Water charges revisited?

Deleted User wrote: »

You’ve provided no link to back up your figures. I have. And, Yes, 1.8 billion would be correct. You seem to be mixing up Dublin figures and those for the whole country.

Read again the links you included and the one I have. That might clarify things.

Sorry?

The average person uses 129 litres of water a day

https://www.water.ie/news/research-shows-over-50-of/


4.73m people x 129 litres = 610m litres average a day.


Therefore, on average, that is 610m litres of water used per day.


Let's call that 600m.


But average demand in Dublin alone is >500m a day.

Mr. Jerry Grant:

There is a very fundamental point around need. Deputy Ó Broin referred to requiring 545 million litres a day in 2015 . That is the average demand on a given day. There is no peak in that; there is no headroom in that.

https://www.kildarestreet.com/committees/?id=2017-02-15a.557

If we continue to operate without the required headroom, we can expect more frequent water outages in the coming years as demand increases," a consultation report on the project, published today, says.

The reason is because some 1.67 billion litres of water is generated every day, but 658 million is lost through leaking pipes. In Dublin, there is demand for 580 million litres but just 600 million is available.

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-water-to-spend-13bn-pumping-waterfrom-shannon-to-ease-shortages-in-dublin-and-midlands-36838100.html


More is lost through leaking pipes than what people are using.


658m litres > 610m litres



Do you think people are using 383 litres or 129 litres on average every day? And your 1.8bn usage figure is correct? How?


You cited the 383 litres figure. What is it? It's not what the average person uses each day. That figure is 129 litres according to IW.



I don't think my figures are wrong but if they are please show where?

Edward M wrote: »

I think the 383 figure is per household on average, it has been used before.
https://www.rte.ie/news/2017/0425/870162-water-usage-figure/

Yes and even at that it's an odd metric to use in this conversation given that the RTE report describes it as being prone to being skewed and distorted.

Deleted User wrote: »

That would make sense. The Irish times article said that it was per person.

Where Dense seems to be getting confused is in using the amount treated in the greater Dublin area as being the amount treated for the whole country when it’s not.

Where is the error in my sums though?



You said there's a mistake but won't show where beyond saying I'm confused.



What figure should I be using for the average personal usage figure, something not from the IW ad and website that I had been speaking about and have linked to?



It's 129 litres. You do the sums and show where I'm going wrong?

ianwalsh2 wrote: »

129 Litres is the average figure per person used in the home, based on the figures from domestic meters. There is a lot lost through leakeage, and then the rest is used commercially, i.e. factories, agriculture, hotels, pubs, offices etc.

Ok non domestic or commercial usage must be around 600 million litres a day on top of domestic usage then?


So roughly 600m for domestic use, the same for commercial and another 600 lost in the network?


That rounds off around the 1.8bn that MaryAnne84 said it produces a day I suppose.



We usually only hear about the domestic use I think.



It's interesting to see ballpark how much the businesses use.

ianwalsh2 wrote: »

I think water lost through leakage is about 45%, so assuming the 1.8Bn figure is right your ballpark figures are more like 800 lost, 600 domestic and 400 non domestic.

But that still doesn't make sense because Dublin alone is using almost all of that domestic figure according to Paul Melia in the Indo:

The reason is because some 1.67 billion litres of water is generated every day, but 658 million is lost through leaking pipes. In Dublin, there is demand for 580 million litres but just 600 million is available.

https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-water-to-spend-13bn-pumping-waterfrom-shannon-to-ease-shortages-in-dublin-and-midlands-36838100.html

That's why these figures are not stacking up.
Any report shows Dublin "using" >500m litres a day.


Unless they're calculating the 658m leaking incorrectly, where that 658m litres should really be much higher because this 580m daily Dublin "usage" is so high because it includes network leakage that isn't being mentioned.


Which would be a bit misleading, having given a leakage figure which we presume includes leakages in the Dublin area, which upon further inspection may not....


Is there any other explanation?


(That 1.8bn production figure came from someone else and I think it might have been slightly out, but then not by much.)











https://amp.independent.ie/irish-news/irish-water-to-spend-13bn-pumping-waterfrom-shannon-to-ease-shortages-in-dublin-and-midlands-36838100.html