Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

Pintman Paddy Losty · 10-06-2018 10:51PM

banie01 wrote: »

Paddy I'm not gonna lie, I saw the thread notification and thought here's Paddy with his after time analysis glad to see I am mistaken.

It is a very sharp dip, likely driven by the moves to counter market manipulation that are currently picking up.
The folks banging the drum about institutional money are in for a rude awakening if they think the S.E.C are going to sit back and allow the market to be so openly manipulated.
The wash trading, the OTC coin dumps, the MT Gox trustee trades and in particular Tether are all going to come into sharp focus over the next few months I'd hazard.

To be fair my public predictions were bang on. Completely misjudged this one though. Glad I didn't make any public pronouncements about the price.

JohnnyFlash · 10-06-2018 10:54PM

banie01 wrote: »

The wash trading, the OTC coin dumps, the MT Gox trustee trades and in particular Tether are all going to come into sharp focus over the next few months I'd hazard.

Jaysus, Banie, you coming around to my line of thinking?!

I'd put them all into the small space compared to the environmental impact of Bitcoin and Ether. Proof of Work is a system that rewards spending as much electricity as possible. And that really isn't good.

Anthracite · 10-06-2018 11:04PM

sexmag wrote: »

It was predicted by this guy in coindesk the other day. He's article makes sense he just couldn't predict which way it would go.

https://www.coindesk.com/which-way-now-low-bitcoin-price-volatility-may-force-breakout/

50 billion dollars gone in the last 24 hours which was nearly 1/7 Of the market

People are making predictions all the time about everything. That 'prediction' is worthless.

lol - just read it, he doesn't even predict whether it will go up or down!

Chancer3001 · 10-06-2018 11:04PM

Horrible day.

Except veritasium somehow up 40%

sexmag · 10-06-2018 11:08PM

Anthracite wrote: »

People are making predictions all the time about everything. That 'prediction' is worthless.

lol - just read it, he doesn't even predict whether it will go up or down!

Did you actually read my comment before replying?

JohnnyFlash · 10-06-2018 11:10PM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Horrible day.

Except veritasium somehow up 40%

That's a pump and dump, Chancer. The liquidity is pretty small, but they've managed to make about 2.2 million as a result. Diminishing returns, but they got the ethereum out on the market for about that much.

sexmag · 10-06-2018 11:11PM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Proof of Work is a system that rewards spending as much electricity as possible. And that really isn't good.

Agreed but I'm almost certain that people pointed out arguments to this too you previously? Pos I believe

Also as soon as we go full renewable energy it wont make a lick of difference how much we use, we can just make more

JohnnyFlash · 10-06-2018 11:47PM

sexmag wrote: »

Agreed but I'm almost certain that people pointed out arguments to this too you previously? Pos I believe

Also as soon as we go full renewable energy it wont make a lick of difference how much we use, we can just make more

Full renewable energy? I rarely ask for any follow up on a place like this, but how the sweet Jesus is that going to happen?

GarIT · 10-06-2018 11:55PM

sexmag wrote: »

Also as soon as we go full renewable energy it wont make a lick of difference how much we use, we can just make more

The materials used to make the machinery that captures renewable energy is often harmful to the environment so we should minimise the infrastructure needed by being efficient as much as possible.

If everyone used bitcoin and the electricity costs scaled up proportionally it would delay the world going fully renewable by at least 100 years.

JohnnyFlash · 11-06-2018 12:10AM

GarIT wrote: »

The materials used to make the machinery that captures renewable energy is often harmful to the environment so we should minimise the infrastructure needed by being efficient as much as possible.

If everyone used bitcoin and the electricity costs scaled up proportionally it would delay the world going fully renewable by at least 100 years.

Also, any pow implementation rewards you for throwing as much computing power at the lowest energy cost possible so you can win coins. So renewable energy will never be at the races. A complete fiasco.

el diablo · 11-06-2018 03:31AM

Chancer3001 wrote: »

Horrible day.

Except veritasium somehow up 40%

There are a couple of channels that pump the crap out of that ****coin (Bix Weir, Clif High etc). It has barely any liquidity, the owner holds 98% of the tokens and none of the exchanges will touch it.

banie01 · 11-06-2018 09:05AM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Jaysus, Banie, you coming around to my line of thinking?!

I have shared my own beliefs on those particular issues public here for a while.
Its not made me a sceptic, but I do believe that it's going to have an impact.

As for ICO's, they are akin to boiler house scams.

Pussyhands · 11-06-2018 10:37AM

....I just wanna be rich 0_0

Anthracite · 12-06-2018 08:00PM

sexmag wrote: »

Did you actually read my comment before replying?

He didn't predict anything though, did he?

Or at least, a prediction no better than mine: at some point, in the near future, the price of Bitcoin will change rapidly for many complex reasons mostly related to human psychology.

It may go up or down.

I look forward to pointing back to the this prediction in the coming weeks and claiming prescience

Pintman Paddy Losty · 12-06-2018 08:04PM

Anthracite wrote: »

He didn't predict anything though, did he?

Or at least, a prediction no better than mine: at some point, in the near future, the price of Bitcoin will change rapidly for many complex reasons mostly related to human psychology.

It may go up or down.

I look forward to pointing back to the this prediction in the coming weeks and claiming prescience

Only one person on this forum has been able to nail their colours to the mast with a solid price prediction and succeed on more than one occasion.

GarIT · 12-06-2018 08:26PM

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

Only one person on this forum has been able to nail their colours to the mast with a solid price prediction and succeed on more than one occasion.

Who?

Bob24 · 12-06-2018 08:32PM

Looks like there might be another massive drop kicking off right now:

Pintman Paddy Losty · 12-06-2018 08:33PM

GarIT wrote: »

Who?

Yours truly.

Refer to my April 01st and May 01st predictions. Only two I made and both were bang on the money.

GarIT · 12-06-2018 08:40PM

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

Yours truly.

Refer to my April 01st and May 01st predictions. Only two I made and both were bang on the money.

Sure

Pintman Paddy Losty · 12-06-2018 08:50PM

GarIT wrote: »

Sure

Only man to put his bollocks on the block and was vindicated on both occasions.

sexmag · 12-06-2018 08:57PM

Pintman Paddy Losty wrote: »

Only man to put his bollocks on the block and was vindicated on both occasions.

And then said you would charge people for the service instead of actually putting your money where your mouth is.

Fair play though 2 out of 2,I couldn't do it

JohnnyFlash · 12-06-2018 09:39PM

sexmag wrote: »

And then said you would charge people for the service instead of actually putting your money where your mouth is.

Fair play though 2 out of 2,I couldn't do it

I've become very knowledgeable about Bitcoin, altcoins, and blockchain in general. Fascinating on technical, psychological, economic, and environmental levels. In reality it's almost impossible short crypto - you can do so on Bitfinex or Bitmex, but the whole market is so manipulated with wash trading, fake volume, painting the tape, tether and other pegged coins that you really wouldn't want to.

I think much of the sudden downturn is related to the shambolic EOS launch. Even the true disciples of crypto saw what 4 billion raised delivered in reality - nothing.

makeorbrake · 12-06-2018 11:51PM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I think much of the sudden downturn is related to the shambolic EOS launch. Even the true disciples of crypto saw what 4 billion raised delivered in reality - nothing.

Well, this is an interesting departure, JF. Lets have your SP on EOS then. Does it have any redeeming factors?...anything to bring to the table? Otherwise, what are it's flaws?

I have not followed the launch that closely but I wasn't aware of any criticism of the launch itself. It's an interesting test case as it's the first time there's been a launch with this type of structure. There has been criticism of the potential for centralisation by way of the 21 block producers - that's the only thing that I've heard as a negative related to the past couple of weeks with EOS.

They've raised a savage amount of $$ - no doubt. It makes me wonder what would happen if those resources are actually used to build out the eco-system IF there's substance to their offering.

However, I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you simply see NO value proposition (with or without looking at it) on the basis that this is your blanket view regardless of the project??

Anthracite · 13-06-2018 12:05AM

Bob24 wrote: »

Looks like there might be another massive drop kicking off right now:

Exactly as I predicted earlier today!

Anthracite wrote: »

at some point, in the near future, the price of Bitcoin will change rapidly for many complex reasons mostly related to human psychology.

It may go up or down.

Earleybird · 13-06-2018 12:10AM

Anthracite wrote: »

Exactly as I predicted earlier today!

I think that we're going to see it go up or down or sideways next. You heard it here first folks.

JohnnyFlash · 13-06-2018 12:25AM

makeorbrake wrote: »

Well, this is an interesting departure, JF. Lets have your SP on EOS then. Does it have any redeeming factors?...anything to bring to the table? Otherwise, what are it's flaws?

However, I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that you simply see NO value proposition (with or without looking at it) on the basis that this is your blanket view regardless of the project??

I see absolutely no value proposition to EOS. In that you are very much correct. And I've been the most consistent poster in this forum when it comes to calling out the lack of genuinely real world deliverables and use cases when it comes to these preposterous ICO offerings. Buy the hype, and sell the reality.

EOS offers: nothing.

Ok, decentralized consensus is at the essence of the EOS pitch. And blockchain as a tech. Has some potential use cases. They couldn't deliver (after Block.One raised 4 billion!!) on the back of it:

A single compelling use-case.
A way of easily voting on conensus.

An explanation of how buying these coins offers the owner a means of ownership/added value based on the EOS operating model.

What I see is a very well considered exit scam. Brock Pierce, Dan Larimor and that crew have already exited the market. You can download the source code, share the private keys, and vote all you want. On what? Where will EOS change a single industry in the next 2 years? Cause no other start-up could raise that sort of capital without a very driven and clear use-case.

makeorbrake · 13-06-2018 12:54AM

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

I see absolutely no value proposition to EOS. In that you are very much correct.

I may not be able to short crypto (one thing we can agree on!) but I'd have put the farm on this response.

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

And I've been the most consistent poster in this forum when it comes to calling out the lack of genuinely real world deliverables and use cases when it comes to these preposterous ICO offerings.

hmm...there's a certain consistency there alright - but you never take any account for any form of technological improvement. I'm not saying i'm convinced by EOS (yet) but it shows some progression on blockchain 1.0 (bitcoin) and blockchain 2.0 (ethereum).

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

Ok, decentralized consensus is at the essence of the EOS pitch. And blockchain as a tech. Has some potential use cases.

So you've identified use cases but they have not?

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

They couldn't deliver (after Block.One raised 4 billion!!) on the back of it

When did they raise the 4B? How much time from raising the 4B is sufficient for them to develop the project further?

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

A way of easily voting on conensus.

As per my last post, I have not been following it that closely - what has gone wrong with voting? I understand that voting may take a while - but that in and of itself isn't an issue, is it?

JohnnyFlash wrote: »

What I see is a very well considered exit scam. Brock Pierce, Dan Larimor and that crew have already exited the market.

I'll say that Brock Pierce for me is a red flag (not for what he may or may not get up to in his private life - but because of where he has brought a previous business and also that piece featured on John Oliver's summary of Cryptocurrency). Dan Larimer brought Steemit through from start to finish - so he has some track record.

Do zero fee transactions not mean anything to you?
Does solving the scaling issue not mean anything to you?
How about much faster tx confirmations?
Is it not progressive to have removed miners as a stakeholder group from the equation?
Are they worthy of any recognition or acknowledgement?

I'm not in any way saying that EOS is golden - I have not researched it sufficiently to form an opinion on it. However, I do see some iterative progress with it by comparison with what has gone before.

As stated previously, I wouldn't be inclined to agree with you on much(!) but I do accept that many of these projects are early in terms of getting all the way through towards the use cases that are bandied about...leaving them very high risk as everyone here accepts and understands. That said, you appreciate that it's a platform - which provides others with the ability to build things out on - in line with whatever use cases they have in mind?

Would be interested to hear the viewpoint of someone who has properly kicked the tyres of EOS - with the belief that it will deliver as an outcome.

sexmag · 14-06-2018 04:19PM

https://www.coindesk.com/jim-chanos-is-out-of-his-depth-trashing-crypto-assets/

Good article to have a little read

TallyRand · 16-06-2018 02:39PM

makeorbrake wrote: »

I may not be able to short crypto (one thing we can agree on!) but I'd have put the farm on this response.

hmm...there's a certain consistency there alright - but you never take any account for any form of technological improvement. I'm not saying i'm convinced by EOS (yet) but it shows some progression on blockchain 1.0 (bitcoin) and blockchain 2.0 (ethereum).

So you've identified use cases but they have not?

When did they raise the 4B? How much time from raising the 4B is sufficient for them to develop the project further?

As per my last post, I have not been following it that closely - what has gone wrong with voting? I understand that voting may take a while - but that in and of itself isn't an issue, is it?

I'll say that Brock Pierce for me is a red flag (not for what he may or may not get up to in his private life - but because of where he has brought a previous business and also that piece featured on John Oliver's summary of Cryptocurrency). Dan Larimer brought Steemit through from start to finish - so he has some track record.

Do zero fee transactions not mean anything to you?
Does solving the scaling issue not mean anything to you?
How about much faster tx confirmations?
Is it not progressive to have removed miners as a stakeholder group from the equation?
Are they worthy of any recognition or acknowledgement?

I'm not in any way saying that EOS is golden - I have not researched it sufficiently to form an opinion on it. However, I do see some iterative progress with it by comparison with what has gone before.

As stated previously, I wouldn't be inclined to agree with you on much(!) but I do accept that many of these projects are early in terms of getting all the way through towards the use cases that are bandied about...leaving them very high risk as everyone here accepts and understands. That said, you appreciate that it's a platform - which provides others with the ability to build things out on - in line with whatever use cases they have in mind?

Would be interested to hear the viewpoint of someone who has properly kicked the tyres of EOS - with the belief that it will deliver as an outcome.

As a casual, sceptic observer of crypto I think Johnny is very consistent and if I used this forum as a microcosm of crypto I’d be very negative on it.

No one wants to put their mark on any coins now it seems, the doubts are creeping in.

Using above argument about eos which you brought on with questions to JF and while you ask him to argue his side you use words like “I haven’t been following it closely” “X is a red flag” “a lot of these projects are very high risk” (gambling) and you want to hear from someone with positive things to say in eos?

Will you challenge that person as much as Johnny?.

makeorbrake · 16-06-2018 03:02PM

TallyRand wrote: »

No one wants to put their mark on any coins now it seems, the doubts are creeping in.

If you mean that nobody posted on EOS, I don't think you can draw any conclusions on that! As JF outlined, EOS have just raised a shed load of money...so there are people out there that have an interest in it. I'm curious about it myself - hence my last post.

TallyRand wrote: »

Using above argument about eos which you brought on with questions to JF and while you ask him to argue his side you use words like “I haven’t been following it closely” “X is a red flag” “a lot of these projects are very high risk” (gambling) and you want to hear from someone with positive things to say in eos?

I don't really know where you're going with that? I indicated a couple of things that I'm not happy with myself when it comes to EOS - so that's hardly me being partisan. As you've noted, I said that I wasn't fully up to speed re. EOS - hence my encouragement for JF to come back on certain points and someone to put the counter argument.
You are aware that this is a DISCUSSION board, right? The problem with JF is that he posts something up - but will never come back on queries raised. I find that kind of pointless.

TallyRand wrote: »

Will you challenge that person as much as Johnny?.

If I have the knowledge, absolutely. However, this is not a private discussion. I don't control it - anyone can ask whatever they want and make whatever point they want.

If I amend my request and I ask anyone who has a negative view of EOS to comment, does that make you feel better? Why don't you tell us what is wrong about the EOS proposition or are you just going to be a hurler on the ditch???

Is anyone else starting to become a bit worried? mod note in first post

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