it but not kn that even though its tax free you must notify revenue

I would say the fact that you have to notify revenue definitely puts people off, as for the number of people doing it "on the quite" its hard to really say, most people don't fancy sharing their home with strangers.

Jamsiek · 11-09-2018 12:12am

Vanessa Billions Strapless wrote: »

THe government should not be interfering in LLs who want to let their properties on Airbnb.

Many cities around the world with housing crises are cracking down on Airbnb due to the lack of available accommodation for people.
Many apartment buildings have banned apartments being used for it too as it brings people in that don't look after the building with increased noise levels etc.

splinter65 · 11-09-2018 1:06am

oceanman wrote: »

I would say the fact that you have to notify revenue definitely puts people off, as for the number of people doing it "on the quite" its hard to really say, most people don't fancy sharing their home with strangers.

I have a double room empty and not for 10000 per week would I inflict my husband and I and our dog on anyone.
My brother in law and his wife and dog have a lodger for 3 years and it works very well because they and she are civilized young people.
We on the other hand are not.
I suspect there are more like us then my BIL. That’s the problem.

Mooooo · 11-09-2018 12:18pm

Tony EH wrote: »

Or just import a load of Poles like we did in the naughties.

Saying we can't build houses because we don't have builders is one of the most ridiculous things I seen in this thread and considering the bullshit that's typed here every time Slydice posts the figures, that's really saying something.

How many people have completed trade apprenticeships in the last 10 years? What was one of the main groups that emigrated to get work?

oceanman · 11-09-2018 12:44pm

Bubbaclaus wrote: »

Are we going to magic up more competent construction workers from somewhere? That's my point, its not as simple as just saying build more houses and it gets done.

whats wrong with letting contractors from outside the country tender for all this building work...so long as the work was carried out to proper building regs ect I don't se a problem.

Topgear on Dave · 11-09-2018 9:04pm

Mooooo wrote: »

How many people have completed trade apprenticeships in the last 10 years? What was one of the main groups that emigrated to get work?

Two anecdotes for you from the last fortnight, Iv been getting work done on my house.

- I was in a tile shop in Dublin and a guy came in saying he had lots of work on and couldnt get tilers.

- I called a local plumbing company and the woman said all the boys were busy. They had tried to get more plumbers and they were very hard to get.

- I visited a few kitchen showrooms, all flat out too.

Trades must be getting hard to find.

Sleeper12 · 11-09-2018 9:15pm

Topgear on Dave wrote:

Trades must be getting hard to find.

100 percent agree in Dublin.

I'm a member of a plumbing Facebook group with over 2000 Irish plumbers. Most counties have work but some plumbers outside of Dublin can't get more than a few hours work per week. Some are better off on the dole & not even bother trying. I'm not saying that this is the way to go but some parts of the country are still in ression

Topgear on Dave · 11-09-2018 9:47pm

True. Im from Cavan and know fellas driving to Dublin region every day.

Its not that hectic round home but its picked up a lot.

13-09-2018 8:40am

I’m sure that some will find fault with this. https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0913/993427-land_development_agency/

“The Government is to launch the new Land Development Agency, which it says will coordinate State owned lands for regeneration and development, and open up sites for the provision of housing.

It will be funded to the tune of €1.25 billion and will have the power to use State land and to buy private lands on which potentially thousands of homes will be built across the country.

The Government believes the new agency could lead to the construction of more than 150,000 homes over the next 20 years.

They will include social, affordable and private homes.

The new organisation will be run along commercial lines and it will see the State forming joint ventures with builders and developers to provide homes.

It is understood there will be a requirement that one third of homes built on State lands will have to be affordable ones.

Taoiseach Leo Varadkar has already said this initiative will be viewed in the future as being on par with the establishment of the ESB and the IDA.

Minister for Housing, Planning and Local Government Eoghan Murphy brought proposals for its establishment to a Cabinet meeting yesterday.”

Hitman3000 · 13-09-2018 9:11am

Deleted User wrote:

Iâ€™m sure that some will find fault with this.

There was an agency set up in 2011 along the same lines as what is proposed now that same agency delivered nothing and was wound up in 2013. At least though at the time FG was able to point and say we are doing something. It was discussed on Morning Ireland earlier.
Thanks for the link to the press release though. Lots of "coulds" but very little details.

Sleeper12 · 13-09-2018 9:16am

Hitman3000 wrote: »

There was an agency set up in 2011 along the same lines as what is proposed now that same agency delivered nothing and was wound up in 2013. At least though at the time FG was able to point and say we are doing something. It was discussed on Morning Ireland earlier.
Thanks for the link to the press release though. Lots of "coulds" but very little details.

Had they put the billion plus wasted on Irish water in 5 or 6 years ago we might not have any housing shortage at all by now.

I welcome it but so frustrating it takes the government so long to react. How many lives have suffered

ELM327 · 13-09-2018 9:23am

Old diesel wrote: »

I never said it's anything like reality but reading between the lines it appears to be what Landlords would like.

Its clear from landlord complaints that dipping into their OWN money every year is unacceptable. I've seen lads whine at having to put 5/6 k of their own cash a year into paying costs.

I've also seen them insist that they need a monthly profit.

No problem with this except that it looks to me that to attract and retain landlords requires a very expensive model totally at odds with the competiveness we seek elsewhere

If you're not cash flow positive it's very difficult to maintain and expand a portfolio. I was involved on a small scale syndicate a few years back and we targeted properties that could be cash flow positive. Even if you're neutral once you've accounted for maintenance,it's feasible as you've an asset at the end. The 50% tax (or 15% corporate tax rate + penalty) makes it difficult but not impossible. If you want a property that you're paying the mortgage yourself its much less hassle to not rent it out.

Renting out properties is a for profit business. And a tight margin one at that (not withstanding what some lefties in the media will have you believe).

Currently you need a minimum of 25% deposit for a BTL. Not 10 or 20.

ELM327 · 13-09-2018 9:24am

Deleted User wrote: »

I’m sure that some will find fault with this. https://www.rte.ie/news/2018/0913/993427-land_development_agency/

“The Government is to launch the new Land Development Agency, which it says will coordinate State owned lands for regeneration and development, and open up sites for the provision of housing.

It will be funded to the tune of €1.25 billion and will have the power to use State land and to buy private lands on which potentially thousands of homes will be built across the country.

The Government believes the new agency could lead to the construction of more than 150,000 homes over the next 20 years.

They will include social, affordable and private homes.

The new organisation will be run along commercial lines and it will see the State forming joint ventures with builders and developers to provide homes.

It is understood there will be a requirement that one third of homes built on State lands will have to be affordable ones.

Taoiseach Leo Varadkar has already said this initiative will be viewed in the future as being on par with the establishment of the ESB and the IDA.

Minister for Housing, Planning and Local Government Eoghan Murphy brought proposals for its establishment to a Cabinet meeting yesterday.”

And Ireland swings further to the left. Didnt think it was possible.
Wonder who's going to fund these "affordable houses". Probably middle ireland who are taxed to the hilt, and for whom houses are not easily rendered affordable.

Hitman3000 · 13-09-2018 9:29am

ELM327 wrote:

And Ireland swings further to the left. Didnt think it was possible. Wonder who's going to fund these "affordable houses". Probably middle ireland who are taxed to the hilt, and for whom houses are not easily rendered affordable.

Don't worry the plan, like alot of aspirations from government will come to nothing. It's a preelection fudge. The housing crisis has been identified as a potential area to loose votes.

Topgear on Dave · 13-09-2018 9:31am

Sleeper12 wrote: »

Had they put the billion plus wasted on Irish water in 5 or 6 years ago we might not have any housing shortage at all by now.

Just for fun I googled news from 2012 and this came up first.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/more-than-50-000-irish-emigrated-during-2012-1.1509489

"The number of people emigrating from Ireland continues to rise as 89,000 people left the State in the year to April, an increase of 2.2 per cent on the previous 12 months.

Figures published today by the Central Statistics Office show 50,900 Irish people emigrated in the period, up from 46,500 last year.

This brings the total number of Irish people who have emigrated since 2008 to 200,600."

Nobody cared about housing back then, and nobody has a crystal ball to see the future.

Sleeper12 · 13-09-2018 9:37am

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Just for fun I googled news from 2012 and this came up first.

https://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/more-than-50-000-irish-emigrated-during-2012-1.1509489

Nobody cared about housing back then, and nobody has a crystal ball to see the future.

Well you see that's not really true. The government had been warned in 2012 about a housing shortage that was happening right then. It has grown as the government ignored the problem & the problem became a crises.

BTW how many of the 50,000 flying out of Ireland were moving out of rented homes? I think you'll find the vast majority were young people leaving their parents home.

Then the government has to paln for when these 50,000 return to Ireland. They didn't do that either

Topgear on Dave · 13-09-2018 9:40am

Sleeper12 wrote: »

BTW how many of the 50,000 flying out of Ireland were moving out of rented homes? I think you'll find the vast majority were young people leaving their parents home.

Then the government has to paln for when these 50,000 return to Ireland. They didn't do that either

Plenty left rentals. I was one of them.

Sleeper12 · 13-09-2018 9:45am

Topgear on Dave wrote: »

Plenty left rentals. I was one of them.

There were reports even then that there was a housing shortage there & then. There was a reason why the rents were jumping up year on year. The reason was housing shortage. Housing shortage turned into a homeless crises. They were warned. There are threads here on boards going back years about the housing shortage. It's not a new problem. It's just been ignored for years

Claw Hammer · 13-09-2018 11:35am

There were threads here with posters gloating about how much they had forced their landlord to reduce the rent because of the drop in the rental market. Where are they now?

13-09-2018 11:56am

Sleeper12 wrote: »

There were reports even then that there was a housing shortage there & then. There was a reason why the rents were jumping up year on year..............

In 2012? Rents were falling back then, not rising.

13-09-2018 11:57am

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There were threads here with posters gloating about how much they had forced their landlord to reduce the rent because of the drop in the rental market. Where are they now?

That coolaid doesn't taste half as sweet now I reckon.

ELM327 · 13-09-2018 12:02pm

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There were threads here with posters gloating about how much they had forced their landlord to reduce the rent because of the drop in the rental market. Where are they now?

If it were truly a free market, the rise in demand would result in a surge in rent prices.
Combine that with terrible state interference (RPZ) and it's actually pushing the rents up further.
I'd say no matter what figure you ask for as rent in Dublin City, you'd get it.

Claw Hammer · 13-09-2018 12:04pm

ELM327 wrote: »

If it were truly a free market, the rise in demand would result in a surge in rent prices.
Combine that with terrible state interference (RPZ) and it's actually pushing the rents up further.
I'd say no matter what figure you ask for as rent in Dublin City, you'd get it.

There is an upper limit. There is a house in Rathmines unlet for the past few weeks. LL asking too much.

ELM327 · 13-09-2018 12:11pm

Claw Hammer wrote: »

There is an upper limit. There is a house in Rathmines unlet for the past few weeks. LL asking too much.

Well it's his property to do with as he pleases tbh, but I'd be surprised in this environment unless he's asking 100k a month

Claw Hammer · 13-09-2018 12:13pm

ELM327 wrote: »

Well it's his property to do with as he pleases tbh, but I'd be surprised in this environment unless he's asking 100k a month

He is looking for about 6.5K

13-09-2018 12:15pm

Claw Hammer wrote: »

He is looking for about 6.5K

A colleague was paying €900/month for a room in a 5 bed Rathmines houseshare 18 months ago.

I reckon €6.5k isn't wildly optimistic unless the place is in less than decent condition or quite small (3 bed)

Sleeper12 · 13-09-2018 12:19pm

Augeo wrote: »

In 2012? Rents were falling back then, not rising.

This is incorrect. Rent increased 8.2 percent in 2012 due to the growing housing shortage

https://static.rasset.ie/documents/news/q1-2015-daft-rental-report.pdf

13-09-2018 2:52pm

Sleeper12 wrote: »

This is incorrect. Rent increased 8.2 percent in 2012 due to the growing housing shortage

https://static.rasset.ie/documents/news/q1-2015-daft-rental-report.pdf

Not according to the report ...........

Sleeper12 · 13-09-2018 3:03pm

Augeo wrote: »

Not according to the report ...........

Did you miss this?

8.2%
(Year-on-Year change in average rent nationwide)
Rents Rise Nationally

-
Daft.ie National Rental Index
(2012 average = 100)
4
| The Daft.ie Rental Report, 2015 Q

13-09-2018 3:13pm

Mmmmmm I'll spell it out for you......

December 2011 - 98.9 (2011 average = 99.3)
December 2012 - 100.9, (2012 average = 100)

that's not an 8.2% rise

And the graph I showed (nationwide) showed clearly falling rents across the nation in 2012, Dublin rises in 2012 negated these on the overall figures)

One has to look beyond the headlines when talking about specifics

The 2012 average of 100 seems the be the starting point ......... that does indeed indicate that the 8.2% rise wasn't seen in 2012, if it was then they'd have taken 2011 as the starting point, but it wasn't so they couldn't. HTH.

2009 to 2012 (inclusive) was the bottom of the rental market. As per your screenshot. You won't find a 2012 report bleating on about rising rents, nationwide.

Homelessness on the rise

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