Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

Captain Obvious · 20-07-2018 3:19pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Ah folks, you're not honestly still trying to suggest that amounts to "siding with a hostile foreign power over his own government"??

I honestly thought something else had come up when I read that.

No you didn't. You must think we are as stupid as Trump thinks Americans are.

Leroy42 · 20-07-2018 3:24pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Owned her" lol.

Whoopie said Trump starts conversations with "Mexicans are liars and rapists" and that he "whips up people to beat the hell out of people" and then kicked her off the show not letting her reply to that nonsense. That means she "owned her"?

No, that's not how you treat someone and that is not discussion. She shoulf be ashamed of herself, as should anyone that feels that's an okay thing to do to a guest that has been invited onto a show and if Fox did the same to a liberal I'd say the same.

Riiight.. but its ok for Trump to refuse to take questions from journalists simply because he doesn't like their network?

Hypocrisy yet again.

mcmoustache · 20-07-2018 3:26pm

Captain Obvious wrote: »

No you didn't. You must think we are as stupid as Trump thinks Americans are.

I think the term is, pissing on your leg and telling you it's raining.

everlast75 · 20-07-2018 3:27pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Whoopie said Trump starts conversations with "Mexicans are liars and rapists" and that he "whips up people to beat the hell out of people" and then kicked her off the show not letting her reply to that nonsense. That means she "owned her"?

To be fair, he did say those things. And if you come back with "when?", I'd refer you to a search engine.

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

No, that's not how you treat someone and that is not discussion. She shoulf be ashamed of herself, as should anyone that feels that's an okay thing to do to a guest that has been invited onto a show and if Fox did the same to a liberal I'd say the same.

Great - I actually agree with you.

Now, if I had the rest of the afternoon, I could get you a good and representative cross section of Fox interviewers behaving far worse than (admittedly, the out of order) Whoppi Goldberg.

ancapailldorcha · 20-07-2018 3:31pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

When did he do that?

That's a weak response. I'm not sure why people continue to defend him to the hilt when it's becoming more and more obvious that the Russians have significant influence or possibly even control over him. That you have to pretend to be unaware of Helsinki to try to mount such a defence is quite an impressive set of mental acrobatics.

batgoat · 20-07-2018 3:33pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Owned her" lol.

Whoopie said Trump starts conversations with "Mexicans are liars and rapists" and that he "whips up people to beat the hell out of people" and then kicked her off the show not letting her reply to that nonsense. That means she "owned her"?

No, that's not how you treat someone and that is not discussion. She shoulf be ashamed of herself, as should anyone that feels that's an okay thing to do to a guest that has been invited onto a show and if Fox did the same to a liberal I'd say the same.

She's paraphrasing things that he has said about Mexicans. He also has attempted to cause violence at his own rallies.

https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/donald-trump-incitement-violence/

So nothing untrue was said, meanwhile the judge accused her of being deranged. You noticing your double standard here?

everlast75 · 20-07-2018 3:36pm

"Damn Microsoft, and their partisan ways"

I'm guessing that's the reason why they won't be believed, as per the Senate Intelligence Committee, The CIA, The FBI etc etc etc

https://twitter.com/juliaioffe/status/1019984074885271556

weisses · 20-07-2018 3:37pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

Judge Jeanine Pirro has a book out about how she feels there has been a conspiracy against the Trump administration

This Jeanine Pirro ?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTd2V-YTJkI

I dont think its wise to use the word syndrome and that women in one sentence

Here another masterpiece from her

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=T0iA9RXEkas

She sounds as deranged as the POTUS

EltonJohn69 · 20-07-2018 3:59pm

why is she so mad ! is this just a character she plays to get rich or is she that full of hate ?
she is like something out of an 80's movie portraying a dystopian american future

kunst nugget · 20-07-2018 4:04pm

She's proper gas. An absolute mentaller.

ELM327 · 20-07-2018 4:09pm

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Owned her" lol.

Whoopie said Trump starts conversations with "Mexicans are liars and rapists" and that he "whips up people to beat the hell out of people" and then kicked her off the show not letting her reply to that nonsense. That means she "owned her"?

No, that's not how you treat someone and that is not discussion. She shoulf be ashamed of herself, as should anyone that feels that's an okay thing to do to a guest that has been invited onto a show and if Fox did the same to a liberal I'd say the same.

everlast75 wrote: »

To be fair, he did say those things. And if you come back with "when?", I'd refer you to a search engine.

Great - I actually agree with you.

Now, if I had the rest of the afternoon, I could get you a good and representative cross section of Fox interviewers behaving far worse than (admittedly, the out of order) Whoppi Goldberg.

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

That doesnt mean that all mexicans are like that.

Water John · 20-07-2018 4:12pm

So that demonised any undocumented Mexicans WTF.

kunst nugget · 20-07-2018 4:12pm

ELM327 wrote: »

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

By post?

ELM327 · 20-07-2018 4:13pm

kunst nugget wrote: »

By post?

Yes of course. :rolleyes:

Here's the exact quote

POTUS wrote:

"When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending the best. They're sending people that have lots of problems and they're bringing those problems. They're bringing drugs, they're bringing crime. They're rapists and some, I assume, are good people, but I speak to border guards and they're telling us what we're getting."

https://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/wild-donald-trump-quotes/9/

Captain Obvious · 20-07-2018 4:13pm

ELM327 wrote: »

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

That doesnt mean that all mexicans are like that.

Who was sending exactly?

ELM327 · 20-07-2018 4:14pm

Captain Obvious wrote: »

Who was sending exactly?

--

ELM327 wrote: »

Yes of course.

Here's the exact quote
https://www.cbsnews.com/pictures/wild-donald-trump-quotes/9/

Leroy42 · 20-07-2018 4:15pm

ELM327 wrote: »

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

That doesnt mean that all mexicans are like that.

NO, you are right it doesn't.

It means that all the Mexicans in the US are like that. Now since he was talking to Americans, then he really is saying that all the Mexicans living and working around them are rapists and drug dealers.

You really think the Americans care what the Mexicans living in Mexico are like?

spacecoyote · 20-07-2018 4:15pm

ELM327 wrote: »

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

That doesnt mean that all mexicans are like that.

Ah OK, so he didn't say all Mexicans are rapists & drug dealers, just the ones that are being "sent" to America.

That's much better indeed. How dare people make such wild generalisations about a statement by the president...when he would never make such a generalisation himself. Oh wait...

aloyisious · 20-07-2018 4:18pm

It'll probably come as a surprise to the Ukrainians but, according to Anatoly Antonov, Russia's US ambassador, Don & Vlad discussed a referendum being held on the issue of the Ukraine's future during their Helsinki meeting. Up til now the US and Russia have been on opposing sides on the issue.

The next meeting, according to Don, is to cover terrorism which might mean him sacrificing the present US position on the Ukraine for a move by Russia on it's Syrian position. It all depends on what one sees as terrorism.

https://www.independent.ie/world-news/trump-and-putin-discussed-referendum-in-ukraine-russian-ambassador-says-37138465.html

Captain Obvious · 20-07-2018 4:21pm

ELM327 wrote: »

--

You're suggesting perhaps the Mexican government is picking who attempts to cross the border? Or is someone else sending them?

Leroy42 · 20-07-2018 4:24pm

Elm, based on what Trump says, don't you think it is reasonable that US people now see a Mexican, one sent to the US, that they assume it is one of the bad ones. Based on nothing more than where they came from, their race....sounds a lot like racism to me.

ELM327 · 20-07-2018 4:31pm

Captain Obvious wrote: »

You're suggesting perhaps the Mexican government is picking who attempts to cross the border? Or is someone else sending them?

of course not, don't be ridiculous.
Trump was speaking in the impersonal tense and stating that the country was sending their rapists etc

Not the best grammar but he's a president not a grammar nazi!

Leroy42 wrote: »

Elm, based on what Trump says, don't you think it is reasonable that we people now see a Mexican, one sent to the US, that they assume it is one of the bad ones. Based on nothing more than where they came from, their race....sounds a lot like racism to me.

I think he probably intended the remark as aimed towards those who illegally immigrate from mexico (hence the idea of the wall)

However if you take the comment in no context and just analyse the verbiage used then yes I can see why you would take that as the literal meaning. Ironically as someone with Asberger's I'm generally the one struggling to get context but you seem to be doing that here. On purpose as it supports your view of the potus perhaps. Now I'm being cynical.

Christy42 · 20-07-2018 4:41pm

ELM327 wrote: »

Outlaw Pete wrote: »

"Owned her" lol.

Whoopie said Trump starts conversations with "Mexicans are liars and rapists" and that he "whips up people to beat the hell out of people" and then kicked her off the show not letting her reply to that nonsense. That means she "owned her"?

No, that's not how you treat someone and that is not discussion. She shoulf be ashamed of herself, as should anyone that feels that's an okay thing to do to a guest that has been invited onto a show and if Fox did the same to a liberal I'd say the same.

everlast75 wrote: »

To be fair, he did say those things. And if you come back with "when?", I'd refer you to a search engine.

Great - I actually agree with you.

Now, if I had the rest of the afternoon, I could get you a good and representative cross section of Fox interviewers behaving far worse than (admittedly, the out of order) Whoppi Goldberg.

What he actually said was that they were not sending the good guys, no, they were sending their rapists, their drug dealers.

That doesnt mean that all mexicans are like that.

It is interesting that you think that is much better. It is not.

Do you or Trump have evidence to back this up? It seems like they are not sending rapists too often.

https://www.google.ie/amp/s/www.washingtonpost.com/amphtml/news/fact-checker/wp/2018/01/18/trumps-claim-that-immigrants-bring-tremendous-crime-is-still-wrong/

Trump just wants people to hate immigrants and illegal immigrants. This is why crimes from illegal immigrants are examined to the nth degree (remember the register, parading victims on stage). Other criminals are not given the same attention because they don't fit his narrative of hating Mexicans etc.

Leroy42 · 20-07-2018 4:42pm

ELM327 wrote: »

of course not, don't be ridiculous.
Trump was speaking in the impersonal tense and stating that the country was sending their rapists etc

Not the best grammar but he's a president not a grammar nazi!

But he clearly said they are sending. That implies that it is a deliberate act and that that is why he can be sure they are all drug dealers etc.

ELM327 wrote: »

I think he probably intended the remark as aimed towards those who illegally immigrate from mexico (hence the idea of the wall)

So why did he say , "they are sending"? If they are illegal then by definition nobody is sending them, they are doing it on their own.

And we are back to you thinking what he said, rather than dealing with what he actually said? Why do you feel entitled to second guess what the man said? He has never restated it, never offered a retraction. On basis basis do you think he misspoke?

And doesn't that call into question everything he says?

ELM327 wrote: »

However if you take the comment in no context and just analyse the verbiage used then yes I can see why you would take that as the literal meaning. Ironically as someone with Asberger's I'm generally the one struggling to get context but you seem to be doing that here. On purpose as it supports your view of the potus perhaps. Now I'm being cynical.

There is no other meaning to take from it. How else can we judge what a person says, except on what the person actually said? I am dealing with the words he actually used, in the context that he was drumming up support for himself and his Wall idea.

everlast75 · 20-07-2018 4:42pm

ELM327 wrote: »

I think he probably intended the remark as aimed towards those who illegally immigrate from mexico (hence the idea of the wall)

So, what he was saying was that any illegal immigrant from mexico is a rapist or a drug dealer, somehow that is better.. and you don't think that is racist?

Excuse my vernacular, but where in the **** does he get off saying that every single Mexican coming across the border is a rapist or drug dealer. Unless he has empirical evidence to confirm that, his ignorant and misinformed words do nothing but rile up an already racist base.

And even if he isn't racist (which he most certainly is), then he is an absolute despicable hate monger for making such wild and scandalous accusations against people, the plight of whom, he has never had the misfortune, given his lavish and blessed upbringing, to experience.

seamus · 20-07-2018 4:43pm

ELM327 wrote: »

Not the best grammar but he's a president not a grammar nazi!
...
I think he probably intended the remark as aimed towards those who illegally immigrate from mexico (hence the idea of the wall)

"I think"

"he probably"

So you freely admit that the intent & context of his remarks is unclear, and at best is imprecise and grammatically flawed.

Can't you see how that presents an issue when someone is supposed to be a leader? How can someone lead with any level of effectiveness when he cannot express himself in a coherent manner?

That doesn't mean they have to be H.G. Wells or anything, but if there's confusion over whether or not you're completely racist, or whether you've just committed treason, then that's a pretty strong indicator that your communication skills are incredibly poor.

Intentionally or not, the spirit of his Mexico statement is clear; "Mexicans" are "not us" and the ones here are "bad". That's irrefutable.

StringerBell · 20-07-2018 4:44pm

ELM327 wrote: »

of course not, don't be ridiculous.
Trump was speaking in the impersonal tense and stating that the country was sending their rapists etc

Not the best grammar but he's a president not a grammar nazi!

I think he probably intended the remark as aimed towards those who illegally immigrate from mexico (hence the idea of the wall)

However if you take the comment in no context and just analyse the verbiage used then yes I can see why you would take that as the literal meaning. Ironically as someone with Asberger's I'm generally the one struggling to get context but you seem to be doing that here. On purpose as it supports your view of the potus perhaps. Now I'm being cynical.

It's hardly surprising given your own somewhat racist/xenophobic views though is it that you find yourself in agreement and happy to attempt to skew the picture on this.

Hey, here's a question.

Two Mexicans move to the US, they have a baby. Is that baby Mexican or American?

Sal Butamol · 20-07-2018 4:47pm

Hilary to run again? Who's the alternative?

pixelburp · 20-07-2018 4:49pm

Pleading semantics doesn't detract from the implied hostility towards "The Other", a political tactic that is as old as time and extends far beyond the current US climate. It really shouldn't be that much of a stretch to see how Trump used this fear / hatred of the Other during his rallies. To use the American phrase, it was 'dog whistling', heavily coded statements to condemn a whole demographic via affecting concern over the "bad hombrés" as Trump also called them. He did the same again when he railed against the 'immigrant caravans' that were apparently full of violent, nasty people.

There is already a very strong, resting resentment towards migrants from Latin and South America that predated Trump; he knew this, and used coded language to whip crowds up into a frenzy. This was, and remains, his base - the "Build a Wall" demographic, because the whole pretext was based upon a hatred of people coming across the Southern Border. It's 'they took our jobs' territory and Trump promised them a big, shiny wall to keep the rapists out.

Captain Obvious · 20-07-2018 4:49pm

StringerBell wrote: »

It's hardly surprising given your own somewhat racist views though is it that you find yourself in agreement and happy to attempt to skew the picture on this.

Hey, here's a question.

Two Mexicans move to the US, they have a baby. Is that baby Mexican or American?

And is he born a rapist or a drug dealer?

Donald Trump Presidency discussion thread III

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